Easy to Beat Up Joe: Yes It Is: Doesn't He Deserve it?

[Sissy1946]

Oracle: Agree on it being easy to beat him up, lately there has been nothing to praise him for, especially the way we've lost some of our players, Chauncy, Afflallo, Summers, Terrico White, Rip & a few more, who have we got in return for some of these guys that our continuing to have success? Who hired Curry & Kuester, I hear you but I'm not seeing anything of relevance here, all the players we have lost & the players we have on this team are all on Joe Dumars win, lose or draw, I don't see the other side of this maybe like you do but I know I've had it with this crap, he has chances to come out & really tell us why or what the hell is going on instead of feeding the manure of rebuilding & not play guys like Macklin or Daye much, if you rebuild you play the players or, you stick them in the D-League, they have to keep playing, the board is not level here with Dumars. Even if Gores would come & say Friggin' something, we had a chance to believe again when Gores got the team but without a leader look where it's going now, we lose, we lose & we lose but Joe says we're rebuilding but when you got Gordon, Prince, Charley V, Maxiell, Bynum, Wilkens & Russell, (What?), who are these guys the D-Lague players of the day? I just can't condone what's happening with this team, there's no goal, at least a goal you or the fans can see, where is it, I'm pretty much a Piston fan for years & years & these last 3 years are pure crap. I want them to do good, I really do, read the schill writings of Vince Ellis & Morningood or whatever his name is, delusional pair they are, somehow I don't know if we had all writers here in town like Drew Sharp & a hard azz as he is, if they all shamed Dumars & saying hey Joe what's up? Don't send us no tickets cause we ain't going to watch this crap, if only that would happen, what would be scary about it is Dumars wouldn't even lend an ear, I may be a little overboard a little but this guy scares the Schitt out of me but what Realy scares me is if we get the 1st pick in the draft, then I'm running for cover, can we say Rodney White, Mateen Cleaves & etc, I do not trust him anymore, & still having reservations about Gores, how he's letting Dumars handle this is not being handled with care, hey my opinion because I'm one opinionated some-beech but just the way I feel about this situation. Iam not like Prince for example, I will not if given a pass dribble left, dribble right, fake left & right & then dribble until there' one second left & throw up a prayer, (Clang off the rim again Prince), absolutely not, I'm taking it right to the hole or hitting' the open man & thats one thing that Prince & Dumars DO NOT Do. Man, am I glad I got that off my shoulders, hope it didn't bore ya. You ought to see me bowl, te-he! Yea that was a nice play by Macklin, play the guy Frank.

[merc]

Yea, it's too bad our window doesn't fit Kaman's availability... woulda been a gr8 story about local kid puts them over the top... the Tay 4 Kaman deal has sailed.... it would take a miracle turnaround to open those kind of talks again.

I'm torn between taking the slow boat with draft picks and using it to snag a nice young vet... the top 3 bigs look like difference makers (assuming Drummond changes his mind)... after that I think there is too much stock being put into lotto hopes... like these kids are a lock to be allstars...

I can't even discuss the idea of drafting another swing player (BPA).... this is the one opportunity to go big.

On some forums just bringing up the idea of dealing a protected pick is like you took away their legos.... or eggos... they all turn into piranhas... and when those kids they wouldn't let go fail... I'll get the paddle out and send them to their rookie room

[deusXango]

The only way out of this mess is through the draft. We've had two decent drafts already, and it's my opinion that the sooner we put a couple more pieces with them, the sooner we'll be able to shop for quality veterans. What I'm saying is sucking this shortened season should be enough "strike while the iron is hot" and all that; get the two high draft picks now, instead of one now, and one next year after sucking again.

Cutting to the chase, I'm in favor of engineering another top 5-6 pick acquisition to go with our #1 pick! With those two picks draft Anthony Davis and Michael Kidd-Gilchrist. We've now got the missing ingredients to complete our rebuild; a shotblocker and a genuine leader. For those that believed that Stuckey could and should be given a chance at PG because he was big, strong, and fast, how about getting on board with Kidd-Gilchrist as our SG in the backcourt with Knight? He's a mutated version of Aaron Afflalo who we foolishly let get away, but look at Aaron now.

