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Re: FORUM

Post  cool breeze on Sun Jan 07, 2018 4:25 pm

[quote="Sparma"]Great game, great games by Moreland and Boban!!

Caveats: a) Houston scored 37 in the 1st quarter with Moreland in there the whole time, and Boban in there for 2.1 seconds, so that the defensive mastermind didn't work so well from the get go; the D tightened up with Boban in there in the 2nd quarter, then continued at the elevated level with Moreland; b) 4 Moreland scored 4 of his points BECAUSE he's so crummy as a scorer, 2 from FTs (credit to him for making those) when he was fouled off the ball deliberately because he was 4-10 from the stripe hitherto and the other when 4 guys converged on Ish leaving Moreland totally free by the basket because he was seen as posing no threat, and b) relying on Moreland so heavily wouldn't have work except that the Pistons were otherwise uncharacteristically potent on O (see BallinD's stats).

That said, genuine kudos to Moreland for a couple of reasons: a) he did a fine job linking play on O, which is reflected in (but not confined to) his 4 assists, and b) even though Boban's clearly the superior offensive player (even tonight, on Moreland's best game ever), at times I think the other guys function better offensively with Moreland in there because it can create better spacing without Boban clogging the middle, especially for a guy like Tobias.  I think the numbers bear out that doesn't happen generally, but if the shooting's on I can see where sometimes there'd be an advantage for the other 4.

Lots of energy, strong play by Buycks, and the team generally.

And credit to SVG for successful coaching with his best player out.

Taking a look at the boxscore I see that Boban had the 2nd best +/- in his 11 minutes, with 10 minutes, and that Moreland had the worst in his 35 minutes.  Given the dismal recent stats BallinD cited, I would have given Boban more minutes than Eric, but Moreland was really productive this evening, and SVG's rotations worked.  Not generally a successful strategy, I still think, but credit to all, including SVG, for tonight's rousing success.

Can't resist doing what I told myself don't do this anymore. That would be posting on this forum. You did a great job on this Sparma. As you know I have been a big supporter of Moreland since SVG put him in the rotation. I think with Moreland, success will bring more success next season because I know he will do the weight work in the off season to gain the proper amount of weight to bring a Ben Wallace type game to some NBA team. What I think this team needs more of is a 2nd tier defense against drivers. Somehow AD has never been alert enough to provide that for an entire game so far. I think AD has been hurt with the rib injury going into the Philly game but he offered no paint protector at all in that game. I think our Piston team needs a guy like Moreland moving forward. He moves from the strong side to the weak side quickly without thinking about it Just as he did as a college player. He can get out on shooters and just never stops competing for both offensive and defensive rebounds. And another thing I saw last night that was different was the way Tobias Harris responded to Moreland getting the start. I thought the red head bands those two players was pretty cool. This was the best game that I have ever seen Tobias Harris play on the defensive end. He was just as active at Moreland. And the highlight for me was when Houston's coach called for an intentional foul with 4 minutes to play. He sure noticed that Moreland was screwing up his ability to get easy shots around the basket. He wanted Moreland out of the game and he fully expected Eric to fold at the foul line. After Moreland drained both free throws the hack Moreland strategy flew out the window. I really am surprised that more Piston fans do not enjoy watching Eric Moreland fight his butt off for the Pistons. He plays old school style and Tobias Harris likes playing with him. I think he even motivates Andre Drummond as AD sits on the bench and watches Eric's effort.

It just pleases me so much when someone I pull for has success. And our new point guard is fantastic. He is another guy who fits my program more than either Smith or Jackson.

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They Won!

Post  WTF on Sun Jan 07, 2018 1:55 am

I was wrong I didn't think they would pull this game out especially without Andre but I didn't know Harden was out either.
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Houston

Post  Sparma on Sun Jan 07, 2018 12:22 am

Great game, great games by Moreland and Boban!!

Caveats: a) Houston scored 37 in the 1st quarter with Moreland in there the whole time, and Boban in there for 2.1 seconds, so that the defensive mastermind didn't work so well from the get go; the D tightened up with Boban in there in the 2nd quarter, then continued at the elevated level with Moreland; b) 4 Moreland scored 4 of his points BECAUSE he's so crummy as a scorer, 2 from FTs (credit to him for making those) when he was fouled off the ball deliberately because he was 4-10 from the stripe hitherto and the other when 4 guys converged on Ish leaving Moreland totally free by the basket because he was seen as posing no threat, and b) relying on Moreland so heavily wouldn't have work except that the Pistons were otherwise uncharacteristically potent on O (see BallinD's stats).

