A MESSAGE TO GRIZZ

[deusXango]

Grizz, I ask you to stay the course, keep an open mind, and watch this season unfold with a keen eye. It's gonna be a doozy, with more to be revealed.

[Phil-Good]

The Pistons have two franchise player in my opinion already in Moose and B.K.7.

Moose will get 8, 9 and then 10 million per year.

B.K.7 should be in that 6,7, and 8 million per season range eventually.

This will be A very important summer coming up. The Pistons will have A high first round pick. ( I don't see the Pistons making the playoffs). The Pistons will also have to go after A really special Small Forward. What I would do is trade up in the lottery. It's going to be some good small forwards there in the 2013 NBA Draft.

But my point is, Joe can't over spend. It might be best to go into the season with all that cap money and look for good trades and players teams can't afford to keep. (EXAMPLE # 1. James Harden)

[deusXango]

2012-13 Salary: $5,000,000

2013 Free-Agency Status: Unrestricted

Overvalued

"Jason Maxiell is overvalued, overrated and overweight.

Though the power forward has received plenty of opportunities to prove himself with the Pistons over the past seven years, he has hardly taken advantage of them.

For his career, Maxiell has averaged a lukewarm 5.9 points and 4.2 rebounds per game and proven to be a defensive liability in the post. And while he has never amounted to more than a 20-minutes-per-game player, the fact that he's lasted as long as he has, and paid as much as he is, boggles the mind.

Luckily for him, he finds himself in a position to be an everyday starter for the second straight season in Detroit.

Unfortunately for the Pistons, such a victory for him is unlikely to translate into additional wins for the team."

This is a Bleacher Report evaluation that I totally agree with; please, Joe Dumars, do not re-sign this player again. Enough is enough!

[deusXango]

Sixth Man of the Year: James Harden, Oklahoma City Thunder


[Only admins are allowed to see this image]
Mike Ehrmann/Getty Images

"It's not exactly bold to predict a repeat Sixth Man of the Year award for Oklahoma City Thunder standout James Harden, at least on the surface.

Unless the Thunder and Harden reach common ground in the next few weeks, he'll be entering a contract year in 2012-13. With Harden reportedly seeking a max contract from the Thunder, [Only admins are allowed to see this link], he'll have all the incentive in the world to continue elevating his play this coming season.

Harden repeating as the award winner would be unprecedented, though, at least in the past two decades. There are only three two-time winners, [Only admins are allowed to see this link]: Kevin McHale, Ricky Pierce and Detlef Schrempf. Schrempf was the last back-to-back winner, in the 1990-91 and 1991-92 seasons with the Indiana Pacers.

While that history doesn't favor a Harden repeat, here's something that does: He just turned 23 and was on a team that came within three games of an NBA championship last season.

The bitterness of the Thunder's Finals defeat—especially given the egg Harden laid during most of that series—should only drive him to perform at an even higher level in 2012-13.

Harden spending the summer with teammates Kevin Durant and Russell Westbrook on the USA Olympic team should only help the Thunder get off to a running start. Don't be surprised to see Harden average somewhere around 20 points a game despite coming off the bench, which should make him the runaway choice for for Sixth Man of the Year."

It must be the beard that people don't like..........it's gotta be the beard!

[Oracle]

Oracle .. you do a great job balancing humor with good analysis posts ..... Me ::. I just go beserk .. I do think Stuckey will have a good season and Harden is not coming here anyway ... so what was the point .. I have no idea ..

Grizz, it's hard to live in a world with no humor, lol.

However, I must admit that when there's a lack of activity with the Pistons, what else is there to do?

I can't wait until we have a lot more real Pistons Talk!

[lemonpen]

Sixth Man of the Year: James Harden, Oklahoma City Thunder


[Only admins are allowed to see this image]
Mike Ehrmann/Getty Images

"It's not exactly bold to predict a repeat Sixth Man of the Year award for Oklahoma City Thunder standout James Harden, at least on the surface.

Unless the Thunder and Harden reach common ground in the next few weeks, he'll be entering a contract year in 2012-13. With Harden reportedly seeking a max contract from the Thunder, [Only admins are allowed to see this link], he'll have all the incentive in the world to continue elevating his play this coming season.

