Off Topic 2

[Oracle]

If you haven't seen Trump dancing with the Arabs, here it is set to "Rock the Casbah" 

https://twitter.com/BeardedGenius/status/866036160128327681

[Oracle]

Ok, I found this funny, but a lot of people on twitter thought it was distasteful... hell that's what made it funny to me 

[Oracle]

@Sparma - It's not optimism, just following the logic.
1. They were better this year, but you know the issues.
2. They'll be better next year barring injury
3. Stan will learn a lesson, but this is my only fear, that he learns the wrong one

BTW, the right kind of tanking can be good. There were years where Joe should have tanked. It allows us to get a star capable player and still keep the good players on the roster. A full tank is what I don't like because it throws everything out.

@Ballin - Apologies, what I said did sound like closing the door before anybody tried it, I didn't mean to say it that way. Hell, if throwing in KCP works, I'm all for it. I like KCP, but to get a high upside star in here trumps that, IMO.

[BallinD]

We can always come up with a reason for it not to work.  Who knew we could get Rasheed Wallace for scraps and scrubs?  Who knew we could get Weggie, a starting caliber PG for scraps and scrubs.  Who knew we could get Tobias for a broken Jennings and Illy.  The point is to get out there, get a third team involved, go forward with a plan.  Am I saying it will be easy or I have all the answers?  NO.  But sharks circle when there is blood in the water and trades get done under all sorts of circumstances, including the recent trade of Cousins for scrubs and scraps.

And there is this to address the talent argument: Det. News: Pistons Need Spirit

@Don, having FAILED to address the only point of the post because as usual, your comments are poorly thought out and wrong, then you proceed to unleash a wave of hate at KCP & Drummond. I have no idea what's going on in your life, but obviously something is very wrong, you used to have very well thought out comments... in all caps, but well thought out.

@Ballin - I think Lemonpen made a good point about KP, and I'm backing off not adding the 1st round pick, which likely won't get a shot by SVG. I doubt throwing in KCP makes a lot of sense to NY since they'll be giving us a guy on his rookie contract and taking on Drummond's 25M, why would they entertain KCP's cost?

The ECF is interesting. I was going to post yesterday that I don't believe in Cleveland's conversion to greatness. By finishing 2nd, they avoided the Wizards, who likely would have lost to them, but who match up a lot better and would have a chance to beat them. The good news for Cleveland is that they match up with GS very well, but they may still lose.

[Sparma]

Oracle: "I noticed that you have a lot of assumptions associated with both methods, but only negative ones associated with not tanking."

Not really. I tried an edit to clarify the problems of tanking, but got hijacked while editing. btw, this site doesn't seem entirely secure. Tanking can go wrong in a number of ways, such as major injuries sidetracking things and probabilities not falling your way. Philly has illustrated both problems to a certain extent. Also, if a bunch of teams tank in a given year there's trouble. If a bunch of teams adopted the Hinkie approach longterm, that'd really jeopardize the strategy.

We seem to be in agreement that some bounce back is to be expected.

I don't see the road taken as leading to contention for the Pistons. Do you, even though you're clearly more optimistic about the team than I am? Tanking could be the path to contention. Maybe not, but if we're still in a lukewarm spot deeply into next season, I'd like to find out. At that point, I'd prefer it to the mediocre alternatives that would appear to be available.

SVG's earned another year to do it his way, but that way's looking pretty limited now. Tanking's not the way to go? Could well be, but I prefer it to being mediocre for another decade, if there isn't a serious upturn partly in next season. I foresee some improvement, but nothing close to awe inspiring. By contrast, post-Cleveland, Philly's one of the likely contenders, unless it turns out they can't hold on to their wealth of talent. But if that's their fate, that brings us back to why it makes sense for a team like Detroit to take bold/ wild risks, in a market like ours and without superstar talent on the roster. 

I noticed that you have a lot of assumptions associated with both methods, but only negative ones associated with not tanking.

Why would SVG doing it his way be limited? We were expected to challenge the Cavs this year, but injury and mismanagement doomed that plan, but none of the facts on the ground have changed, but damn near to a man on this board, they feel the same as you... Why?

Philly looked better this season, but better in a weaker conference should be taken his a huge grain of salt.

