Reality Check ..

[Grizz2]

[Only admins are allowed to see this image]

Oracle .thanks .. . this really puts it all in perspective .. with Jmax and Prince and Stuckey Starting .. we can beat 4 or 5 teams in the NBA once in a while .. As everyone is saying .. if we are going to lose .. lets develop the young players instead of tapping down their career potential .. Lets do what OKC did .. even if we dont have a MVP level player .. Larry Frank, the stupid bomb is ticking and when it blows up, you are the one who is going to be called that

[Grizz2]

.. the Pistons are going to win LESS games this year even with a good infusion of good young talent that Joe Dumars has brought into the Piston Family ??? I think it will be because Stuckey's play is deteriating for god knows what reason .. THIS IS STUCKEY's team .. He should be at the peak of his game and we really have no one else developed as the primary weapon to cause breakdowns in the other team (THIS IS BY DESIGN .. all the GM moves made have led us to this point).....So believe it or not .. if RS fails .. the team fails basically, at least in terms of winning games (still have a lot of hope for young player development) .. I also wonder if the team will be worst because what Coach Frank is teaching (bad stuff) will be implemented more in how the players play .. ALWAYS Get the best coach even and especially if the team is developing .. Prove me wrong Stuckey and Frank! Please ....

PS. It is also a very open question whether ANY other NBA team would want 3 of our starters, Prince (too passive and lethargic), Stuck (too wild and erratic), and JMax (can play well only in very short bursts), even as bench players .. Think about that for a moment ..

[deusXango]

.. the Pistons are going to win LESS games this year even with a good infusion of good young talent that Joe Dumars has brought into the Piston Family ??? I think it will be because Stuckey's play is deteriating for god knows what reason .. THIS IS STUCKEY's team .. He should be at the peak of his game and we really have no one else developed as the primary weapon to cause breakdowns in the other team (THIS IS BY DESIGN .. all the GM moves made have led us to this point).....So believe it or not .. if RS fails .. the team fails basically, at least in terms of winning games (still have a lot of hope for young player development) .. I also wonder if the team will be worst because what Coach Frank is teaching (bad stuff) will be implemented more in how the players play .. ALWAYS Get the best coach even and especially if the team is developing .. Prove me wrong Stuckey and Frank! Please .... [Only admins are allowed to see this image]

PS. It is also a very open question whether ANY other NBA team would want 3 of our starters, Prince (too passive and lethargic), Stuck (too wild and erratic), and JMax (can play well only in very short bursts), even as bench players .. Think about that for a moment ..

Excellent insight Grizz. First off, this is what we've been waiting for; the day Stuckey matures, as a player (3-4 years), and is surrounded by young talent (because he couldn't lead the grizzled vets that were here, when he arrived), he was to be the face of the franchise, and leader of the team. Here we are.

The most sobering fact is, the starting lineup suggests that the teams top 5 players are being used (no matter how you spin it); we've been a lottery team for 3 years running, and no one can tell me that Prince, Stuckey, and Maxiell are among the top 5 players on the team (talent wise). The only thing they have going for them is they've been in the league longer, well, they've had their chance and blew it! As long as we start players that no one wants on their team, the less trade value any of our players have; the less respect our franchise recieves from other teams (when it comes to making trades), and the longer we languish in mediocrity. If these players presently starting are the best, it's a direct reflection on Dumars as a GM, and Lil' Larry's judgement as a coach.

[allion1]

Hey guys! I just found this forum and this is my first post!

Anyway, I'm thinking Stuckey would be best as a 6th man. He could come off the bench and immediately attack. This is what he does best. As a starter, if the offense doesn't run through him he gets passive and then ends up with single-digit scoring games. As a 6th man, he would never have to wait his turn to score. As well, he would be surrounded by good shooters which would open up driving lanes for him.

