Mad at Frank

[Grizz2]

Last night Charlie was everywhere. There is no doubt that he was MVP in that game. However, I am not getting excited. Let's see if Charlie V can play like that against a good team or in the next game. I have my doubts but hope that I am wrong.

Daye hit two threes in the first half of this last game. His stroke looked good. However, I was not impressed with his floor game. And in the 2nd half, he was horrible. Daye flat out cannot defend anyone. This Washington team is so bad that nobody should get excited about anything other than the Pistons are more fun to watch than the year before and the year before that.

As usual the first and second year players had a tough time in the second half of this past game. However, the good news is that few first or second year players get to play much at all in this league. I thought that Singler started out good getting a steal and 4 rebounds in the first quarter and missing the one shot he took and I believe that is the only time he had an opportunity to touch the ball on offense. Singler missed two shots and had a charging call against him and was sent to the bench and slammed his fist against the back of a chair disappointed in the way he had played. Knight had a difficult 2nd half as well which is to be expected in a back to back game for a guy who gives 100% all the time.

My issue is with the coaching staff. When Daye and Singler were having problems, Jerebco had to sit out the entire game. That is so foolish. And of course the Russian had the same experience. The Pistons were down right horrible in the 3rd quarter but Frank decided he didn't need Jerebco or the Russian. Instead he brought in his two sons, Bynum and Daye. Now I believe the front office is requiring the coach to play Daye. There has been no valid reason to play him. I for sure like watching him hit the long ball but how many times has he been able to do that this season? And he rates as the worst or among the worst passers and defenders in the league. He played way too many minutes. Why can't Frank play more players and see who is playing well? Why keep Daye out there for so long at the expense of the team? And all the Russian needs is playing time and he will be an effective big man who offers better shot blocking and rebounding. And I am tired of watching "There Has Never Been A Shot I Didn't Like" Bynum screwing up the offense. If Frank replaces Prince with Maggette, I might have to boycott future games. This coaching staff sure can piss off a lot of fans and cause the attendence to drop even more as this season moves forward.

Cool Breeze .. A lot of us have issues with the way Frank is giving time to players who are hopeless .. while benching those who could actually develop into good players given a chance ... Really .. our rosters were a total mess with Curry and Kuester .. but now that we have decent or good players .. it is beyond infuriating to see little Larry showing how much power he has to implode the team ..

[Oracle]

I say we just trade for Cousin and give up all our expiring contracts to get him. Really people (Pistons Fans) is Cousins any worse than Sheed, or Rodman? Think too much is being made out of this.

Too answer PBoy quetstion no I wouldn't trade Drummond for Cousins, but I would love to have Cousins on this team. Let him keep acting up, let his stock keep falling so we can get him for little or nothing. I don't care if he curses the local media (lord knows I want too), so what he curses LF you didn't seem to mind Sheed cursing Flip, or Tay calling out the last 3 coaches (Larry, Moe and Curly) in the media

If Cousins was starting next to Moose and Drummond was coming off the Bench I don't think any of us could object to such a front court,

That won't be losing anything if Cousins blows up in our face!

You have to be in need of a big man in the worst way to take that chance, and with Drummond here, it would be gross misconduct to even contemplate that move!

BTW, I don't see how a team of Cousins & Drummond could even work on a nightly basis!

[Oracle]

Yikes!!!

[Only admins are allowed to see this link]

[deusXango]

Last night Charlie was everywhere. There is no doubt that he was MVP in that game. However, I am not getting excited. Let's see if Charlie V can play like that against a good team or in the next game. I have my doubts but hope that I am wrong.

Daye hit two threes in the first half of this last game. His stroke looked good. However, I was not impressed with his floor game. And in the 2nd half, he was horrible. Daye flat out cannot defend anyone. This Washington team is so bad that nobody should get excited about anything other than the Pistons are more fun to watch than the year before and the year before that.

As usual the first and second year players had a tough time in the second half of this past game. However, the good news is that few first or second year players get to play much at all in this league. I thought that Singler started out good getting a steal and 4 rebounds in the first quarter and missing the one shot he took and I believe that is the only time he had an opportunity to touch the ball on offense. Singler missed two shots and had a charging call against him and was sent to the bench and slammed his fist against the back of a chair disappointed in the way he had played. Knight had a difficult 2nd half as well which is to be expected in a back to back game for a guy who gives 100% all the time.