The bottom line is that there is no sure way to getting to the top, a quick look at the odds shows that they are long for most teams, and a lot has to go right to make it work.

That's why I'm so shocked at how drastic the desire is to change everything based on a crap shoot as wild as blowing everything up, which should be the last resort when nothing else works.

Blowing up relies on a lot of praying, first you need to tank to get as high a pick as possible and tanking is no guarantee of getting a top pick if there are better tankers out there. Then if you do get a top pick, there is no guarantee that the pick will be worth a damn.

You can't build things up by magic, SVG has done almost everything right, he and Gores are setting up the infrastructure to attract talent, provide a community benefit and show as much loyalty to players as possible in this cut throat business. 

Contrary to popular belief, we have a lot of talent on this team and we'll be better at the start of next season than the team predicted to finish as high as 3rd in the east when it was a better conference than the west two seasons ago.

In short the pessimism does not reflect the reality, IMO. Success is not always or mostly a straight line, there are setbacks. The test is how we recover from the setback, which is why I agree that SVG has earned another shot, another setback and we'll know something is very wrong.

[Oracle]

Jackson and franchise center Andre Drummond are close friends, but it's not about that. Off-court chemistry only matters if it translates on the floor. Despite the fact that the pieces fit on paper, the Pistons often looked like they didn't love playing together. Unless you have overwhelming talent, it's hard to win when your players aren't on the same page. 

That's what happened to us when Reggie came back, the players were no longer on the same page, and they tried to bring Reggie along, but SVG disrupted the process.

[Oracle]

SVG's earned another year to do it his way, but that way's looking pretty limited now. Tanking's not the way to go? Could well be, but I prefer it to being mediocre for another decade, if there isn't a serious upturn partly in next season. I foresee some improvement, but nothing close to awe inspiring. By contrast, post-Cleveland, Philly's one of the likely contenders, unless it turns out they can't hold on to their wealth of talent. But if that's their fate, that brings us back to why it makes sense for a team like Detroit to take bold/ wild risks, in a market like ours and without superstar talent on the roster. 

I noticed that you have a lot of assumptions associated with both methods, but only negative ones associated with not tanking.

Why would SVG doing it his way be limited? We were expected to challenge the Cavs this year, but injury and mismanagement doomed that plan, but none of the facts on the ground have changed, but damn near to a man on this board, they feel the same as you... Why?

Philly looked better this season, but better in a weaker conference should be taken his a huge grain of salt.

The bottom line is that there is no sure way to getting to the top, a quick look at the odds shows that they are long for most teams, and a lot has to go right to make it work.

That's why I'm so shocked at how drastic the desire is to change everything based on a crap shoot as wild as blowing everything up, which should be the last resort when nothing else works.

Blowing up relies on a lot of praying, first you need to tank to get as high a pick as possible and tanking is no guarantee of getting a top pick if there are better tankers out there. Then if you do get a top pick, there is no guarantee that the pick will be worth a damn.

You can't build things up by magic, SVG has done almost everything right, he and Gores are setting up the infrastructure to attract talent, provide a community benefit and show as much loyalty to players as possible in this cut throat business. 

Contrary to popular belief, we have a lot of talent on this team and we'll be better at the start of next season than the team predicted to finish as high as 3rd in the east when it was a better conference than the west two seasons ago.

In short the pessimism does not reflect the reality, IMO. Success is not always or mostly a straight line, there are setbacks. The test is how we recover from the setback, which is why I agree that SVG has earned another shot, another setback and we'll know something is very wrong.

[Sparma]

Again, I think Philly's a success story, certainly in comparison with us. So that's an example, although admittedly it's a story in a making. Let's talk again in two years. I think they're close, and that's with plenty of setbacks.

Beyond that, what are we really talking about? If we're talking about building through the draft, that's happened plenty of times. If it's about building through the draft, maybe not so much. So if the question becomes where have I EVER seen a champion built through high picks (rather than a question about tanking per se): the Bulls dynasty was essentially built through high picks, with Jordan at #3, Pippen (with a trade), and Horace Grant (admittedly at 10). That cadre of high picks constituted the core of the first half of that dynasty.

Maybe the building through high picks doesn't work so well anymore because small & medium market teams can't hold on to those picks? But OKC came close to a championship with high picks in Westbrook, KD, and Harden. They decided they needed to trade Harden, then lost KD. Still, that's a good recent example of building through the draft.