Michael Beasley, Nickolus Batum are just a couple of veteran names thrown out there that are better than Prince and Daye, but are young enough to fit in with our rebuild. My personal preference would be acquiring the services of Chandler, Wilson our homeboy! Visualize this:
PG Knight
SG Kidd-Gilchrist
SF Chandler
PF Davis
C Monroe
with a bench of Macklin, Singler, and a couple three quality role playing veterans. I'd pay a dollar to see that.

If I'm Tom Gores, I'd bite the bullet and bring back Larry Brown to coach/teach these young men to play the right way, especially the backcourt players, and hire Laimbeer as his big man coach....LB is going to burn out in a season or two anyhow leaving Laimbeer with a young team ready to contend. This is a little too rich for "Opie" to try and coach.

[merc]

DX, after Drummond (says he's back for another year), Davis & Robinson... what big kid is gonna help turn this around?

[Grizz]

.. is filled with players who are virtually untradeable for ANYONE of quality OR any draft pick .. NO ONE FLAT OUT WANTS: CV, BG, PRINCE, JMAX, BEN W, Wilkins, or Russell (AND CAN YOU BLAME THEM?).. and Daye and JJ's stock is going down fast .. I guess in the depths of despair as we are now, you want to believe there is some way to get rid of the deadwood / deadheads and wake up to a team that is filled with youth, talent and motivation ... Problem is, Joe has been running this team INTO THE GROUND for the past 4 seasons with the wrong players, wrong positions, wrong trades,wrong head coaches, wrong salary deals, wrong draft picks (except the following 2)... Monroe and Knight give us hope ... and that is why they are untradeable because the Pistons want to see them develop into very good players here and form a foundation .. What we really need is Amnesty where you get extra draft picks for cutting players free ..

By the way .. Worried about Knight's play of late and that's the thing about having bad / imbalanced rosters and / or bad / imbalanced head coaches ... Players can lose themselves as Stuckey has from season 2 on .. and as Daye and JJ have since this season .. If the Pistons had had their shit together, Stuckey would be a very solid SG at this time and JJ would be a solid SF... But we have to hang in there and just give them better coaching and defined roles and minutes to get their game together ... happy about Monroe .. Will just keep believing in Knight even if he has a bad game now and then ..

[Grizz]

Oracle: Agree on it being easy to beat him up, lately there has been nothing to praise him for, especially the way we've lost some of our players, Chauncy, Afflallo, Summers, Terrico White, Rip & a few more, who have we got in return for some of these guys that our continuing to have success? Who hired Curry & Kuester, I hear you but I'm not seeing anything of relevance here, all the players we have lost & the players we have on this team are all on Joe Dumars win, lose or draw, I don't see the other side of this maybe like you do but I know I've had it with this crap, he has chances to come out & really tell us why or what the hell is going on instead of feeding the manure of rebuilding & not play guys like Macklin or Daye much, if you rebuild you play the players or, you stick them in the D-League, they have to keep playing, the board is not level here with Dumars. Even if Gores would come & say Friggin' something, we had a chance to believe again when Gores got the team but without a leader look where it's going now, we lose, we lose & we lose but Joe says we're rebuilding but when you got Gordon, Prince, Charley V, Maxiell, Bynum, Wilkens & Russell, (What?), who are these guys the D-Lague players of the day? I just can't condone what's happening with this team, there's no goal, at least a goal you or the fans can see, where is it, I'm pretty much a Piston fan for years & years & these last 3 years are pure crap. I want them to do good, I really do, read the schill writings of Vince Ellis & Morningood or whatever his name is, delusional pair they are, somehow I don't know if we had all writers here in town like Drew Sharp & a hard azz as he is, if they all shamed Dumars & saying hey Joe what's up? Don't send us no tickets cause we ain't going to watch this crap, if only that would happen, what would be scary about it is Dumars wouldn't even lend an ear, I may be a little overboard a little but this guy scares the Schitt out of me but what Realy scares me is if we get the 1st pick in the draft, then I'm running for cover, can we say Rodney White, Mateen Cleaves & etc, I do not trust him anymore, & still having reservations about Gores, how he's letting Dumars handle this is not being handled with care, hey my opinion because I'm one opinionated some-beech but just the way I feel about this situation. Iam not like Prince for example, I will not if given a pass dribble left, dribble right, fake left & right & then dribble until there' one second left & throw up a prayer, (Clang off the rim again Prince), absolutely not, I'm taking it right to the hole or hitting' the open man & thats one thing that Prince & Dumars DO NOT Do. Man, am I glad I got that off my shoulders, hope it didn't bore ya. You ought to see me bowl, te-he! Yea that was a nice play by Macklin, play the guy Frank.

