FORUM

Page 3 of 40 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4 ... 21 ... 40  Next

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Re: FORUM

Post  Oracle on Tue Apr 28, 2015 10:52 pm

deusXango wrote:
Oracle wrote:But for some reason, you simply don't read it...
I'm not alone brother.

Just like your Monroe posts tend to start out with "I know this is unpopular" referring to moving Monroe! Really???

Everybody wants to move him, why haven't you got that memo? We're only dicking around about how best to do it!
"I know that I'm taking an unpopular stance, but I'm all for letting Monroe walk, for a number of reasons, the most glaring is, he wants too much money and attention for what he brings to THIS team." I believe this is how I started my post (singular time I posted that way) and it wasn't about moving him, it was about letting him move on without compensation, and I know that's not what the average wants!

Oracle, I give, you win, you're absolutely correct on all points; I yield, I'll cease and desist from making any posts, that way I won't sport my ignorance.


Bye!
avatar
Oracle

Posts : 6255
Join date : 2011-12-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Final salvo, followed by the white flag

Post  deusXango on Tue Apr 28, 2015 10:24 pm

Oracle wrote:But for some reason, you simply don't read it...
I'm not alone brother.

Just like your Monroe posts tend to start out with "I know this is unpopular" referring to moving Monroe! Really???

Everybody wants to move him, why haven't you got that memo? We're only dicking around about how best to do it!
"I know that I'm taking an unpopular stance, but I'm all for letting Monroe walk, for a number of reasons, the most glaring is, he wants too much money and attention for what he brings to THIS team." I believe this is how I started my post (singular time I posted that way) and it wasn't about moving him, it was about letting him move on without compensation, and I know that's not what the average wants!

Oracle, I give, you win, you're absolutely correct on all points; I yield, I'll cease and desist from making any posts, that way I won't sport my ignorance.
avatar
deusXango

Posts : 2831
Join date : 2011-12-21
Location : Oaxaca, Mexico

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Don

Post  Oracle on Tue Apr 28, 2015 9:36 pm

Don wrote:Oracle wouldn't changing the rules to prevent intentional fouls on weak free throw shooters make Andre Drummond happy? Gosh then we can look forward to watching him get worse. He did get worse this season when compared to the previous season. Face it the only teams that want to banish using intentional fouls against weak NBA players as part of their strategy to win games are teams who have key players who can't shoot free throws. If the league changes the rules, then they have made a statement that the NBA encourages bad habits and eliminates another potential strategy teams can use against each other. As it is, the NBA has become a league for dummies rather than producing excellent complete basketball players.

I specifically didn't address Drummond or any other team, I addressed what's right!

Intentional fouling is NOT a part of the game, that's the point, nothing else, and it has ZERO to do with pressure to learn fundamentals or sending messages other than the NBA should be about basketball!

This is a FLAW in the sport of basketball... period!

It's the kind of cheating that's embedded into American Culture so deeply, you don't even see it for what it is!
avatar
Oracle

Posts : 6255
Join date : 2011-12-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FORUM

Post  cool breeze on Tue Apr 28, 2015 9:21 pm

Oracle wrote:
cool breeze wrote:Put Labron James on the Bucks and I believe no NBA team could beat them. The Bucks are playing defense on the same level as some of Michael Jordan's superior defensive teams that won it. And Labron would love to play with those Bucks players too.

On the other hand, there is no way Labron could win the championship with the players Van Gundy had this past season. No way in hell! Labron if forced to play with the Pistons would insist on hand selecting two big men in the D League to man the 4 and 5 positions.

And how many seasons have we fans been told that the strength of the Detroit Pistons is our two big men Greg Monroe and Andre Drummond. Get real Stan and start over and please don't bring back C. Butler for another go around. Who are you trying to fool?

Don, I watched that game, and the Bulls turned the ball over constantly(well Rose at least), and it had nothing to do with defense! They also must have missed 20 layups less than 1 foot from the rim, and a few right at the rim.

Yes the Bucks have potential, and yes they do play defense first, so I'm not saying I don't see good things ahead for them, but right now, they suck, IMO!

Having said that, I am amazed how well Kidd is doing with these youngsters.

Now to your comments. Yes, our big men are troublesome on the defensive end! I guess I really hate to face that, but the difference between where they need to be and where they are is HUGE!

Drummond should not be called a franchise player at this point, potential, but not there yet! Of course that has nothing to do with him getting a max contract, he does deserve that, but he has a ton of work to do.

Comment & Statement:

  1. I disagree that LeBron could take that Buck team very far! He's going to have struggles, even with his current team, and they have very decent bigs, a fantastic ball handler in Irving that can score, Love who can do it all, JR Smith off the bench, the Bucks aren't anywhere near that category.
  2. I don't like the intentional fouling. Some say that the way to end it is to be able to make free throws, but that argument sucks to me. My reason for not liking it is that an intentional foul is NOT a basketball move or play! A foul is part of the game, but an unintentional part of the game, it plays no role in the operation of basketball! Neither does taking charges, they're both cheats! Intentionally taking a charge should be a foul... just my opinion!



Oracle I saw Rose taking the bate to drive where the Bucks were waiting to ambush him. Rose felt he had to go it alone because all of the Bucks players played near perfect positional defense on his Bulls teammates. Butler was 5 for 21 from the floor. Rose had 6 turnovers and scored a total of 15 of 20 shot attempts and all of his 7 three point attempts. The easy shots missed around the rim in my opinion were missed because the Bucks hands were near the ball and the fear Chicago players had that their shot would be sent to the rafters. I am sure the Bulls will cut down on their 13 turnovers and attack in a different way, but please don't try to say that the Bucks didn't give a great effort which would be enough to beat most teams last night. Can they sustain that at home for game 6? Some people believe that they can do it and bring it to a game 7. I personally love watching this series. The Bulls had to play outstanding basketball to win those first 3 games. And compared to our Pistons, the Bucks are far superior in every way and especially their front office planning. It isn't even close. Those young Bucks players are hard nosed kids who never know when to quit. Management has created the right culture that Van Gundy only can talk about. They will get better and better unless bad luck with injuries happen to knock on their door. The Bucks play all out kick ass and take names basketball. Meanwhile, we have our plod horses running the floor like they have a stick up their rears. Oh I forgot that was when Charley played for our team with that 8.5 million dollar contract. Sorry for bringing that up again Joe. I just don't trust players who come into the NBA who are clueless about playing defense. It usually never works out well but many on this forum believe in miracles with our two big men. When you play in the NBA for 3 seasons or more and fail to even contimplate boxing out somebody when an opposing shot is launched, then that tells me that type of player will never care enough to listen to any coach. They will listen to their agent instead. I want to see for myself that Andre Drummond is interested in doing the right thing for his team and that he plans to stay around if he does. Monroe knows that he has slow feet but to this day has not mastered basic fundamentals relating to playing defense. But I will say, Monroe was better in defensive situations than Drummond and better than he was the previous seasons.

