Singler

[WTF]

IMO, Singler is going to be very valuable to us once we turn the corner!

70 point half... WTF

Oracle, what corner is this exactly that we must turn in order for Singler to become valuable?

When the team is down and getting stomped, Singler never has demonstrated that the team could jumped on his back and he'd carry them; in a runaway win, like today, he's still a non-contributor. What's his value to us? Oh yeah, he knows where to go on the floor (nobody else on the team knows that) and he's smart!

I know you're all saying, "what's with DX and Singler? What's it going to take for him to shut up?" It's simple. Trade him. 

 
Sounds good DX, but I'll shut up about him when Don does.  I swear it like hearing him going about Brandon Knight all over again.  Sure sometimes players with talent lack some fundamental and that's okay they have talent but having fundamentals an no talent well that doesn't do **** for a team.  Singler is the New Michael Curry

[merc]

Jennings played a great floor game... can't ask for more open looks.
This one game showed how dominant the interior game can be when they successfully spread the floor.

Monroe... nice example for the kids today... cut the F'n whining all the time.... I'm glad they tossed him this was becoming Sheed like.

[deusXango]

IMO, Singler is going to be very valuable to us once we turn the corner!

70 point half... WTF

Oracle, what corner is this exactly that we must turn in order for Singler to become valuable?

When the team is down and getting stomped, Singler never has demonstrated that the team could jumped on his back and he'd carry them; in a runaway win, like today, he's still a non-contributor. What's his value to us? Oh yeah, he knows where to go on the floor (nobody else on the team knows that) and he's smart!

I know you're all saying, "what's with DX and Singler? What's it going to take for him to shut up?" It's simple. Trade him. 

[WTF]

Who said Josh Smith was elite? No one
Who said Josh Smith was clutch? No one
Who said Josh Smith was franchise? No one

Who said Kyle Singler was the greatest thing ever? Don did
Who always tooting Kyle's horn? Don does
Who always yakking about Kyle's big IQ? Don is
Who air balled a finger roll? Kyle did

[Oracle]

IMO, Singler is going to be very valuable to us once we turn the corner!

70 point half... WTF

[deusXango]

Don wants to know how in the hell you air ball a finger roll  

He's a glue guy...the ball got stuck to his fingers.

[deusXango]

This guy is playing OUT OF THIS EFF'IN WORLD; it's a shame his coach insists on pairing him with the likes of J.J. and Singler, to help with the offensive load.

[WTF]

Don wants to know how in the hell you air ball a finger roll  

[Oracle]

The very term "Glue Guys" indicates the basis of their function, but offers no clue of timing.  Do lottery teams really need glue.  Isn't foundation material necessary for glue to serve its function.  As a playoff wannabe aren't we still looking for PRODUCTIVE guys, to BIND together.   The best glue in the world won't adequately strengthen a structure of styrofoam bricks.  

We need a knockdown shooter.  Bring on Gigi.

Let's stay off the "Glue" guys until the main dudes get their act together!

Thanks Lemonpen!!!

[cool breeze]

Monroe wasn't mentioned in the Detroit News article. Instead it was Kyle Singler who is a guy that comes off the bench and is not supposed to supply much scoring at all. The team depends on scoring from Smith, Monroe, Jennings, Stuckey and KCP. - Don

Not only does Kyle not supply any scoring he really doesn't do much of anything else except in the imagination of his  Extremist Fan Base.  

You really kill me pointing fingers at Josh Smith nothing you say about him is Fact Based and reeks of your personal dislike of him as a player.   When Kyle starts producing 19 rebounds, 8 assist, 5 steals and 3 blocks in a game then please talk all the **** you want, but Kyle play doesn't justify him deserving any PT.  I didn't hear you making excuses for Kyle's lack of offense when he was started last seasons (As bad as you bashed Stuckey last season) shouldn't Kyle be producing at the same clip as Stuckey coming off the bench if not better? So I'm calling Bullshit on most of you rant about Smith and what his expectation be. He along with Stuckey have been your most consistent players to date.  The team production drops when Kyle is on the floor.

I make it no secret how I feel about the inconsistent play of Moose and think the media needs be more critical of how he plays. Was Kyle on the floor? Yep sure was and he did nothing in those same 6 minutes, in fact he netted 33 minutes in total and produce nothing, did he double digit rebounds, assists or scoring? NOPE did he shut down the man he was guarding? NOPE so his ass deserves criticism from the media.  