That said, genuine kudos to Moreland for a couple of reasons: a) he did a fine job linking play on O, which is reflected in (but not confined to) his 4 assists, and b) even though Boban's clearly the superior offensive player (even tonight, on Moreland's best game ever), at times I think the other guys function better offensively with Moreland in there because it can create better spacing without Boban clogging the middle, especially for a guy like Tobias.  I think the numbers bear out that doesn't happen generally, but if the shooting's on I can see where sometimes there'd be an advantage for the other 4.

Lots of energy, strong play by Buycks, and the team generally.

And credit to SVG for successful coaching with his best player out.

Taking a look at the boxscore I see that Boban had the 2nd best +/- in his 11 minutes, with 10 minutes, and that Moreland had the worst in his 35 minutes. Given the dismal recent stats BallinD cited, I would have given Boban more minutes than Eric, but Moreland was really productive this evening, and SVG's rotations worked. Not generally a successful strategy, I still think, but credit to all, including SVG, for tonight's rousing success.

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Re: FORUM

Post  Sparma on Sat Jan 06, 2018 8:55 pm

SVG puts Boban in with 2.1 seconds left in the first quarter. So he's capable of situational subbing! Does that -, off of a foul by Moreland counts against him.

Kelser subtly incredulous, remember that Boban put up 27 v the Rockets in the spring ("like stealing from a baby"). Kelser, after a stretch in which Boban massively outperformed Moreland: "The Pistons have to be happy with what they got from Boban."

46-45, and Moreland comes back in. Wait, 46-46 with Boban down a plus (out on the 2nd FT), and Moreland up one.

BallinD wrote:SVG starting Moreland...he wants to show those stupid posters (especially that pesky BallinD) that Moreland can score points outside of the GLeague, and surely he can outrebound Boban.  "Come on, make me proud!"  

Last season Boban scored 27 against Houston and helped us win, so he starts Moreland.  Makes sense!
Go Pistons!
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Defense Vs Offense

Post  BallinD on Sat Jan 06, 2018 8:14 pm

SVG starting Moreland...he wants to show those stupid posters (especially that pesky BallinD) that Moreland can score points outside of the GLeague, and surely he can outrebound Boban.  "Come on, make me proud!"  

Last season Boban scored 27 against Houston and helped us win, so he starts Moreland. Makes sense!
Go Pistons!
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Defense vs Offense

Post  BallinD on Sat Jan 06, 2018 7:10 pm

Will our HC ever figure out a way to balance the two.  It seems to me the best players come into the league offensively talented and some with potential to play great defense after years of work at it.  SVG wants to draft offensively talented players and then punish them with DNP-CD until they  become great defensive players from playing in practice and G-League efforts, while other coaches let them grow into defensive players with practice, and play on the floor (except SJ, which maybe explains why he gives him such a long leash).

Despite what Stan will moan about, we are still a pretty good defensive team but poor offensive.  The ratings are in: 22nd in offensive ratings and 11th in defensive ratings.  Similar to last year.

The last five games we scored: 78, 104, 79, 89, 83.  Clearly that is not going to get it done, no matter who we are playing.  This is the NBA folks.  We arent going to win very often with those kind of numbers.  In those five games, the opponent had to only score 90 points to win 4 out of 5.  That is ridiculous!

The last five games we surrendered: 114, 111, 93, 102, 107.  We could have scored 110 and won three out of five, not a ton of points.

Put another way, the median avg points is 105.  The last five games we hit the median one time and gave up more than the median three times.