Oracle wouldn't changing the rules to prevent intentional fouls on weak free throw shooters make Andre Drummond happy? Gosh then we can look forward to watching him get worse. He did get worse this season when compared to the previous season. Face it the only teams that want to banish using intentional fouls against weak NBA players as part of their strategy to win games are teams who have key players who can't shoot free throws. If the league changes the rules, then they have made a statement that the NBA encourages bad habits and eliminates another potential strategy teams can use against each other. As it is, the NBA has become a league for dummies rather than producing excellent complete basketball players. I would like the league to allow any type of zone defense. We could use more of a variety in strategy than less don't you think? As it is now, every team runs the same offensive plays. They try to draft or sign the same type of players. If you have a weaker market franchise, then you usually get the worst players to run those plays and always suffer from low attendance or lack of basic interest. That is currently the issue with the Pistons. The Pistons had to sign players like Will Bynum to get fans to attend games. Create a circus act and have some great halftime entertainment. The fans are justified in not attending games when their players can't figure out the fundamentals of the game or never were interested or mentally capable. They don't have to because they were giant sized people who can run and chew gum at the same time. Imagine if the league were more creative to encourage different styles, how interesting that could be for everyone. Extend the 3 point line out and create a 4 or 5 point shot ( that might open the door for players like the great George Yardley who couldn't make an NBA team today even if he were in his prime). Widen the painted area and finally admit that there were special Shaq rules when he played. (How can we forget the dull plays Shaq developed where he put his butt out and inched his way towards the rim pushing back his defender before making his signature turn move where he stopped twisted and rammed his shoulder into his defender. then to cap it off he put his off arm on the shoulder of that defensive man to help him get up high enough to dunk the basketball. That play took about 6 seconds to develop and wouldn't be allowed in 8th grade basketball.) I am sure that Mutombo would be in favor of the NBA (now that David Stern is gone) finally admitting their guilt in fixing those basketball games for the Lakers in the playoffs. To stay with this theme how about encouraging rules to benefit teams that use the full court press? Reduce the time teams are allowed to get the basketball past half court. Reduce the 5 second rule to 4 seconds on inbounding the basketball. Instead the NBA has gone backwards to the Planet of the Apes by discouraging teams from placing their focus on defense and brains while allowing palming of the basketball and 3 to 4 steps without dribbling on drives to the basket for certain players to help create higher scoring. (Labron did that when Cleveland beat the Pistons at home in the playoffs for the first time. That is how he scored around 50 points). The rules are set up for fans who don't pay close attention and don't even bother to learn the rules of the game. This current game is designed for space cadet fans who only admire the shooters. I want more and hate the fact that our Piston teams now are known as SOFT around the league. DEMAND MORE PISTON FANS. DON'T BE SUCKERED ANYMORE BY THE FRONT OFFICE. MOTOR CITY BASKETBALL MUST RETURN.  

My rant for the day is now complete.

cool breeze

Posts : 2720
Join date : 2011-12-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

DX, this is the problem, and it keeps getting stated...

Post  Oracle on Tue Apr 28, 2015 8:21 pm

But for some reason, you simply don't read it...


DX wrote:First off I was talking about the SF's on the team and I feel that QM is deserving of the same chance they got, in terms of PT; unless someone saw something that blew their hair back in the play of Butler or Martin that I didn't, give the man a chance!


How many times must everyone here say that before you stop acting like nobody has said it?


You won't accept us saying that he should get a chance, your next post always responds like you never heard that from ANYONE!

Just like your Monroe posts tend to start out with "I know this is unpopular" referring to moving Monroe! Really???

Everybody wants to move him, why haven't you got that memo? We're only dicking around about how best to do it!

Let me apologize about the Chauncey comparison, it could be taken both ways, but I get your meaning now!
avatar
Oracle

Posts : 6255
Join date : 2011-12-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

My point missed by a million miles, intentionally or unintentionally

Post  deusXango on Tue Apr 28, 2015 5:55 pm

WISEFAN wrote:
Oracle wrote:
DX wrote:Oracle, I'm not looking for another potential All-Star, just a good, young, hard working player to fit in perfectly with what we have and contribute to a vastly improving team. If QM could be such a player, that'd make our search for quality contributors that much easier. IMHO.

Really? Then you should have been satisfied with Singler, because QM isn't even that good!

Your actions betray your words, you compare QM, at best an amateur D-Leaguer, to players we gave multi-year contracts to, as the future of our club? What in the world can you be thinking with these statements.

This dude will be gone before the season starts! You keep talking about his ability, but you offer no proof other than youtube videos that even Darko has!

The proof of ability is somebody giving you a multi-year contract to perform, if you can't get that, sorry, it ain't happening.

BTW, you dare to compare QM to Chauncey? At no point in Chauncey's career was he EVER without a multi-year contract. Moving between teams is no shame, but getting waived is... I give you QM!

And here you go again, it's not enough that I said we should give him a chance, nooooo, we have to say he not only needs a chance, but that he will be good enough to stay, and that he should be considered as part of our core!

In short, you won't take yes for an answer!

BTW, I am looking for a potential all star for SF, especially if SVG gets Johnson or Kaminsky, both of whom look to me like they have all star potential... start dreaming bigger, there aren't many Covington's in the D-League!

We should be looking for the best possible resources at every position on this team.  Last I check I didn't see an All Star on our roster at any position SF, PF, SG, PG or center. I'm not pounding the drum for 2nd rounders, D-leaguers, waived, players as part of this team going forward.  Don't get me wrong if they're on the squad I would love to see them flourish her.

I have to laugh at the Chauncey thing as well.  Chauncey was a lottery selection with great college credential who had issues of fit and not talent that got him traded multiple times. Also when given the opportunity both here and in Minny he seized the moment.  Big Difference!

First off I was talking about the SF's on the team and I feel that QM is deserving of the same chance they got, in terms of PT; unless someone saw something that blew their hair back in the play of Butler or Martin that I didn't, give the man a chance! We've got one lottery draft pick and can't totally rebuild a team on that (particularly since we need a SF and PF), and as has been stated ad gagum, a rookie isn't going to come in a make an immediate impact, so what's wrong with running out the best we already have until we can do better?

I never compared QM to Chauncey as players, I addressed the fact that because a player is moved several times before he settles in someplace where he can blossom has happened to some of the best, and I used some of our past greats as an example. Words were put into my mouth that I didn't say and if I were less sensitive to the fact that sometimes people in the forum arena get things wrong, I'd be having a hissy fit! Sh!t on QM, I want Durant here...he fits SVG style of play, and do a S&T for "Boogie" Cousins, because we need a beast inside! PG, lemme see; bring back BK7 instead of re-signing Jackson, he should be better than Jackson by now anyway and he's a Piston at heart.

Let me be cool because, y'all are my brothers and I'm not into offending my "peeps" over a debate.
avatar
deusXango

Posts : 2831
Join date : 2011-12-21
Location : Oaxaca, Mexico

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Don on Bucks

Post  Oracle on Tue Apr 28, 2015 3:52 pm

cool breeze wrote:Put Labron James on the Bucks and I believe no NBA team could beat them. The Bucks are playing defense on the same level as some of Michael Jordan's superior defensive teams that won it. And Labron would love to play with those Bucks players too.

