The Cynic

[WTF]

PBoy sound like that old poster from PistonsTalk days named  The Cynic

[Phil-Good]

Average loss to A average team from A average team on A average NBA night.

Sorry to say this team is going no-where! Blow this thing up Gores!

Van Gundy time is almost up and he can see the writing on the wall.

Gores, don't let this guy mortgage the future in Luke Kennard or that 2018 first round pick.

Get ready to pull the plug on this "Make the Playoff bull s.h.i.t mission!

Nobody cares about making the playoffs just to get sweep in the first round by Boston, Toronto, Milwaukee or Cleveland. [b][b][/b][/b]

If the rebuild starts now it will not take that long. Trade Jackson, Johnson, J.L. Drummonds and Avery Bradley.

If the rebuild is done correctly, this team and city will have more to look forward to then losing in the first round.

[Oracle]

You have AD on that list of keepers and Avery Bradley off the list. If your analysis was based on this last game then you must have been sleeping. First off the coach did not cause Bullock to be an ineffective player for the entire 2nd half. The coach did decide on using Ish Smith and he was the target of the opposing coach as Moore scored at will against Smith in the first half and Rondo took Smith to the basket for a layup in one of the deciding plays towards the end of the game. Smith missed a layup under the basket just before that play. 

Makes perfect sense. you never got excited when KCP did the same thing.

But Bradley gave up more points that he scored, his defense was horrible, they went over, around and through Bradley's defense, a very poor showing. Dump the runt ASAP!

@Ballin: You're right, we do need play makers, and here I'll give Bradley some credit. While Stanley is an underrated play maker, he's simply not good enough right now.

@Wise: I'd take a flyer on Mirotic to see how he fits the rest of the year, if it doesn't work, let him walk.

Buycks(pronounced as Bikes) continues to surprise! He's got some rough edges, but the kid has to tools to work with, decent size, can get to and finish(mostly) around the rim, but he does need to work on his passing.

[BallinD]

I think we need playmakers more than anything else and do not need shooters per se, because we have enough shooters on the roster, but do not have people who can break the defense down off the dribble and create shots for other Pistons. Weggie could do it sporadically

Perhaps that is one reason shooters who come here tend to underperform their season averages, because the same shot here is tougher than in many other locales. Our team is low in assists, low in motion, despite the so-called motion offense. Mirotic is a shooter, maybe he can make plays, not sure. I'm not seeing he could take us to next level, and the thought of throwing in picks or Kennard/Ellensen is repulsive.

I do believe SJ is more of a playmaker than many give him credit for and maybe we should not mortgage the future for "Win-Now desparation at the hands of SVG. Certainly we cannot continue to give away picks or young talent. On NBA TV, I have seen several games where Spencer Dinwiddie looked really good, energetic, dynamic and able to get shots for other people. From what I have seen, he could beat out Weggie, though he is not as accomplished a shooter and not as dynamic a penetrator as vintage (long gone) Weggie. SVG screwed the pooch on that one as well. Should we trust him with the pets in the future? Nope, he will screw them too.

[WTF]

I wouldn't give up a 1st to get him but who gladly give them Tolliver, SJ, Leuer a maybe a 2nd round pick.   I would do a straight exchange for Bradley and toss in SJ as well for Mirotic.   

Kennard should not be an option/included in a trade that does not put us in the Next Level Category.


I do think Mirotic would be a nice addition my only concern is that SVG would lose his mind and we'll go back to the offense of old of solely ISO and 3's if we don't get a floor general.

Mirotic is in his last year of contract with a team option so if this move pushes us to a 4th seed I would strongly consider it hard to look away from his numbers as well.  Neither Tolliver nor Leuer are worth a damn though some of you seem to think Tolliver is an important piece.  Just keep Kennard out of trade exchange our guard situation already a mess don't make it worse.   

SVG says we're under the cap and have a roster spot available.  There's only 3 untouchable at the moment unless a no-brainer appears but right now I would be reluctant to trade away AD, Harris and Kennard all for various different reasons but I would not move these 3 players nor give up a pick.

[lemonpen]

Fire The Turd as president and coach.  

Keep Drummond, Harris, Bullock, Moreland, Boban, Tolliver, Galloway and Kennard.  

Get rid of or try to get rid of Reggie, Bradley, Leuer, Johnson and Ellenson for draft picks or young players.

Maybe keep Smith and/or Buycks as back-ups.

Draft two PGs from the following list and develop them.

1.  Collin Sexton
2.  Trevon Duvall
3.  Tony Carr
4.  Tra Holder
5.  Jalen Brunson
6.  Shake Milton
7.  Thomas Wilder
8.  Devonte Graham
9.  Aaron Holiday
10. Jaylon Adams.

You have AD on that list of keepers and Avery Bradley off the list. If your analysis was based on this last game then you must have been sleeping. First off the coach did not cause Bullock to be an ineffective player for the entire 2nd half. The coach did decide on using Ish Smith and he was the target of the opposing coach as Moore scored at will against Smith in the first half and Rondo took Smith to the basket for a layup in one of the deciding plays towards the end of the game. Smith missed a layup under the basket just before that play.

