Re: FORUM

[frankied]

What Dumars says about discipline makes perfectly good sense. The problem is that even as a Joe fan I can't help but remember him singing a different tune not long ago, one that involved a smooth transition into a new era. Also, the Prince signing doesn't fit well with the discipline he mentions. I keep thinking Joe has hidden knowledge, only to be disappointed, eg, concerning Rodney White, Sharpe, Daye, Wilcox, Stuckey (as much more than he seemed to me from day 1), and Terrico White. I can't help but think he resigned Prince partly to justify not having gotten a 1st rounder for him last year (OBM and others can deny that was a genuine possibility). Joe's playing a dangerous game in that he's being passive when his job is at risk. I think he'll get one more draft as well as the chance to amnesty Charlie V after the season and go for one trade then. That draft had better be a doozy and it may well be. Not sure he'll survive to see its fruits though.

I hear ya Sparma... I keep thinkin' that Tay was signed to be dealt for someone younger...
In a way this season is going well... Knight & Monroe getting the PT... Stuckey playing some SG... the pick is looking better by the day.... not like we were gonna be a playoff threat.. so this is what it's like being a Warriors fan.

if he played daye i would agree. but benching one of your recent first rounders when you are so bad in order to play a journeyman on a one year contract makes little sense.
play the kids...see what happens ...dwal with the consequences. THAT is rebuilding.

[Grizz2]

... and I hate this . . . All the past blunders .. no one in the local media has ever held him responsible on some very irresponsible stuff .. Based on his past glory as a player and as a GM .. Joe D can be the Piston GM even if he continues to make blunders .. even if the team is winning 20 to 30 percent for the next 3 seasons ... His job will always be held sacred to the organization . I could take it all a lot better except when I hear the bullshit Joe spouts about what is, what will be, and what has been going on . and with the shrill shills who call themselves Piston beat writers .. who also are spewing nonsense / manure 24 / 7 ... and it stinks .. but that doesnt mean any of us have to like it .. But the sad truth is ... Joe Dumars has been GM-ing for the past 3 seasons as if no matter what he does, his job is safe ... and that is exactly the case ! .. He has nothing to worry about ... Well .. I suppose there is one case that could wake the owner Gores up .. if attendance stays a diaster as it now is .. Meanwhile .. expect all the Piston hacks and lackeys who write or broadcast the Pistons to go overboard with excuses, unwarranted or exaggerated praise or re-direct the blame where it doesnt belong ..

[Sissy1946]

Wilkens had a total of 11:47 with no points tonight & "Waste of Space" himself Maxi-Pads had a total of 9:46 time played with Zero points, as bad as Daye is this year if your rebuilding you play him or get rid of him not play Maxi-Pads or Wilkens, does Dumars really believe we're falling for this Schitt? What a waste of an article with Jelly-Joe, he doesn't even have a clue with the players he's signed & or have drafted in his career with them. We're just going to have to grin & bear it with this fool until Gores gets tired of not seeing any fans in the stands, it will serve him right because of his inability to see what Joe is doing to this team. Mr. gores your only chance to save this franchise is to FIRE did you notice all the minus's tonight with the starting 5, Ridiculous, truly pathetic, leaves the fans nothing to look forward to.

[Grizz2]

JJ, Monroe, and Knight .. that's it .. And remember Rip was too until he was bought out ..

[frankied]

JJ, Monroe, and Knight .. that's it .. And remember Rip was too until he was bought out ..

well, i think that several other players were not mistakes, assuming the normal course of nba transactions.
maxiell...stuckey...ben...maybe daye...
the problem is that most of these players have been put into positions they are not competent to fill.
max is ...what? stuckey is a 3rd guard, but he's been playing starting PG til now. ben is an emergency big man who has been thrust into a starting position. daye is a SG who has played both SF and PF.
a mistake, imho, is a player who cannot play in the nba. imho, these guys can play, and play on very good teams,but they need to be in their proper roles.
(BG fits that definition also, though his signing was clearly a mistake.)