On the other hand, there is no way Labron could win the championship with the players Van Gundy had this past season. No way in hell! Labron if forced to play with the Pistons would insist on hand selecting two big men in the D League to man the 4 and 5 positions.

And how many seasons have we fans been told that the strength of the Detroit Pistons is our two big men Greg Monroe and Andre Drummond. Get real Stan and start over and please don't bring back C. Butler for another go around. Who are you trying to fool?

Don, I watched that game, and the Bulls turned the ball over constantly(well Rose at least), and it had nothing to do with defense! They also must have missed 20 layups less than 1 foot from the rim, and a few right at the rim.

Yes the Bucks have potential, and yes they do play defense first, so I'm not saying I don't see good things ahead for them, but right now, they suck, IMO!

Having said that, I am amazed how well Kidd is doing with these youngsters.

Now to your comments. Yes, our big men are troublesome on the defensive end! I guess I really hate to face that, but the difference between where they need to be and where they are is HUGE!

Drummond should not be called a franchise player at this point, potential, but not there yet! Of course that has nothing to do with him getting a max contract, he does deserve that, but he has a ton of work to do.

Comment & Statement:

  1. I disagree that LeBron could take that Buck team very far! He's going to have struggles, even with his current team, and they have very decent bigs, a fantastic ball handler in Irving that can score, Love who can do it all, JR Smith off the bench, the Bucks aren't anywhere near that category.
  2. I don't like the intentional fouling. Some say that the way to end it is to be able to make free throws, but that argument sucks to me. My reason for not liking it is that an intentional foul is NOT a basketball move or play! A foul is part of the game, but an unintentional part of the game, it plays no role in the operation of basketball! Neither does taking charges, they're both cheats! Intentionally taking a charge should be a foul... just my opinion!

avatar
Oracle

Posts : 6255
Join date : 2011-12-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Final thought regarding this Bucks team compared to our Pistons

Post  cool breeze on Tue Apr 28, 2015 3:06 pm

Put Labron James on the Bucks and I believe no NBA team could beat them. The Bucks are playing defense on the same level as some of Michael Jordan's superior defensive teams that won it. And Labron would love to play with those Bucks players too.

On the other hand, there is no way Labron could win the championship with the players Van Gundy had this past season. No way in hell! Labron if forced to play with the Pistons would insist on hand selecting two big men in the D League to man the 4 and 5 positions.

And how many seasons have we fans been told that the strength of the Detroit Pistons is our two big men Greg Monroe and Andre Drummond. Get real Stan and start over and please don't bring back C. Butler for another go around. Who are you trying to fool?

cool breeze

Posts : 2720
Join date : 2011-12-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FORUM

Post  cool breeze on Tue Apr 28, 2015 2:47 pm

Oracle wrote:Ok, I was being kind, it's a total Cluster F**K!!!

Rose really hurts the Bulls defensive scheme, they play a lot better without him.

But oddly, he's hurting them offensively as well, they seem totally out of sync!

Sloppy basketball by both, but credit the Bucks, they won!

I know you are not discounting the potential of this Bucks team with this post. This game was not about Chicago. It should be about the Bucks and what their management has done to create a team that will be difficult to beat in the future. Under Kidd's coaching and leadership, these Bucks players understand how to win in the NBA.

This Bucks team is doing something different from any other NBA team. I love it. It shows how stupid Joe Dumars was with his insane idea that a team can win with players who have no understanding and history of playing solid defense. The Bucks players are not only really good defenders individually but they are long, lean and quick and can play good team orientated defense. They come up with loose balls and anticipate what play their opponent is running. They are incredibly quick to the ball be it rebounding or blocking shots. And now there is the confidence factor going forward that their team chemistry and the way they approach playing basketball might be better than any other NBA team. As a group these Bucks players are not good offensive players. They miss open shots often. But throughout this season they have led the league in creating turnovers. Both of their point guards are getting better in crunch time situations. In the close out game at Chicago it was Bayless who played really well. And last night Michael Carter Williams was outstanding with elite level driving and finishing to go with an outstanding defensive effort. The team targeted Chicago's two best scorers, Butler and Rose and stopped both cold because the team executed their defensive plan of attack to stop those two players. Now the experienced Bulls team will need to reload and come back with something new to win this series.

I personally love this series. How many years have some of us been talking about our inept management where all we have seen wearing Piston uniforms are reject defensive losers. This team is still loaded with the same kind of players. You cannot win crap without having players and management that wants to build a superior defensive team if you have a small market team in the Mid West area. Our management under the rule of Joe Dumars went the opposite way hand picking players who had no idea or had no interest in playing defense. They were after stats to build their chances of getting another contract. That last contract given to Stuckey was INSANE. And the two contracts given to Gordon and Charlie V were more insane. Yes we had insanity in our front office for sure Piston fans. And now we have Stan Van Gundy. Is he all talk and will be fully satisfied in making the playoffs in this weak Eastern Conference? I want to see better athletes and better leadership and can stomach another losing season if the team is on the right track. When you have two huge big men who are limited in ability and drive to become outstanding two way players, then you are stupid to keep the same thing going. We have two big men who have never played good defense and because of their lack of interest are having a difficult time catching up even if they are dedicated to trying harder to get it right. Was Henson the better choice in the draft if you really are interested in creating a winning basketball team and developing a player who will stick around after his rookie contract expires? I know he can't make free throws either but this guy gets key rebounds and makes key blocks and he is getting better as a basketball player. A player can average 15 rebounds and game and average 15 points all with dunks but that means crap when it comes to winning basketball games. What are player agents telling the players they represent. Get the stats and make sure you spend most of your energy building stats and then get a max contract and move to LA or New York. How many stats are created for players who dive for loose basketballs or manage to get key blocks or key rebounds when games close? Players like that bond with their team fully. They are not interested in what their agents are telling them from week to week. Where are the stats for players who continually screw up defensive rotations? Where are the stats for players who after several seasons and coaching staffs still can't play pick and roll defense? Where are the stats for players who offer no resistance when opposing players drive into the paint? Remember when Ben Wallace was in his prime and refused to allow anyone to get an easy shot or layup in the painted area when he was in his prime? Yes Ben Wallace would have fit in well on that Bucks team but not this current Piston team. Meanwhile, We have soft pussy big men who get a thrill out of dunking the basketball. The agent says way to go Andre! The crowd loves it. The agent could care less about the Detroit Pistons. They are in it for the money not for the good of the NBA. Management knows that most fans don't know crap and they can easily sucker some fans to come to games much like they did with the circus act with Will Bynum and Brandon Jennings in previous seasons.

We fans need to get on the right track and stop talking about players like Quincy Miller of all players. Did any of you Miller supporters actually watch him play defense when he did get playing time? I am also not impressed with Shaun Williams. It was not because his 3 point shooting average was not up to the level Van Gundy was looking for, it was because he is not a stand out defensive player. Come on Stan Van Gundy stop trying to fool the fans. Get some hard nosed high energy players. Do not draft Stein. That guy cannot make a NBA rotation. I will be surprised if any of the 7 Kentucky players in this draft have the ability to make a rotation next year. They are all project type players who have the potential to get their skill set up to the necessary standard to make a contribution but they are not close to being good two way players yet. Even Winslow is not ready. He was one of the protected players in the NCAA tournament this year. He should have fouled out in the first half of every game. IN the Finals he committed at least 12 obvious fouls that were not called.