Your comments relating to Singler is pure nonsense. I shouldn't need to even mention Singler. He is a bench player not a starter like Last season. And Last season he had no offensive plays so he could shoot the ball more. I am not sure what you are saying about Josh Smith but if you think he is a good player, then you haven't been watching the games very close. He cannot defend small forwards or has chosen not to defend when he plays that position. I can see when players are not thinking on the floor. At least Singler's mind is in the game and he is working hard on defense. How did Singler adversely affect this last game compared to the players who are making all the money on this team? Why does Singler's name keep coming up at all. He is not supposed to be an important player. This guy makes one million a year so how can you believe he is the problem? No Singler is the scape goat for all fans and Joe Dumars perhaps who want to take the focus off players who are sadly going to be Pistons for a long time and who make all the money. Smith is not a smart player. He doesn't give his best effort all the time. Please watch him during his rest periods and I don't mean when he is on the bench. Smith is a player a team cannot count on when the going gets tough. He was that kind of player in Atlanta. It might not be his fault. Maybe this is the best he can play. Dumars was counting on Smith to be a outstanding player in crunch time and he has never been that kind of player. Poor shot selection and mental errors have been his downfall as a basketball player. He has not been able to lift himself into the level of an elite player. We need at least one elite player. So Singler has nothing to do with how much this team wins this season or the season after this one. Dumars guessed wrong. And he guessed wrong on Jennings at least it appears so based on the games he has played so far. This team needed Jennings and Smith to play at an extremely high level and the rest of the players needed to perform at least average based on NBA standards. Are some of you fans expecting that Singler, the after thought player who was a late 2nd round draft choice to be the franchise player? He is by far the best defensive player on this team. That is why all of his coaches so far have trusted him and give him playing time. He follows the game plan unlike players like Smith and Jennings who have their own game plan. But game after game fans look at the stats and say that guy Smith is doing a great job. Just look at those rebounds. Drummond is doing a good job with rebounding. That is what the coach wants from Drummond. He is improving as a player. But Smith and Jennings should already be complete players. I am really worried that our Pistons will be average to below average for several years now that we have Smith and Jennings. We have no chance of getting one of the good players in this coming draft because of the Gordon deal. Our goose might be cooked. Maybe the only hope is that the two expiring contracts of Stuckey and Charlie V might land a solid player somehow. But you can bet that Smith will never lead this team to a championship. He is not that type of player. And I have nothing personally against Josh Smith. He left high school with amazing physical gifts but didn't have that time in college to learn how to play the right way. So he has multiple defects in his game and his mind. He needs to play inside on offense and drop this habit of shooting from distance so much. He is taking the easy way out and is avoiding punishment players take when they go inside. I listen to the opposing announcers when Detroit plays and they keep saying what I am repeating. Who is making all the money? Who is making mental mistakes in the 4th quarter? Do you believe that a guy like Drummond, Datome or Singler, KCP or Charlie V are guilty of causing the team to lose or the big money players who don't show up? Detroit fans are smarter than many give them credit. Isiah Thomas was the big money player. Billups was the big money player when he won MVP in the Championship. We trusted those players. Their teammates trusted them. Do the rest of the flock relating to the lower money players on this roster really trust in Josh Smith? Did any of the Atlanta players trust in Josh smith? He wanted the money so he needs to show that he deserves the money. And you fans who do not demand the same are part of the problem. The pressure should not be on the coaching staff. The pressure should be on the players who make all the money. Can Smith take the pressure? Can Jennings take the pressure? Is Monroe even capable of playing any better? Smith and Jennings are capable of playing at a much higher level but that takes work in the off season. That is the way it is throughout this league so get real please. Did anyone blame Siva for this loss. He had around 5 horrible turnovers in that game. But the real truth is that Siva didn't lose that game. It was Josh Smith, Brandon Jennings and Greg Monroe who lost that game. You can't have your franchise player missing 8 straight free throws alone. Drummond can miss 20 straight free throws and that would not have such a negative effect on this team. The big money players have to make big shots and they needs to get big steals and rebounds as well.

One final thought is that some of you who have blamed Singler since he arrived and always involved him in potential trades won't have him to kick around next season. I am sure he will want out and will get a much nicer contract on another team where fans will appreciate his game more. Meanwhile, we will be watching mentally challenged players for another 3 years. That will make 7 seasons in a row. Won't that be fun!

[Oracle]

Watch out for this one!

I don't know the score, but IMO, we win this one going away!