Meanwhile, Avery Bradley was the guy who played an amazing 2nd half and got the Pistons back in the game scoring 14 points in the 3rd when the rest of the team looked dead. Your timing relating to Bradley was a bit off. Bradley had been in  shooting slump but nobody seems to notice that he was coming off an injury.

It is puzzling to me as to why after every game the Pistons lose it is necessary to bash the coach. The game was decided by the players and the refs. Did SVG leave out anyone that you believe should have played in that game?

Why didn't you mention AD as being a player who was directly involved in causing this loss in the closing minutes? He is the guy who the team should be able to count on in crunch time being he makes over $20M. But he didn't Murph. Yes once again with about 30 seconds left AD failed to box out Cousins much like the Whiteside blunder last season and the result was two big points. He didn't even attempt to get a body on him. How in hell can you just stand and watch when the game is on the line? Then in the Pistons next to last possession when Bradley had to throw up a off balance shot in the lane, I noticed that AD was watching on the opposite low post not even attempting to fight for position to get the rebound. No he was a like deer in the headlights and was watching Avery. No anticipation going on. Didn't move even one leg. He was frozen in time. As the elite athletes say in the Ironman competition, those who win have a special mental edge. They all work hard trying to find that edge. That is what Zeke and Laimbeer said as well. AD is the franchise player who has no mental edge. AD and RJ take up about $40,000,000 of payroll. I just don't see how Piston management can justify handcuffing themselves because of those two players. With Reggie's injury, it is hard to trade him so management is in the same situation now as they were last season when Reggie was recovering from another injury. And AD gets a free pass by most posters on this forum. Maybe you think that he will get that special edge as a player eventually. I hope you are all right.

One good criticism that is appropriate relating to SVG is why he decided to give Spencer Dinwiddie away. The Pistons had a smart point guard who actually consistently runs the offense that the team practices. He passes the basketball instead of dribbling around trying to create something that isn't there. SVG wanted a lot of pace out of his point guards. Dinwiddie is not a player who will race down the court like an idiot with no plan in mind. This Piston team works best when they run their half court offense. They usually lose when the point guards cause a lot of unforced errors or turnovers. But the Pistons do not have a point guard who can run a half court offense with the exception of our new guard, Mr. B. from the minor league. . Against the Philly blowout I didn't see many screens set at all. Players were standing in place and going one on one must of the time after the point guard dribbled away 15 seconds of the 24 second shot clock. Then in the next game against Houston, the Pistons actually played smarter basketball setting screens and moving without the basketball and not turning over the ball so much. I hardly recognized this Piston team from the one who played against Houston. Speed of Smith running from end to end had no positive effect most of the time. Meanwhile, just as i suspected, Spencer Dinwiddie has carved out a spot on the Nets and he is refreshing to watch. Dinwiddie has size, smarts, and at 6 foot 6 inches would have had no problem defending any of the guards the Pelicans had so much success with against the Pistons. Against certain matchups, Smith is great but not last night. And SVG could have groomed Spencer Dinwiddie for a big role on this Piston team. Spencer is just one of those players that I have really liked watching since he played at Colorado before his ACL injury that hampered him early on with the Pistons. Spencer is another player like Middleton who slipped away for nothing in return. Regarding SVG and how he handled the Spencer Dinwiddie situation his grade has to be an F.

What could the Pistons get for Andre Drummond now? I would believe they could get a lot. And I do not want Cousins either.

Yep. I was stomping around the family room wondering why AD, the leagues best offensive rebounder, wasn't even in the camera shot on the next to last shot. I was also disappointed that Ish didn't take control of that same possession making sure the everyone was in the right position to run an organized play.

[lemonpen]

Just wondering what that rant was all about Lemonpen relating to your response to my idea that it might be necessary to include a player like Johnson in any potential trade involving Jackson and Drummond. Whatever it takes Lemonpen. I like Stanley Johnson and have not given up on him or his basketball career. It is too early. But I do believe that the Pistons future could  be brighter in the long run if management could move AD and RJ for either a top pick in the draft or some established rotation players. The Pistons are handcuffed now because of the money being paid AD and RJ. I do not believe the Pistons can win a championship with either player.

Our Piston players were really fun to watch against Houston. They played really hard. Sometimes that is all it takes. But some of the biggest stat guys who are capable of doing amazing things just don't care enough to bring that high effort more than 50% of the time.  Maybe some of you missed the game too and if you did you missed out on a lot of fun.