Another consideration: the Hinkie strategy may be part of a tiny sample size. Plenty of teams will tank for a season or so. And some teams are bad for years, with high picks, like Sacramento. But I think the strategy of deliberately and ruthlessly tanking year after year may be rare. Arguably, there's a success rate (or soon will be) of 1 out of 1 (100%) for the fully dedicated, all in, long term, Hinkie approach.

Compare that to the alternatives. How many successful strategies available to the Pistons can we point to in today's NBA? Maybe Dumars could have pulled off something like what Ainge later did/ is doing in Boston, late in the Pistons run. The AI fiasco would have had to have turned out differently for that to have worked. If not tanking, what are the realistic alternatives for us leading to contention? The first couple years of the SVG regime made a lot of sense to me, yet here we are.

Maybe a small/ medium market team just can't contend by way of the draft anymore? Possibly so, but what's the alternative? I've praised SVG (before this season) for upgrading incrementally, but the relatively low ceiling paired with that strategy was always foreseeable.

SVG's earned another year to do it his way, but that way's looking pretty limited now. Tanking's not the way to go? Could well be, but I prefer it to being mediocre for another decade, if there isn't a serious upturn partly in next season. I foresee some improvement, but nothing close to awe inspiring. By contrast, post-Cleveland, Philly's one of the likely contenders, unless it turns out they can't hold on to their wealth of talent. But if that's their fate, that brings us back to why it makes sense for a team like Detroit to take bold/ wild risks, in a market like ours and without superstar talent on the roster.

Going Hinkie?  Won't happen this year, but I'd take Philly's future over ours.  In that way, the Hinkie-initiated "Process" is well on its way to working.  They're sitting on the #3 this year & four 2nd rounders in a deep draft.  They get the Lakers' 1st round pick next year (unless #1) which should be a really high pick & their own should be high once again.   A couple years from now, if health is with them, they should be becoming a good team, with the potential to be great.  Can't say the same about the Pistons who took a lower risk path with less potential reward.  I'd be happy to bring in Hinkie to blow things up next year if things remain tepid.  We've been largely irrelevant for the past 9 years; that trend could easily go on another decade.  Last year notwithstanding, SVG's earned another year to do it his way, but then it's fair to blow it up.  Dream on about Boston's pick, LA's pick, or Porzingis.   We'll likely stay the course and float forward.  The only time I see SVG going for the huge gamble (a la Cousins) is when he becomes convinced his gig may be in genuine jeopardy.  I'd don't see that realization hitting him this summer.  Maybe by the trade deadline though.

Concerning the D which Cool mentioned, the stats do tell part of the story: the Pistons don't turn the ball over much, which contributes heavily to solid defensive numbers.  Beyond that, I read that they generally get back on D (even though I've heard complaints about AD), which again makes for solid numbers.  Those two strengths go together/ are compatible with their direct playing of D not being good, which is I think the feature of their D that Cool was highlighting.

Sparma, when and where have you EVER seen this Hinkie approach work? It doesn't, it's hard to build up from nothing, but in this method, you also have to specify your end game.

The only hope of that approach is that you build up enough assets to swing a trade for an established star, but the obstacles to making that happen are HUGE for a couple of reasons.

First, the assets are low cost assets, so they typically don't amount to much and secondly, good luck getting a star to come to a losing franchise on the Hinkie dream of future promise.

Guys are frustrated with the process here and oddly panicked after an understandable setback where we lose about 7 more games, hardly a major setback.

Dreaming is more in the Hinkie thinking, it's ALL Dream nothing is guaranteed, the LA/Boston picks are in play, that's reality, and there are two ways to participate. Either directly or indirectly as a 3rd team to make things work.

KP is an opportunity but I admit that it's low because NY would be a fool to let him go, still, we have the assets to make it work and Drummond is only a 5 year pro and in big men, that's very young and generally before they bloom.