Detroit needs to draft either Stanley Johnson or Kaminsky in this draft.

cool breeze

Posts : 2720
Join date : 2011-12-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

I'll Add

Post  WTF on Tue Apr 28, 2015 12:47 pm

Oracle wrote:
DX wrote:Oracle, I'm not looking for another potential All-Star, just a good, young, hard working player to fit in perfectly with what we have and contribute to a vastly improving team. If QM could be such a player, that'd make our search for quality contributors that much easier. IMHO.

Really? Then you should have been satisfied with Singler, because QM isn't even that good!

Your actions betray your words, you compare QM, at best an amateur D-Leaguer, to players we gave multi-year contracts to, as the future of our club? What in the world can you be thinking with these statements.

This dude will be gone before the season starts! You keep talking about his ability, but you offer no proof other than youtube videos that even Darko has!

The proof of ability is somebody giving you a multi-year contract to perform, if you can't get that, sorry, it ain't happening.

BTW, you dare to compare QM to Chauncey? At no point in Chauncey's career was he EVER without a multi-year contract. Moving between teams is no shame, but getting waived is... I give you QM!

And here you go again, it's not enough that I said we should give him a chance, nooooo, we have to say he not only needs a chance, but that he will be good enough to stay, and that he should be considered as part of our core!

In short, you won't take yes for an answer!

BTW, I am looking for a potential all star for SF, especially if SVG gets Johnson or Kaminsky, both of whom look to me like they have all star potential... start dreaming bigger, there aren't many Covington's in the D-League!

We should be looking for the best possible resources at every position on this team. Last I check I didn't see an All Star on our roster at any position SF, PF, SG, PG or center. I'm not pounding the drum for 2nd rounders, D-leaguers, waived, players as part of this team going forward. Don't get me wrong if they're on the squad I would love to see them flourish her.

I have to laugh at the Chauncey thing as well. Chauncey was a lottery selection with great college credential who had issues of fit and not talent that got him traded multiple times. Also when given the opportunity both here and in Minny he seized the moment. Big Difference!

avatar
WTF

Posts : 4150
Join date : 2011-12-13

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Oracle

Post  deusXango on Tue Apr 28, 2015 12:34 pm

I know that I'm taking an unpopular stance, but I'm all for letting Monroe walk, for a number of reasons, the most glaring is, he wants too much money and attention for what he brings to THIS team. I've heard the argument put forth about the rising CAP and what a deal he'd be on the trade market, but I ain't buying it; all things being equal, if he has no takers now, he won't have any later. With the influx of younger, more skilled, and athletic C/PF, coming into the league, along with the development of some that are already in the NBA, Monroe's limited game will lose it's luster and trade appeal. We'll be stuck with an albatross around our neck, contractually speaking, bigger than Smith's, Gordon's, Villanueva's, and Meeks; the last thing we need, going forward, is a overpaid/untradeable player who the president/coach is determined to compete with. Since Monroe's been in the NBA the draft has always preceded FA...this is SVG's first shot at a lottery pick in his career and he's hamstrung with what to definatively do because of the b!tch style, diva like, approach Monroe has taken for two years running! Last year it was he wanted to see what it was like to experience unfettered FA, this year he's talking sh!t about he's not opposed to returning to the Pistons, well guess what numb nuts, you've never left the Pistons, but you know exactly what your worth is outside of Detroit, regardless of what your supporters think. See, an unpopular stance.

The core of our future has shifted with the production of a raw, none FT shooting, lost on defense, lazy center; he's outperformed the mainstay at center and forced him into a position where he's of lessor effectiveness...PF, and the glorious, accidental, acquisition of a PG that plays a sensible, team oriented game, who's enthused to be paired with our improving SG, who has the potential not only to become a great scorer, but a defensive demon, add to that mix our second year elite combo guard in the making, along with our lottery pick panning out, we're in better shape than this years record suggests. Be it Stanley Johnson or Mario Hezonja, Trey Lyles, Bobby Portis, Kripris Porzingis, or Frank Kaminski, we'll have a great pick to add to our arsenal (if they're not a bust), with an off season and full season together, Drummond, Jackson, and KCP should be something of a surprise to NBA followers, and our version of 6th man of the year, Dinwiddie, gives me hope.

FA is where I have another problem with Monroe. It's rumored that Boston is willing to give up their #16 pick to whomever takes on "Crashes" contract also; that would be great to have at worst the #8 and #16 pick this year, but it would take knowing exactly where Monroe's head was before we made that commitment...Johnson/Hezonja at #8 and Portis at #16 isn't out of the realm of possibility and I think that'd leave us super solid! There's going to be a legit, high production PF out there for the signing, who may not be that magical 20/10 guy (which Monroe has never been either), but a much better fit for what SVG wants to do. IMO the Moose is the fly in the ointment with his foot dragging, flip/flopping, about where he wants to be and knowing full well, it's not in Detroit.

Oracle, those are some of the unshakable thoughts I've had on those subjects, may be wrong, may be right, but in the end I just hope the team gets a whole lot better and soon.
avatar
deusXango

Posts : 2831
Join date : 2011-12-21
Location : Oaxaca, Mexico

View user profile

Back to top Go down

RE: Hi Wise, good to see you back...

Post  WTF on Tue Apr 28, 2015 12:27 pm

Oracle wrote:
WISEFAN wrote:I look at the Celtics crappy roster and bang my head in trying to figure out why the Pistons couldn't finish with a .500 record and make the playoffs. The C's were trying to tank at one point and still stumble into the playoff.  I'm not all that sure the Bucks had a better roster than ours talent wise.  The difference is we got pussy players and the Celtics and Buck don't.  We have better talent but they're all big pussies.

How about that Charlie V as well.  I watch both Josh and Charlie impacting a game.  Most nights Singler would have had to play every minute of regulation and 2 OT's to get 8 points and 6 boards. Well Charlie did it in 12 minutes of play.  I think we should have kept Josh and Charlie.  

Josh has been playing his ass off!!! IMO, without Josh, the Rockets are nowhere as good a team in the playoffs, as Josh has been a real difference maker!

I'm not shocked by this level of production, because as you said, Josh has a solid track record! He's still dumb as nails, but on that team, he's a LOT lower on the pecking order, so they keep most of it under control!

So why did the Celtics & Bucks make the playoffs, when the Bucks are clearly a putrid team, and the Celtics, while better, aren't as good as we are when playing right?
It's called Josh Smith and Brandon Jennings! Josh was HORRIBLE here for a lot of reasons!


  1. He's NOT a person to build a team around, but here, he was the biggest name player, and in the NBA, that means something and is highly respected(see Iverson starting over RIP on rep alone) so players here deferred to him, and he's no leader.
  2. Josh makes bad decisions and he makes the regularly unless controlled
  3. The announcers commented on something that always puzzled me about Josh. How can someone shoot 3's and can't shoot FT's?