[Oracle]

VIDEO: Trey Burke scores 20 points as the Jazz beat the Suns to get their first road win

That's why you draft winners, they just know how to win!

That was my argument for picking Carmelo over Darko! IMO, that shouldn't have even been a contest in Joe's mind!

Ditto Trey Burke or MCW over KCP! Both came from solid wining programs!

And even though Stuckey is doing well now, that's why you keep Afflalo over Stuckey(if that's the choice)! Afflalo came from a legendary program and a winning team!

[WTF]

Disregard I think your remark stated what I said I my response. My Bad

[WTF]

That's why you wait as close to the Feb deadline before trying to figure out who needs to go and who doesn't for all but the obvious slugs! - Oracle

What if half the team needs to go at that time?  

I agree and disagree with this if we're talking moving a player like Moose, or even Stuckey and CV base on their expiring contracts, but waiting to part with the likes of Singler, JJ, Bynum and others shouldn't be put off until February IMO. Joe needs to tweet small things until then because if he doesn't start now he won't know what he really has/need come February.

Joe has to remember he's in a playoff or bust environment, his clock is ticking

[Oracle]

If our shots were falling, the conversation would be completely different!

IMO, we've been lucky that they aren't falling, because it exposed a whole host of issues that would have been covered up otherwise.

Shots falling would have minimized...

1. Moose's defensive failures and inconsistent play at times.
2. Drummonds lack of presence intimidating on defense
3. Josh Smith low BBall IQ at times(sometimes it's high, but gets low at the wrong time)
4. The utter failure of Jennings as a PG running this team(I can live with him learning, but what's annoying is his lame excuses)
5. Poor coaching decisions by Cheeks on in game adjustments, silly lineups, and poor run stopping timeout calls!

There's more, but good shooting would have covered all of this up!

The good news is that it's all fixable except the shooting, which will eventually fix itself, I refuse to believe that these guys who have had way better success won't start hitting.

For whatever reason poor shooting is catching  and becomes a team confidence thing! At some point it wears off!

That's why you wait as close to the Feb deadline before trying to figure out who needs to go and who doesn't for all but the obvious slugs!

We know a lot, but we really don't know a lot, if you know what I mean

[WTF]

Monroe wasn't mentioned in the Detroit News article. Instead it was Kyle Singler who is a guy that comes off the bench and is not supposed to supply much scoring at all. The team depends on scoring from Smith, Monroe, Jennings, Stuckey and KCP. - Don

Not only does Kyle not supply any scoring he really doesn't do much of anything else except in the imagination of his Extremist Fan Base.

You really kill me pointing fingers at Josh Smith nothing you say about him is Fact Based and reeks of your personal dislike of him as a player. When Kyle starts producing 19 rebounds, 8 assist, 5 steals and 3 blocks in a game then please talk all the **** you want, but Kyle play doesn't justify him deserving any PT. I didn't hear you making excuses for Kyle's lack of offense when he was started last seasons (As bad as you bashed Stuckey last season) shouldn't Kyle be producing at the same clip as Stuckey coming off the bench if not better? So I'm calling Bullshit on most of you rant about Smith and what his expectation be. He along with Stuckey have been your most consistent players to date. The team production drops when Kyle is on the floor.

I make it no secret how I feel about the inconsistent play of Moose and think the media needs be more critical of how he plays. Was Kyle on the floor? Yep sure was and he did nothing in those same 6 minutes, in fact he netted 33 minutes in total and produce nothing, did he double digit rebounds, assists or scoring? NOPE did he shut down the man he was guarding? NOPE so his ass deserves criticism from the media.

[cool breeze]

In reading the Detroit News article about who to play, and the content in that article, it is clear to me that the News sports writers are not in tune with reality. The same is true with writers in this forum who state that the poor play and effort by this group of Piston players is the fault of the coaching staff. Never it seems do the Detroit News reporters state the truth. This group of players are inferior to the players who are kicking their asses night after night. Detroit can only beat up on the weak teams. Our Pistons players are weak players mentally and physically. That is why they lose. Stop making up excuses for them. Josh Smith has been a failure as a leader or even a competent fringe player so far. He misses 8 straight free throws. He misses defensive assignments at least 12 times per game. He stood out as a guy who doesn't have his head in the game against the Lakers when he blew that defensive assignment before the first half. He still refuses to play inside on offense which is his only strength. He will never be a player like Labron James although he has the body and physical gifts to become a great player it will never happen because he mind will not cooperate. Other teams look forward to playing against the Detroit Pistons because our Pistons as a group do not play smart basketball. This team is on first level play if you have ever played 4 Score as a kid then it is like you never were able to get to the 3rd or 4th level in that game. Over the past 4 years, we have seen much of the same stuff. Players are still on this team who have low basketball IQs. The coaching staff cannot improve players who have learning disabilities. Take this last game where the coaching staff instructed the guards and small forwards to not switch and stay on the perimeter or at least know where your assigned opponent is located on defense. What we saw throughout this last game was Laker players shooting wide open jump shots. How do you miss? Meanwhile our players couldn't hit anything outside the paint but our guys had players defending them to make it difficult to get a shot off.