[Oracle]

Going Hinkie?  Won't happen this year, but I'd take Philly's future over ours.  In that way, the Hinkie-initiated "Process" is well on its way to working.  They're sitting on the #3 this year & four 2nd rounders in a deep draft.  They get the Lakers' 1st round pick next year (unless #1) which should be a really high pick & their own should be high once again.   A couple years from now, if health is with them, they should be becoming a good team, with the potential to be great.  Can't say the same about the Pistons who took a lower risk path with less potential reward.  I'd be happy to bring in Hinkie to blow things up next year if things remain tepid.  We've been largely irrelevant for the past 9 years; that trend could easily go on another decade.  Last year notwithstanding, SVG's earned another year to do it his way, but then it's fair to blow it up.  Dream on about Boston's pick, LA's pick, or Porzingis.   We'll likely stay the course and float forward.  The only time I see SVG going for the huge gamble (a la Cousins) is when he becomes convinced his gig may be in genuine jeopardy.  I'd don't see that realization hitting him this summer.  Maybe by the trade deadline though.

Concerning the D which Cool mentioned, the stats do tell part of the story: the Pistons don't turn the ball over much, which contributes heavily to solid defensive numbers.  Beyond that, I read that they generally get back on D (even though I've heard complaints about AD), which again makes for solid numbers.  Those two strengths go together/ are compatible with their direct playing of D not being good, which is I think the feature of their D that Cool was highlighting.

Sparma, when and where have you EVER seen this Hinkie approach work? It doesn't, it's hard to build up from nothing, but in this method, you also have to specify your end game.

The only hope of that approach is that you build up enough assets to swing a trade for an established star, but the obstacles to making that happen are HUGE for a couple of reasons.

First, the assets are low cost assets, so they typically don't amount to much and secondly, good luck getting a star to come to a losing franchise on the Hinkie dream of future promise.

Guys are frustrated with the process here and oddly panicked after an understandable setback where we lose about 7 more games, hardly a major setback.

Dreaming is more in the Hinkie thinking, it's ALL Dream nothing is guaranteed, the LA/Boston picks are in play, that's reality, and there are two ways to participate. Either directly or indirectly as a 3rd team to make things work.

KP is an opportunity but I admit that it's low because NY would be a fool to let him go, still, we have the assets to make it work and Drummond is only a 5 year pro and in big men, that's very young and generally before they bloom.

[Sparma]

Going Hinkie?  Won't happen this year, but I'd take Philly's future over ours.  In that way, the Hinkie-initiated "Process" is well on its way to working.  They're sitting on the #3 this year & four 2nd rounders in a deep draft.  They get the Lakers' 1st round pick next year (unless #1) which should be a really high pick & their own should be high once again.   A couple years from now, if health is with them, they should be becoming a good team, with the potential to be great.  Can't say the same about the Pistons who took a lower risk path with less potential reward.  I'd be happy to bring in Hinkie to blow things up next year if things remain tepid.  We've been largely irrelevant for the past 9 years; that trend could easily go on another decade.  Last year notwithstanding, SVG's earned another year to do it his way, but then it's fair to blow it up.  Dream on about Boston's pick, LA's pick, or Porzingis.   We'll likely stay the course and float forward.  The only time I see SVG going for the huge gamble (a la Cousins) is when he becomes convinced his gig may be in genuine jeopardy.  I'd don't see that realization hitting him this summer.  Maybe by the trade deadline though.

Concerning the D which Cool mentioned, the stats do tell part of the story: the Pistons don't turn the ball over much, which contributes heavily to solid defensive numbers.  Beyond that, I read that they generally get back on D (even though I've heard complaints about AD), which again makes for solid numbers.  Those two strengths go together/ are compatible with their direct playing of D not being good, which is I think the feature of their D that Cool was highlighting.

[Oracle]

@Don, having FAILED to address the only point of the post because as usual, your comments are poorly thought out and wrong, then you proceed to unleash a wave of hate at KCP & Drummond. I have no idea what's going on in your life, but obviously something is very wrong, you used to have very well thought out comments... in all caps, but well thought out.

@Ballin - I think Lemonpen made a good point about KP, and I'm backing off not adding the 1st round pick, which likely won't get a shot by SVG. I doubt throwing in KCP makes a lot of sense to NY since they'll be giving us a guy on his rookie contract and taking on Drummond's 25M, why would they entertain KCP's cost?

The ECF is interesting. I was going to post yesterday that I don't believe in Cleveland's conversion to greatness. By finishing 2nd, they avoided the Wizards, who likely would have lost to them, but who match up a lot better and would have a chance to beat them. The good news for Cleveland is that they match up with GS very well, but they may still lose.