Josh works in Houston because they have bigger names to control him, it's a great fit, but why you don't see that is odd, because having him here is a disaster!

We lost 23 games with Josh, and just winning a few of those gives us a shot at the playoffs, winning half of them would have put us in the playoffs near 6th seed.

So we aren't in the playoffs because of Josh #1, and Jennings injury #2, that's it, no hard math required Smile

Been reading just haven't had time to post much. I hear you on your reasoning with Josh just don't agree considering Josh is/was just a player on a team and the control thing was an SVG issue not a Josh issue. IMO SVG never coach to the level of talent he had on the team this goes for Cheeks as well but any coach with common sense wouldn't have allowed Josh to be a leader. As great as Rodman was every coach he played under had enough sense not to put him a leadership role but knew how to maximize his effectiveness on the court. What happening in Houston with Josh could have and should have worked here.

I think players deferring to Josh (Jennings, and especially Monroe) in clutch moments was just dumb on their parts. Josh gets the failures but not all the blame IMO.
avatar
WTF

Posts : 4150
Join date : 2011-12-13

View user profile

Back to top Go down

DX

Post  Oracle on Tue Apr 28, 2015 6:14 am

deusXango wrote:
Oracle wrote:Ok, I was being kind, it's a total Cluster F**K!!!

Rose really hurts the Bulls defensive scheme, they play a lot better without him.

But oddly, he's hurting them offensively as well, they seem totally out of sync!

Sloppy basketball by both, but credit the Bucks, they won!
Man-O-man, that sounds like what Monroe does for the "new Pistons" on both ends of the floor (we DID play better without him in the lineup and I won't forget that); Monroe has the same impact on the floor as Rose? Do you think David Falk can use that as a selling point to bidders for the Moose's services?

The good news is, when the Pistons make the playoffs, we'll probably go further than the first round and become something we haven't been in the past,  the darlings of the NBA. See the T-shirt slogan, "The City of From Worse To First." It's late and I'm crazy, so out.

DX, let's not argue about QM, he just isn't that important, what to do about Monroe, the future core, and getting the best draft pick and hot FA's and potential trades is where the real action is.

Can we just agree that we all would like to see QM get a shot to play, and he's slated to in the summer leagues where KCP got his shot to impress SVG, and he delivered. Good luck QM!
avatar
Oracle

Posts : 6255
Join date : 2011-12-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

DX

Post  Oracle on Tue Apr 28, 2015 1:15 am

DX wrote:Oracle, I'm not looking for another potential All-Star, just a good, young, hard working player to fit in perfectly with what we have and contribute to a vastly improving team. If QM could be such a player, that'd make our search for quality contributors that much easier. IMHO.

Really? Then you should have been satisfied with Singler, because QM isn't even that good!

Your actions betray your words, you compare QM, at best an amateur D-Leaguer, to players we gave multi-year contracts to, as the future of our club? What in the world can you be thinking with these statements.

This dude will be gone before the season starts! You keep talking about his ability, but you offer no proof other than youtube videos that even Darko has!

The proof of ability is somebody giving you a multi-year contract to perform, if you can't get that, sorry, it ain't happening.

BTW, you dare to compare QM to Chauncey? At no point in Chauncey's career was he EVER without a multi-year contract. Moving between teams is no shame, but getting waived is... I give you QM!

And here you go again, it's not enough that I said we should give him a chance, nooooo, we have to say he not only needs a chance, but that he will be good enough to stay, and that he should be considered as part of our core!

In short, you won't take yes for an answer!

BTW, I am looking for a potential all star for SF, especially if SVG gets Johnson or Kaminsky, both of whom look to me like they have all star potential... start dreaming bigger, there aren't many Covington's in the D-League!
avatar
Oracle

Posts : 6255
Join date : 2011-12-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FORUM

Post  deusXango on Tue Apr 28, 2015 1:07 am

Oracle wrote:Ok, I was being kind, it's a total Cluster F**K!!!

Rose really hurts the Bulls defensive scheme, they play a lot better without him.

But oddly, he's hurting them offensively as well, they seem totally out of sync!

Sloppy basketball by both, but credit the Bucks, they won!
Man-O-man, that sounds like what Monroe does for the "new Pistons" on both ends of the floor (we DID play better without him in the lineup and I won't forget that); Monroe has the same impact on the floor as Rose? Do you think David Falk can use that as a selling point to bidders for the Moose's services?

The good news is, when the Pistons make the playoffs, we'll probably go further than the first round and become something we haven't been in the past, the darlings of the NBA. See the T-shirt slogan, "The City of From Worse To First." It's late and I'm crazy, so out.
avatar
deusXango

Posts : 2831
Join date : 2011-12-21
Location : Oaxaca, Mexico

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Why can't QM fit in with Jackson, Dinwiddie, KCP, and Drummond?

Post  deusXango on Tue Apr 28, 2015 12:45 am

Oracle wrote:DX, thanks for the article: Jackson & Dinwiddie are no brainers as the PG's going forward! As Don said, Dinwiddie has an entirely different style, more like Chauncey in his ability to settle the team down, get them into their sets and execute in the half court, and amazing ability for a rookie! Dinwiddie doesn't need to be signed, but giving Jackson the absolute MAX is not only sound business, it's the right thing to do! It'll look like a bargain once the CAP rises, and it locks him up as he enters his prime!
Gee, thanks Oracle. Very Happy

Wise said he didn't notice KCP's jump in production... Wow! KCP made a big leap from his rookie year, let me repeat, rookie year, just in case you were expecting veteran numbers or something! I expect a smaller but more significant jump this coming season, KCP is developing nicely thank you!
Wise seems to be in critical overdrive and I understand it totally. This past season under SVG sucked like the past 5 under Joe, and the numbers don't lie; a whole lot of motion, but not very much traction. Given enough time and team improvement, he'll probably become one of KCP's biggest fans.

QM is another case, Wise is pretty much on the right path with him! Wise mentions that he got a big shot with Denver, but what he didn't mention was that he also got a shot with the Kings, and they couldn't use him. Let's not pretend he hasn't had plenty of opportunities, and nothing has happened... is everybody wrong?
How many hands did Chauncey go through before he ended up here? He had plenty of opportunities, was everybody wrong? Here in Detroit, he found a coach with a philosophy to match his ability to teach and a hand steady enough to see him through. "Play the right way," was the battle cry that led to a championship, where will "put up a f@ckin' wall," take us?