Sissy .. hell yes we have a right to be angry and blame Joe Dumars ... many times over ... I love Joe the player and what he did 5 to 10 years ago as GM ... People sometimes change for the worse and he did as GM .. Too long has JD been given a complete pass for really dumbass decisions for the past 4 or 5 seasons ..

[Grizz]

I this article I was reading about the Hornets trading Kaman at NBA.com, they talk about the teams he may go to, and the teams he won't. Here's what they said about Detroit.

"Detroit: Seems like a natural for Kaman, who's from Grand Rapids, but the Pistons are also rebuilding and don't want to give up any of their young assets like forwards Jonas Jerebko or Austin Daye, or rookie Brandon Knight, in a package for Kaman. Detroit is committed to going slowly, through the Draft, and certainly wouldn't part with a pick that's going to be high in the Lottery."

Oracle .. From what I have read .. the hornets WANT a LOT .. YOUNG GOOD PLAYERS OR DRAFT PICKS ... for Kaman .. almost impossible for us to get him on those terms ..

[Sissy1946]

Kinda got my azz crazy tonight, hurried home to see that crap on the court, wanted to hold someone responsible or choke somebody's snot out of them & low & behold Joe's name came up again, imagine that, yea he has done some good things but it's been a while, we need to get our good players some bigs, this has got to be eating them up as we speak, actually felt sorry for Monroe in his interview, he needs some help down low. What you said about Dumars doing good things for them is true but you'd think with all that knowledge & where he's came from that we'd be better off than where we are now & that's when I start getting frazzled with him, he knows better than this, jeeze, he's a former Bad Boy, look at all the crap he went through with that team, thick &'thin, one for all, picking' up the pieces with Jordan, Isiah, Laimbeer, Rodman, Chuck Daly, he learned this Schitt & carried some with him to build a winner with the 2004 team & the 8 years they were respected in the NBA, & my question is how in the hell, did this happen, not just this year but when he first hired Curry I really thought this man lost it, & when Curry said we're going to hold everyone accountable except me bull, i lost a lot of respect for Joe then & then with Kuester well the funny farm was calling it seemed like, who would hire this guy? And look where we are after all the signings, the acquisitions the coaches. Tiddly Winks anyone. Only thing I can seriously think of on what has happened to our beloved basketball team is We have Officially Been Punked, what else is it with Joe's credentials? We're in another dimension, anyone else have any answers.

[Grizz]

Kinda got my azz crazy tonight, hurried home to see that crap on the court, wanted to hold someone responsible or choke somebody's snot out of them & low & behold Joe's name came up again, imagine that, yea he has done some good things but it's been a while, we need to get our good players some bigs, this has got to be eating them up as we speak, actually felt sorry for Monroe in his interview, he needs some help down low. What you said about Dumars doing good things for them is true but you'd think with all that knowledge & where he's came from that we'd be better off than where we are now & that's when I start getting frazzled with him, he knows better than this, jeeze, he's a former Bad Boy, look at all the crap he went through with that team, thick &'thin, one for all, picking' up the pieces with Jordan, Isiah, Laimbeer, Rodman, Chuck Daly, he learned this Schitt & carried some with him to build a winner with the 2004 team & the 8 years they were respected in the NBA, & my question is how in the hell, did this happen, not just this year but when he first hired Curry I really thought this man lost it, & when Curry said we're going to hold everyone accountable except me bull, i lost a lot of respect for Joe then & then with Kuester well the funny farm was calling it seemed like, who would hire this guy? And look where we are after all the signings, the acquisitions the coaches. Tiddly Winks anyone. Only thing I can seriously think of on what has happened to our beloved basketball team is We have Officially Been Punked, what else is it with Joe's credentials? We're in another dimension, anyone else have any answers.