We are ranked 25th in true shooting %, 26th in FTA, 19th in Rbd, 30th in blocks

So we cannot protect the rim, get fouls (jump shooting team) rebound (despite Dre), block shots, score!  What a pickle!  Anybody got a sandwich (for Stan).
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Don

Post  Sparma on Sat Jan 06, 2018 6:55 pm

Like Murph, I hope that you continue to post on our forum, a forum which is nearing endangered status.  And like Murph, I find your posts maddening sometimes (eg when you want to put Boban on IR for the year, when it turns out he's the most efficient offensive player in recorded NBA history).  Also like Murph, I think it would be good for all of us to stick fairly closely to our designated topic.  Bill James thinks there's a pretty fair chance of another civil war within the coming decades.  I'm not going to go that far, but we all know that these are tremendously volatile times.  Without downplaying that, and even without denying that I'm offended by some of the comments posted, I think we should focus on the Pistons and related stuff (which can be a lot!), if only with a self-interested eye on our survival as a forum.
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It Does Look Bad

Post  WTF on Sat Jan 06, 2018 4:10 pm

The next 6 or 7 could result in L's people I'm not sure if they'll win tonight even being at home against the Rockets this could get ugly real quick.  It's real bad when we can no longer look at the schedule and pencil in wins.  Every game is now a crap shoot  facepalm.  

When I made my prediction estimated my chances of being wrong at 50% I think I'm 60% now.  If this team finish this below .500 it's a wrap for them.
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Just Yapping

Post  WTF on Sat Jan 06, 2018 3:40 pm

In the 26 seasons prior to the 2008-09 season do you know we only missed the playoffs 5 times.   Those DNQ from the playoffs came during a period of time from 1992-93 season to the 2000-01 seasons.   Grant Hill drafted in the summer of 1994 spent 6 season with the Pistons taking us to the playoffs in 4 of those 6 seasons he played here.  

I guess I'm just trying to make some sense of the level of acceptance there seem to be with how things are going since 2008-09 to current.  Seems we spent more time making excuses, lowering the bar along with our expectations since then.  


It just seems crazy that in the last 8 seasons from where we drafted each season that we only sniff the playoffs once during that time.  Something is seriously wrong and I don't think they'll make the playoffs this season if drastic doesn't change soon.  I thought before the season that not tanking but a major retooling needed to be done now I can make an argument of a massive rebuilding but it won't work if SVG remains in place.  

Going back to those 26 seasons except for the 6 season Hill lead this team those remaining 20 season were lead by HOF backcourts and I say that because both CB and Rip are being consider for HOF voting.  Not sure why we would be thinking that Andre is the way to glory but so of you do but despite his stats the gut and eye test tells you he's not as good the centers that played on our championship teams.  I think it should be a disclaimer next to all the praise Andre gets that reads he's not getting those numbers playing against great talent or the level of talent as Bill and Ben.  

I wonder sometimes that we still had our draft picks from the last 8 season and with the right coach would this team be better.  I guess what I asking is if with all things being perfect if our starting lineup was Knight, KCP, Middleton, Moose and Andre and they were properly coach and used would we be a contending team right now today.  I like to think so I like to think Cheeks was a perfect head coach for PG and thought both the Wallace's were great teachers and motivators for both Monroe and Andre. 

Somehow we manage to give up 4 of those drafted players for nothing.  I fear we're mishandling our last three picks (SJ, Ellenson and Kennard) These are really all top 10 picks even though Ellenson and Kennard dropped they were strongly considered top 10.  So can honestly say that in 7 of the last 8 season we selected a top 10 draft pick 5 for certain yet we struggling today to simply to be an 8th. Something is seriously wrong and needs to righted quickly if this team fails to make the playoff we're looking at another 8 or 10 years of DNQ.
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Move Over Caldwell. Is There Room on That Bus

Post  BallinD on Sat Jan 06, 2018 2:31 pm

SVG on his way out of town? No, he'll scratch and claw and fight to the bitter end. This team is maddening! Is it too late to tank, someone said? lol lol

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Yikes!

Post  Murph on Sat Jan 06, 2018 2:25 pm

Don...Please don't stop posting.  I admit that I often find your posts frustrating, especially when you shower your favorite players with love and admiration, while you relentless rip into my favorite players.  I did not mean to attack you personally.  I was trying to point out the bias in your posts to try to get you to be more balanced.


Man...what a sh*t show that was last night.  I lasted through 1 1/2 quarters, and then turned off the game.  This team is in serious trouble.  If last night's game was any indication, we're not even going to make the playoffs.
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What in the world was that?

Post  Oracle on Fri Jan 05, 2018 11:29 pm

I saw the score early and knew where that train wreck was heading.

Sadly, I have no words, well none I care to voice out of frustration.