Monroe wasn't mentioned in the Detroit News article. Instead it was Kyle Singler who is a guy that comes off the bench and is not supposed to supply much scoring at all. The team depends on scoring from Smith, Monroe, Jennings, Stuckey and KCP. That is where the problem lies. In this last game, Monroe didn't do anything positive in 6 minutes of crunch time. How is it possible to win a game if you have a key player not being involved in anything especially on defense and rebounding on both ends. He let Laker guards get position and obtain offensive rebounds. That is a clue to me that this team can never win games with Monroe playing in crunch time unless they are playing against slow plodding teams that have played back to back games before playing against the Pistons.

Where does the blame belong. JOE DUMARS has to take all of the blame for his inept selection of players. How didn't know that the combination of having three small point guards on the same team would spell doom. Two of those point guards are not point guards and they are Jennings and Bynum. Why did Joe Sign Bynum instead of a pass first defensive minded point guard to offer something different for opponents? Why didn't Joe see what I saw when Bynum ran the team in previous seasons. Everyone on offense stands around while Bynum dribbles around. But the dead giveaway is how many players Joe Dumars has given away to other teams that had the potential to be good two way players. This was not a concern at all for the GM of the Detroit Pistons but he didn't take any heat from our Detroit News reporters. Instead, the reporter who wrote that article places all the pressure on Mo Cheeks insisting that he must somehow make it all work. That doesn't happen in the NBA. You have to have the good players to win. So you Piston fans who continue to pick apart players who come off the bench instead of pointing fingers on Joe Dumars are way off base. He has signed those starters who cannot hold their own against other starters. Those starters do not look like smart players. That is what concerns me the most. Atlanta sure doesn't miss Josh Smith one bit.

[WTF]

Harrellson: Has truly surprised me with his play, he' proven he can defend, score in the post and stroke the long three ball. I like his activity on the floor on both ends and his attitude. He wants to be an NBA player.
 
Charlie:  You give Charlie 20-25 minutes you'll get double digit scoring consistently something you won't get out of JJ or Singler.  Charlie will never be a defensive whiz but he plays it well enough to justify PT and when have he not enter a game with out a steal or a block shot or 2.  He's more clutch than most of the team.
 
Gigi: If he anything close as advertised he needs to be on the floor.  I like his activity offensively he gets open and his defense seems average but so does Singler's and JJ's defense.
 
Chauncey: Health and age is his issue but experience and smarts to deliver the ball to these shooters and take that shot himself has great value.   We don't get this out of Bynum
 
Stuckey: If we think he's 6th Man Material now imagine how much better he'll be if he's surrounded by shooters at the other 4 positions.  He might average above 20pts a game.
 
Collectively this second unit could give them 40 a night so please again tell me why Cheeks wasting time on Bynum, Singler and JJ?

[WTF]

Our Starters Yes this unit needs time to mesh and develop chemistry so having that wait and see attitude is reasonable. Jennings needs to learn that PG position and develop chemistry with the rest of the starters, Josh need to find his niche and how he truly fits and KCP needs to gain more confidence.   I'm not overly concern with our starters on either end of the floor.
 
Our Bench Is another story and is where most of the team issues lies and where Cheeks need to settle our roster issues.  We don't have shooters in our starting unit but we have them in the second unit so I don't understand Cheeks use of the bench right now.  Right now CB is out but there's  no way that second unit should not consist of Gigi SF, Charlie PF, Harrellson C, Stuckey SG and CB PG.   This gives them (count them) 4 long range shooters in the second unit so why is Cheek **** around with Singler, JJ and Bynum?  Why is he trying to squeeze orange juice from a potato because those three players don't give the team the outside shooting it needs?

[WTF]

So we already are sure of the end result of this roster?... interesting.