The other reason I believe Stuckey should come off the bench is that IMHO his skills don't really mesh with Knight. There were several times against Houston that Knight drove to the hoop and the defense collapsed. We had Stuckey and Tay on the wings. We just can't make other teams pay for collapsing because neither Stuckey nor Tay is a proficient 3 pt shooter. Put a guy like English out there and it's a different story.


Cheers,
-AL

[WTF]

Hey guys! I just found this forum and this is my first post!

Anyway, I'm thinking Stuckey would be best as a 6th man. He could come off the bench and immediately attack. This is what he does best. As a starter, if the offense doesn't run through him he gets passive and then ends up with single-digit scoring games. As a 6th man, he would never have to wait his turn to score. As well, he would be surrounded by good shooters which would open up driving lanes for him.

The other reason I believe Stuckey should come off the bench is that IMHO his skills don't really mesh with Knight. There were several times against Houston that Knight drove to the hoop and the defense collapsed. We had Stuckey and Tay on the wings. We just can't make other teams pay for collapsing because neither Stuckey nor Tay is a proficient 3 pt shooter. Put a guy like English out there and it's a different story.


Cheers,
-AL

Glad you found us the more the merrier....

[WTF]

Boy do I remember all the Stuckey arse sucking, by now he should be surpassing the level of Chauncey. We'll in any case it doesn't matter where or when Stuckey comes in the game because I stand by my original assessment of Stuckey. He has a ton of talent and no brains operate or control it (Like having a space shuttle and no manual to fly the damn thing)

Truth be told with his talent level alone he should have surpassed Chauncey during his 3rd season. Fact is Stuckey best season was his rookie season, because of 2 people only and those folks were Chauncy and Flip Saunders. Lets not talk stats, but Stuckey made great decision with the ball and played within himself his rookie season that our dumb GM thought it was a great idea to trade CB.

I dare anyony to say that Stuckey has shown any sign of having a brain since Flip was fired and CB was trade

[cool breeze]

Boy do I remember all the Stuckey arse sucking, by now he should be surpassing the level of Chauncey. We'll in any case it doesn't matter where or when Stuckey comes in the game because I stand by my original assessment of Stuckey. He has a ton of talent and no brains operate or control it (Like having a space shuttle and no manual to fly the damn thing)

Truth be told with his talent level alone he should have surpassed Chauncey during his 3rd season. Fact is Stuckey best season was his rookie season, because of 2 people only and those folks were Chauncy and Flip Saunders. Lets not talk stats, but Stuckey made great decision with the ball and played within himself his rookie season that our dumb GM thought it was a great idea to trade CB.

I dare anyony to say that Stuckey has shown any sign of having a brain since Flip was fired and CB was trade

Wisefan it was very clear in the game with Houston that Stuckey had zero confidence in his outside shot. I thought that he had been working on his outside shooting over the summer. I know one player on U of Arizona basketball team that shot over 20,000 jump shots from outside the arc in a 2 month period of time. Stuckey doesn't have the best form and because he didn't have confidence in his outside game, he seemed to be very confused throughout the game.

[cool breeze]

All the players and coaches were talking about playing better defense throughout the summer. It didn't happen in the first game of the regular season. In fact, there were so many basic errors made by the players in their rotations I was shocked. The big guys didn't rotate fast enough. The guards could not stop dribble penetration. Of the guards, Stuckey was the worst of all on defense. That is the way it has always been with Stuckey. He never played any defense in college and didn't learn the fundamentals of playing defense. Now in the NBA he has had a long history of not bearing down and playing smart basketball on defense if he is not scoring a lot of points. That is a really bad sign.

Based on the first game, it is clear that Kim English makes the team better. If stuckey is not scoring a lot, English should get the majority of minutes. English has a nasty side and is not afraid of anyone. Just give this guy a lot of playing time and he will shine by January.

It was shocking to see how the Piston offense operated after the opposing team made a basket. There was very little movement. Either Stuckey or Bynum held the basketball or controlled the majority of the shot clock. When Monroe received the basketball, there was very little movement. He was not able to pass the basketball because nobody had the desire to get open.

[WTF]

Boy do I remember all the Stuckey arse sucking, by now he should be surpassing the level of Chauncey. We'll in any case it doesn't matter where or when Stuckey comes in the game because I stand by my original assessment of Stuckey. He has a ton of talent and no brains operate or control it (Like having a space shuttle and no manual to fly the damn thing)

Truth be told with his talent level alone he should have surpassed Chauncey during his 3rd season. Fact is Stuckey best season was his rookie season, because of 2 people only and those folks were Chauncy and Flip Saunders. Lets not talk stats, but Stuckey made great decision with the ball and played within himself his rookie season that our dumb GM thought it was a great idea to trade CB.

I dare anyony to say that Stuckey has shown any sign of having a brain since Flip was fired and CB was trade

Wisefan it was very clear in the game with Houston that Stuckey had zero confidence in his outside shot. I thought that he had been working on his outside shooting over the summer. I know one player on U of Arizona basketball team that shot over 20,000 jump shots from outside the arc in a 2 month period of time. Stuckey doesn't have the best form and because he didn't have confidence in his outside game, he seemed to be very confused throughout the game.

Cool I'm not sure what Stuckey did over the summer, but not much changed from last season. His game hasn't improved, his attitutude towards improving hasn't change either. There was a time when you could look at a player from year to year and see improvement, not with Stuckey though who's been clearly over his head since being handed the team.

This clown said a couple of seasons ago that on paper they should be competing for a title, now he's sitting here listening to everyone mentioning Knight, Monroe and Drummond as the future and now he got English on his ass. I'll give Stuckey this much credit though, he was smart enough to get Joe to offer him scared money.

[cool breeze]

I notice that the Detroit News is always the whore paper who gives the public what the team management wants. This is much like the CIA worked for many years. Instead of working to find out what was really going on in other parts of the world, The CIA created false stories and facts to the various administrations hoping things would come out the way they wanted the world to be. Read "Lagacy of Ashes" about the true history of the CIA and then compare what we read in the papers about the Detroit Pistons.

The Pistons will never win anything significant starting Jason Maxiell at power forward with Monroe at center. If management is so set on playing Maxiell then fit him in at a guard or small forward slot. That makes about as much sense. Monroe is a horrible defender right now. The Pistons need a guy with size to just stand in the paint so guards cannot drive to the basket at will. The Piston guards as a group are horrible defenders. I know that knight is getting better. But Bynum and Stuckey are downright horrible as they have always been. Yet the Detroit News has stated over the past year that Stuckey is a defensive ace who has greatly improved. The Pistons have shot blockers in Drummond and "The Russian". Yet as bad as this team played in the last game, "The Russian" didn't get on the floor except for the warm ups. He will only slide further downhill and at the end of this season, the Pistons will be the same team they were last season. I think that the owner should give Frank a guarantee that he will not be fired for the next two seasons if he can somehow fit the new players in the rotation. That way the coaching staff can relax and teach the young guys correctly. It is madness to hold on to the fake reality that the Pistons can win with that starting lineup they currently believe in.

[WTF]

Exactly Cool, they keep pussy footing around with the purpose of this season is really about. If it's truly a rebuild process then Drummond, and Singler should be inserted immediately into the starting lineup. But even with Gores silly notion that this team can make the playoffs this year making it with JMax and Tay in the starting lineup still means nothing while the development of the younger guys suffer. This only mean that the young player will still be behind come next season and your still in the same sinking boat.

[deusXango]

Hello Al, been reading your posts over on MLive, and have found them to be thoughtful, insightful, and opinionated. Glad you found your way over, and welcome; we'll enjoy all that you bring.

[Oracle]

We need Drummond & Singler starting, and English getting more PT!

We also need the big Russian as the first big off the bench!

I'm not kidding, it's time to look to the future! I'm not stuck in stone about who starts/backups where, but here is one thought.

Starters/Backups
Knight/Bynum
Stuckey/English
Singler/Prince/Middleton
Monroe/JJ/Maxiell
Drummond/Russian/Maxiell

However, I can guarantee you one thing(although I hope I'm wrong).

There won't be any changes during this road trip!

BTW, Welcome Allinon1

[Oracle]

I notice that the Detroit News is always the whore paper who gives the public what the team management wants. This is much like the CIA worked for many years. Instead of working to find out what was really going on in other parts of the world, The CIA created false stories and facts to the various administrations hoping things would come out the way they wanted the world to be. Read "Lagacy of Ashes" about the true history of the CIA and then compare what we read in the papers about the Detroit Pistons.

I found it on Amazon, just ordered!

[Only admins are allowed to see this link]

[Mike]

Mike, I don't know who you are or where you came from, but you damn sure came on strong! I'm really impressed with your knowledge/insight of the game, and your breakdown of the coaching deficiencies (particularly on the defensive end). Keep up the good work, and continue to bring it.

Thanks for the kind words guys I came across this forum in a search and you guys know your stuff too...glad to join. I'm just a frustrated fan like the rest of us, who sees some good young talent not being used properly - at least not yet. Hopefully Drummond gets a chance to shine tonight. I want to see more English too. Lets go lil Larry...time to take the kid gloves off!

[deusXango]

Should we find ourselves on the "too bad" end of an ass kicking tonight, it'll be time for some serious soul searching by the 3 headed monster of Gores, Dumars, and Lil' Larry. One game deep into the season and fans (who once fanatically supported Stuckey) are turning on our franchise face like he's some sort of Benedict Arnold, and he's not. He's just an okay player who's not worked on improving his game since he's been in the league; if you don't get better, you're getting worse, if for no other reason than time passing! Joe Dumars made him out to be something that he's not, and kept the spotlight on him, which was unfair. Knowledgable fans saw a long time ago that Stuckey was in over his head; no PG skills, and if he didn't develop an outside shot he'd be next to worthless as a SG. "Big, strong, and fast, who attacks the rim" is what SF's are made of, but he ain't that big, or strong, or an accomplished enough finisher at the rim to be a decent SF. He's not an elite level player, yet he starts no matter what (PG or SG just keep him on the floor...in the starting lineup). That's not his fault.

I'm looking at the number of SF picks made by the Pistons over the last 4 years, yet Prince is still the starter. Why? Not only was he foolishly resigned, but a trade offered to Dumars for him was turned down. There are some young lions on the team now that probably will bring more to a winning effort than Prince, yet he starts. It's almost as if the talent level at that position can't rise above what Prince can bring at any given time; I know why names like Josh Smith, Rudy Gay, Wilson Chandler, and Derrick Williams (to name a few) are poo-pooed. We got Prince. The stink of favoritism is so strong, it's beginning to drive the most loyal fans out of the Palace.

Now here's why Lawrence Frank can never be more to me than "Lil' Larry." He has all the earmarks of someone suffering with the Napolian complex. A gifted politician who's gone mad. We can give him a pass for not pairing Vernon Mackiln with Monroe last year, but playing Maxiell, because we never got a chance to see what Macklin could do, and he was an end of the 2nd round pick. Not true with Drummond! Andre Drummond was a lottery pick (who every team that needs a big man would give their eye teeth for), who we saw during summer league play, and pre-season, and he's better by far than Maxiell. Young, dumb, raw, but better and brings more to a winning effort than Maxiell. Lil' Larry lied when he said there were no incumbents; the positions were up for the taking, if one of the young'uns stepped up and took it. In the eyes of many, Drummond stepped up and took him a spot along side Monroe. In addition to that BS, he preaches defense, but the team has gotten no better at "D" than it was under the two preceeding clowns, and the offense has gotten worse! A pre-season of experimenting with lineups, and this is what we got? As dumb as they were, I believe that by now, things would be different under Michael Curry and John Kuester, and the difference would be better...I couldn't stand those two either.

[Fennis Dembo]

Biff Burns: It was not a Happy Halloween for the Pistons as they ran out of tricks and were beaten the Rockets from Houston. What happened in the fourth quarter coach?
Coach Frank: It’s all on me. We have a lot of guys new to the NBA and I forgot to tell them the game was 48 minutes long, not 40 like they were used to in college. That guy with the goofy looking Halloween beard disguise, who was that? I think they brought Kobi in as a ringer and put those funny whiskers and wig on him. He killed us figuratively speaking and maybe literally too.
Biff Burns: No coach that was James Harden.
Coach Frank: Now I know your pulling a Halloween prank on me. Harden is on Oklahoma City’s team.
Biff Burns: He was traded to the Rockets two days ago.
Coach Frank: I wish the hell somebody on my staff would keep me informed of these things. Who knew? WTF!

Biff Burns: How would you rate your team’s defense, they allowed 105 points?
Coach Frank: Defense? Defense? We don’t need no defense! We got no stinking defense! Defense what’s that?

Biff Burns: Stuckey was 1 for 9 from the field and Harden torched him for 37 points and 12 assists.
Coach Frank: I think Charles Dickens put it best in his classic novel “Rodney Gets Twisted”. Stuckey got his butt handed to him by Harden in the first half. Then in the second half he said, “Please, sir, may I have some more.” And Harden gleefully granted him his request, his butt on a silver platter.

Biff Burns: Did you know fans, there is a New Proposition on the Michigan Ballot for Tuesday’s election? So make sure you vote.

State of Michigan Proposition #999 - Should Little Larry take Stuckey out of the game when he plays like a deer standing in the middle of the road that sees the headlights of an oncoming 18 Wheeler bearing down on him at 70 mph? (Vote for One)

___ YES ____NO

Vote No - The Committee to have Stuckey play 40 minutes a game
Vote Yes - The Committee for Pistons’ Victories


Biff Burns: What would the Notes and Quotes be without making fun of my favorite benchwarmer Charlie V?
Biff Burns: Does Charlie V look like he has gained weight? He looks bulkier.
Unnamed Piston Source: Yes, he has a new part time job. Once a month they pull him through the Detroit-Windsor Tunnel to clean it out.

Biff Burns: Well fans it’s off to Phoenix in the middle of some damn desert. I’ll saddle up my mule named Sal and meet you there. Adios.

[WTF]

Mike, I don't know who you are or where you came from, but you damn sure came on strong! I'm really impressed with your knowledge/insight of the game, and your breakdown of the coaching deficiencies (particularly on the defensive end). Keep up the good work, and continue to bring it.

Thanks for the kind words guys I came across this forum in a search and you guys know your stuff too...glad to join. I'm just a frustrated fan like the rest of us, who sees some good young talent not being used properly - at least not yet. Hopefully Drummond gets a chance to shine tonight. I want to see more English too. Lets go lil Larry...time to take the kid gloves off!

We need more voices and opinions hope you and Al stick around

[WTF]

Problem is that Joe can't keep his nose out of his coaches business keep or refrain from fucking with their rotation. He would press LB into playing Memo and I always thought LB should have. He tried pressing Flip into playing Amir and JMax major minutes that neither deserved. Then his dumb ass forced Curry into playing and starting AI, then he fucked up Kuester entire roster by signing Ben Gordon and CV who he was forced to play. I'm sure Kuester wanted to start Monroe from day one just as Lil Larry wanted to start Drummond and Singler on day one. Lil Larry is little because he doesn't have the balls to stand up to Joe like Rick, LB and Flip did....

[Sebastian]

Biff Burns: It was not a Happy Halloween for the Pistons as they ran out of tricks and were beaten the Rockets from Houston. What happened in the fourth quarter coach?
Coach Frank: It’s all on me. We have a lot of guys new to the NBA and I forgot to tell them the game was 48 minutes long, not 40 like they were used to in college. That guy with the goofy looking Halloween beard disguise, who was that? I think they brought Kobi in as a ringer and put those funny whiskers and wig on him. He killed us figuratively speaking and maybe literally too.
Biff Burns: No coach that was James Harden.
Coach Frank: Now I know your pulling a Halloween prank on me. Harden is on Oklahoma City’s team.
Biff Burns: He was traded to the Rockets two days ago.
Coach Frank: I wish the hell somebody on my staff would keep me informed of these things. Who knew? WTF!

Biff Burns: How would you rate your team’s defense, they allowed 105 points?
Coach Frank: Defense? Defense? We don’t need no defense! We got no stinking defense! Defense what’s that?

Biff Burns: Stuckey was 1 for 9 from the field and Harden torched him for 37 points and 12 assists.
Coach Frank: I think Charles Dickens put it best in his classic novel “Rodney Gets Twisted”. Stuckey got his butt handed to him by Harden in the first half. Then in the second half he said, “Please, sir, may I have some more.” And Harden gleefully granted him his request, his butt on a silver platter.

Biff Burns: Did you know fans, there is a New Proposition on the Michigan Ballot for Tuesday’s election? So make sure you vote.

State of Michigan Proposition #999 - Should Little Larry take Stuckey out of the game when he plays like a deer standing in the middle of the road that sees the headlights of an oncoming 18 Wheeler bearing down on him at 70 mph? (Vote for One)

___ YES ____NO

Vote No - The Committee to have Stuckey play 40 minutes a game
Vote Yes - The Committee for Pistons’ Victories


Biff Burns: What would the Notes and Quotes be without making fun of my favorite benchwarmer Charlie V?
Biff Burns: Does Charlie V look like he has gained weight? He looks bulkier.
Unnamed Piston Source: Yes, he has a new part time job. Once a month they pull him through the Detroit-Windsor Tunnel to clean it out.

Biff Burns: Well fans it’s off to Phoenix in the middle of some damn desert. I’ll saddle up my mule named Sal and meet you there. Adios.

Another enjoyable read Biff Burns, aka Fennis Dembo, aka ???. Good stuff, once again.

BTW, The Beard is dusting up the "Highlight Factory", tonight the same way he showed off at the Palace.

[Oracle]

Unfortunately, I think you need to keep Biff more informed! Biff said,

Biff Burns: It was not a Happy Halloween for the Pistons as they ran out of tricks and were beaten the Rockets from Houston. What happened in the fourth quarter coach?

Biff, the Pistons will never run out of tricks as long as the smallest trick of them all is still employed here... Larry Frank!

[Grizz2]

Just 1 game but still .. Looks like I was way wrong about Felton and Kidd .... big time ... I expected the Knicks to be a disaster this season ... WRONG ... Anyway .. the fraud flop team I have never hated more lost ... so .. Pistons can develop in a NBA where no team is given corrupt special treatment ..

[Oracle]

Just 1 game but still .. Looks like I was way wrong about Felton and Kidd .... big time ... I expected the Knicks to be a disaster this season ... WRONG ... Anyway .. the fraud flop team I have never hated more lost ... so .. Pistons can develop in a NBA where no team is given corrupt special treatment ..

You gotta LOVE it!!!

[Oracle]

This kid is AWESOME!!!

His basketball instincts are superb!

Passing, blocking, you name it, he's the real deal!

[Oracle]

Stuckey can't shoot, and can't make layups RIGHT AT THE BASKET!!!

Knight is sometimes way too cute with his passed, and gets turns instead!

Scola is abusing Maxiell down low, as he can easily shoot over him!

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