What should we call our new amazing point guard who arrived from the minor leagues but plays with more passion than our $16M man might ever show. He looked fantastic to me playing against seasoned vets too. Then there is Moreland who most posters dismiss as a piece of crap. Eric makes those two big free throws and the crowd goes crazy with happiness but some of you are perhaps a bit pissed off because you think that Moreland steals minutes from Boban. Boban played well too. We didn't need AD in that game.  Why is it that a lot of players seem to play better without either Reggie or Andre? Some young kid comes up from the minor leagues and plays his butt off and you guys don't find that exciting at all? Harris wears a matching head band with Moreland and that doesn't get your juice going especially when Harris plays his best defensive game since arriving in Detroit? What gives? There is a lot to be thankful for and I suspect if that same group gets the most minutes, they will continue to look like a real basketball team. And by the way I agree with at least one other poster, Sparma, who gave SVG some credit for his coaching during that Houston game. Nobody is perfect or all bad. SVG has had some good moments as a coach this season. The Pistons are going to be up and down this season a lot and especially when AD and RJ play. I am just enjoying this short period of time when both of them are hurt. And I do not hate either player. In fact both have played better this season than last. But something is wrong with AD and his lack of engagement in providing lane protection or just screening out opponents often enough. And RJ did play well in his last game just before he was injured but I can never predict from one game to another how he might perform on offense as a real point guard. And his defense really hurts the Pistons most of the time.

WTF you had a good post on Big Daddy Ball. He tops anything that I have seen regarding parents who try to live through their kids. I wonder if the son who was caught with his hands in the cookie jar with his other two teammates would have preferred to stay at UCLA. I think he had that option like the other two players who cannot play this season. That Ball kid must be under Dad's spell big time. Who would turn down being in college, taking classes and being around the college babes to travel the globe with Dad? That is about as bad as being placed upside down in a burlap bag and severely beaten because you didn't eat your Brussel sprouts. I think Dr. Evil revealed that he suffered that experience while in therapy as he remembered moments growing up in Rangoon as a teenager. Go Pistons!  

Just Feeling Cheeky. It was all in fun.

[WTF]

Leuer saw a specialist in Indianapolis more than a month ago who recommended an injection. He recently started taking another anti-inflammatory. Every time some progress is made and they accelerate Leuer’s work load, though, the problem reappears.

Surgery has been broached. Leuer keeps pushing back, hoping the ankle he’s rolled so many times responds as it always has before.

I hate to say this "but how retarded" it's seems insane that you won't consider the possibility that surgery is required especially 2 months in to sitting out of games.  Makes sense to have the bone fragment just removed if it's causing the issue so to sit and think it will somehow magically fix itself is stupid.

IMO there's something cowardly going on and don't mean Leuer afraid of doctors I just think he enjoys the free money.  This is why I hate guaranteed contracts in the NBA because he can sit out until his contract ends and get every cent guaranteed in his contract.  

I can't believe he's dedicated or committed if every avenue of getting better isn't done.  Like I said people join the resistance because this type of thinking is insane.  Something is wrong because we seen players play with injuries before we saw Grant Hill play with a bad ankle, we saw Zeke play with multiple injuries, we use to watch players on the sideline riding bikes to stay loose with back injuries when surgery was the most practical solution but we also applauded their resolve to be on the floor despite their injuries.  

Those players got on the floor for far less money but with a greater desire to compete and win at all cost so why are we paying these players the big money again.  So Leuer comes out ever game fully dress to play and then determine every game the last 2 months if he's ready to go only ending up heading back to the locker room to put on street close and sit behind the bench like a fan.

[WTF]

Join the Resistance.

We have to fight against accepting change that occurs simply for the sake of change. Nothing about this current NBA makes any real sense yet many accept it as some new norm.

I'm cannot and will not accept the things I see with this team after seeing first hand what have traditionally worked with this team and how it produced 3 Championship and 5 trips to Finals.   

I keep watching this team shoot 30% on 3's and think that it's okay, I can't be convinced that a better percentage shot isn't better than a errand 3.  I refuse to praise players like Tolliver when I look at the stat sheet only to see that he's consistently shooting 0 for whatever and continue to get minutes.  Remember Chuck use to fine players for taking 3's and LB would often lose his mind over them.  Hard to argue with the 2 coaches that took us to those 5 Finals.

I can't be convinced that tradition PG play doesn't work in todays NBA, that having a floor general is no longer relevant and important.  I can't be convinced that a pass first, vocal floor leader that direct the team won't work.  We don't have a guard like that in fact we don't have a player like that at any position and this sad.

If only this team could get back to thinking, working hard, being mentally tough and determined can they then reach next level.   Come on people we know what Champions look like.  Ask yourself if you're seeing it in any of these players now.

[Murph]

I've been a Reggie Jackson fan until this latest ankle injury.  We simply cannot have our seasons hinge on Jackson's precarious health every year.  SVG cannot continue to build around a player who misses half of every season.

Kudos to DX for advocating the trade of Jackson for Ricky Rubio last year.  Rubio sucks also, but at least he stays healthy.  

And fire the Turd for tying up 5 years and $80 million for a player he can't even trade for Evan Fournier.

[cool breeze]

Fire The Turd as president and coach.  

Keep Drummond, Harris, Bullock, Moreland, Boban, Tolliver, Galloway and Kennard.  