 
 
Some things about this team roster are all ready clearly obvious, in fact many were obvious before the season even started.  There are things we should have a wait and see attitude about like waiting to see if the team starting unit actually can meh or not.   But there were things that needed to be addressed over the summer, things we already had answers to or saw the potential for a bad mix. The longer dumb dumb (Joe) wait to fix this the worse things will be
 
1. It was obvious that the roster was out of balance when last  season ended yet it remains out of balance. This is something that we shouldn't have a wait and see attitude on. Clearly there's room for improvement with the roster so why wait. 
2. Just as we conclude the value of Jason, Knight and others either having any or not moving forward, that assessment could have been made about JJ, CV, Bynum, Stuckey and Singler as well.  Smartly Joe recognize the value in keeping Stuckey but how dumb is/was to resigned Bynum, and not move CV oppose to watching 8.5 million sit. So when you look at all the DNP-CD and the salaries attached it logically piss one the **** off knowing our bench is still  very suspect.
 
3. Some of the team issues has nothing to do with a roster meshing when it's clear that we still have players who stink and provide the team with nothing.  This applies to Singler, JJ and Bynum for the most part who have been chemistry killers. Nothing magical is going to happen with these three players that makes the roster better.

[Sparma]

Sitting at 6-10, I'm nearly certain the team will get better.  There's too much talent, youth, collective inexperience, and weak competition to think otherwise.  These factors can a boost to what Cheeks (about whom Dr. J. wrote very favorably, as a player) might hope to accomplish.

At the same time, we can be confident that some of the roster problems (lack of outside shooting, worryingly pervasive low BB IQ, key players out of position, lack of balance, defensive mismatches) are structural.  A GM/VP intervention needs to address these problems before we can hope to make the great leap forward.

[Sebastian]

If WE loose to Philly, today, there will have to be personnel changes -- trades!

Joe can't afford to wait until December 15th. 

[merc]

So we already are sure of the end result of this roster?... interesting.

[deusXango]

I don't think Smith wants to play for Cheeks anymore than Cheeks respects Smith. J-Smoove was playing his ass of until Cheeks, seemingly, started to single him out for petty reasons; "yeah, I f#cked over him, but so what? Let's move on." Fans that don't like Smith will not understand what that starting streak Smith had going on for over 8 years being broken meant to him, because he stayed with his ill father for a day...a day that a practice was unexpectedly called, when Cheeks knew full well, before hand, that Smith planned to stay in Atlanta. Before that he was benched, like all the teams woes were his fault; we can all now clearly see that's not true.

Fact is, a lot of fans are itching for Monroe or Smith to go, and whoever has a bad game are the victims of endless ridicule. Smith shows that he has game, but he frustrates fans with his play; what are the reasons why?

Here's a sidebar mini-rant; what if the team is beginning to feel that unwarranted favor is being shown to Singler, because of his increasing PT where he doesn't do anything with it? The biggest contrast of players is when Stuckey and Singler enter the game together; Stuckey produces, and Singler doesn't. Talk about sideshows, where are the buckets? Stuckey and Singler play equal minutes off the bench; what's up with that?

This team can play, but Cheeks HOF credentials are more impressive to people outside the Pistons locker room, and we'll see, in the days to come, just how much they want to play for Cheeks.

[Sparma]

In our pessimistic moods, at least. Underachievers, less than the sum of their parts, fitting together poorly, lacking the team balance that would be aided by sharp outside shooting.

I can't fault Dumars with going all in this off-season, trying to gather the most talent he could (the chance for a slow and steady rebuilding job was given up when what could have been a real high first rounder was sent to Charlotte to rid ourselves of Gordon.)

Have only been able to watch occasionally, but I'm going to take issue with Don based on my steady viewing last season: Monroe's a smart player, playing above his talent level. His array of inside moves, based on reading his opponent(s), and his sense of positioning demonstrated by his passing, show as much. No doubt he struggles mightily on D. The critique I'd agree with is that he's not a warrior on defense, that he's not only slow but passive at times.

(btw, I can't resist taking note of Brandon K's horrific assist to TO ratio, admittedly in little playing time thus far. When will he be placed in a role where he can succeed (6th man)?)

I take comfort from the Tigers, who gathered talent as best they could (Fielder), only later to try to build a sensible roster. Granted they've gathered talent at a way higher level than the Pistons. But Joe's got to take after Dombrowski, shuffling the pieces, looking for a better fit. The odds are against him, but again, I can't fault him for choosing (it looks) to go out with a bang rather than a whimper.

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