My issue is with the coaching staff. When Daye and Singler were having problems, Jerebco had to sit out the entire game. That is so foolish. And of course the Russian had the same experience. The Pistons were down right horrible in the 3rd quarter but Frank decided he didn't need Jerebco or the Russian. Instead he brought in his two sons, Bynum and Daye. Now I believe the front office is requiring the coach to play Daye. There has been no valid reason to play him. I for sure like watching him hit the long ball but how many times has he been able to do that this season? And he rates as the worst or among the worst passers and defenders in the league. He played way too many minutes. Why can't Frank play more players and see who is playing well? Why keep Daye out there for so long at the expense of the team? And all the Russian needs is playing time and he will be an effective big man who offers better shot blocking and rebounding. And I am tired of watching "There Has Never Been A Shot I Didn't Like" Bynum screwing up the offense. If Frank replaces Prince with Maggette, I might have to boycott future games. This coaching staff sure can piss off a lot of fans and cause the attendence to drop even more as this season moves forward.

Cool Breeze .. A lot of us have issues with the way Frank is giving time to players who are hopeless .. while benching those who could actually develop into good players given a chance ... Really .. our rosters were a total mess with Curry and Kuester .. but now that we have decent or good players .. it is beyond infuriating to see little Larry showing how much power he has to implode the team ..

Fellows have you noticed that with all the posturing Lil' Larry is doing, he's really coaching the same way Kuester did, and Curry was the last coach to coach the Pistons to a playoff berth? Both of these guys were novice HC's, so what can he possibly be trying to prove? That he's dumber than the dumbest?

My gut tells me that Dumars is not going to bail him out by making a meaningful trade (for all that're hanging on for the trade deadline), and his true coaching prowess is going to show game-by-game, after the all-star break. My gut also tells me that Gores favors Dumars more than he does Lil' Larry.

[Grizz2]

[/img][Only admins are allowed to see this image]

Player Net
Prince 5
Villanueva 4.3
Drummond 2.3
Stuckey 1.6
Monroe -1.5
Knight -2
Maxiell -3.6
Singler -4
Bynum -6.7
Daye -7.2
Maggette -8.5
English -8.7
Jerebko -13.6
Middleton -24.3


IMO, This so far is the best single stat to judge how players are doing ... of course .. HOW the players are used by the head coach is not indicated either so even this is not completely accurate .. This NET stat is plus / minus averaged with the players they were defending during the game ...

CV and Prince .. Congratulations ... Now Wise and Cool Breeze can both be happy!

Lawrence Frank (9-21)

PTS/G: 93.6 (24th of 30) Opp PTS/G: 95.7 (9th of 30)
SRS: -2.40 (20th of 30) Pace: 90.1 (26th of 30)
Off Rtg: 103.2 (20th of 30) Def Rtg: 105.5 (15th of 30)
Expected W-L: 13-17 (21st of 30)




Merry Christmas Everyone!

[Only admins are allowed to see this image]

[WTF]

I say we just trade for Cousin and give up all our expiring contracts to get him. Really people (Pistons Fans) is Cousins any worse than Sheed, or Rodman? Think too much is being made out of this.

Too answer PBoy quetstion no I wouldn't trade Drummond for Cousins, but I would love to have Cousins on this team. Let him keep acting up, let his stock keep falling so we can get him for little or nothing. I don't care if he curses the local media (lord knows I want too), so what he curses LF you didn't seem to mind Sheed cursing Flip, or Tay calling out the last 3 coaches (Larry, Moe and Curly) in the media

If Cousins was starting next to Moose and Drummond was coming off the Bench I don't think any of us could object to such a front court,

That won't be losing anything if Cousins blows up in our face!

You have to be in need of a big man in the worst way to take that chance, and with Drummond here, it would be gross misconduct to even contemplate that move!

BTW, I don't see how a team of Cousins & Drummond could even work on a nightly basis!