[Grizz]

JJ, Monroe, and Knight .. that's it .. And remember Rip was too until he was bought out ..

well, i think that several other players were not mistakes, assuming the normal course of nba transactions.
maxiell...stuckey...ben...maybe daye...
the problem is that most of these players have been put into positions they are not competent to fill.
max is ...what? stuckey is a 3rd guard, but he's been playing starting PG til now. ben is an emergency big man who has been thrust into a starting position. daye is a SG who has played both SF and PF.
a mistake, imho, is a player who cannot play in the nba. imho, these guys can play, and play on very good teams,but they need to be in their proper roles.
(BG fits that definition also, though his signing was clearly a mistake.)

Frankie .. Excuse me if I get a bit worked up .. It is not directed to you at all and I am thankful for all you have posted these past years .. Anyway.. In a post 2 weeks ago . I was more specific as to why the rest of the team were mistakes ..A GM MISTAKE covers salaryand development and position and age and abilities as related to ALL team needs... Not enough to say that Ben G on such and such team would be good .. Ben G is here and he IS a mistake and has been except for a handful of games in 3 effin seasons . The guy is making more than 10 million per!!! but here we .go.. Daye .. was not the position we needed ... You said that at the draft .. Stuckey should not have been resigned for the salary he got and he has been put into the wrong team roles and positions for 3 seasons ---BOTH MISTAKENLY USED AND DEVELOPED --- and has shown a rotten attitude at times to boot .. Consider: Piston Management still doesnt know if he is a starter or off the bench nor his set position! GM Mistake 3 fold just for Stuckey! Prince is also a BIG MISTAKE since he is an older player who just gets in the way and he certainly does NOT bring it very often .. Ben W .. too old .. BG and CV .. cannot play defense but paid as if they can play both sides of the court starters .. Mistakes .. Jmax .. are you kidding? Dont even need to explain that ..

Imagine if you will if Joe had gone in a different direction, such as in getting and keeping players who can play both sides of the court .. or not hanging on to old players or... not overpaying players who are limited in what they can do .. or had tried to get PGs and Bigs on the team before very recently .. So yeah ... pretty much everyone except those 3 are mistakes of one kind or another .. and 3 out of 12 isnt good enough .. And make that 3 out of 13 since we have to count Rip as a mistake so bad Joe had to give him away rather than keep him... and Singler stayed the hell away from us .. 3 out 14 .. Granted we may yet get something out of him .. but for now .. mistake .. Meanwhile .. no one in sports journalism will ever even point to EVEN ONE MISTAKE! sheesh ..

You know the most mind numbing thing to consider? Before the Billups trade .. Joe Dumars had good GM principles and managed the team with them .. making sure we had enough fire power and defense at all positions .. as well as good head coaches .. he chucked away all his principles and just winged it as if he were a god who could do no wrong or a deadbeat who didnt have time to brush the donut crumbs off his shirt so he could make a plan or lead the team with some common sense and dedication..But we do keep hearing BS from Joe and the writer rags all out to cover his big butt .... There is now no easy fix for several years even if he were replaced by an awesome GM or if Joe D reverted back to his old winning ways ..

[Sissy1946]

[Only admins are allowed to see this link] A lot of people are pizzed off that Im still not a Piston, the nerve of that Jelly Filled Idiot, Did you read that article on him from Langious? WHAT? Liar, Liar, Pants on Fire.

[Grizz]

[Only admins are allowed to see this link] A lot of people are pizzed off that Im still not a Piston, the nerve of that Jelly Filled Idiot, Did you read that article on him from Langious? WHAT? Liar, Liar, Pants on Fire.

Sissy .. which article? thanks..

[Sissy1946]

[Only admins are allowed to see this link] Then turned around & traded me to Denver with Afflalo, as like most of these guys on here I didn't have a chance to show what I had to offer, which wasn't much anyway but I sure like to take naps.