Get rid of or try to get rid of Reggie, Bradley, Leuer, Johnson and Ellenson for draft picks or young players.

Maybe keep Smith and/or Buycks as back-ups.

Draft two PGs from the following list and develop them.

1.  Collin Sexton
2.  Trevon Duvall
3.  Tony Carr
4.  Tra Holder
5.  Jalen Brunson
6.  Shake Milton
7.  Thomas Wilder
8.  Devonte Graham
9.  Aaron Holiday
10. Jaylon Adams.

You have AD on that list of keepers and Avery Bradley off the list. If your analysis was based on this last game then you must have been sleeping. First off the coach did not cause Bullock to be an ineffective player for the entire 2nd half. The coach did decide on using Ish Smith and he was the target of the opposing coach as Moore scored at will against Smith in the first half and Rondo took Smith to the basket for a layup in one of the deciding plays towards the end of the game. Smith missed a layup under the basket just before that play.

Meanwhile, Avery Bradley was the guy who played an amazing 2nd half and got the Pistons back in the game scoring 14 points in the 3rd when the rest of the team looked dead. Your timing relating to Bradley was a bit off. Bradley had been in  shooting slump but nobody seems to notice that he was coming off an injury.

It is puzzling to me as to why after every game the Pistons lose it is necessary to bash the coach. The game was decided by the players and the refs. Did SVG leave out anyone that you believe should have played in that game?

Why didn't you mention AD as being a player who was directly involved in causing this loss in the closing minutes? He is the guy who the team should be able to count on in crunch time being he makes over $20M. But he didn't Murph. Yes once again with about 30 seconds left AD failed to box out Cousins much like the Whiteside blunder last season and the result was two big points. He didn't even attempt to get a body on him. How in hell can you just stand and watch when the game is on the line? Then in the Pistons next to last possession when Bradley had to throw up a off balance shot in the lane, I noticed that AD was watching on the opposite low post not even attempting to fight for position to get the rebound. No he was a like deer in the headlights and was watching Avery. No anticipation going on. Didn't move even one leg. He was frozen in time. As the elite athletes say in the Ironman competition, those who win have a special mental edge. They all work hard trying to find that edge. That is what Zeke and Laimbeer said as well. AD is the franchise player who has no mental edge. AD and RJ take up about $40,000,000 of payroll. I just don't see how Piston management can justify handcuffing themselves because of those two players. With Reggie's injury, it is hard to trade him so management is in the same situation now as they were last season when Reggie was recovering from another injury. And AD gets a free pass by most posters on this forum. Maybe you think that he will get that special edge as a player eventually. I hope you are all right.

One good criticism that is appropriate relating to SVG is why he decided to give Spencer Dinwiddie away. The Pistons had a smart point guard who actually consistently runs the offense that the team practices. He passes the basketball instead of dribbling around trying to create something that isn't there. SVG wanted a lot of pace out of his point guards. Dinwiddie is not a player who will race down the court like an idiot with no plan in mind. This Piston team works best when they run their half court offense. They usually lose when the point guards cause a lot of unforced errors or turnovers. But the Pistons do not have a point guard who can run a half court offense with the exception of our new guard, Mr. B. from the minor league. . Against the Philly blowout I didn't see many screens set at all. Players were standing in place and going one on one must of the time after the point guard dribbled away 15 seconds of the 24 second shot clock. Then in the next game against Houston, the Pistons actually played smarter basketball setting screens and moving without the basketball and not turning over the ball so much. I hardly recognized this Piston team from the one who played against Houston. Speed of Smith running from end to end had no positive effect most of the time. Meanwhile, just as i suspected, Spencer Dinwiddie has carved out a spot on the Nets and he is refreshing to watch. Dinwiddie has size, smarts, and at 6 foot 6 inches would have had no problem defending any of the guards the Pelicans had so much success with against the Pistons. Against certain matchups, Smith is great but not last night. And SVG could have groomed Spencer Dinwiddie for a big role on this Piston team. Spencer is just one of those players that I have really liked watching since he played at Colorado before his ACL injury that hampered him early on with the Pistons. Spencer is another player like Middleton who slipped away for nothing in return. Regarding SVG and how he handled the Spencer Dinwiddie situation his grade has to be an F.

What could the Pistons get for Andre Drummond now? I would believe they could get a lot. And I do not want Cousins either.

[Murph]

Fire The Turd as president and coach.

Keep Drummond, Harris, Bullock, Moreland, Boban, Tolliver, Galloway and Kennard.

Get rid of or try to get rid of Reggie, Bradley, Leuer, Johnson and Ellenson for draft picks or young players.

Maybe keep Smith and/or Buycks as back-ups.

Draft two PGs from the following list and develop them.

1. Collin Sexton
2. Trevon Duvall
3. Tony Carr
4. Tra Holder
5. Jalen Brunson
6. Shake Milton
7. Thomas Wilder
8. Devonte Graham
9. Aaron Holiday
10. Jaylon Adams.