Man I would rotate these three (Monroe, Cousins, Drummond) both are a perfect match for Monroe and if say's Drummond could learn to play both PF and center then it works with pairing him with either Monroe or Cousins sort of like rotating three guards.

Not like Cousins has some crazy contract attached to his ass that we'll be stuck with him, It's definitely worth taking a look at. Lets not forget Cousins wanted to be a Pistons, he liked Joe prior to the draft and Joe wanted Cousins.

[Oracle]

Man I would rotate these three (Monroe, Cousins, Drummond) both are a perfect match for Monroe and if say's Drummond could learn to play both PF and center then it works with pairing him with either Monroe or Cousins sort of like rotating three guards.

Not like Cousins has some crazy contract attached to his ass that we'll be stuck with him, It's definitely worth taking a look at. Lets not forget Cousins wanted to be a Pistons, he liked Joe prior to the draft and Joe wanted Cousins.

Wise that doesn't have a snowballs chance in hell of working! You seriously underestimate the ego of NBA stars that are used to starting! If Cousins can't start, there's going to be trouble in river city.

However, you said something that makes a lot of sense, and let me add to it to make it a lot more workable!

First, you're totally right that Cousins doesn't have a crazy contract, in fact, as contracts go, it's puny! So that opens the door, IMO, to make a move to get Cousins easier to swallow!

Secondly, if we do this, we HAVE to trade Monroe... we won't need him anymore!

Third, we start Cousins at the PF, and Drummond at Center. Why? Well, Cousins is the scorer, and while he can defend, Drummond is the ace in that department! These two would dominate the NBA for YEARS, and I do mean DOMINATE!

Fourth, and one thing not mentioned, is that this will reunite Cousins with his college PG, Brandon Knight! Then I do believe that between Knight & Joe, Cousins would be in an environment where he would feel at home and produce. Not to mention that he would be in a position where he knew he had to produce or face possibly being out of the league!

Ok, I'm on board, Joe drop the doughnuts and pick up the phone! Take Wise's advice and unload every expiring we got, and Monroe, but get this done!!!

[Oracle]

First Phillip poses a question.

Then Mercury poses a trade, but the key is that Merc wants to trade Monroe, and that ingnites the thought process.

Wise, never one to leave the Status Quo(lol), poses a radical move!

His thoughts makes me rethink what he and Mercury said, and BAM, I make some mods that I hope will help, I'm on board... anybody else?

Diversity of thought is a beautiful thing!!!

[Grizz2]

First Phillip poses a question.

Then Mercury poses a trade, but the key is that Merc wants to trade Monroe, and that ingnites the thought process.

Wise, never one to leave the Status Quo(lol), poses a radical move!

His thoughts makes me rethink what he and Mercury said, and BAM, I make some mods that I hope will help, I'm on board... anybody else?

Diversity of thought is a beautiful thing!!!

Oracle .. Right ....And then you summarize it ...Kudos to all involved .. especially to Phillip for posting the intriguing question ..

[deusXango]

First Phillip poses a question.

Then Mercury poses a trade, but the key is that Merc wants to trade Monroe, and that ingnites the thought process.

Wise, never one to leave the Status Quo(lol), poses a radical move!

His thoughts makes me rethink what he and Mercury said, and BAM, I make some mods that I hope will help, I'm on board... anybody else?

Diversity of thought is a beautiful thing!!!

Gentlemen, Lil' Larry won't pair Monroe with Drummond, what makes you think he'll do things differently because Cousins is here? We have the untried Russian, who still may get DNP-CD's. With all his immense talent, I don't see Sacramento raising a lot of hell (what's the won/lost record since with Cousins?) Let me get this straight, there is a groundswell of support for trading over $20 million in expiring contracts for a 21st century William Bedford, or Marvin "Bad News" Barnes if you will, but we've said "no" to Josh Smith, and what we said to James Harden, I won't repeat?!
I'm on board, why not?

[WTF]

"He's a great player. He can pick and pop," Stuckey said. "It's common sense. It's not just pick and pop; he can take guys off the dribble and into the post."