The answer is who knows, but we have absolutely no obligation to give him any shot of making the team. We didn't draft him, he's not a Piston or has Piston ties, SVG brought him aboard for insurance. Still, I would like to see the kid get a shot to see if he's as talented as some think he is, but Merc's Daye comparison is pretty good!
QM is just as much a Piston as Chauncey, Rip, Corliss, and James, because we didn't draft them either (by your standards of what it takes to become a "true Piston." Why bring him in as insurance, if he couldn't play, and you've got Cartier Martin, who was signed by SVG and healthy, on board? Austin Daye was damn near 7 feet tall and didn't reach 200 lbs.; to compare anybody over 6' 5" to Daye is just cruel. lol

NBA players have a lot of difficulty when it's not obvious what position they play! QM should be a PF, but he couldn't last there if his life depended on it, and he may not be able to defend the SF position well enough to ever be a starter, but he may become a quality backup.
PF? PF?! The only time I heard anybody else suggest QM was a PF was when SVG first signed him to be "insurance" for the Pistons. I recall a lot of the players that went elsewhere and blew up, were not seen beyond the coaches and fans took it for granted that if they didn't get any PT, they had nothing to offer...that proved to be untrue, more often than not. It would be a shame to dump a player who can fill a position of extreme need, is all I'm saying; if we could've played better than .500 ball and made the playoffs with who we had manning the SF spot, QM can move the needle this year!

Too early to tell, but why he gets as much ink here as he does surprises me because he doesn't move the needle on our future, and he's more likely to be back in the D-League than suiting up for us!
Wow! I'm stunned by such a positive and glowing prediction for a player who all we have is circumstantial evidence for/against. facepalm
Oracle, I'm not looking for another potential All-Star, just a good, young, hard working player to fit in perfectly with what we have and contribute to a vastly improving team. If QM could be such a player, that'd make our search for quality contributors that much easier. IMHO.
avatar
deusXango

Posts : 2831
Join date : 2011-12-21
Location : Oaxaca, Mexico

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Bulls vs Bucks = Clown Fest

Post  Oracle on Mon Apr 27, 2015 11:48 pm

Ok, I was being kind, it's a total Cluster F**K!!!

Rose really hurts the Bulls defensive scheme, they play a lot better without him.

But oddly, he's hurting them offensively as well, they seem totally out of sync!

Sloppy basketball by both, but credit the Bucks, they won!
avatar
Oracle

Posts : 6255
Join date : 2011-12-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

He's a disgrace to his race...

Post  Oracle on Mon Apr 27, 2015 10:35 pm

The human race!!!

And Joe drafted this slug loser!!! The Euro player that was going to make all American players look weak in comparison lol

avatar
Oracle

Posts : 6255
Join date : 2011-12-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Jackson, Dinwiddie, KCP & QM

Post  Oracle on Mon Apr 27, 2015 8:35 pm

DX, thanks for the article: Jackson & Dinwiddie are no brainers as the PG's going forward! As Don said, Dinwiddie has an entirely different style, more like Chauncey in his ability to settle the team down, get them into their sets and execute in the half court, and amazing ability for a rookie! Dinwiddie doesn't need to be signed, but giving Jackson the absolute MAX is not only sound business, it's the right thing to do! It'll look like a bargain once the CAP rises, and it locks him up as he enters his prime!

Wise said he didn't notice KCP's jump in production... Wow! KCP made a big leap from his rookie year, let me repeat, rookie year, just in case you were expecting veteran numbers or something! I expect a smaller but more significant jump this coming season, KCP is developing nicely thank you!

QM is another case, Wise is pretty much on the right path with him! Wise mentions that he got a big shot with Denver, but what he didn't mention was that he also got a shot with the Kings, and they couldn't use him. Let's not pretend he hasn't had plenty of opportunities, and nothing has happened... is everybody wrong?

The answer is who knows, but we have absolutely no obligation to give him any shot of making the team. We didn't draft him, he's not a Piston or has Piston ties, SVG brought him aboard for insurance. Still, I would like to see the kid get a shot to see if he's as talented as some think he is, but Merc's Daye comparison is pretty good!

NBA players have a lot of difficulty when it's not obvious what position they play! QM should be a PF, but he couldn't last there if his life depended on it, and he may not be able to defend the SF position well enough to ever be a starter, but he may become a quality backup.

Too early to tell, but why he gets as much ink here as he does surprises me because he doesn't move the needle on our future, and he's more likely to be back in the D-League than suiting up for us!
avatar
Oracle

Posts : 6255
Join date : 2011-12-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FORUM

Post  cool breeze on Mon Apr 27, 2015 3:11 pm

deusXango wrote:"Over the season's final 16 games, starting with the March 17 win over Memphis that snapped a 10-game losing streak, the Pistons were a top-10 offensive team and slightly better than an average defensive team. They went 9-7 over those final 16 games – despite playing without Greg Monroe for 11 of them – which tied with New Orleans at the bottom of the top 10 teams in the league during that stretch.

The Pistons shot .457 from the field and .386 from the 3-point line over those 16 games, well above their performance over the course of the season at .432 and .344. Over 82 games, .457 would have put the Pistons third in the league in overall shooting and .386 would have slotted them fifth.

Jackson clearly was the driving force behind the offensive surge. Over those final 16 games – and that's essentially 20 percent of the NBA season, hardly an insignificant sample size – Jackson averaged 20 points, 11 assists and five rebounds while shooting nearly 50 percent from the field and 40 percent from the 3-point line."
-From an article in NBA by K. Langlois

This is why I suggested re-signing Jackson to the max (if that's what it takes to keep him); we haven't seen PG play like that, since when? That Jennings outburst was an anomaly and couldn't be sustained, but Jackson showed is the tip of the iceberg...he can and will get better. If Moose max money can be justified, because of the rising CAP, then Jackson is damn near twice the value and grossly underpaid in comparison. Top tier PG's are hard to find and Jackson is a top tier PG!

I'm for keeping Spencer Dinwiddie as Reggie's backup because, he's bigger, longer, stronger, and plays a more controlled game than Jennings, not to mention he's coming in cheaper. I'm looking for a dominate 2nd unit, this upcoming season, and it should start with sound PG play, just where the starting unit left off.

Great post dX. I agree with everything you said here. With Jackson and Dinwiddie handling the point guard position we have two winners and dedicated gym rats. I wouldn't bet a dollar on Jennings staying in Detroit for more than one season. If Stan can trade him that will be a bonus. Over the long haul Jackson is a better choice over Jennings. The two cannot co exist. And with Dinwiddie the team gets an entirely different type of player. Spencer is a low turnover smart decision type offensive player and can become a lock down defender with his work ethic, size and athletic ability. And throughout Dinwiddie's basketball history, he has been known at a CLUTCH type player who hits winning shots and makes winning type plays when it counts. Jackson needs to keep the high intensity attack mode going while reducing his turnovers and saving more energy for defense. We have 3 players with high potential in Jackson, Pope and Dinwiddie. And we can hope that Drummond can become a real two way basketball player that can stay out of foul trouble and make free throws. Now to find 5 to 7 quality players to fill out the team and let them play together for two years.

cool breeze

Posts : 2720
Join date : 2011-12-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Hi Wise, good to see you back...

Post  Oracle on Mon Apr 27, 2015 2:55 pm

WISEFAN wrote:I look at the Celtics crappy roster and bang my head in trying to figure out why the Pistons couldn't finish with a .500 record and make the playoffs. The C's were trying to tank at one point and still stumble into the playoff.  I'm not all that sure the Bucks had a better roster than ours talent wise.  The difference is we got pussy players and the Celtics and Buck don't.  We have better talent but they're all big pussies.