Sissy .. very true .. How can Joe go through the Bad Boys .. Defense .. Bigs ..Teamwork .. and get to the Hall of Fame .. THEN .. Build TIME TO GET TO WORK CHAMPIONSHIP .. emphasizing those same great principles ????

And then it is like JOE IN NO WAY SHAPE OR FORM OR WEIGHT OR SMARTS . starting in 2008 .. IS THE SAME GUY WHO WAS SO upfront, dedicated, smart, strong, honest, and lived those principles every day he worked for the Pistons .. I can only guess that success spoiled him .. and he got lazy and dishonest .. Yeah . I just said those things .. because what he has said and done are just that .. And it is an effin shame .. I will try to remember him the way he used to be .. and just think of the guy in charge now as some different guy who looks a bit like the Joe D we all knew and loved ..

I think I could take better if the god damn useless writers (example: ) covering the Pistons had any integrity .. I would not feel the need to vent here as much if they had ever been more honest in covering the Pistons ...

[Grizz]

Frankie .. Good to see you took it to Dan Feldman over this .. I finally saw the article .. and .. gave my 2 cents hard to his face ..

[Only admins are allowed to see this link]



This is why being a Piston fan has been even harder over the last 4 seasons .. bad decisions AND media dishonesty ,...

Joe Dumars: “The ultimate team player. Chauncey represents everything David Stern wants in this league.”

[FlyDog]

[Only admins are allowed to see this link]

What a buffoon.

[Grizz]

[Only admins are allowed to see this link]

What a buffoon.

Thanks for this Flydog .. talk about 2 players going in different directions .. CB is doing his part to help the Clippers clicking pretty well .. Demolishing the Thunder and before that ....plenty of big shots by Mr. Big Shot .. We need vets who are LEADERS if we are going to have such on this team .. Dont see any at the moment ..

[Fennis Dembo]

The Real Notes and Quotes from the Milwaukee game not the stuff we get from the beat writers - by Biff Burns

Biff Burns: Let me see. The Pistons had a 21 point loss to Philadelphia and a 21 point loss to Milwaukee. Monroe had 16 points and 10 rebounds and 2 assists against Philadelphia and 16 points and 10 rebounds and 2 assists against Milwaukee. I feel like Bill Murray in the movie “Groundhog Day” and it’s only three more days till the actual Groundhog Day. Tomorrow’s prediction a 21 point loss to New York and 16 and 10 and 2 for Monroe. Wednesday’s game against New Jersey, I don’t want to think about it.

Coach Frank: The game had all the elements of a garbage dump during a heat wave.

Dumars: I am not a knucklehead.
Gores: The jury is still out on that one.

Dumars: For some reason Billups, Hamilton, Afflalo, and McGrady look pretty good to me now.

Biff Burns: Why did it take so long to diagnose that Charlie V has bone spurs?
Dumars: We sent him to a shrink first because we thought he was a hypochondriac.

Letter from the three casinos in Detroit to Allen Iverson: We miss you. Please come back after you straighten out your little bling thing. We will comp your soft drinks.

[Cool Bre]

For the life of me, I cannot understand why Macklin doesn't get in the game with some of the regulars like Prince. He looks quick to the ball, can block shots and can run the court. What do the Pistons have to lose at this point? Does Frank worry that he might be fired if the loses keep stacking up? I think the next person to get fired will be Joe Dumars if things continue to go South so if I were Joe Dumars, I would be pulling for more playing time for Macklin just for the outside chance that he can develop into a dependable player this season. Instead, Monroe is playing too many minutes, JJ looks burned out, Wallace and Maxiell should play but does it really matter what they do?