Initially I understood why Joe signed Charlie and thought it was a good move at the time. Sometimes fans can forget things about a player especially once they're sporting a Pistons uniform. Reminder or should I say a quick trip down Memory Lane When Charlie played for the Bucks he use to whip Big Ben and Sheed ass all over the court mainly in the post. Offensively Sheed was basically looking at a clone of himself in Charlie (a player very much capable of scoring in many ways) What Charlie wasn't was a defensive gem the way Sheed was.

Now if you're a fans that fancy defensive prowess and rebounding machine (Murph and Don) then I can see where their dislike of Charlie come from. "However" I think their dislike is colorfully over-stated, like his socks looking funny when he runs and what not. I think that neither can get pass those socks to actually see that Charlie plays ok defense, not the best defense but ok defense.

Charlie can have more games like he did the other night offensively, if he stay's healthy and keep playing smart like he has.

[WTF]

First Phillip poses a question.

Then Mercury poses a trade, but the key is that Merc wants to trade Monroe, and that ingnites the thought process.

Wise, never one to leave the Status Quo(lol), poses a radical move!

His thoughts makes me rethink what he and Mercury said, and BAM, I make some mods that I hope will help, I'm on board... anybody else?

Diversity of thought is a beautiful thing!!!

Gentlemen, Lil' Larry won't pair Monroe with Drummond, what makes you think he'll do things differently because Cousins is here? We have the untried Russian, who still may get DNP-CD's. With all his immense talent, I don't see Sacramento raising a lot of hell (what's the won/lost record since with Cousins?) Let me get this straight, there is a groundswell of support for trading over $20 million in expiring contracts for a 21st century William Bedford, or Marvin "Bad News" Barnes if you will, but we've said "no" to Josh Smith, and what we said to James Harden, I won't repeat?!
I'm on board, why not?

DX, I would love to have Josh Smith shit I'm greedy and not so on board about waiting for our youth movement to develop to be contending 4 seasons down the road. The only player on this team that I find to be off limit is Drummond. I'm always thinking of players we could surround Drummond with, but at the same time I'm think win now oppose to later. Personally I would like us to do what Boston did and give up half the roster to become immediate contenders and keeping the franchise piece (Rondo). Drummond would be our Rondo.

The difference between us and Bostons is we can do it with out breaking the bank and still be able to put some additional talent in place.

[WTF]

Lineup 1: Monroe - PF, Josh - SF, Drummond - C, Stuckey - PG and English - SG. Key Reserve: Knight

Lineup 2: Monroe - PF, Cousins - C, Josh - SF, Stuckey - PG, and English - SG Key Reserve: Drummond

Lineup 3: Aldrige - PF, Drummond - C, Josh - SF, Stuckey - PG, and English - SG Key Resevre: Knight

[Murph]

Lineup 1: Monroe - PF, Josh - SF, Drummond - C, Stuckey - PG and English - SG. Key Reserve: Knight

Lineup 2: Monroe - PF, Cousins - C, Josh - SF, Stuckey - PG, and English - SG Key Reserve: Drummond

Lineup 3: Aldrige - PF, Drummond - C, Josh - SF, Stuckey - PG, and English - SG Key Resevre: Knight

Did I miss something? I never realized Wise was such a Stuckey fan. Wise has Stuckey starting at the point in every one of his fantasy line-ups.

[cool breeze]

"He's a great player. He can pick and pop," Stuckey said. "It's common sense. It's not just pick and pop; he can take guys off the dribble and into the post."

Initially I understood why Joe signed Charlie and thought it was a good move at the time. Sometimes fans can forget things about a player especially once they're sporting a Pistons uniform. Reminder or should I say a quick trip down Memory Lane When Charlie played for the Bucks he use to whip Big Ben and Sheed ass all over the court mainly in the post. Offensively Sheed was basically looking at a clone of himself in Charlie (a player very much capable of scoring in many ways) What Charlie wasn't was a defensive gem the way Sheed was.

Now if you're a fans that fancy defensive prowess and rebounding machine (Murph and Don) then I can see where their dislike of Charlie come from. "However" I think their dislike is colorfully over-stated, like his socks looking funny when he runs and what not. I think that neither can get pass those socks to actually see that Charlie plays ok defense, not the best defense but ok defense.