[lemonpen]

That should be enough to get Porzingis or other similar stars soon to be available in this invaluable offseason when so many pieces will be in play.  Drummond and a pick or a piece, KCP? Ellensen.  We must not be desparate and we must make the salaries work.  

I would do that for a young star in the mold of long, lean, can shoot and truly play inside-out.  If we can get KP or George, or Butler, or Isaiah Thomas, or Griffin we will actually have a star to build a core around.  We can then build a core and by the time Lebron is done, we will be positioning ourselves to compete with a new core.  We currently do not have one.

If forced to make salaries work wouldn't we have to take some mix of large/med/small matching contracts back, cause the Zinger is still on a rookie deal.  As I indicated earlier if PK has superstar written all over him, and he is cheap, and locked up for a while longer, and NO star free agent is knocking on our door,  why on earth would we suddenly become so cost conscience.  Hasn't the last 35 years proven that ya gotta have a superstar to have a hope.

[lemonpen]

@Don - There's an old saying, "Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and to remove all doubt.".

The corollary here is that it's better to be a minor loser than to tank Hinkie style and be exposed as a total loser.

Ok, the analogy isn't all that great, LOL, but you get the point.

Don, when did this level of thinking EVER deliver on single championship in the last 20 years? The days when this made a lick of sense are gone, nobody can win that way! BTW, this level of tanking is doing Philly a hell of a lot of good  

Drummond: I'm willing to go one more year with this team as it is with some tweaks internally and externally. I don't mind if we trade anybody on the team if it improves us, but one idea that was floated in the press, while a long shot, I'd jump all over in a NY minute(pun intended).

Porzingis for Drummond would be a GREAT trade for us and I wouldn't throw in our current first round pick as the article has, just a straight up trade since they're hating on Kristaps right now.

Tanking or blowing up what doesn't work is a no brainer for me. I actually watched the dysfunction very closely as my buddies who have all dropped out of Piston basketball watching. It is not difficult to see with your own eyes that several highly paid Piston players are not keepers. Once you play with no passion you have lost most most people who love the game of basketball. Clouding the issue by talking it up relating to moving players down the road is just a cop out and should only be used by the management team that is trying to cover up their mistakes. If Stan Van Gundy would just come clean and tell the fans he made some big mistakes by signing Drummond, Over paying Jackson, and even thinking about signing Pope to a long term contract, I would respect Stan a lot more. Fans are just gullible as hell. Right now there is some sucker who would consider taking on Drummond's contract. His misleading stats might fool some GM but it won't happen if the Pistons start another season with him. The burden with the payroll is significant. There can be no surprise young star player coming to the Pistons in the future if Detroit is paying Jackson, Drummond and Pope money that should only go to a high caliber proven player. Jackson, Drummond and Pope do not scare any team in the NBA. Instead all NBA teams look forward to playing against those three players. All three are dysfunctional in several categories and they just do not click with each other. Any new players who play the right way with high energy will be bitter in a matter of a few weeks if they get stuck playing with those players.

Pope has not shown anything special at all and instead has revealed several key weaknesses that will prevent him from becoming a consistent offensive threat. His defense is way over rated as he proved with his match ups with top tier guards this past season. If he was going to show that he was a first class player who can deliver in a playoff situation than he would have done that this season because this is his money season. Why would anyone expect next season will be more productive than his money season??? But all I hear is that it is automatic that Pope will get a 5 year deal for over 100-115 million for 5 years. You have to be a complete idiot to do that in my opinion. Why not just let him go and play another young guy for two or more years? What do the Pistons gain by signing him? We have all seen how he plays and it is clear that he will never be a high IQ winning type player unless management trades both Jackson and Drummond. Still Pope has not earned that kind of money. His ball handling for a 2 guard is below standard. His court vision is below standard. KCP is not a good passer. He is not a good shot creator. The worst part is that Pope does not play all out for an entire game. He plays hard at his own selected moments. Bot this is the most important thing that bugs me. Nobody in Piston management has ever identified why they MUST SIGN POPE. WHY? Please provide the details that warrant handing out this big contract and thus paralyzing the team even further. It is as if they might lose Labron James. If a healthy Bullock had been pampered as much by giving him the most minutes of any player for several seasons I think that Bullock, Johnson, or Hilliard would be just as good as KCP. He has not had to have his confidence shaken at all by any coach though out his time as a Piston. Nothing to worry about relating to being on the court. Meanwhile, every other young player has been tortured mentally by never feeling like their coach has their back. They can never feel confident of their position on the team from game to game. Being that Pope has had the full blessing of his coaches for a long time, I would expect that he would stand out every game as a real hard nosed player. That hasn't happened. He happened with Isiah Thomas and Joe Dumars. It happens on other NBA teams. KCP is not Leonard. But he will get the kind of money that Leonard gets. That is why other NBA players laugh at Piston management and get a little pissed knowing that guys like Pope, Drummond and Jackson are not in their league.