Knight showed his first sign of hitting the wall. I predicted this would happen due to too many minutes being played after the game was out of reach. Knight has tried to do too much as a rookie. I was really upset when Frank continued to play Knight in the game before this last one against the Bucks. I kept saying why are you doing that Mr. Frank? Knight had played his heart out and there was no purpose to keep him in the game in the 4th quarter. Instead, Frank took out Stuckey who had clearly not played hard at all in that game. So your reward if you are a starter in a blowout game is to keep you suffering longer if you play your heart out. That is a mistake. Frank has done that with JJ in the past as well until now JJ is just going through the motions like Stuckey. Knight is a leader and is going to be a great player for the Pistons. Treat him right. Frank did limit Knight's playing time last night because for the first time, Knight was not an effective player. Of course Knight might have some type of illness as well but it was clear that he was not himself.

I for one am not happy with Stuckey again this season. He disappears much of the time and does not move without the ball. If you are the shooting guard, you can't stand around on offense. And Stuckey never does anything outstanding on defense. So much has been sacrificed by Dumars on Stuckey's behalf and he is not coming through. This guy is not a leader by example. He doesn't seem very unhappy when his team is getting blown out. Everyone on the forum keeps talking about how we need more quality big men. That is a given but I am not convinced that we have enough NBA quality guards as well. I believe in Brandon Knight. He is a player on both ends of the court and is only going to improve and surprise us in a positive way. After that I feel the Pistons have the worst guards in the league. If any good team wants to, they can shut Stuckey down by taking away his ability to drive to the hoop. He is most effective dribbling the basketball the entire length of the court and going in before a defense gets set up properly. Knowing that is how he scores points, any quality team will be prepared and will limit his effectiveness. Isn't it about time that Stuckey proved that he can score in the half court offense? You need to move without the basketball consistantly and Stuckey is seldom moving at all. In my opinion, Joe Dumars has destroyed this team because he had so much faith in Stuckey and Stuckey has not become a outstanding basketball player that the Pistons need if they want to stay in most basketball games.

[frankied]

i think grizz touched on something important.
knight is taking a slight step back, imho. it seems as though he has hit a point where he needs to figure out some things, on court, and it also looks like he is not getting much help.
he needs someone who knows how to play the point guard spot to help him through this tough stretch.
it could be a coach or another player, but it doesn't look like that person is around the team now.
walker russell certainly knows how to play the spot, but as a d-league rookie on a ten-game contract, it is unlikely that he has the juice to pull another rookie aside and act as any sort of mentor. he could be gone any day.
but he has hit a stage that most rookies hit - and especially point guards - where scouting reports are out on them and teams have figured out what they do and are adjusting, and now he has to figure out how he is going to respond.
now is when coaching and player development is crucial, as he definitely needs direction.

[deusXango]

I see you missed it Frankie, so I'll re-post my feelings for helping young Knight, and solidifying our future with a strong backcourt.

"If I'm Tom Gores, I'd bite the bullet and bring back Larry Brown to coach/teach these young men to play the right way, especially the backcourt players, and hire Laimbeer as his big man coach....LB is going to burn out in a season or two anyhow leaving Laimbeer with a young team ready to contend. This is a little too rich for "Opie" to try and coach."

"Opie" being Lil' Larry. Lawrence Frank had difficulty coaching Jason Kidd, a sure fire HOF point guard, and has not shown any evidence of being able to develop NBA talent. His X's and O's proficiency is yet to be determined. There is no history between Gores and Brown and he's available. If Gores is going to throw his money around, dismiss Frank, hire Brown, and let Joe handle cleaning up his player payroll mess. Larry Brown is arguebly the best teacher in the pro game today (even if you don't like him), and Knight would greatly benefit from his tutelage, probably the last guard in the NBA to do so.