Charlie can have more games like he did the other night offensively, if he stay's healthy and keep playing smart like he has.

Wisefan we saw a different Charlie V on the 2nd of a back to back against Washington. He was fun to watch. However, that is the very first time that Charlie has played that hard in a Piston uniform. And he did it against a very weak team. How can we forget the way Charlie ran the court like an old lady last season and the season before that one?

Stuckey is playing well right now as well. But again Stuckey always plays well against the weakest teams in the league. I am waiting for Stuckey to actually lead the team like a leader should when the Pistons play against good competition. Instead, he usuallly shrinks into the shell of the players he could be. I am still not sold on either Stuckey or Charlie V and would include both in any potential trade to bring in a consistant player with this young group of future stars.

Some of you Piston fans still keep placing English in some futuristic starting lineup. When Knight arrived in Detroit, he became part of the rotation right away because he earned it. Singler did the same. There must be something others know that you don't know about English. Maybe the fact that he is not ready to be an everyday player. Still, Ie support giving him some playing time each game like I do for The RUssian Assassin and Middleton. This team has nothing to lose. Detroit cannot make the playoffs so the young guys should play to see how good they might become. With Prince injured, fans could make a good case for Middleton being in the rotation. The young players who are playing are playing too many minutes at times. When Prince was healthy, he was playing too many minutes. Coach Frank is not a very good manager for sure.

Merry Christmas to all of you!

[deusXango]

Lineup 1: Monroe - PF, Josh - SF, Drummond - C, Stuckey - PG and English - SG. Key Reserve: Knight

Lineup 2: Monroe - PF, Cousins - C, Josh - SF, Stuckey - PG, and English - SG Key Reserve: Drummond

Lineup 3: Aldrige - PF, Drummond - C, Josh - SF, Stuckey - PG, and English - SG Key Resevre: Knight

Wise, all these are obtainable and stunning lineups (#3 may be a little hard to do), and I couldn't help but notice that there is a common thread in all of them; Stuckey has been returned to the starting lineup, English is the starting SG, and Josh Smith is on the team. I think Josh and English would add some sizzle to the starting unit but, Stuckey would severely cripple the 2nd unit in his absence. Stuckey is playing his best and most consistent ball of his career (and improving) on the 2nd unit....wouldn't you like to see how this plays out? Here I go, talking sh!t again, how about trading for Smith now and signing Chris Paul this summer? There's no shame in pursueing the best.
2013-14 Lineup Drummond-C, Monroe-PF, Smith-SF, Paul-PG, and English-SG Key Reserves: Stuckey, Singler, CV, Middleton, and Kravtsov
Prince, Jerebko, and Knight are choice trade pieces.

[Oracle]

The reason Cousins was even midly attractive now was that his contract was easy to swallow, Josh Smith's isn't, and would cause major problems down the road as the youngsters contracts grow!

Josh Smith is a short term fix, and something you do if it will put you over the top!

Wise, your lineups suck because they continue to include Monroe! Stuckey starting I could live with, and it makes sense from the well known theory of wanting to start your best defensive players to set the tone! Knight could and would provide a strong spark to the 2nd unit, but right now, Stuckey is the better all around player!

I think Merc is on to something! We have the center, but we can do a better at the PF. A more athletic PF would really make this team stand out!

Don't get me wrong, I really like Monroe, but I like Cousins at PF a lot more. Better scorer, better athlete, better defender!

As I said before, can you show me a front line that could compete with Cousins & Drummond? I don't think so, teams would see record scoring droughts while the twin towers throw each other alley oops all night long!

[Oracle]

Why Cousins?

It's a combination of the contract and the talent!

[WTF]

Lineup 1: Monroe - PF, Josh - SF, Drummond - C, Stuckey - PG and English - SG. Key Reserve: Knight

Lineup 2: Monroe - PF, Cousins - C, Josh - SF, Stuckey - PG, and English - SG Key Reserve: Drummond

Lineup 3: Aldrige - PF, Drummond - C, Josh - SF, Stuckey - PG, and English - SG Key Resevre: Knight

Did I miss something? I never realized Wise was such a Stuckey fan. Wise has Stuckey starting at the point in every one of his fantasy line-ups.