Sign and trade with Pope is OK if we get something great. If we get rid of Drummond and Jackson for draft picks and expiring contracts, the Pistons have a future. This is not the old way Oracle. All of the smart GMs are trying to get the top college players out of the draft knowing that their vet players cannot compete with the top 4 NBA teams currently playing. How did Detroit get Isiah Thomas? He was the 2nd overall pick. There is your proof. You cannot sign 2nd rate players like Leuer while paying dead weight players like Drummond, Jackson and now Pope and expect to win. You can't sign players like Smith and expect to win in the playoffs. Call me stupid but you will be crying the blues once we get into the months of January, Feb. and March again. That is when our losers play a little softer and think that nobody is watching. I sure am not going to waste any more of my time watching Detroit's Big Three. What more is there to see? The Big Three suck and I feel sorry for the players who are stuck playing with them.

Imagine how cocky KCP will be next fall as he takes home those big checks. Will he ignore his coach like Andre did this past season? Stan will be puzzled regarding the horrible team chemistry and the 3 point shots won't be falling like he thought. Then the trade deadline will approach and Piston management will once again say everyone is available for trade consideration but the deal must be really good. Then they will make up stories about all the calls they got but nothing was good enough for Stan's players. His guys are just having more bad luck. Then Detroit will get the 12th spot again in the draft and no 2nd round pick. Management will still have no takers for the Big Three from their secret calls made with every NBA team. Please take Andre, Reggie or KCP we will throw in a lot of money. PLEASE!! So again the spin stories will start that this team has taken longer than expected to gel but don't worry we will do some tweaking and keep this great core and will win big next season. After all Andre Drummond was unable to play for 3 months because of a injured left ear lobe. He did come back in April to finish the season weighing in at 310 pounds. Pope will have filled out his uniform in the belly area as well. Jackson will still be having breathing issues but the knee worked great. Meanwhile teams that continue to beat Detroit will be tanking for one more season to snag a top draft pick. Then three years from that time, Labron will announce his retirement. This will be the time when the Pistons will do a Stuckey type thing and thinking that all NBA teams are secretly talking to Andre, will offer him another sweet contract and bid against themselves. Anybody who has watched the Detroit Pistons play basketball against New Orleans, New York Knicks, Miami and a host of other bad tanking teams and suffered though watching those games where our team at full strength lost should see through the bull crap. The only way any self respecting coach could show up to coach that group would have to for the money because it can't be fun to be around players who do not improve and do not give an honest effort. But smoke and mirrors can work on some fans so opening night next fall will feature some pretty women dancing much better than Andre Drummond dances in the circle before the game starts. Imagine Bill Russell dancing in the circle and the coming out and playing with his arms below his waist. YEE HAW.

You went above & beyond to criticize every real and imaginary characteristic of KCP, BUT still look for something "great" in return.
Man o man !!

[cool breeze]

JEREBCO: Who didn't love Jonas Jerebco when he played for Detroit? Somehow he was considered a 2nd rate player overlooked while other dysfunctional players took his rotation spot. Then of course one exceptionally smart coach Brad Stevens recognizes his value. One thing about Brad Stevens, he never allows any of his players to rest on the bench and acquire rust for very long. I kept wondering why the Jerebco experiment wasn't tried until the blow out in the 2nd game. This game showed everyone why Jonas had so many fans in Detroit. He played Love better than anyone so far in the playoffs. He took no crap from any Cleveland player throwing Love to the floor at one point. But better yet Jerebco drilled some clutch 3 point shots. Isn't Stan Van Gundy looking for a stretch 4 who can hit 3s and play defense? This season Jerebco made $5 million and has no contract next season yet. Will Cleveland snatch him away from the rest of the slow minded management teams like Detroit? Who is a better all around player, Jon Leuer or Jonas Jerebco? Jerebco started a lot of games for the Celtics this past season. I would think that Boston would sign him again. But how Detroit let this guy go is insane and how they played him as a Piston is inexcusable. Jonas is not a guy who will stand around much. So he won't be a good fit for Stan Van Gundy's team. I have to wonder how SVG felt after he read about Andre Drummond interview with the press. My teammates just need a lot of REST.