[Sissy1946]

When I e-mailed Vince Ellis about the Pistons rebuilding & why Macklin didn't play more than he has instead of wasting minute on Maxiell & Wallace he told me he agreed & their was a reason he wasn't getting the minutes, he said he couldn't elaborate on that, I e-mailed him back again thinking what the hell is up with that response he gave, was it something that Frank is seeing in practice that's keeping him from that or what? Told him I'd love to have his job also. Still waiting on that response but probably wishful thinking that he would say the jist of the problem.

[FlyDog]

Great post. Stunkey stunks. HE is Knight's mentor? My goodness. I'm convinced that Dumar's is a complete and utter tard. GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!

[Grizz]

When I e-mailed Vince Ellis about the Pistons rebuilding & why Macklin didn't play more than he has instead of wasting minute on Maxiell & Wallace he told me he agreed & their was a reason he wasn't getting the minutes, he said he couldn't elaborate on that, I e-mailed him back again thinking what the hell is up with that response he gave, was it something that Frank is seeing in practice that's keeping him from that or what? Told him I'd love to have his job also. Still waiting on that response but probably wishful thinking that he would say the jist of the problem.

Sissy .. 76er announcers agree said a lot of various good things about Macklin and the way he was playing .. the mystery continues .. Vince Ellis cant elaborate on that? I thought he was a reporter but ... guess not ...

[FlyDog]

Biff Burns take over for George Blaha as the lead commentator. GO BIFF!

[FlyDog]

I've never seen Macklin play. I'd love to, but since I turn the game off when we're down 20 or more entering the 4th Quarter, I haven't had the opportunity.

[frankied]

can't elaborate?
sounds like BS to me.
all i know is what i see when he is on the court. he's a legitimate big guy, in fact, a half inch shorter than cole aldrich with an inch less wingspan. so, in terms of size, he's pretty much the same size as a guy who was a lottery pick last year as a center.
he's mobile, he's got good hands, he seems to have nice hops, especially for a guy his size, and he seems to have a nose for offensive rebounds. he doesn't seem to be as active defensively, for whatever reason, but apparently, he was the same way in college.
considering the team's hole in the middle, it is puzzling why a guy who might be able to help is glued to the bench.
imho, just another example of a coach who is afraid to try a young guy out of fear that he might royally screw up.
but, how much worse could things be?!!!!?

[frankied]

I see you missed it Frankie, so I'll re-post my feelings for helping young Knight, and solidifying our future with a strong backcourt.

"If I'm Tom Gores, I'd bite the bullet and bring back Larry Brown to coach/teach these young men to play the right way, especially the backcourt players, and hire Laimbeer as his big man coach....LB is going to burn out in a season or two anyhow leaving Laimbeer with a young team ready to contend. This is a little too rich for "Opie" to try and coach."

"Opie" being Lil' Larry. Lawrence Frank had difficulty coaching Jason Kidd, a sure fire HOF point guard, and has not shown any evidence of being able to develop NBA talent. His X's and O's proficiency is yet to be determined. There is no history between Gores and Brown and he's available. If Gores is going to throw his money around, dismiss Frank, hire Brown, and let Joe handle cleaning up his player payroll mess. Larry Brown is arguebly the best teacher in the pro game today (even if you don't like him), and Knight would greatly benefit from his tutelage, probably the last guard in the NBA to do so.

DX,
i did see your post and actually agree wholeheartedly with its sentiments.
however, i can't ever imagine that ever happening, as much as i'd like to see it.
too bad, cause knight is exactly the kind of guy that brown could turn into an all-star. he seems to have a tough enough skin so that LB wouldn't destroy his confidence, and LB could definitely teach him some fundamental stuff he obviously needs to know.
if you watch kyrie irving, you see a guy who's had excellent coaching and is just putting into practice stuff he's learned. knight, on the other hand, just appears to be getting by on pure talent and heart.

[cool breeze]

[quote="deusXango"]I see you missed it Frankie, so I'll re-post my feelings for helping young Knight, and solidifying our future with a strong backcourt.