Yeah I found that strange too, what was I thinking I have seen something in Stuckey since he's been part of the 2nd unit and I'm starting to like it. What the name Seb came up with? Bully Guard Funny how things have change we were all screaming for him to become the SG and never acknowedging his ass couldn't shoot. Turns out Stuckey is the best PG we have (Sorry Knight Fans)

Unfortunately we can't rid the team of everyone, so after Drummond I now have to say that Stuckey is the other player I wouldn't trade provide could land Josh, Cousins or Aldrige in any conbinanation of two

[WTF]

The reason Cousins was even midly attractive now was that his contract was easy to swallow, Josh Smith's isn't, and would cause major problems down the road as the youngsters contracts grow!

Josh Smith is a short term fix, and something you do if it will put you over the top!
Wise, your lineups suck because they continue to include Monroe! Stuckey starting I could live with, and it makes sense from the well known theory of wanting to start your best defensive players to set the tone! Knight could and would provide a strong spark to the 2nd unit, but right now, Stuckey is the better all around player!

I think Merc is on to something! We have the center, but we can do a better at the PF. A more athletic PF would really make this team stand out!

Don't get me wrong, I really like Monroe, but I like Cousins at PF a lot more. Better scorer, better athlete, better defender!

As I said before, can you show me a front line that could compete with Cousins & Drummond? I don't think so, teams would see record scoring droughts while the twin towers throw each other alley oops all night long!

That's my whole idea Oracle put us over the top. I agree that Cousins & Drummond would be a monster but adding Josh to the mix puts it right over the top and that could happen almost immediately. If we did this today we be whipping on everyone's ass tomorrow. If we trade every piece of turd and expiring contract Josh is very doable. Only he (Josh) and Stuckey will be the biggest contract. remember half the team is rookie contracts by the time we facing resigning Monroe and Cousins it still would be affordable.

The reason why Monore remains is that Cousins though affordable still remains a wild card so Monroe is still viable in that regards. If it works Monroe can be traded later only. if the Cousins experiment fails we still have Monroe in the bad.

[Oracle]

[Only admins are allowed to see this link]

[Oracle]

[Only admins are allowed to see this link]

[Oracle]

[Only admins are allowed to see this link]

[lemonpen]

Cousins is a confirmed coach killer, who's widely recognized immaturaty is far beneath his years, is a rotten influence, and a suspect teammate.

Why is everyone in lockstep to bring him here, where the HC is only mildly respected. Here, where the not too distant past provides a sharp reminder of how little support the sitting President of Basketball Operations gives a HC in turmoil. Here, where the core has under 3yrs experience and is being counted on to develop then carry the mail.

Sheed was nowhere like Cousins but his on court influence finally permeated Rips seemingly goodguy demenor. You never know who will bite the apple.

Taking on DeMarcus carries far greater risk than drafting Drummond with his supposed issues. The downside could mean 3 more years of lottery picks.

[lemonpen]

The following wishes go out to Piston Nation.

To the “Oh How I Hate Lawrence Frank” Fan Club:
As the saying goes “coaches are hired to be fired”. So when that day finally arrives my wish for you is that LF is no less than the Rick Carlisle of this era, meaning he will hand over a nearly Ship Shape squad to the guy that delivers us the Glory Days.

To the “Grass is Always Greener on Everyone Else’s Roster” Fan Club:
My wish for you is that Joe pulls off a multitude of trades bringing you fresh fodder for 2014 trade deadline dreams.

To the “Joe Must Go” Fan Club:
My wish for you is Wisdom & Patience to accept that which you cannot change.


To the “Cheerleader” Fan Club:
My wish for you is W’s galore. You should be able to cheer for the real thing just once more.


To the “I'll Live With Losing as Long as We Play the Kids” Fan Club:
My wish for you (well, us) is Smelling Salts to wake you (well, us) from the delusion. No one likes losing and you (well, us) will soon return to complaining about one thing or another.






Merry Christmas To All and To All A Good Night

[Sponsored content]