Harden repeating as the award winner would be unprecedented, though, at least in the past two decades. There are only three two-time winners, [Only admins are allowed to see this link]: Kevin McHale, Ricky Pierce and Detlef Schrempf. Schrempf was the last back-to-back winner, in the 1990-91 and 1991-92 seasons with the Indiana Pacers.

While that history doesn't favor a Harden repeat, here's something that does: He just turned 23 and was on a team that came within three games of an NBA championship last season.

The bitterness of the Thunder's Finals defeat—especially given the egg Harden laid during most of that series—should only drive him to perform at an even higher level in 2012-13.

Harden spending the summer with teammates Kevin Durant and Russell Westbrook on the USA Olympic team should only help the Thunder get off to a running start. Don't be surprised to see Harden average somewhere around 20 points a game despite coming off the bench, which should make him the runaway choice for for Sixth Man of the Year."

It must be the beard that people don't like..........it's gotta be the beard!

No opinions, but this Harden picture is painted with a LOT of the same stokes as with BeeGee. High scoring, high dollar, bench player.

[Oracle]

2012-13 Salary: $5,000,000

2013 Free-Agency Status: Unrestricted
"Jason Maxiell is overvalued, overrated and overweight.

I don't see that at all.

How is he overrated? One look at his numbers and history, and anybody that overrates him has to be looney toons, so I'm not buying that.

Maxiell is hardly overweight, at least as of last season, he was finally at his best weight of his career, and that allowed him to perform at his highest level.

He's also not over valued. At 5M with his length of time in the league, you could make an argument that he's paid about right for his production level.

The bottom line to me is that he's priced exactly right, and is a valuable addition to most clubs as probably the 2nd big off the bench.

What people are reacting to is the lunacy that has Maxiell starting for any team. That writer shouldn't get distracted by that, and make up stuff.

[Oracle]

"It's not exactly bold to predict a repeat Sixth Man of the Year award for Oklahoma City Thunder standout James Harden".

It would be for me!

I think Harden would be totally overrated and overvalued if anybody was foolish enough to give him a max contract.

Harden should have a very good year, based solely on the team he plays for, and the scrubs he generally runs his numbers up on.

However, as we saw, when the Heaters played more starter quality players on him, he sunk like smelly turd!

He's a good player, but let's not get carried away.

[Sebastian]

2012-13 Salary: $5,000,000

2013 Free-Agency Status: Unrestricted
"Jason Maxiell is overvalued, overrated and overweight.

I don't see that at all.

How is he overrated? One look at his numbers and history, and anybody that overrates him has to be looney toons, so I'm not buying that.

Maxiell is hardly overweight, at least as of last season, he was finally at his best weight of his career, and that allowed him to perform at his highest level.

He's also not over valued. At 5M with his length of time in the league, you could make an argument that he's paid about right for his production level.

The bottom line to me is that he's priced exactly right, and is a valuable addition to most clubs as probably the 2nd big off the bench.

What people are reacting to is the lunacy that has Maxiell starting for any team. That writer shouldn't get distracted by that, and make up stuff.

Oracle, just curious, you note that Maxey is "paid about right for his production level".

Would you endorse resigning Maxey at $5/per on July 1, 2013?

[Oracle]

Oracle, just curious, you note that Maxey is "paid about right for his production level".

Would you endorse resigning Maxey at $5/per on July 1, 2013?

Absolutely NOT!!! I just don't believe that you have to put someone down to get a reason to dump them, let the facts of a situation back up your reasoning.

The fact is that he's right somewhere, but not for a rebuilding team that needs to give their youngster as much PT as possible.

OKC did it right, they believed in the talent they had, and fed them a steady diet of max minutes, and got some real winners.

If the Pistons really believe in the talent that we have(like most of us do), they'll get rid of the vets, and play the youth until they mature!

[Grizz2]

"It's not exactly bold to predict a repeat Sixth Man of the Year award for Oklahoma City Thunder standout James Harden".

It would be for me!

I think Harden would be totally overrated and overvalued if anybody was foolish enough to give him a max contract.

Harden should have a very good year, based solely on the team he plays for, and the scrubs he generally runs his numbers up on.

However, as we saw, when the Heaters played more starter quality players on him, he sunk like smelly turd!

He's a good player, but let's not get carried away.

.... but he is not worth a max contract . So that is why everyone hates him .. 16 million a year? Good luck with that .. I hope this is all due to a greedy agent and not due to him ..