How about that Charlie V as well.  I watch both Josh and Charlie impacting a game.  Most nights Singler would have had to play every minute of regulation and 2 OT's to get 8 points and 6 boards. Well Charlie did it in 12 minutes of play.  I think we should have kept Josh and Charlie.  

Josh has been playing his ass off!!! IMO, without Josh, the Rockets are nowhere as good a team in the playoffs, as Josh has been a real difference maker!

I'm not shocked by this level of production, because as you said, Josh has a solid track record! He's still dumb as nails, but on that team, he's a LOT lower on the pecking order, so they keep most of it under control!

So why did the Celtics & Bucks make the playoffs, when the Bucks are clearly a putrid team, and the Celtics, while better, aren't as good as we are when playing right?
It's called Josh Smith and Brandon Jennings! Josh was HORRIBLE here for a lot of reasons!


  1. He's NOT a person to build a team around, but here, he was the biggest name player, and in the NBA, that means something and is highly respected(see Iverson starting over RIP on rep alone) so players here deferred to him, and he's no leader.
  2. Josh makes bad decisions and he makes the regularly unless controlled
  3. The announcers commented on something that always puzzled me about Josh. How can someone shoot 3's and can't shoot FT's?

Josh works in Houston because they have bigger names to control him, it's a great fit, but why you don't see that is odd, because having him here is a disaster!

We lost 23 games with Josh, and just winning a few of those gives us a shot at the playoffs, winning half of them would have put us in the playoffs near 6th seed.

So we aren't in the playoffs because of Josh #1, and Jennings injury #2, that's it, no hard math required Smile
avatar
Oracle

Posts : 6255
Join date : 2011-12-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FORUM

Post  cool breeze on Mon Apr 27, 2015 2:53 pm

WISEFAN wrote:I look at the Celtics crappy roster and bang my head in trying to figure out why the Pistons couldn't finish with a .500 record and make the playoffs. The C's were trying to tank at one point and still stumble into the playoff.  I'm not all that sure the Bucks had a better roster than ours talent wise.  The difference is we got pussy players and the Celtics and Buck don't.  We have better talent but they're all big pussies.

How about that Charlie V as well.  I watch both Josh and Charlie impacting a game.  Most nights Singler would have had to play every minute of regulation and 2 OT's to get 8 points and 6 boards. Well Charlie did it in 12 minutes of play.  I think we should have kept Josh and Charlie.  

It is not hard to figure out why the Celtics make the playoffs and our Pistons didn't. We have the softest big men in the NBA when it comes to playing basic defense, protecting the paint from guards driving, failure to guard their own assigned player, and of course failure to box out and anticipate where the ball will come off the rim on missed opponent shots. This has been the major problem for the Detroit Pistons now for several years and it didn't get much better with Van Gundy coaching Monroe and Drummond. There is such a cover up going on relating to the inept play of our big men. All season Piston announcers kept telling us about the amazing scoring and rebounding stats our two big men are able to accumulate. That is what they seem to be after - STATS and they get them in times when the games were not on the line. Monroe is most likely history as a Piston but we can't be sure. If he returns we can expect more of the same from him although I suspect his offensive game might get better if he works at his mid range game more. But is Monroe even interested in improving his defense? He never had been interested enough in the past including college. And what about Drummond. Has Drummond ever been tuned into playing defense? He is no rookie. Anthony Davis played defense well as a rookie and then got much better. In what area has Drummond improved on defense? You are correct we do have not only pussy players but players who lack the basic knowledge of how to play basketball the right way. Other big men who kick our two huge player's asses night in and night out care more and work harder than our two glorified big men who seem to me to be guys who are not easily coached. Before they step onto the floor they look so imposing. Then as we watch the game get going we see signs of them getting real slow running from free throw line to free throw line. They take it easy at times and that is when our Pistons get burned. And of course there is all this talk that Drummond is the franchise player. Has he ever said that he wants to stay in Detroit when his contract comes up? Is he dedicated to making our Pistons better over a long period of time? Does he care enough about his team to improve his free throw shooting?

WIsefan you are on the right track if you are a bit depressed when thinking about our Pistons. We have a team that is starting over year after year. We do have some hope for the future in perhaps Jackson, Pope and Dinwiddie becoming great players and staying in Detroit. While a lot of fans and organization people with the Pistons believe that Drummond will become a smart winning type player, I have my doubts based in his history so far but I hope he is on the right track mentally and knows that he has a lot of work to do. I am worried about lack of loyalty by players who do improve enough to do anything meaningful as well. Joe Dumars created a culture where players would be smart if they did want to move elsewhere. He traded players for stupid reasons like Knight and Middleton and you can bet that Monroe has that in the back of his mind. He was friends with Knight before that trade and was really bothered by it. Nothing made any sense over the last 6 years when Joe Dumars ran the show. Some fans want to believe that Tom Gores and his group were behind that stupid give away trade. If Dumars believed in Knight and Middleton then why didn't he stand up for them and let it be known that he disapproved. That is what a real leader would do. Just one word from Dumars would have killed that deal. The past is the past and there is good reason why we get sick to our stomach as we watch other teams getting playoff experience. Detroit needs about 7 new players who are really NBA caliber type guys. We have too many fringe players that management has gambled on and lost.

When mentioning Charlie V we cannot forget that he was a complete losers when he was making that 8.5 million dollars per year. He gave less than any player I can recall who has ever worn the Piston uniform. The film doesn't lie. While Josh Smith played as hard as he could every night for the Pistons and it didn't work out well, he can hold his head high still, while Charlie can only be proud of his tweeting ability relating to his statements about how much talent he really has but has not been able to show it because of the various coaches Detroit hired. Charlie was a lazy ass player who should have been removed quickly regardless of the cost.

cool breeze

Posts : 2720
Join date : 2011-12-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

My case for keeping Reggie Jackson

Post  deusXango on Mon Apr 27, 2015 2:35 pm

"Over the season's final 16 games, starting with the March 17 win over Memphis that snapped a 10-game losing streak, the Pistons were a top-10 offensive team and slightly better than an average defensive team. They went 9-7 over those final 16 games – despite playing without Greg Monroe for 11 of them – which tied with New Orleans at the bottom of the top 10 teams in the league during that stretch.

The Pistons shot .457 from the field and .386 from the 3-point line over those 16 games, well above their performance over the course of the season at .432 and .344. Over 82 games, .457 would have put the Pistons third in the league in overall shooting and .386 would have slotted them fifth.

Jackson clearly was the driving force behind the offensive surge. Over those final 16 games – and that's essentially 20 percent of the NBA season, hardly an insignificant sample size – Jackson averaged 20 points, 11 assists and five rebounds while shooting nearly 50 percent from the field and 40 percent from the 3-point line."
-From an article in NBA by K. Langlois

This is why I suggested re-signing Jackson to the max (if that's what it takes to keep him); we haven't seen PG play like that, since when? That Jennings outburst was an anomaly and couldn't be sustained, but Jackson showed is the tip of the iceberg...he can and will get better. If Moose max money can be justified, because of the rising CAP, then Jackson is damn near twice the value and grossly underpaid in comparison. Top tier PG's are hard to find and Jackson is a top tier PG!