Wow, Don takes the cowards way out, can't say I'm surprised!
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Philly

Post  Sparma on Fri Jan 05, 2018 10:20 pm

By the time I started watching in the second quarter, the game was already settled.

Credit to Andre for playing through pain, if indeed he wasn't at further risk.

Solid showing for Buycks; Galloway showed a bit of life.

I'd give Moreland the edge over Boban tonight, even though he didn't score.

Ellenson showed some flashes.

Disheartening game.  Just not good enough.  Too late to tank I suppose.
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Seriously People

Post  WTF on Fri Jan 05, 2018 9:45 pm

"I will let the experts on this forum like you have some peace for the rest of the season." 


Now lets play the victim here SMH  facepalm. Everyone has strong opinions and I'm sure we use great effort not to project our personal views when expressing them though from time to time it might happen.  

Here's what I enjoy with most posters on here.  1. The majority here are willing to offer up facts towards there point of view on the team, players, coaching or whatever.   Most rely on numbers and statistics to back an argument or state their case I don't always by into the numbers but there a measurement for arguing a point of view. 2. Some may simply use the Gut Feeling or Eye Test to assess things I tend to do that quite a bit but even then I have to rely on some measures of statistical evidence while largely looking at all the intangibles.   3. I think in either of the 2 above cases it often leads to healthy debating and the excitement of seeing how it all unfolds down the line.  

Here's what I dislike about a few posters.  1. It seems lazy to never want to use numbers and stats to validate an opinion and rely heavily on hearsay and second hand information then pass it off as being a factual source of truth.  2. These people remind me of the old ESPN commercial where my sports knowledge is bigger than your sport knowledge but it was base on who had more statistical information except in the case of these people they're just simply right and everyone else is wrong. 3. It also seem cowardly for some posters to avoid reasonable debate with facts by including things not of topic to avoid being wrong.  Have you ever asked them a question only to have it ignored or the topic change to deflect from the subject I bet we're still waiting on some answers.  Standing your comments and opinions and back them up.
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I Know I Should Have Ignored It.....

Post  WTF on Fri Jan 05, 2018 9:01 pm

Oracle wrote:@Wise: The President is indeed president... of the electoral college, which is the way we do things, but that better change. He is NOT the president of the people, having lost by more than 3 million votes, so people can rightfully claim he's not their President. I don't advise making a point about it because there's nothing to do now, but I don't deny them their right to say it.

BTW, I wish Don hadn't brought that up, not sure where that rant came from, but since he did...

But you know that **** be bugging me when he does comments like that.  I'll just have to learn to be stronger and resist repsonding
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Really It's Sad Commentary

Post  WTF on Fri Jan 05, 2018 8:28 pm

It is stupid how SVG is handling Kennard and I hope it doesn't ruin this kid confidence at least I don't think it will.  But SVG is clearly in the way of progress for this young man.   I can see Kennard putting up numbers in the same manner Tripuka did as a rookie if he's giving a real opportunity like how we treated rookies in the past.   Imagine SVG playing this game with a rookie Grant Hill.  Imagine if Chuck didn't have the balls to toss Joe to the wolves after Long went down with an injury.

When Bradley went down there was no doubt that Kennard should have immediately went to starting and playing 30 minutes and now that Reggie down he should be finding minutes for him at PG as well.   There is no way that this kid shouldn't be logging 30 minutes a game rather at 1 single position or at various position during a single game (Meaning find him minutes no matter where at)
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Stuff...

Post  Oracle on Fri Jan 05, 2018 8:24 pm

Boban: This is ridiculous!!! They didn't just invent tape when Boban came here. If SVG didn't know EVERYTHING he's complaining about now, he needs to be FIRED immediately! Nothing about Boban is new and he gave him that big(for him) contract and now he wants to be shocked, SHOCKED that there's gambling going on here?

Kennard: His time is NOW, everybody sees it if the media is finally talking about it  lol

@Wise: The President is indeed president... of the electoral college, which is the way we do things, but that better change. He is NOT the president of the people, having lost by more than 3 million votes, so people can rightfully claim he's not their President. I don't advise making a point about it because there's nothing to do now, but I don't deny them their right to say it.

BTW, I wish Don hadn't brought that up, not sure where that rant came from, but since he did...