[Grizz2]

Oracle .. you do a great job balancing humor with good analysis posts ..... Me ::. I just go beserk .. I do think Stuckey will have a good season and Harden is not coming here anyway ... so what was the point .. I have no idea ..

Grizz, it's hard to live in a world with no humor, lol.

However, I must admit that when there's a lack of activity with the Pistons, what else is there to do?

I can't wait until we have a lot more real Pistons Talk!

Oracle, soon there will be a lot of real stuff going on with the Pistons .. Very optimistic .. for the first time in a long time .. The only other news I would like to comment on is that the Flopping Rule also has game suspensions after the 5th time .. Hope that extends into the play-offs .. Would be very interested to see the NBA review the 2012 Heat Play-offs to hear how many flops they actually did according to Crooked Cook the Books Stern... My guess is about a dozen flops a game .... Send LBJ and Wade to the FLOP SUSPENSION PRISON... for about the 500 or so each has debased the league with ..

[merc]

Have to say the D-League has been a disappointment ... where is the "development" for any of our players?
We share the Mad Ants with two other teams... no chance of training the kids under our own system... instead we rely on the "splinter approach"... the more splinters you collect the more you're supposed to improve... it's a shamockery.... we'll never know the true effects of wasted young talent who lost their confidence.
ESPN is running a series on the benefits of a minor league system (even mentioned how Drummond would benefit).
Another benefit of each team owning their own Minor league team would be for vets rehabing their injuries (like MLB).

[Grizz2]

New NBA Anti-Flopping Penalties



a first time offense will get a player a warning. A second offense will cost $5,000. A player will receive a $10,000 fine for a third offense, $15,000 for a fourth and $30,000 the fifth. If a player is caught flopping six times the league may decide to hand down a suspension.


LBJ and Wade FLOPPED 6 times minimun in each NBA play off game last season ..

Shane Battier (Birmingham Detroit Country Day) says he's "wholeheartedly against" the NBA's new "anti-flopping" rule. "Reputation may play a big role in it," Battier said. Yet that's exactly what Indiana coach Frank Vogel is hoping will happen this season when the NBA begins administering the rule. The league announced last week that it will begin the tricky work of reviewing flops and dives and slapping repeat offenders with fines. Vogel called into question the Heat's defensive practices during the Pacers' second-round series against Miami. The biggest flopping team in the NBA: that's what Vogel labeled the Heat.



Shane Battie KNOWS these penalties WOULD mean the Heat HAVE NO CHANCE at the NBA title IF they are fairly and consistently enforced .. EFF YOU BATTIER .. You didnt win anything last season .. just took what the crook Stern gave you



NBA player [Only admins are allowed to see this link] was critical of flopping in the league. In a 2008 interview, when he was with the [Only admins are allowed to see this link], he complained:

“

"All that bull shit ass calls they had out there. With Mike [Callahan] and Kenny [Mauer] -- you've all seen that shit," Wallace said. "You saw them calls. The cats are flopping all over the floor and they're calling that Mother Fucking Shit. That SHIT ain't basketball out there. It's all FUCKED UP entertainment. You all should know that Goddamn shit...It's all fucking entertainment."[Only admins are allowed to see this link] At the time, Wallace was the NBA's career leader in both technicals and ejections, but went on to claim that some of those calls stemmed from his reputation, and also believed that a technical called in the same game on his Celtics teammate [Only admins are allowed to see this link] was sketchy at best:[Only admins are allowed to see this link] <TABLE style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; MARGIN: auto; WIDTH: auto; BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" class=cquote> <TR> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: left; PADDING-BOTTOM: 10px; PADDING-LEFT: 10px; WIDTH: 20px; PADDING-RIGHT: 10px; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; COLOR: rgb(178,183,242); FONT-SIZE: 35px; VERTICAL-ALIGN: top; FONT-WEIGHT: bold; PADDING-TOP: 10px">“</TD> <td style="PADDING-BOTTOM: 4px; PADDING-LEFT: 10px; PADDING-RIGHT: 10px; VERTICAL-ALIGN: top; PADDING-TOP: 4px">Let the Golden Child [Only admins are allowed to see this link] do that, or one of the NBA Without Border kids do that, it's all fine and dandy. This game is watered down, watered down with all that flopping. They're setting rules on us to the point where you're taunting if you dunk on somebody. Paul dunked it and then he didn't say nothing, but it's a tech. Without a doubt .. Flopping ..especially that on the offensive end .. has been in the process of ruining the NBA .. That is why I am glad all those who bitched about this crap were venting their outrage .. Apparently Stern will at least try to appear to be against flopping .. I think even the stigma of getting a fine will stop or severely slow down the FLOP party of some jive ass players like LBJ .. But suspensions are the real measure if the rules have any force to them ... I hope but do not know for sure, that the FLOP COUNT continues on into the play-offs ... At least Stern will get it back in his face if the league does not call Flops correctly on LBJ and Wade .. I would have gone straight to suspensions AND fines .. but .. that's me .. </TD></TR></TABLE>