[Murph]

I agree that this team should not trade Kennard.  The Turd is getting desperate.  And he's really desperate if he thinks Evan Fournier is going to save the season.  

Geesh.  I guess that shows us what he thinks of Jackson, Kennard, Bradley and Galloway, if he thinks Fournier is such a huge upgrade.  

The Turd is watching his season crash like a slow motion train wreck.

[Oracle]

He was begging for the foul call and he was clearly fouled on a nice drive to the basket, and they called a tech!

[Phil-Good]

"Adrian Wojnarowski reports the Pistons pursued a trade for Evan Fournier involving Reggie Jackson and possibly Luke Kennard."


IF Van Gundy trade Luke Kennard I will FIRE HIM MYSELF!

And I'm not JOKING!

Luke Kennard has star potential written all over him. This kid is the starting 2-guard. Don't know what Van Gundy is waiting for but Luke is that DUDE!

[cool breeze]

First the facts: We were lucky to get Bradley on such short notice, it was at least some small comfort for letting, yet another player, walk with absolutely no return(who does that?)! This Piston management crew struggles to close deals that clowns transact in their sleep!

But keeping him past the deadline or this year is lunacy for a variety of reasons, health, size, and being slightly overrated are the main issues. People see a few games and them believe they can make sweeping decisions, but that's risky, as the following report starts to detail.

Negative

Unfortunately, this is the Avery Bradley part.

I’m an “eye test” guy through and through and didn’t believe the ugly analytical numbers in regards to Avery Bradley heading into the season.

How could all these guys be wrong?

38 games later, there is a good chance I’m wrong.

Your Honor—in my defense—my attention to Bradley detail while in Boston green obviously wasn’t as close as it is in Piston blue (grey? red? white?).

Since game one, I’ve lost track on how many times Bradley has been on the wrong side of communication and recognition errors:

I love the way Avery Bradley handles himself as a NBA pro. And I really enjoy his movement on offense. He reminds me of Richard Hamilton a bit as he moves from side to side on offense. And of course Bradley had an amazing playoff run last season. He saves his best for the last half of the season. SVG might think he is fighting for his job and wants more players like Bradley around instead of removing him. His shooting has been off but he does make some big shots and steals when it counts in games. We are all different and I respect your opinions but do think you are wrong. I hope they sign him to a new contract. Other players on the team like and respect him. His impact on Bullock and Kennard is not something to ignore. They are both thankful he is their teammate. I fact it seems all of the roster players get along really well this year. I appreciate that is happening and suspect Bradley and Tolliver have had a lot to do with the change in culture.

[cool breeze]

Just wondering what that rant was all about Lemonpen relating to your response to my idea that it might be necessary to include a player like Johnson in any potential trade involving Jackson and Drummond. Whatever it takes Lemonpen. I like Stanley Johnson and have not given up on him or his basketball career. It is too early. But I do believe that the Pistons future could be brighter in the long run if management could move AD and RJ for either a top pick in the draft or some established rotation players. The Pistons are handcuffed now because of the money being paid AD and RJ. I do not believe the Pistons can win a championship with either player.

Our Piston players were really fun to watch against Houston. They played really hard. Sometimes that is all it takes. But some of the biggest stat guys who are capable of doing amazing things just don't care enough to bring that high effort more than 50% of the time. Maybe some of you missed the game too and if you did you missed out on a lot of fun.

What should we call our new amazing point guard who arrived from the minor leagues but plays with more passion than our $16M man might ever show. He looked fantastic to me playing against seasoned vets too. Then there is Moreland who most posters dismiss as a piece of crap. Eric makes those two big free throws and the crowd goes crazy with happiness but some of you are perhaps a bit pissed off because you think that Moreland steals minutes from Boban. Boban played well too. We didn't need AD in that game. Why is it that a lot of players seem to play better without either Reggie or Andre? Some young kid comes up from the minor leagues and plays his butt off and you guys don't find that exciting at all? Harris wears a matching head band with Moreland and that doesn't get your juice going especially when Harris plays his best defensive game since arriving in Detroit? What gives? There is a lot to be thankful for and I suspect if that same group gets the most minutes, they will continue to look like a real basketball team. And by the way I agree with at least one other poster, Sparma, who gave SVG some credit for his coaching during that Houston game. Nobody is perfect or all bad. SVG has had some good moments as a coach this season. The Pistons are going to be up and down this season a lot and especially when AD and RJ play. I am just enjoying this short period of time when both of them are hurt. And I do not hate either player. In fact both have played better this season than last. But something is wrong with AD and his lack of engagement in providing lane protection or just screening out opponents often enough. And RJ did play well in his last game just before he was injured but I can never predict from one game to another how he might perform on offense as a real point guard. And his defense really hurts the Pistons most of the time.