@Murph: IMO, Drummond will be a superstar if he continues the improvement he's shown so far. He's getting better, and just a few more areas need addressing, and he's going to be there!
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Re: FORUM

Post  cool breeze on Fri Jan 05, 2018 8:17 pm

Murph wrote:"This is starting to look like the MSMBC trash talkers who hate our President."

Don, reading your last post is like listening to fake news.  For the last five years, you have been the single most negative poster on this forum.  You have relentlessly ripped our best player, Drummond, up one side and down the other for being stupid and lazy for 5 years.

You did it again two days ago, when you tried to compare Drummond to Deandre Ayton.  Come back to me in 10 years when Ayton has put together a healthy successful NBA career that's better than Drummond's before you start trashing Drummond in favor of Ayton.

And now you're all Mr. Positive...because 3 of your favorite players, Stanley Johnson, Avery Bradley and Eric Moreland are playing like crap, and are getting bashed on this board.  Now you write things like:

"Actually I am surprised that more of you were not satisfied with how the Pistons played in this last game. It is almost impossible to pull out a win when your opponent makes 17 three point shots and many of those shots were very difficult makes. Everything was bouncing Miami's way last night but did our players ever give up?"

Yeah well if Drummond had played as badly as Bradley and Moreland did against the Heat, you'd be writing a page long post with no paragraph breaks calling Drummond stupid and lazy in 50 different ways.

Reading your posts is like watching CNN for political news.  You are so biased in favor of your favorite players and against everyone else's favorites that it's embarrassing.

Oh my i guess there is no hope for civility as they used to say in the President Obama years Murph. What has this world come to? I have never denied my rants about players. Usually my complaints never involve players who try hard and give their all. I respect that. What I have never respected involving highly paid NBA basketball players is when they fail to give a reasonable effort that most unpaid high school players always make. faking it on the hardwood is very disturbing for me and makes my blood boil. That happened way too much last season and the culprits were none other than Andre Drummond and Reggie Jackson. Jackson did not look healthy and I blame some of his sorry playing time on Stan Van Gundy for having blinders on when both Reggie and Andre would go through the motions. It turns out that AD's nose might be partly to blame but I can't buy that completely. He quit on his team after the month around Christmas time. My post involving the comparison of Ayton to Drummond involved where they were in being NBA ready when they came into the draft. AD was a horrible college player. He was not ready and was fundamentally unsound. Meanwhile individuals like Shaq think Ayton is the 2nd coming because he can do a lot of great things on both ends now. And his basketball mind is more suited to success. However, anything can happen relating to injuries. AD has been a slow learner but this season he has shown that he can get better. Perhaps AD will peak when he is 28 or 29. Still he is a gamble because AD is just not a fundamentally sound basketball player and it appears that he really has problems with attention span and being "engaged" 100% for an entire game. Can he change that? Anything is possible and I hope he cares enough to do it for the Pistons.

I was just thinking about what it will be like for the team who gets Ayton. As Bill Walton says over and over Ayton might play for Arizona but put him on any team and they will win. Got got me with that CNN stuff. That hurts Murph. Have I gone so far off base that I sound like Chris Mathews? Holly hell what have I done to myself? It seems that I piss off too many posters these days. I like to protect the players that I see on the court who have great heart and show that they really care. If they screw up at times, I forgive them as a stupid fan. So maybe I do go overboard often trying to protect them. I sure did that with Brandon Knight. Maybe it is time for me to move on to a different sport. Bill Laimbeer cannot watch NBA games anymore. It couldn't been easy for him to just stop watching. I will let the experts on this forum like you have some peace for the rest of the season.

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Preaching To The Choir

Post  BallinD on Fri Jan 05, 2018 3:15 pm

Good read on Kid Kennard.  Gives us hope for the future.  Please trade Bradley, (throw in Stanley) not that Kennard is better, but cost analysis shows this may be a way to get a 1st round pick? and to start to stockpile talent rather than lose players for nothing!

LINK: Luuuuuuuuke!

This is just a tidbit from Fansided:  "At 6.5 points per game, Kennard’s numbers don’t immediately jump off of the page, but the Pistons’ first round pick has contributed at a high level when given the opportunity.

Consider this.

Mitchell has only had five games this season where he has played under 25 minutes and taken eight shots or less. In those games, he’s averaging a miserable 4.0 points per game on 25.0 percent shooting in 18.6 minutes of floor time.