[Oracle]

[Only admins are allowed to see this link] Then turned around & traded me to Denver with Afflalo, as like most of these guys on here I didn't have a chance to show what I had to offer, which wasn't much anyway but I sure like to take naps.

I remember Sharpe, and he was going to be the next... zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzzz
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[Sissy1946]

Grizz: Go down to Wise's 6:15pm post to get the link.

[Sissy1946]

[Only admins are allowed to see this link] I'm ready to take over this ship right now, no wonder he doesn't want me on the team, he's always had the ACCOUNTABILITY PROBLEM even when he was with us, why do you think he hired coaches like Curry & Kuester? I guarantee you this, Gores will nail him good, its coming, just watch the ATTENDANCE FACTOR, He Gone & Gores will call me & I'll be there with BIGS in hand, SALUTE!!!!

[Sissy1946]

[Only admins are allowed to see this link] Then turned around & traded me to Denver with Afflalo, as like most of these guys on here I didn't have a chance to show what I had to offer, which wasn't much anyway but I sure like to take naps.

I remember Sharpe, and he was going to be the next... zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzzz
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Oracle: Yes Sir, He was a Real Sleeper in the draft.

[Sissy1946]

Grizz: That Sports info thing on the right has the article, it says Joe D: No Small Thinking.

[WTF]

Joe is a wishy washy liar and I don't know why some of you fall into the bullshit he say's especially coming from a TrueBlue article. Joe is the Mitt Romney of NBA GM's he changes like the wind anything that is positive coming from this mess is clearly accidental. This team would tank rather Joe had Gores blessing or not, the team sucks.

Sure getting a 3rd lottery pick would be great, but it's not some stroke of genius on Joe's part. I wouldn't get all gunho about him adding supporting pieces to surround three lotto picks (Monroe, Knight and whomever) because he couldn't even add the needed supporting pieces around a contentding team so I doubt if he's that bright to do the same for a rebuilding team.

Joe is so full of it not three season ago he was talking about a seamless transition of rebuilding on the fly, now the ass is saying how you need to do it from scratch. Well this is year three and where's the real progress because the team is still 3-4 years out from contending. I hate when this fat ass get accidental credit for accidental intellegence

[WTF]

Imgaine for a moment that the team was .500 or slightly above what type of song Fat Joe would be singing. That article would have read something like how he was on the cusp of turning the team around with his astute genius in resigning a cornerstone player like Tay and the un-antiquated PG better known as Combo Guard 2.0 Stuckey.

Please if we were truly rebuilding the likes of Ben Wallace wouldn't be starting in place of some young player and we wouldn't have resigned Tay to waste valueable cap space in appeasing the "Rett Type Fan Base".

Joe is a fat fuck up and some of you sound like Ellis and Goodwill giving him credit for the positives that may come from losing this season.

[WTF]

Thank goodness we weren't without good basketball yesterday. Great game by the Wolves and Spartans last night. Go Blue!!!!! that's 3 in a row over the Spartans.

[WTF]

Dalembert who should be playing side by side with Monroe is a good defender not really is to shoot over in the post area. Monroe should have taken Dalembert further out from the post this was the time to shoot 12 feet out.

I get so tired of watching Big Ben and Prince lose games for this team. Just play the young guys because nothing is being gained in playing this 2.

[Murph]

If McGee is really available, then Joe should offer our #1 pick. (As Sebastian has been suggesting for a while now.)

McGee averages a double-double and blocks 3 shots a game.

[WTF]

If McGee is really available, then Joe should offer our #1 pick. (As Sebastian has been suggesting for a while now.)

McGee averages a double-double and blocks 3 shots a game.

Still wouldn't give up our 1st for him. McGee seems a little braindead as well in the growth department, he can be had for JJ, Daye and 2 round pick as the Wizards are looking to clean house and clear cap space. Rumors has it Flip is ready to quit or be fired and everyone including Walls is potentially on the blocks.

[Murph]

Still wouldn't give up our 1st for him. McGee seems a little braindead as well in the growth department, he can be had for JJ, Daye and 2 round pick as the Wizards are looking to clean house and clear cap space. Rumors has it Flip is ready to quit or be fired and everyone including Walls is potentially on the blocks.

Sure, if the Wizzard would take JJ and Daye and a couple of 2nd rounders. But I don't know why they'd do that.

So, unless our pick turns into the #1 or #2 pick in the draft (Drummond or Davis), which it probably won't, then I think McGee is better than anyone else available (Sullinger, Henson, Barnes or Gilchrist) for our needs.

[WTF]

Still wouldn't give up our 1st for him. McGee seems a little braindead as well in the growth department, he can be had for JJ, Daye and 2 round pick as the Wizards are looking to clean house and clear cap space. Rumors has it Flip is ready to quit or be fired and everyone including Walls is potentially on the blocks.

Sure, if the Wizzard would take JJ and Daye and a couple of 2nd rounders. But I don't know why they'd do that.

So, unless our pick turns into the #1 or #2 pick in the draft (Drummond or Davis), which it probably won't, then I think McGee is better than anyone else available (Sullinger, Henson, Barnes or Gilchrist) for our needs.

Under normal circumstances for the Wizards no they wouldn't take a JJ and Daye deal. But the owners right now or so down on what's going on there that they may be willing to do so. Toss in the rights to Singler as well if it'll make more sense.

We're in need of both a big and a scoring wing player and wouldn't sacrifice our 1st on McGee when he can be had for less. I think Joe would be out bidding himself like he always does if he serves up our 1st round pick because if nothing else we could still land that SF if not a big.

[frankied]

If McGee is really available, then Joe should offer our #1 pick. (As Sebastian has been suggesting for a while now.)

McGee averages a double-double and blocks 3 shots a game.

i'd only trade the first if it is lottery-protected.
why pay a premium price for some else's headache. i really like mcgee but you cannot ignore that he acts like a big dummy. he is risky, and while he is good enough to gamble on, you still have to hedge your bet a bit.

[deusXango]

Why do we (some of us, not all) continue to hunt for excuses to rid ourselves of the first round pick??!!! Everybody that know anything about basketball realize that this is the deepest draft in years, yet posters come on here and talk about "if we don't get the 1st or 2nd pick we need to trade it for this player or that player." This is not a two player draft! When I read that JaVale McGee was superior to any player other than Drummond or Davis, I lost it! Where did he go in his draft class? Moultrie, Robinson, Kidd-Gilchrist, and Henson even are more valuable to this teams rebuilding effort than McGee now...the dream is, of course, to get Drummond or Davis, but I realize that the season hasn't played out yet, and we may catch fire and win 10-12 in a row, right? We just might play our way to the 7th or 8th pick, right? Well guess what? We're rebuilding around #7 & 8 in Monroe and Knight! Two players taken in comparative inferior drafts! McGee is the big man on a team with a potential all-star PG in Wall, and a complimentary post player in Blatche, and coached by the great Flip Saunders, yet they suck more than we do currently with a more balanced roster. The only player I'd take from the Wizards would be John Wall and I wouldn't give up our first pick for him! A backcourt of Wall, Knight, and Stuckey hmmmmmmm.

Anyway, back on point, we need to be trying to parlay some of what's not working here into more first rounders (at least one in the top 10) as we're rebuilding around 20 & 21 year olds; a couple three more youngsters with talent would give us a real core group for the future, and as much as I hate to say it, we also need another coach. I'm keeping in mind that this is Joe's mess that needs straightening out, a mess that he took years creating!

[WTF]

True dat DX I think the Pistons benefit more holding onto that pick oppose to trading it on a player like McGee. Not taking anything from McGee he has talent but his current stats on a 1-12 team doesn't speak for his career stats which are well below the double double he's doing now. McGee can be had for less

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