POPE: I don't really want to discuss the Pope situation where it seems there isn't even any discussion about possibly not signing him. It is automatic. Piston management has spoken. Yet I see that Avery Bradley makes a little over 8 million a year. Who is the better player? Who is a key player for Boston in the playoffs this season? who made the winning shot in Cleveland? Bradley is one of the best on ball guard defenders in the NBA. I loved the series with Boston vs Washington. Where Beal and Wall can score at will against Pope anytime they want to, it was different in that playoff series when Bradley was playing on either of the Washington stars. Bradley had the reputation of an outstanding NBA defender up until this past year. As Chris Webber informed game watches tonight, Bradley put in one hell of a summer working on his ball handling skills and finishing at the rim along with hours of shooting the outside shot. So who is the better player, Pope or Bradley? Piston fans it isn't even close. Bradley might be the best defensive guard in the NBA now. He is young. His quickness is outstanding. But his HEART is what separates him from the average NBA guards. Pope didn't put in that same amount of work last summer or if he did, he worked on the wrong things. After Pope's first NBA season he should have been working hard on his ball handling skills. He doesn't get down low enough to protect the basketball and his dribble is too high. He takes too many big steps and has no change of pace. Somehow the details do not matter to Piston management. Playing KCP anything more than 8 million will be just another of many dumb ass decisions.

Congratulations to Celtic players for never giving up and not allowing Cleveland to bully you. The good guys won even though Kevin Love shot the lights out again and Irving was spectacular. Hard work and playing with HEART can work wonders. Those two ingredients are missing from this Piston team. Spending more money when coach designated key players show very little heart or hard work will make the owner look like a fool.

[cool breeze]

My dream that possibly could have happened before the trade deadline was of course trading Drummond to Boston in a deal that would have included that coveted pick. Big mistake if Detroit rejected the offer. Now it seems everyone is trying to figure out which team will get lucky. George wants to play for the Lakers so it seems that Indiana is out of luck. Chicago wants that pick real bad but Jimmy Butler might not be enough. Gordon H. would love to play for his old coach Brad Stevens but it is doubtful that Utah would want to give him up. The latest rumor seems to involve one of my favorite NBA players, Anthony Davis. What I didn't know is that Davis is only 24 years old. Imagine that Piston fans. There goes that theory that all we need to do is wait until Andre Drummond grows up mentally. No Davis is light years ahead of Drummond and always makes a complete fool of him every damn game. Does Andre want to hide in a dark corner whenever he has to play against Davis? Inside-outside whatever he picks, Davis scores at will against Drummond. But should we worry about the Detroit Piston defense? Not according to the stat guys who love to muddy the water so nobody will remember what actually happened in the actual games.

Adding Anthony Davis to that Celtic team will make Cleveland go out and find another superstar to play next to Labron. The Celtics have a short window to win it all. New Orleans is going nowhere any time soon like our Pistons, so maybe they will be willing to part with their All Star big man who does everything exceptionally well. I hope this happens just to make it harder for Cleveland to dominate.

Meanwhile Detroit fans will continue to watch the same crew with a little tweaking of course involving adding another $20 plus million dollar salary. How exciting! Great job Piston management.

[BallinD]

That should be enough to get Porzingis or other similar stars soon to be available in this invaluable offseason when so many pieces will be in play. Drummond and a pick or a piece, KCP? Ellensen. We must not be desparate and we must make the salaries work.

I would do that for a young star in the mold of long, lean, can shoot and truly play inside-out. If we can get KP or George, or Butler, or Isaiah Thomas, or Griffin we will actually have a star to build a core around. We can then build a core and by the time Lebron is done, we will be positioning ourselves to compete with a new core. We currently do not have one.

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