[WTF]

Oracle, just curious, you note that Maxey is "paid about right for his production level".

Would you endorse resigning Maxey at $5/per on July 1, 2013?

Absolutely NOT!!! I just don't believe that you have to put someone down to get a reason to dump them, let the facts of a situation back up your reasoning.

The fact is that he's right somewhere, but not for a rebuilding team that needs to give their youngster as much PT as possible.

OKC did it right, they believed in the talent they had, and fed them a steady diet of max minutes, and got some real winners.

If the Pistons really believe in the talent that we have(like most of us do), they'll get rid of the vets, and play the youth until they mature!

Absolutely gald you said no I disagree that Maxi-pad has ever lived up to the 25 Million 5 year deal Joe gave him way back when. First off it was a deal done out of fear and that fear being that Joe thinking he would somehow blow it if he allowed him to walk and he blossom into something decent.

JMax has under perform every year of that contract so far, even last season doesn't make up for it. My guess that if not traded he might have a stellar season this year tricking Joe into another 5 years.

[deusXango]

JMax has under perform every year of that contract so far, even last season doesn't make up for it. My guess that if not traded he might have a stellar season this year tricking Joe into another 5 years.

Anything short of averaging 15 pts. 10 rebs., or being selected to one of the all-pro teams, he should be done in Detroit. Villanueva must be a 20/10 man for the next two years for another contract here. The future is pushing players like them out of the picture; it's time for talented, producing, youth.

[WTF]

Honestly I would much rather hang on to Daye than to Maxiell. Admittedly I was one at the time who thought JMax had turned the corner before he signed that deal. IMO I thought it was a good sign, but before the ink was truly dry on that deal I realized it was a mistake. That Maxiell had played his way into that deal and then went back to being lazy and being played out position. IMO he should have always been a SF, he was suppose to be our next Corliss.

[Oracle]

Honestly I would much rather hang on to Daye than to Maxiell. Admittedly I was one at the time who thought JMax had turned the corner before he signed that deal. IMO I thought it was a good sign, but before the ink was truly dry on that deal I realized it was a mistake. That Maxiell had played his way into that deal and then went back to being lazy and being played out position. IMO he should have always been a SF, he was suppose to be our next Corliss.

Yup, that's exactly what he was supposed to be, but in reality, he's no Big Nasty.

Jumping into the "Way Back" machine, I have to marvel at how lucky we've been to have some great undersized low post players that were great!

Dantley was a BEAST in the low post, and had the moves to back it up. I'll never forget how he dominated the taller AC "My hair's on fire" Green in the finals.

Then of course there was Corliss, who once LB finally figured out how to use him, was another BEAST in the post!

Maxi-Pads wasn't ever going to be one of them, but he could have put up better numbers if he played the SF, IMO!

[deusXango]

I agree that JMax could have severely punished 95% of the SF's in the league, had he been matched up against them, but as I remember it he was always touted as the next Ben Wallace (where that sh!t came from, I dunno).

After watching the flashback video supplied by Oracle, I realized why I could never get into Maxey; Bernard King? Adrian Dantley? Corliss Williamson? Charles Barkley? Wes Unseld? Dave Cowans? Mark Aquirre? Who can I compare him to? Which of these undersized beasts in the paint can I say he honestly remind me of? Honestly, in my heart-of-hearts!

I've not been impressed with his ballhandling skills, passing ability (or willingness to pass), foot speed, ability to finish at the rim, other than the occasional "thunder dunk" (which always brought to mind the Michael Curry left-handed dunk for some reason), or his ability to defend SF's. He's a product of "The dense days of Joe Dumars," and I ain't mad at him for getting paid, I just want someone else to pay him now.