WTF you had a good post on Big Daddy Ball. He tops anything that I have seen regarding parents who try to live through their kids. I wonder if the son who was caught with his hands in the cookie jar with his other two teammates would have preferred to stay at UCLA. I think he had that option like the other two players who cannot play this season. That Ball kid must be under Dad's spell big time. Who would turn down being in college, taking classes and being around the college babes to travel the globe with Dad? That is about as bad as being placed upside down in a burlap bag and severely beaten because you didn't eat your Brussel sprouts. I think Dr. Evil revealed that he suffered that experience while in therapy as he remembered moments growing up in Rangoon as a teenager. Go Pistons!

[Oracle]

First the facts: We were lucky to get Bradley on such short notice, it was at least some small comfort for letting, yet another player, walk with absolutely no return(who does that?)! This Piston management crew struggles to close deals that clowns transact in their sleep!

But keeping him past the deadline or this year is lunacy for a variety of reasons, health, size, and being slightly overrated are the main issues. People see a few games and them believe they can make sweeping decisions, but that's risky, as the following report starts to detail.

Negative

Unfortunately, this is the Avery Bradley part.

I’m an “eye test” guy through and through and didn’t believe the ugly analytical numbers in regards to Avery Bradley heading into the season.

How could all these guys be wrong?

38 games later, there is a good chance I’m wrong.

Your Honor—in my defense—my attention to Bradley detail while in Boston green obviously wasn’t as close as it is in Piston blue (grey? red? white?).

Since game one, I’ve lost track on how many times Bradley has been on the wrong side of communication and recognition errors:

[WTF]

Following Monday afternoon’s shootaround, Van Gundy responded to ESPN’s coverage of the Ball comments with his own vitriol.
“That was some cheap (bullcrap) — that’s what that was — against a professional,” Van Gundy said. “If that’s the way they want to do it, that’s good, but I’m not going to feel obligated to give them extra time and wear a mic and go out and to reporters.
“They can mic LaVar or one of my player’s parents and do a between-quarters interview if that’s the way they want to cover the game.”

What I do give SVG a lot of credit for is stuff like this because there is something seriously wrong when parents of an NBA player is given a platform by ESPN to speak on a coach.  I'm surprise Magic hasn't stepped in along with Lakers ownership to put a stop to (Mr. Ball)  

Mr. Ball has a right to his opinions and perhaps he should find a sports forum to discuss them on and not be given a platform on ESPN to do so.  If your son is as great as you claim then he should already be putting up Lebron like numbers or perhaps looking like a rookie Magic himself but he's not and it has nothing to do with Walton coaching.  ESPN should not be doing this and they're wrong

[WTF]

On Monday morning, Adrian Wojnarowski dropped another bombshell.

He articulated that the Detroit Pistons were involved in serious trade discussions with the Orlando Magic centered around wing, Evan Fournier.

Per Wojnarowski, the Magic were reluctant to accept a deal that included the contract of Reggie Jackson – even if it included rookie, Luke Kennard. Detroit continues to be one of the more aggressive teams on the market as Stan Van Gundy is still inspired to win-now.

Seriously trade Kennard along with Reggie,  I swear I don't like SVG but it could be a win for Kennard getting away from SVG before he ruin his career.  Still this trade does nothing to move the team to next level.   It also still don't address the issues at hand in that we need a PF and an very serious upgrade at the PG position.  

At least SVG talking trade but let it make some kind of sense to moving the team to next level.

[lemonpen]

Would someone please put a label on this team.   They need a name.  Something that sticks.  Something appropriate.
How do you build a record so good against the absolute best, and so bad against the absolute worst?  They tantalize with dreams of sugar plum fairies, then terrorize with nightmares of Jason Voorhees.  
I know one thing;  Stan better put a finger on it real soon.  Cause this has to be his put-up or shut-up year.

@Oracle:  Is it too early to award Bradley the dubious honor of becoming the newest member of the group of Stones who's shot has been Broken-By-Stan.  How much longer before the post game interview with Avery staring at the microphone with a bewildered expression, muttering "I don't get it, I use to could make those shots.  All of um."

@Phil1980Boy:  Consider this.  We suck.  The 76'ers are 16-19 without us and we are 21-14 without them.   If Stan figures out how to stop losing to the Magic-Lakers-Mavs of the world we'll be just fine.  Screw Philly!!!!.  Ahem, that is as long as we don't see them in the playoffs.

@Forum:  Sorry Boys but that Bozo posting as @CoolBreeze is an imposter.  A weak one at that.  He isn't fooling anyone.  Trade Stanley Johnson??????  Buffalo Feathers !!!!!  Next thing you know he will be bragging about the number of All Star ballots he's submitted  for Reggie Jackson.      

Could Reggie Bullock qualify for the Come Back Player of the Year Award.  Or, in the event a candidate would have had to at some time been someone,  would it be Most Improved Player of the Year.

[Phil-Good]

I have some simple advice for Gores and Van Gundy. Especially Gores.

BLOW this S.H.I.T up BABY!

Look at Philly! Boston, the Lakers. Very soon Atlanta will be better then the Pistons. Denver is better, Utah is better, the 76ERS are way better then the Pistons. Milwaukee IS WAY better then the Pistons. Chicago is rebuilding.

I'm telling you Pistons fans. If you not 1 twisted ankle away from winning your conference blow it up. If Lebron twisted his ankle. Boston could win, Toronto, Washington, Philly could pull off A good trade deadline move and be right there, Milwaukee is A really good team and is right there in the mix. I put all these teams in front of the Pistons if Lebron has A season ending issue.

BLOW IT UP Mr. GORES!

The Pistons are headed NOWHERE FAST!! F.U.C.K the playoffs!

Shop Drummonds to A bottom feeder team with great draft picks. Sacramento, Denver, Atlanta, Miami, Charlotte, Memphis, Orlando, Brooklyn loves giving up picks, Phoenix, Dallas Mavricks, Chicago Bulls. Call Cleveland and see how much they love that pick top pick? How about Drummonds and Stanley Johnson for that top pick??



Dump Reggie Jackson and trade Avery Bradley for A expiring contract or A rookie contract kid and A first round pick. Collect second round picks also.

You don't even have to do A FULL Rebuild. Just dump Drummonds, Reggie Jackson and A.Bradley.

Sorry but it's time!!

[Sparma]

Thanks Don! Good to have you back. I'll need to delay further analysis until later. Time to watch Monk reruns with my son.

Great game, great games by Moreland and Boban!!

Caveats: a) Houston scored 37 in the 1st quarter with Moreland in there the whole time, and Boban in there for 2.1 seconds, so that the defensive mastermind didn't work so well from the get go; the D tightened up with Boban in there in the 2nd quarter, then continued at the elevated level with Moreland; b) 4 Moreland scored 4 of his points BECAUSE he's so crummy as a scorer, 2 from FTs (credit to him for making those) when he was fouled off the ball deliberately because he was 4-10 from the stripe hitherto and the other when 4 guys converged on Ish leaving Moreland totally free by the basket because he was seen as posing no threat, and b) relying on Moreland so heavily wouldn't have work except that the Pistons were otherwise uncharacteristically potent on O (see BallinD's stats).

That said, genuine kudos to Moreland for a couple of reasons: a) he did a fine job linking play on O, which is reflected in (but not confined to) his 4 assists, and b) even though Boban's clearly the superior offensive player (even tonight, on Moreland's best game ever), at times I think the other guys function better offensively with Moreland in there because it can create better spacing without Boban clogging the middle, especially for a guy like Tobias.  I think the numbers bear out that doesn't happen generally, but if the shooting's on I can see where sometimes there'd be an advantage for the other 4.

Lots of energy, strong play by Buycks, and the team generally.

And credit to SVG for successful coaching with his best player out.

Taking a look at the boxscore I see that Boban had the 2nd best +/- in his 11 minutes, with 10 minutes, and that Moreland had the worst in his 35 minutes.  Given the dismal recent stats BallinD cited, I would have given Boban more minutes than Eric, but Moreland was really productive this evening, and SVG's rotations worked.  Not generally a successful strategy, I still think, but credit to all, including SVG, for tonight's rousing success.

Can't resist doing what I told myself don't do this anymore. That would be posting on this forum. You did a great job on this Sparma. As you know I have been a big supporter of Moreland since SVG put him in the rotation. I think with Moreland, success will bring more success next season because I know he will do the weight work in the off season to gain the proper amount of weight to bring a Ben Wallace type game to some NBA team. What I think this team needs more of is a 2nd tier defense against drivers. Somehow AD has never been alert enough to provide that for an entire game so far. I think AD has been hurt with the rib injury going into the Philly game but he offered no paint protector at all in that game. I think our Piston team needs a guy like Moreland moving forward. He moves from the strong side to the weak side quickly without thinking about it Just as he did as a college player. He can get out on shooters and just never stops competing for both offensive and defensive rebounds. And another thing I saw last night that was different was the way Tobias Harris responded to Moreland getting the start. I thought the red head bands those two players was pretty cool. This was the best game that I have ever seen Tobias Harris play on the defensive end. He was just as active at Moreland. And the highlight for me was when Houston's coach called for an intentional foul with 4 minutes to play. He sure noticed that Moreland was screwing up his ability to get easy shots around the basket. He wanted Moreland out of the game and he fully expected Eric to fold at the foul line. After Moreland drained both free throws the hack Moreland strategy flew out the window. I really am surprised that more Piston fans do not enjoy watching Eric Moreland fight his butt off for the Pistons. He plays old school style and Tobias Harris likes playing with him. I think he even motivates Andre Drummond as AD sits on the bench and watches Eric's effort.

It just pleases me so much when someone I pull for has success. And our new point guard is fantastic. He is another guy who fits my program more than either Smith or Jackson.