That’s about the relative court time and usage rate that Kennard has been seeing on a nightly basis since the beginning of November.

There’s something to be said about allowing rookies to get into the flow of the game and that means giving them ample playing time on a consistent basis." Amen!

Fansided: The Pistons’ rookie owns a true shooting percentage of 54.4 percent compared to Mitchell’s 54.6 percent. Kennard has taken 41.8 percent of his field goal attempts from beyond the arc, while Mitchell has shot 40.3 percent of his attempts from deep so far this year.

Kennard owns an offensive rating of 103 and a defensive rating of 107. Mitchell comes in at 102 and 107, respectively.  Wake up SVG.  Repeat after me: Stupid Van Gundy!
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Boban/ Murph

Post  Sparma on Fri Jan 05, 2018 2:25 pm

Thanks for that Murph. I'd used them before, but hadn't realized the defensive ranking is right there. Boban's D ranking's gotten worse each year! From an outstanding 96 (with SA), to an ok 103, to a shaky 106, as you point out. Can't resist mentioning that his career average is 100 (including SA), still better than Eric.

Still, that's worse than I thought, and significantly worse than Moreland this year. I'll stick with my contention that he's got defensive strengths, along with glaring weaknesses, but with diminished confidence. Those aren't good D numbers for this year!

Strengths wise: In the 538 story they mention lowered shooting percentage within 6 feet of the basket when he's defending (no surprise when you're trying to shoot over a giant); also (as best I understand) that he'd have the 2nd best rebounding rate (among all Pistons, I think) after Rodman if he qualified there.

He poses quite a puzzle. Clearly, I don't think Stan's up to solving the Boban puzzle, let alone the Boban & Moreland puzzle, but this evening will pose another interesting opportunity, especially assuming AD's still out.





Murph wrote:"I've been contending that Boban has great weaknesses but also strengths on D. I don't have access to some of ESPN's stats, the ones you pay for."


Sparma...try Basketball Reference for all the stats you'd ever want to surf through.  You can spend hours, days, weeks cross referencing basketball statistics to your hearts content.  And it's free!

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/marjabo01.html

https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/DET/2018.html


Boban's defensive rating this year is 106, which ties him for 5th on the team with Stanley Johnson.  Meanwhile, his offensive rating is 116, which is 2nd on the team to only Reggie Bullock.

Incidentally, Moreland's defensive rating is 101, which is 2nd on the team to only Drummond.
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Not My President!!!!!

Post  WTF on Fri Jan 05, 2018 9:49 am

This is starting to look like the MSMBC trash talkers who hate our President.

I don't claim him, didn't vote for him, don't want him you can keep him.  Hell I don't want SVG I claim his arse either, didn't vote for him, don't want him and hope like hell we don't keep him.  

Can you impeach a coach and owner? 
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Basketball Reference

Post  Murph on Fri Jan 05, 2018 8:05 am

"I've been contending that Boban has great weaknesses but also strengths on D. I don't have access to some of ESPN's stats, the ones you pay for."


Sparma...try Basketball Reference for all the stats you'd ever want to surf through.  You can spend hours, days, weeks cross referencing basketball statistics to your hearts content.  And it's free!

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/marjabo01.html

https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/DET/2018.html


Boban's defensive rating this year is 106, which ties him for 5th on the team with Stanley Johnson. Meanwhile, his offensive rating is 116, which is 2nd on the team to only Reggie Bullock.

Incidentally, Moreland's defensive rating is 101, which is 2nd on the team to only Drummond.
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Fake News

Post  Murph on Fri Jan 05, 2018 7:44 am

"This is starting to look like the MSMBC trash talkers who hate our President."

Don, reading your last post is like listening to fake news.  For the last five years, you have been the single most negative poster on this forum.  You have relentlessly ripped our best player, Drummond, up one side and down the other for being stupid and lazy for 5 years.

You did it again two days ago, when you tried to compare Drummond to Deandre Ayton.  Come back to me in 10 years when Ayton has put together a healthy successful NBA career that's better than Drummond's before you start trashing Drummond in favor of Ayton.

And now you're all Mr. Positive...because 3 of your favorite players, Stanley Johnson, Avery Bradley and Eric Moreland are playing like crap, and are getting bashed on this board.  Now you write things like:

"Actually I am surprised that more of you were not satisfied with how the Pistons played in this last game. It is almost impossible to pull out a win when your opponent makes 17 three point shots and many of those shots were very difficult makes. Everything was bouncing Miami's way last night but did our players ever give up?"

Yeah well if Drummond had played as badly as Bradley and Moreland did against the Heat, you'd be writing a page long post with no paragraph breaks calling Drummond stupid and lazy in 50 different ways.

Reading your posts is like watching CNN for political news.  You are so biased in favor of your favorite players and against everyone else's favorites that it's embarrassing.


Last edited by Murph on Fri Jan 05, 2018 8:17 am; edited 1 time in total
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Boban's D

Post  Sparma on Fri Jan 05, 2018 12:37 am

I've been contending that Boban has great weaknesses but also strengths on D. I don't have access to some of ESPN's stats, the ones you pay for. Going back to April of 2017, I did find some relevant stuff below (Palace of Pistons).

Noteworthy:
- Boban's defensive rating with San Antonio (96) the previous year would put him at the top of the list (which doesn't copy) of the defensive rating of centers in 2016-17. (With the Pistons he dropped to a 103 last year).
--SA found a way to play to his strengths on D. Of course, a lot of that would come from them having a better D. Beyond that, given the right personnel, you could often rotate on D. And having a strong perimeter D would allow him to anchor the middle with fewer costs.
-- A surprise to me: SA played him twice as many minutes as Detroit did last year. As I remember, he had the 2nd highest PER in the league with SA. Maybe the greatest NBA coach ever was able to get twice as many, super productive, minutes out of him as SVG. Last year was somewhat understandable given that Baynes was a really productive back up center (he's on the list of best defensive rating for Cs). The idea that Boban's undeniable limitations doom him to the minutes SVG finds for him is bogus. That's not just me as a dilettante saying that, but comparing what one of the greatest coaches ever could get out of him (at an earlier stage of development!) to what SVG can.



"Lastly, and maybe most importantly, Boban’s defensive rating in San Antonio was a 96 (he played twice as much!) and it ballooned all-the-way-up to 103 with the Pistons. This is important because when Boban is surrounded by enough help and/or a better defensive scheme, he is able to protect the paint and rim. If Boban is able to regain his defensive rating of 96 while playing formidable minutes, he would be a top tier defensive center as well (source: NBA.com, 2016-17 Centers defensive ratings, sorted by playing 20 games minimum):

Although Boban’s offensive game has seemingly unlimited potenital, he does struggle on defense. Specifically, Marjanovic lacks the quickness to keep up with the perpetually switching rotations of NBA defense and he struggles covering stretch centers."
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Trouble Man

Post  BallinD on Thu Jan 04, 2018 9:58 pm

SVG is going to err on the side of screwing over the youngsters, though we all want to see Kid Kennard get valuable minutes.  I knew he was going to overplay Bradley returning from injury over the more efficient Bullock or Kennard, and sure enough, like clockwork, he did.("That one is on me,"  SVG admits in his 142857th mea culpa).  I think it is abundantly clear that we can afford to swing a trade for Bradley at the deadline, given Kennard and Bullock.  

I would keep Boban, but that is a powderkeg.  Folks need to catch a clue, IMHO  I watch the games and Moreland getting twisted around by the Olynyks of the world regularly, and when he scores his next point it will probably be in the G League. facepalm  So if the "Straight G" player like Olynyk scores on Moreland Tolliver and Boban with ease, why wouldn't you want to give some burn to the guy who can at least score back?!?!

For the fourth year in a row, will SVG give away Talent (this time Bradley) without trying to get anything in return.  Of course he will.  Just ask Josh Smith, Moose, KCP.  Maybe its because his brain is too addled to figure a way to integrate new players.  He couldn't figure out how to use Devin Booker, or Mitchell, though I think he did the right thing in drafting Kennard.  Why is he so arrogant, like a Joe Dumars retread...we don't need no stinking Kris Middleton?

I see the same old thing and I predict it will go down to the wire this year with SVG sitting on pins and needles waiting to get the Weggie back and the Experiment that is the Stanimal brick layer back in the lineup for our stretch run to mediocrity. hehe
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