I'm for keeping Spencer Dinwiddie as Reggie's backup because, he's bigger, longer, stronger, and plays a more controlled game than Jennings, not to mention he's coming in cheaper. I'm looking for a dominate 2nd unit, this upcoming season, and it should start with sound PG play, just where the starting unit left off.
avatar
deusXango

Posts : 2831
Join date : 2011-12-21
Location : Oaxaca, Mexico

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Pussies and Stuff

Post  WTF on Mon Apr 27, 2015 1:09 pm

I look at the Celtics crappy roster and bang my head in trying to figure out why the Pistons couldn't finish with a .500 record and make the playoffs. The C's were trying to tank at one point and still stumble into the playoff.  I'm not all that sure the Bucks had a better roster than ours talent wise.  The difference is we got pussy players and the Celtics and Buck don't.  We have better talent but they're all big pussies.

How about that Charlie V as well. I watch both Josh and Charlie impacting a game. Most nights Singler would have had to play every minute of regulation and 2 OT's to get 8 points and 6 boards. Well Charlie did it in 12 minutes of play. I think we should have kept Josh and Charlie.
avatar
WTF

Posts : 4150
Join date : 2011-12-13

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Well Defended But..........

Post  WTF on Mon Apr 27, 2015 11:37 am

deusXango wrote:
WISEFAN wrote:QM is not an unknown commodity and has every opportunity to make a case for an NBA career lets not forget the fact that he was in Denver and was released by them.   QM is not some kid we just drafted like a Dinwiddie that you could make an argument for opportunity for.
Wise, no matter how he got here, he's here and should be accorded the same consideration that any young player the Pistons acquire, is all I'm saying. Please answer me honestly, so we can move on from this debate, do you see more game in Singler than you do in Miller, potentially? I mention Singler because he started at SF until he was traded. Honestly I see them both as irrelevant to the success of the team so I can't say I'm for either or for that matter who's the better choice.  I didn't care for Singler and never thought he was a proper fit on this team I certainly didn't see him as a starter on any team.

I'm not sure why anyone would be so strong an advocate for a player that was cut and the rest of the teams in the league aren't hot after.  It's okay to like a player and want to see him get a chance but in the case of QM he has had opportunities.  Should he have gotten a chance here I would say yes just based on the turds we had at SF playing in front of him in a season going nowhere.  IMO his ass should follow the entire bunch of SF on this team out the door because I'm tired of projects and rejects. I'm not sure where QM falls considering he couldn't make it in Denver.
Because the Pistons were the first team to grab him from the D-League, where he was the #1 rated player at the time, doesn't mean "the rest of the teams in the league aren't hot after," it means the Pistons didn't snore on this guy like they did Robert Covington. As far as being cut by Denver, Brian Shaw cut him; you do remember Brian Shaw and what he meant to the Nuggets don't you? Miller was playing behind Kenneth Faried, Danilo Gallinari, Wilson Chandler, and Darrell Arthur....that looks like a numbers game to me and I'd have taken Faried, Gallinari, or Chandler over any of our SF's! As a matter of fact, Wilson Chandler name comes up regularly as a target for the Pistons, but because Miller didn't outshine those guys, he ain"t sh!t is what I hear you saying. Okay.  I hear you but this is where I have a difference of opinion as is relates to a number game because Denver could have simply traded him oppose to just releasing him.  I think if he had the potential that any of the other four players mention would have brought further value to the team if they traded one of them and kept QM and continue to groom him as you like to see SVG do.  IMO my opinion I can't be completely sold on the numbers theory.

I think since we have had success with players like Chauncey, and drafted the likes of Worm,  and acquired a Big Ben. We know have this false illusion that every player with get has this same potential no matter how we acquired them (Draft, Trade, or Free Agency) I also think that the bad habit of throwing away talent before its time was an issue as well that led to this thinking.  Lets not make the mistake of thinking QM is a Middleton, Affalo, Bonzi Wells or Amir that we might have given up on prematurely.
facepalm   

Sadly we see this flash of potential early on with some players and 5 seasons later we're still waiting for it to manifest into stardom. We did it with Stuckey though a large part of the blame can go to coaching and Joe, we did it with Monroe who we should have traded after his second season. I'm laughing at the article posted on the side about KCP big jump! I must have missed it.
So far as Miller goes, I'm not advocating giving him a 5 year test run, like some mediocre players have been given here, but 1 year to prove or disprove his worth, and during that year be grooming the certain #8 draft pick to the nuances of the NBA...it's a win situation anyway you look at it. I can't argue your point here but it just not that important that he's giving the kind of opportunity you're suggesting if he gets it great I hope he succeeds but if he doesn't then he just on a long list of players in the league that didn't get afford the time to prove their worth.  

This team has stunk for so long that we've forgotten what type of players made up our championship teams that we settle and find hope in the most unlikely players.  The kind of hope being placed on QM should be reserved for lottery picks, star college players and proven winners at the college level.
QM played for one of the worst college coaches on the NCAA level of major competition, and no one is anointing him to be a savior, I'm just saying that he can be a contributing piece on a contending team, and I believe he'll fit in nicely with our core group of young players. With all this great coaching SVG is said to bring to the table, how come it doesn't factor into Miller's development? Again its a organization/coach decision. You have to ask what is it QM does or doesn't do in practice to warrant that kind of attention IMO if he's not showing his stuff in practice or exciting the coaching staff to the point that they think they have a diamond in the rough they are not going to take the time to develop him.

I don't really care if he's 110 lbs or 5"1 what I care about is can he impacts W's for the team, and what's already on his resume and he doesn't have a strong resume at this point.  He is unproven even as a role player, I don't mind keeping him on the team and in uniform but I be damn if he should be considered as an alternative for a starting or reliable backup SF.
What would be the point of keeping a 22 year old on your roster if you're predisposed to not considering him for anything from starting to backup duty? A player you find unreliable and lacking in enough skills/talent to get any PT, you wouldn't mind keeping on the team? Outstanding. Peep this. Because as long as he's on an NBA roster opportunity will always be present and isn't that what you want.  I have never looked at a 12th man on roster and felt he warranted PT, but God forbid injury comes and I don't have a 12th man to turn to. QM is just simply not the answer no more than Singler, Butler or Tay were.
This is last April: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVMhfcJpN9s

D League Highlights: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbItsBGblgk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AG_ajjnGho

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8Vijd0yCY0  

Also QM gets opportunity every time he shows up for practice to prove he deserves PT he doesn't deserve PT to prove he deserves PT.
**** I'm out.
Wise, you of all people should understand my passion for supporting a player that the whole world of basketball fans seem to hate; you championed Josh Smith, remember how that felt?

Wow look at Josh now that he's with a team with purpose and direction.  He's been balling his ass off in the 4 playoff games for Houston.  Hate Josh as they may Josh had a resume, and QM doesn't.  I don't think its a hate thing with QM he just not the answer
avatar
WTF

Posts : 4150
Join date : 2011-12-13

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: FORUM

Post  Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Page 3 of 40 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4 ... 21 ... 40  Next

View previous topic View next topic Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum