Free Agents

[Oracle]

Billups: If Clips don't sign him, I would jump on him taking Will Bynum's $/place. I think he would be open to coming back. - If Clips don't sign him, all I would consider is putting a Clip board in his hands! Knight needs a tutor and Stuckey needs a refresher course!

Josh Smith: Not a max guy but will get his $ b/c of a poor free agent class...like Joe Johnson did back in the day. I don't see him as a good piece for us. I think his best days are behind and likes the 3-point shot too much. How does he do defensively vs. other top SFs (James, Melo, etc)?? I know he rebounds and blocks shots, but can he keep on with them...quickness? I doubt it. Will only get worse with more birthdays. - Good points, I was higher on Smith earlier, but now I'm just plain high if I'm wanting him here! We need to go a bit younger!

Calderon: I like him, but not sure if he is best for us. It would depend what he wanted (playing time and $). A plan would have to come together. NOT defensively the best option...we need a good defensive PG...for once (since Billups/M.James/Hunter). - Let him walk!

Bynum (C): Injury prone...would have to get our trainers approval before touching this one. Is Joe D going to gamble with this situation? Could easily lead to his demise. - Hell no, this is not a good idea for all the reasons you name!

Howard (C): Injury prone...(ditto the above). Not fitting in best in LA, but may tough it out. Better situation than Orlando for his last year. If he stays he will always be compared to Shaq and all the other all-time great LA centers. Not sure if his psyche can handle it. He could be a big fish in a small pond in Detroit. (No, I'm not giving up on Drummond or Monroe...we have always shared major minutes between 3 bigs...). He would fit in nicely with our poor FT shooting bigs. - I've soured on Howard big time, and really lost a lot of respect!

Tony Allen: This is a Joe D type player. Great D and experience and most likely on the cheap. - I'm 100% for this move! Allen has Piston DNA all throughout his game! Get this one done if at all possible!

OJ Mayo: I believe he too is going to get paid too much just b/c of the weak free agent class. Joe D will be very tight with the money. - Only if the price is right, but unfortunately it won't be!

True success next year will have to be a combination of the right coach, trades, sign-n-trades, free agent signings, and draft. It will NOT be just on one of them.

Question: does Joe D have full control of his situation or has Gores tightened his leash that will hinder his creativity?

I think Joe has this one! We won't win it all, or even the east next year, but we'll be a very competitive team no matter what coach we get, but with the right coach, we'll take off like a rocket!

[Oracle]

How do you spell D U M B

[Oracle]

No, not the Pistons coaching debacle, but Wolf Blitzer is finally off TV 24/7!

You'd swear that he wasn't only on CNN as much as that bearded puss kept popping up everywhere,

[Sparma]

I'm not saying Knight "can't" be seen as the PG of the future, just that I find it improbable for reasons that have been debated in excess here and elsewhere. More like: he shouldn't be seen as PG of the future rather than he "can't". One apparent point of mediation between us, Oracle, is that if he shows that's he's [to my surprise] capable of being an NBA plus-PG, then he should be given the job at that point, i.e., after earning the spot back instead of having it handed to him. I foresee a good NBA career for him. If he's to be a valuable combo 6th man, as I think, it will be in part because of the PG capabilities which he does have. And if he's to launch into a starting PG role again, I'd like it being from the 6th man position. Not sure how that fits with the guards we have, will be losing, and will be acquiring.

btw, Goodwill wasn't himself making a judgment on Knight-as-PG vs Knight-as-combo-guard-6h man, but just saying that much would depend (this summer already) on how the Pistons' brass project him. Hard to disagree with Goodwill on that point. The further point he made that was music to my ears -- but controversial -- was amnestying CV in the event BK isn't projected as PG of the future.

[Go Stones!]

Billups: If Clips don't sign him, I would jump on him taking Will Bynum's $/place. I think he would be open to coming back. - If Clips don't sign him, all I would consider is putting a Clip board in his hands! Knight needs a tutor and Stuckey needs a refresher course!

Josh Smith: Not a max guy but will get his $ b/c of a poor free agent class...like Joe Johnson did back in the day. I don't see him as a good piece for us. I think his best days are behind and likes the 3-point shot too much. How does he do defensively vs. other top SFs (James, Melo, etc)?? I know he rebounds and blocks shots, but can he keep on with them...quickness? I doubt it. Will only get worse with more birthdays. - Good points, I was higher on Smith earlier, but now I'm just plain high if I'm wanting him here! We need to go a bit younger!

Calderon: I like him, but not sure if he is best for us. It would depend what he wanted (playing time and $). A plan would have to come together. NOT defensively the best option...we need a good defensive PG...for once (since Billups/M.James/Hunter). - Let him walk!

Bynum (C): Injury prone...would have to get our trainers approval before touching this one. Is Joe D going to gamble with this situation? Could easily lead to his demise. - Hell no, this is not a good idea for all the reasons you name!

Howard (C): Injury prone...(ditto the above). Not fitting in best in LA, but may tough it out. Better situation than Orlando for his last year. If he stays he will always be compared to Shaq and all the other all-time great LA centers. Not sure if his psyche can handle it. He could be a big fish in a small pond in Detroit. (No, I'm not giving up on Drummond or Monroe...we have always shared major minutes between 3 bigs...). He would fit in nicely with our poor FT shooting bigs. - I've soured on Howard big time, and really lost a lot of respect!

Tony Allen: This is a Joe D type player. Great D and experience and most likely on the cheap. - I'm 100% for this move! Allen has Piston DNA all throughout his game! Get this one done if at all possible!

OJ Mayo: I believe he too is going to get paid too much just b/c of the weak free agent class. Joe D will be very tight with the money. - Only if the price is right, but unfortunately it won't be!

True success next year will have to be a combination of the right coach, trades, sign-n-trades, free agent signings, and draft. It will NOT be just on one of them.

Question: does Joe D have full control of his situation or has Gores tightened his leash that will hinder his creativity?

I think Joe has this one! We won't win it all, or even the east next year, but we'll be a very competitive team no matter what coach we get, but with the right coach, we'll take off like a rocket!

Keep in mind that when there are injuries and souring of players, it is the best time to get them!

[deusXango]

Josh Smith: Not a max guy but will get his $ b/c of a poor free agent class...like Joe Johnson did back in the day. I don't see him as a good piece for us. I think his best days are behind and likes the 3-point shot too much. How does he do defensively vs. other top SFs (James, Melo, etc)?? I know he rebounds and blocks shots, but can he keep on with them...quickness? I doubt it. Will only get worse with more birthdays.
James and Melo are some big, strong SF/PF types that no one stops!! Josh Smith represents the best available defensive counter for what damage they would bring against the Pistons, and playing in tandum with Drummond, the balance would surely swing our way IMHO. Smith is experienced, not old.

Tony Allen: This is a Joe D type player. Great D and experience and most likely on the cheap.
This player would complete the off-season efforts to surround Drummond with the complimentary defensive players (if you're really building around him then Smith and Allen are the best FA's, like 'em or not), and the next coach would have the foundation players to make this a truly defensive team.

True success next year will have to be a combination of the right coach, trades, sign-n-trades, free agent signings, and draft. It will NOT be just on one of them.
All these moves must be made without unfounded bias and prejudice or the Pistons will find themselves in a predicament that it'll take years to come out of, even with the potential talent we have now.

Stones, you've got some great ideas, and I like the way you addressed the overall needs to be considered, but the quotes of yours that I commented on were just too juicy to pass on. When you get right down to it, it's not that complicated for a GM who's busy doing his job, but for the longest Joe has been making it seem as if it would take a miracle for him to do the right thing and get this team back on track....the same team that he derailed.

[deusXango]

"Averaging 17.5 points, 8.4 rebounds and 4.2 assists per game this season, Smith has been a steady performer and a triple-double threat every time he hits the court, in large part because his basketball IQ and decision-making is finally starting to catch up with his athleticism and talent."
-Bleacher Report assessment of Josh Smith

Josh Smith came into the league straight out of high school, and has gone through the growing pains of learning the pro game and maturing as a man; he's going to be at the peak of his powers for the next 5-6 years, but the Pistons only need him for the next 4 as an everyday starter. This is a no-brainer for Joe Dumars (just like drafting Monroe and Drummond), all he has to do is work the deal that Tom Gores has told him that he can.

As I watch the playoffs today I can't get the image of a frontline of Drummond, Monroe, and Smith out of my mind, simply because I don't see any that are even marginally better; I even felt okay about Stuckey in the backcourt with Allen, if the Pistons failed to draft Burke. Sh!!!!t, that's a starting five and I don't even have a draft pick in mind beyond Burke.

I know that all this speculation about FA signing is premature but, damn, the playoffs are on and I want the Pistons in them kicking ass and taking names.

[merc]

Here's what some folks are forgetting... no matter who we get with our $'s or pick will not be winning a ship until the Heat start slowing down... if you're gonna invest in FAs and trades make sure they fit in our window of opportunity (likely 3+ years out)... no sense spending crazy $'s on players that will be past their prime once our youth is truly ready.

[deusXango]

Merc, you've got your finger on the pulse of things; Miami has about 2-3 more years on top and the Pistons can use that time to develop and grow. This is why I'm so sold on Burke to come here and play with Knight, Drummond and Monroe; that'd be a tough core group and formitable Big 3, with a relentless scorer off the bench. The veterans I suggested (Smith, age 27 and Allen, age 27) can prepare the young SF and SG who would replace them for the Pistons reign on top, toughen up the core group, and be beneficial bench contributors for a few more years. Hopefully the right coaching choice is made and the draft picks work out in our favor. The new CBA demands that a team spend at least 90% of the available CAP money on hand.

[Phil-Good]

This is A great point but the heat can be beat! The key to having A really good team is knowing how to play lock down defense without fouling out.

That's what made Dennis Rodman and Ben Wallace so great. They could defend without double teams or getting into major foul trouble.


That's the key to getting past A team like Miami. That and being able to put up points without lacking on Defense. Hard to do but the championship teams do it.

[deusXango]

Since the Pistons have two second round picks this year and players that can be traded, this seems an opportune time to trade up into the mid first round; I'd use that pick on this 19 year old kid from Croatia, Dario Saric. If you haven't seen him, trust me, he's not another Darko Milicic, his array of skills and size (6' 10", 225 lbs.) makes him a potential all-star SF that the league will have no answer for once he develops properly; with Smith here he wouldn't have to start right away, and we know what a 19 year old can bring to the table.

I've suggested it before and I'm saying it again, draft Burke and Saric this year and start contending! Joe shouldn't wait for Burke to fall to him, if the lottery Gods don't move the Pistons up in the draft, get up off his fat ass and parlay his way up in the draft; that's what great GM's do!! The Pistons don't need to "double down" with pennies in the second round, but make a hit for big $dollars$ in the first round; trade those second rounders for a shot at Dario Saric....that's what Bufford and "Pop" would do if they were in our position. The Pistons have got to start doing things right.

[deusXango]

Thoughtful words of wisdom; that is a formula for success.

[Oracle]

@DX - On second thought, after reading your post on Smith, I'm more willing to entertain getting him, but the price would have to be a lot lower than I think he's looking for.

The problem is that two bad things can happen with him. One, his skills erode just when we need him most(I kind of don't think that will be the case though), and Two, his price rises to a point that we'll have to get rid of him anyway.

But he may be worth the risk as I'll elaborate more later.

@Phillip & @Merc - You both make good points, but I'm going to have to lean a bit towards Phillip on this one! I know the Heat are beatable, and we have the exact formula to beat them that nobody else has... two potent bigs!

The Heat's biggest weakness is their frontcourt, and even next year, we could start to bother them, and the next, take them down! They just haven't faced a team that plays defense and has two bigs that they can't defend.

If Monroe's defense just improves marginally, the Heat will have trouble on BOTH ends of the floor, and that's the perscription for beating them!

So this is where Smith comes in! If as I think, that we'll be ready to challenge them in two years, then Smith makes a lot more sense because we'll likely sign him for 3-5 years anyway, and he solidifies us both defensively and offensively.

You add Tony Allen to that mix, and I'm afraid that we're sitting a few youngsters a bit more than some will like, but they'll just have to fight for minutes!

@Sparma - We're pretty much on the same page with Knight after I see what you mean! I like Knight a lot, but I also have the concerns that you, and others have! The thing I don't want for Knight is to be "Gifted" stuff like Stuckey was, I want him to earn it, and I think he will!

BTW, on Stuckey! I know this isn't popular, but I would start Stuckey with Drummond, Smith & Monroe, and maybe Allen, and call it a day! IMO, even if we draft Burke, my season starting guard is Stuckey, and that's a BIG & TOUGH lineup in anybody's league!

@Stones - Did you see the way Chauncey played last night? Wow, that Clipper team is just more stable and less error prone when Chauncey is in the lineup! He makes Chris Paul a much better guard, and he can still hit the 3's, drive, and of course shoot FT's like a champ!

Chauncey just may be good for 10-15 minutes off the bench as a sort of coach on the floor and from the bench type of deal! I was very impressed!!!

[Go Stones!]

When was the last time we had a max contract player? We had a lot of hope/$ in Grant Hill and he came down lame. If you look at our championship teams it appears we have not had any max contracts (except for ones we inherited for cap space purposes). Joe went and got Sheed when he was undervalued and it was a gamble. He used "extra" players to make it work. Joe D can use "extra" players to get us a good, non-max contract player who can compete and be considered for all-star status. We can not put all our money on one or two players. So much would be expected out of that player that they would be booed out of town...an example is D.Howard in LA.

Keep in mind that the NBA has gotten a lot more strict with defense-related fouls since the game slowed down in 2004. This has a lot to do with why we did not repeat, IMO. This in combination with the Heat reigning for 2-3 more years makes it very difficult to build while tryiing to hit a moving target. Joe has a good start...as many have pointed out.

To my knowledge, even when the Pistons were in their prime, when Joe resigned the starting corre, they did NOT get max contracts. I'm not sure how he did it, but that was never an argument. Maybe not having a star player was how he got that. Pretty smart!

Why do you think RIP, BEN, SHEED, DYESS, BILLUPS, PRINCE did not do as well with their next team after leaving the Pistons? Ben came back and did better than with Bulls or Cavs.

[WTF]

Seems like everyone wants Joe to play it safe when making a Bold Statement is required, when Bold and Daring moves are required. Maybe it's because Bold and Daring sounds scary to some, it definitely doesn't mean to keep building on a 3 year plan just to keep hope alive and it definitely could require some current piece of the puzzle to be sacrificed in the process.

There's nothing Bold about amnestying Charlie, nothing Bold about resigning or not resigning Bynum or Calderon. But it would be Big F**king News if Joe pulled of the free agency signing of Josh Smith or worked a Blockbuster Trade with one of the teams looking not to be heavily penalized by the luxury tax (like Miami). But what many are asking of Joe is to do his normal dance routine of standing pat or doing the minimum (No Risk) with resources his has at hand for fear of whatever.

IMO taking a win now approach is the only approach Joe should be looking at, it the only approach that Gores should be interested in. A three year plan doesn't fill the arena seats, a three year plan doesn't secure Joe job beyond next season and a three year plan likely won't appease fans. Practical, conservative, approaches should be tossed out the window and radical should become the new approach in all three phases (Drafting, Trade and FA)

[deusXango]

Seems like everyone wants Joe to play it safe when making a Bold Statement is required, when Bold and Daring moves are required. Maybe it's because Bold and Daring sounds scary to some, it definitely doesn't mean to keep building on a 3 year plan just to keep hope alive and it definitely could require some current piece of the puzzle to be sacrificed in the process.
This is a definition for "Bold and Daring" that a lot of fans (myself included) need to write down and paste next to their computer for reference when we start posting about the direction of the team. Good Show!

There's nothing Bold about amnestying Charlie, nothing Bold about resigning or not resigning Bynum or Calderon. But it would be Big F**king News if Joe pulled of the free agency signing of Josh Smith or worked a Blockbuster Trade with one of the teams looking not to be heavily penalized by the luxury tax (like Miami). But what many are asking of Joe is to do his normal dance routine of standing pat or doing the minimum (No Risk) with resources his has at hand for fear of whatever.
I agree, too many of us have acquired a taste for mediocrity and the sweet smell and taste of success & victory is foriegn to us. The only team I can think of is Miami but, I'm not for Joe trying to "horse trade" with Pat Riley.

IMO taking a win now approach is the only approach Joe should be looking at, it the only approach that Gores should be interested in. A three year plan doesn't fill the arena seats, a three year plan doesn't secure Joe job beyond next season and a three year plan likely won't appease fans. Practical, conservative, approaches should be tossed out the window and radical should become the new approach in all three phases (Drafting, Trade and FA)
This bottom line makes sooo much sense that you should have typed it twice; Joe Dumars is tasked with doing a lot more than trying to save his ass! There's a mandate to get the team in the running and up field next year, put the fans back into the seats, and do it with a flair that reflects the money spent (I'm imagining that Joe's been told to spend whatever it takes to hire the best coach available also).

Wise you went "yard" with that one; this is why I wanted your ass out of hiatus! Oracle, echoed my suggestion for a possible starting lineup next year that really is awesome, if you stand back and take an open minded look at it:
C- Drummond
PF-Monroe
SF-Smith
SG-Allen
PG-Stuckey
Size, strength, speed, athleticism, tenacity, intelligence, rebounding, defense, and skill; a hand in glove starting unit. No long range shooters but that's what the bench is for and the purpose of having a coach who knows how to employ his rotation for the most effective results.
Oracle, bold and daring is going to call for some favorite youngsters not to be on next years roster so I wouldn't worry about Allen/Smith taking time away from them; these are not old, over the hill veterans. I also see Slava being replaced by a Hickson or Blatche, English quite possibly gone along with Singler (who's value is high for a second round rookie). Remember, the Pistons have got to get Burke and compensate for the loss of next years first round pick (and try to make it a lottery or mid round round pick).

Thanks guys for a great wake up read!!!!

[WTF]

After reading everyone's postings DX it all sounds like the same Ole' Scary song that's been playing around these parts for quite awhile now. People are so scare for fear of blowing something based on perceived potential of players more particularly with these 2nd rounder's on the roster and not excluding Knight and Monroe. Drummond remains the only untouchable but everyone else is fair game.

Joe shouldn't be worrying if Knights gets it in 2 or 3 seasons or any other players for that matter but more focused on present results and putting a contender in place in the immediate future (Today, Now, Presently). The Palace needs to be selling out over the summer from the anticipation of contending and the team needs to be coming into the season like gang busters.

Oracle brought up an ugly possibility where it is all to real for my liking considering the type of ownership we have (he's no Ilitch) and his interest in an economically challenge city is limited. If they don't start to fill the seats very soon this could go from being the Detroit Pistons to the New Mexico Tornados. Don't be fool by Gores because he's all about making money than he is spending it (I don't care what he said about spending money) it better result in profit quickly. Trust me he's not on some 3 year plan when it come to money.

Sadly everyone doesn't look at the urgency for a quick resolve with this team. Sure Monroe has upside perhaps but is he really better than Bosh, sure a max deal might be steep for Josh Smith but do he makes the team better, Sure Knight could be a good PG one day but we're all damn certain that Burke will be a better one on draft day. And as for all those 2nd rounder's we have, there are young veteran t be had right now who are better now to win now.

Yeah Joe gets another chance but what he doesn't get is 3 years to make it work. Remember that people and going into the season as a lame duck GM with potential is silly, he might as well quit now.

[WTF]

I could be down with Van Gundy getting a shot here under the condition he brings Patrick along as an assistant. I also wouldn't object to giving Cheeks the gig as well. Heck lets wrestle Cheeks away from OKC and Van Gundy can bring him and Patrick both as assistant. Oh one more condition Van Gundy would have to start dressing better and get rid of that sh!tty thing under his nose.

Then give him the required personnel on the roster. Patrick would do wonders for Drummond an Cheeks would do wonders for whatever PG's we have.

[Go Stones!]

Thought I would take the time to list all the free agents that are mentionable. Not all of them would be a good fit with Detroit. Would love to throw some additional players around. I still think we need to have someone who takes Max's place as a bruiser. A vet would work or an undervalued youngster with Piston DNA.

Atlanta: Josh Smith, Devin Harris, Zaza Pachulia, Kyle Korver
Boston: None (would consider trade for Paul Pierce who has 15M on books for next year)
Brooklyn: None (may consider garbage exchange for K.Humphries)
Charlotte: Diop, Gerald Henderson
Chicago: Marco Belinelli, RIP (nope), Nate Robinson (would consider trade for Deng - 1 yr 14M)
Cleveland: Walton, Daniel Gibson, Casspi, Wayne Ellington
Dallas: Chris Kaman, Morrow, Darren Collison, Brand
Denver: Andre Iguodala (player option), Corey Brewer, Mozgov
Detroit: Calderon, Maggette, Max, Bynum
Golden State: Jarret Jack (players with player options)
Houston: Daequan Cook
Indiana: David West, DJ Augustin, Tyler Hansbrough (would consider trade for Granger)
LA Clippers: Chris Paul, Odom, Billups, Turiaf, Matt Barnes
LA Lakers: Dwight Howard
Memphis: Tony Allen
Miami: None
Milwaukee: Dalembert, Monta Ellis (player option at 11M), JJ Redick, Mike Dunleavy, Brandon Jennings, Przybilla
Minnesota: Nikola Pekovic, Josh Howard, Louis Amundson, Chase Budinger
New Orleans: Rashard Lewis, Al-Foroug Aminu
New York: JR Smith (player option at 2.9M), Balkman
Oklahoma City: Kevin Martin, Ronnie Brewer
Orlando: Beno Udrih, Eyenga
Philadelphia: A.Bynum, Nick Young, Dorell Wright
Phoenix: Wesley Johnson, Jermaine O'Neal
Portland: Hickson, Shawne Williams, Eric Maynor, Babbitt, Jared Jeffries, Nolan Smith
Sacramento: Tyreke Evans, Aaron Brooks, James Johnson, Cole Aldrich, Toney Douglas
San Antonio: Ginobili, Stephen Jackson, Splitter, DeJuan Blair
Toronto: Sebastian Telfair, Pietrus, Alan Anderson
Utah: Al Jefferson, Maurice Williams, Paul Millsap, Raja Bell, Randy Foye

[deusXango]

I read that junk on Rant Sports about Dumars not having any interest in hiring Laimbeer for the Pistons next Head Coach, and the reason given was so damn petty that I don't want to believe it's true. Laimbeer is outspoken and will be more popular than he is?! WTF??!! As coach Laimbeer would be facing the media more than "Joe the Ghost" would, and as I recall, Chuck Daly was more popular than Jack McCloskey, and (news flash for 'ya fat boy) Larry Brown was more popular than Dumars before he turned into that mindless diva. If Joe has to be more popular than his coach, that's a death knell for his career here; dumbass! As far as Bill being outspoken, as long as he doesn't lie, what's wrong with that? I guess as time went on he fell in love with that riddle spewing, double talking, lying ass Lil' Larry; maybe he should have been shown the door with him.

What Joe fears is probably his lack of stupid control over his coaches decision making, i.e., last year Vernon Macklin wouldn't have rotted on the bench, with Monroe needing help in the paint. Based on his size alone he would have gotten his ass kicked and put into the starting lineup with Monroe before Maxiell got the starting assignment (this is where the rebuild was to have begun); if he didn't work out, then all the fans would have witnessed his failure and not have to wonder about what he may have had to offer. We all knew what Maxiell brought to the table. This year Drummond would have started when the team returned home from that extended road trip the Pistons started the season with; Drummond would have gotten his feet wet with as much PT off the bench as he could handle while the team was on the road, but he would have started with Monroe, Prince, Knight, and Stuckey at the home opener. Maxiell's time would have been limited, and Stuckey and Prince would have been the primary ballhandlers; Stuckey would have had the ball in his hands and Laimbeer's foot up his ass to keep the team involved, and a lot less of that one on one ballhogging. There would have been so many little things that Laims would have done differently (that wouldn't have been to Joe's liking) to make the play more effective and exciting, the Pistons would probably have landed in the playoffs. These are the positive results Bill Laimbeer could have coached out of the team Joe Dumars put together, but his bias and prejudice, without an adult based reason, wasted another two years! That's petty.

[Oracle]

While I can quibble about some of the things you've said, I'm not going to because the power of the message you're delivering is just too important.

IMO, you read the posts where both I and DX were coming to the conclusion that it's time to win! We can't be waiting on Knight to get it, or the youngsters to grow up because our bigs, Monroe & Drummond are pretty much ready now if surrounded by the right pieces.

That was the message I was trying to convey, but then you tied all of that to Joe's fate and the fact that Gores is a business man FIRST, and a Piston/Detroit fan second... i.e., trusting him should not be an option!

Oddly, you really give a prescription for Joe to survive, which I like, but was a bit surprised.

But the message you delivered is that we don't have years to wait, not if Joe wants to be involved, his time is NOW!!! And I believe that our time is now!

As I said, the youngsters are just going to have to fight for minutes, and in reality, isn't that what we want? We keep saying "Play the Best", well, if Joe gets players that are better, then we should be playing them!

The CBA forces us to spend! At first I didn't like that, but in every cloud there is a bit of light peeking through, so yeah spend it all! just make sure you pick up the right stuff, and bring in a few expiring contracts to feed the next round!

BTW, Joe has planned for this when he brought on board guys that focus on how to structure the organization in light of the CBA!

We need to win now, but that doesn't mean that we can't think ahead while we're planning to win! Some youngsters are critical, but at any point in time, there are capable 3-8 year players out there that can fit in right now!

IMO, Joe has this one and he'll hit at least a triple if not a home run!

[Oracle]

I don't know DX, something is wrong that's not visible to us!

You say Joe won't give Laims a chance, but what do you think is the problem that nobody else will either?

I have to think that there's something we don't see that's come out either in interviews or elsewhere!

[WTF]

We need to win now, but that doesn't mean that we can't think ahead while we're planning to win! Some youngsters are critical, but at any point in time, there are capable 3-8 year players out there that can fit in right now! - Oracle

The things I've suggested in the past were most un-popular especially many of my suggestions on trading Monroe before this past season trade deadline and even this summer. Bold and Daring! While the prospect of Monroe and Drummond as a formidable sounds good I still can think of better players to play along side Drummond with more immediate results to winning now. Because of the level of urgency I think is present is why I would risk dealing with Miami to acquire Chris Bosh in trade even if potentially for a seasons.

My thinking is if we find ourselves contending next season Bosh likely stays on, worse case we've lost Monroe but put 18.5 million back on the books in 2014. But I also make the case for this on the premises of us also signing Josh Smith long term. Players like Bosh and Monroe are more easier to replace

The larger point of my post was to suggest that Joe needs to be open about every scenario and be willing to make Bold move regardless to how un-popular it might be or how ever risky it might look long term. One things for certain is whatever Joe does it has to have long term positive effects.

[deusXango]

I don't know DX, something is wrong that's not visible to us!

You say Joe won't give Laims a chance, but what do you think is the problem that nobody else will either?

I have to think that there's something we don't see that's come out either in interviews or elsewhere!

Oracle, that's pure speculation and that ain't you; if there was anything legitimately wrong with Laimbeer the muckrackers would have been more than happy to have reported it by now. If there's any near truth to what you say it would be that league GM's are afraid that Laimbeer would build a mindset on a team (even if it won a championship) that would piss off David Stern, and his girly ways. Remember Joe was the good boy on the Bad Boys. Here in Pistons land I believe that the article on Rant Sports was correct in stating Joe feared Laimbeer becoming more popular than he is here, and that's petty to the point where Joe is willing to bite off his nose to spite his face.

Joe Dumars gave Michael Curry a chance at coaching the Pistons for God's sake!! He's held onto Stuckey for 6 years waiting for him to transform into a PG (drafted at #15) but, after a little less than 2 full seasons, he's willing to give up on Knight (a lottery pick) at 21 years old, as a PG! Would someone please explain the love he's shown Jason Maxiell, and what exactly it's based on in a basketball sense!! This is the guy that drafted Amir Johnson, and Aaron Afflalo and gave them away!! As a GM this man filled up an entire professional basketball roster with forwards and SG's with no centers or PG's anywhere, and went on record to try and explain that sh!t....this is the man that won't give Laimbeer a chance to coach the first place he should be given that opportunity. I don't think it's a question of what's wrong with Laimbeer as much as it's a question of what's wrong with Dumars!

[Phil-Good]

Well I know A WNBA Player. Were friends. I set down and ask her all the basketball fan questions. How is it to be traded? How is it to play for Bill? How is it to play in the WNBA?


She said being traded sucks. They tell you after practice. Then you have to run back to pack whatever things you can to grab the next flight to whatever city because that new team should be playing tonight or the next day.


She said she Loves playing for Bill. He cool, he down to earth and he let's the offense flow. It was the most fun she had ever had playing basketball. High School, College or Pro.

She also said that playing in the WNBA was cool.

My Point. It's something about Bill we don't know. Somebody is black-balling Bill and it's Not Detroit. It 29 other teams out there...

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