I'm with you Wise, Daye over Maxiell. His ceiling remains higher than Maxey's, and he fits better in a rebuild effort than Maxiell does.

[Murph]

DX, your credability is the product of many posts over the years, and if being wrong about anything once in awhile loses it, then none of us have any credability.

In addition, I believe that we all place too much blame on ourselves when a player, through their own lack of effort, or other circumstances fails to live up to the talent we knew they had.

We can predict a lot of things, but we can't control folks character or medical issues, so chill.

Oracle...I agree completely. The fun thing about making predictions on these players is finding out whether you're right or not. If we were right 100% of the time...then what the heck...we wouldn't even have to watch the games.

I've been wrong so many times, I can't remember them all. Some of my worst predictions?...that Jonas Jerebko would be a bust (he isn't). That CV and BG would be good free agent signings (they weren't). That Jeremy Lin would flop in the NBA (he didn't). And that Darko would eventually develop into a servicable NBA center (he still might). But that doesn't stop me for making more predictions.

So DX...you're an excellent poster. And no one cares if Royce White stars in the NBA or not.

[Murph]

And now...the moment we've been waiting for for the last 5 1/2 months, since the Pistons played their final game last season. Tonight, the Pistons open their 2012-13 shedule with a pre-season game against the Toronto Raptors! Finally, we've got some De-troit bask-et-ball to watch!

[Murph]

I agree that JMax could have severely punished 95% of the SF's in the league, had he been matched up against them, but as I remember it he was always touted as the next Ben Wallace (where that sh!t came from, I dunno).

That was a Leeism. As far as I can remember, Lee357 was the one who kept comparing JMax to Ben Wallace, years ago.

[lemonpen]

I agree that JMax could have severely punished 95% of the SF's in the league, had he been matched up against them, but as I remember it he was always touted as the next Ben Wallace (where that sh!t came from, I dunno).

After watching the flashback video supplied by Oracle, I realized why I could never get into Maxey; Bernard King? Adrian Dantley? Corliss Williamson? Charles Barkley? Wes Unseld? Dave Cowans? Mark Aquirre? Who can I compare him to? Which of these undersized beasts in the paint can I say he honestly remind me of? Honestly, in my heart-of-hearts!

I've not been impressed with his ballhandling skills, passing ability (or willingness to pass), foot speed, ability to finish at the rim, other than the occasional "thunder dunk" (which always brought to mind the Michael Curry left-handed dunk for some reason), or his ability to defend SF's. He's a product of "The dense days of Joe Dumars," and I ain't mad at him for getting paid, I just want someone else to pay him now.

I'm with you Wise, Daye over Maxiell. His ceiling remains higher than Maxey's, and he fits better in a rebuild effort than Maxiell does.

I thought you had to have some moves, and not bobble every entry pass, and have a shooting touch, and make more than every other free throw to be capable of punishing someone in the post. Dare I say JMax plataued several seasons ago as a decent offensive rebounder and a tough man2man defender.

[WTF]

My hope for this season is another lottery pick after it's all said and done. I'm not really all that pump if it means watching Tay, Maxiell, Mags and Bynum sucking up minutes. Why I didn't toss CV into this group because he's is likely more plus in the development process for Knight if he can consistantly knock down the three. The previous forementioned players bring no real valueto the team.

[Sebastian]

My hope for this season is another lottery pick after it's all said and done. I'm not really all that pump if it means watching Tay, Maxiell, Mags and Bynum sucking up minutes. Why I didn't toss CV into this group because he's is likely more plus in the development process for Knight if he can consistantly knock down the three. The previous forementioned players bring no real valueto the team.

Oh I wish that Joe would get the Memphis folks on the phone and offer them Tay, Maggette, and heck even Will B. for a "real" Small Forward, Rudy Gay.

Memphis would love to get out of Rudy's contract and Maggette and Will B. would provide them the financial relief; Tay would provide the Grizzs with a veteran, steady small forward.

Yes, I know, Rudy's contract is huge but WE need a real Small Forward. Also, Maxey, Daye, and amnestying Charlie V. would provide US (approx. $16,000,000) enough to extend Moose and later Knight. Also, only $4.5 million of Stuckey's contract is guaranteed in 2013-2014.

People have to realize, WE are not going to get top-notch talent via free agency. WE will only be able to fortify OUR roster via the draft, resigning OUR own, and trades. Top-notch free agent signings are a pipe dream for OUR Pistons.

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