"If I'm Tom Gores, I'd bite the bullet and bring back Larry Brown to coach/teach these young men to play the right way, especially the backcourt players, and hire Laimbeer as his big man coach....LB is going to burn out in a season or two anyhow leaving Laimbeer with a young team ready to contend. This is a little too rich for "Opie" to try and coach."

"Opie" being Lil' Larry. Lawrence Frank had difficulty coaching Jason Kidd, a sure fire HOF point guard, and has not shown any evidence of being able to develop NBA talent. His X's and O's proficiency is yet to be determined. There is no history between Gores and Brown and he's available. If Gores is going to throw his money around, dismiss Frank, hire Brown, and let Joe handle cleaning up his player payroll mess. Larry Brown is arguebly the best teacher in the pro game today.

deusXango I really enjoy what you have to say and highly respect your opinion but I have to disagree with you about changing coaching staffs to include Larry Brown. I thought at one time that Larry Brown walked on water. I have attended coaches clinics where I tried to write down every word he said. He has been a very effective coach and was a great coach in the ABA with the Denver Nuggets and coaching college ball. However, I was very disappointed with Brown as a Pistons coach. He has received way too much credit from Pistons fans. I believe that Billups was already ready to set the NBA on fire when he joined the Pistons. Billups didn't enjoy playing for Brown especially in their championship season. So many fans forget what he did that season with this wild notion to play Corless Williamson at power forward when he had some good big men. He tried it in training camp and it didn't work and he defied logic by staying with this stupid notion for much of the season. He was a horrible coach for Memo. After Brown blew game number 5 in the playoffs against the Nets, he went small with Darvin Ham and Williamson when all of the Nets big men had already fouled out. Billups hit that 3 pointer at the buzzer in regulation to send the game into overtime. Richard Jefferson said the following summer that the Nets players were laughing at Larry Brown because he was so damn stupid. Billups said after that game, " we lost because I had nobody to pass the basketball to". Remember that statement? That was directed straight to the ears of Larry Brown. After the game, the players actually wanted to lift up Larry Brown and give the man and dunk his head in the toilet. I do not believe that the core Piston players on that team ever listened to Brown again and told him he sucked which lead to a big change the next game on the Nets home court where the Piston players took over the team from Brown's micro managing bull crap. However, the following season when Detroit lost the the Spurs, I thought Brown was so insane that he should have been committed to the Ionia home for the Insane. Instead of coaching the team, he was trying to create a war with the front office and talking to the press about how he disliked coaching in Detroit. I believe it was that season that I attended a Suns game and sat behind the Pistons bench. From our view, my wife who likes to look around more than watch the games, noticed that Larry was sound asleep on the bench during much of the game. We couldn't stop watching this scene. During the timeouts, the assistant coaches did all of the talking. Poor Larry attended the game because he was the head coach, but there was nothing in his contract stating that he couldn't sleep. Brown was a great college coach and NBA coach for several seasons but maybe because of his addiction to pain medication and medication for mood swings, he lost the trust of his players. Brown hated living in Detroit and never wants to come back and I am happy about that. This is only my opinion but I believe that the Pistons would have won the championship more easily if Brown had not been their coach. Now everyone is down on Frank coaching the Pistons. However, I think he is doing an OK job and a better job than the previous two coaches. There is just not enough to work with when it comes to real NBA players right now. He has the young guys working hard. He is trying to teach the players how to play defense. The problem is still there though. The vets who make most of the money on the team cannot cut it and don't really care enough to try to improve the team. One thing that the owners need to do is create language in all players contracts that if you do not play or attend practice because of personal reasons, you do not get paid. These players make enough money to pay the price if they need to stay home. Instead, the players on this team miss too many games because of so called personal issues that remain private. If they get paid for not playing then we should get to know why they couldn't play. Imagine the poor ticket holder who wanted to take the kids to watch Prince play and paid the money and then Prince is a no show. It seems that it is OK to screw the customer when it comes to Piston basketball.

[merc]

Pretty sure the reason Macklin is not getting the PT is they are trying move JMax.
No doubt the kid should get more burn.

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