[cool breeze]

I mentioned in my response to Sparma's post which mostly involved Boban's contribution but also provided some positive sentences about Eric Moreland. While I made the statement that the Pistons might be better off with Boban on the injured reserve list earlier, now I will admit that he can be an effective weapon but that all depends on match ups. Could Boban be a starter for the pistons and would he be a better option than Drummond at times? Greg Kelser made the statement that Boban really works hard to establish inside position and has all the moves needed to score once he receives the ball. His problems are on the defensive end especially when opponents have a center who can drill jump shots outside the paint. Yet AD is not even an average defender in that area. Boban seems to be more disciplined as a defender when opponents try to enter the paint than AD. AD is gifted athletically unlike most centers in the NBA but he fails to use that gift by learning how to be more of a defensive monster that he is capable of becoming. He just seems to lag a lot in the first quarter of most games on defense. AD is cranking up his effort more in the 4th quarter but still lacks the quick recognition skill set that all good shot blockers are born with. Being quick to the ball or quick to react and help teammates who have allowed their man to blow by them on drives is a gift that Eric Moreland has been given. If only AD with his size and athletic ability could move like Moreland on defense, I do not think many teams could beat the Pistons. But AD loves offense. Boban is a better offensive player than AD on most nights. What would AD bring the Pistons in a trade now? It seems to me that the team could function well with Boban and Moreland and in a pinch Ellenson or Leuer could fill in when those two are having bad nights. So I propose that the Pistons set themselves up for the future now to give themselves a shot at the championship within the next 3 years. Trade AD and hope his value is enough to bring a game changing player to the Pistons.

My 2nd idea that many have begged for over the past two years is to finally light a fire under the behinds of Piston management to trade Reggie Jackson. He just doesn't fit the current players well at all. On certain nights, Reggie scores a lot of points and makes big plays. He is a good player. But I do not think Reggie Jackson is capable of adjusting his style to make this group of player effective enough to win much of anything. He is a liability on defense and is a ball dominate point guard. If nothing happens I will support and pull for Reggie to be successful as a Piston. But it was clear to me after watching only a few games with Buycks, that he is more of the type of point guard who can lead this team in a positive way. He can create his own shot at the end of the shot clock if necessary. He gets teammates in proper position and passes the ball to them at the right time in the half court offense. And his biggest advantage over either Jackson or Smith is his ability to defend. I love his grit. Most everyone wrote him off as just another fill in until Reggie returns. Last night I was upset when SVG took him out of the game in crunch time. He doesn't back down. He has the toughness of a bulldog. What a great job by SVG to bring in Buycks!

Ish Smith has done a decent job in Reggie's absence. If SVG went with him for the remainder of the season and brought in Buycks off the bench I think the Pistons would function well. I prefer Buycks who has come out of nowhere to show he can keep his cool under pressure and he offers good defense. But the biggest reason why I would prefer that Smith doesn't start is because of how effective he has become as a tempo changer when he comes off the bench. I have gone from hoping Smith would not return this season to a big supporter now. Smith is fighting like hell on defense to make up for his size disadvantage. And he is pretty smart on defense as well knowing how to position himself against much taller players. I would like to see him shoot less and become a stronger play maker before the season ends.

It appears that moving AD and RJ will require the Pistons to include Stanley Johnson. Detroit management should not wait for another season to move Drummond and Jackson. If it takes including Johnson to make things work than so be it. Johnson has been out and other players have stepped up. I like his defense, unselfishness, and passing ability but the NBA has become a scorers game as you all keep saying. Johnson has learned how to get open shots but his release is holding him back and nothing seems to change. Johnson is a good guy to have on any team because he can defend multiple positions and he is still very young. But the Pistons need to shed those two huge salaries of Drummond and Jackson or at least remove one of those players. I do not believe the Pistons will ever win a championship with either of them though. But I like both of them and if nothing happens, they are Pistons and I will support them and hope they can improve. What would AD and RJ bring in trades? Does anyone know just for the sake of curiosity.

One does not have to look at stats to see if players are doing their jobs properly and if they fit the other players on the team. We do not have to be rocket scientists. All we need to do is concentrate or pay attention from beginning and see how the players respond to the ebb and flow of each game. I see that posters list a lot of stats at times. Stats actually tell coaches very little. They see for themselves what is happening at any given moment of every game. Who is successful on the court and who is failing at any given moment? How many times do players make the same mistakes? If a player is shooting a low percentage but makes several key shots in the 4th quarter and steals the ball or somehow gets several key rebounds when it counts, that tells the coach which players he can trust. And the coach is always trying to find the right combinations of players who make each other better. No need to look at the stat sheet to find that out. But if fans want to spend time on stats and share what they find I appreciate that info a lot.

[Oracle]

I hoped you wouldn't let a few negative posts make you do something like quit.

The people that know you best, for better or worse, are the people that will tell you what they think, but that doesn't mean that they don't care or respect most of what you have to give.

Takes a good man to reverse a questionable decision... welcome back!

Pistons: Yeah we won, but it's disturbing how we're winning lately.

If you notice, a lot of our players appear to play much better at home, and lay huge smelly turds on the road(I'm looking at you Harris, Bradley & Bullock).

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