Who cares .. but respect for your view ..

[Oracle]

What are you talking about?

Calderon throws the ball to a Wizard player, and Bynum tries to foul to salvage Calderons horrible play.

The fault is Calderon's, you can't be dropping dimes on the opposing team, this has nothing to do with Bynum, Jose shouldn't have put any Piston in that position in the fading minutes of a tight game, that's VERY poor floor generalship!

We disagree to agree!

Grizz, I respect your views as well, but this isn't a view, we're talking about FACTS! It shouldn't be possible to disagree about facts...

I'm sad that you don't see the facts, and it's also sad that with the way Knight was unfairly blamed for a lot of stuff, you would so easily let Bynum get blamed for Calderon's mistake down the stretch.

BTW, on NBA TV, they also said Calderon almost threw the game away... not ONE mention of Bynum!

[Grizz2]

What are you talking about?

Calderon throws the ball to a Wizard player, and Bynum tries to foul to salvage Calderons horrible play.

The fault is Calderon's, you can't be dropping dimes on the opposing team, this has nothing to do with Bynum, Jose shouldn't have put any Piston in that position in the fading minutes of a tight game, that's VERY poor floor generalship!

We disagree to agree!

Grizz, I respect your views as well, but this isn't a view, we're talking about FACTS! It shouldn't be possible to disagree about facts...

I'm sad that you don't see the facts, and it's also sad that with the way Knight was unfairly blamed for a lot of stuff, you would so easily let Bynum get blamed for Calderon's mistake down the stretch.

BTW, on NBA TV, they also said Calderon almost threw the game away... not ONE mention of Bynum!

Oracle I guess we need something to argue about after a close win ..

I dont care what NBA TV decides is important BTW .. You wouldnt hestitate to ignore their point of view I am sure ...If you didnt agree with it ..

Calderon made a mistake .. a big one .. the only ball he threw away all night .. 18 assists 2 turnovers .. He had a great game otherwise ..

Giving the other team a clear path foul .. 2 foul shots and possession of the ball ..when you are up by 3 ... is NOT a smart play .. that is a fact ... I see Bynum making a bad play by Calderon .. a worse one ..

I still like Bynum .. and he is a good back up PG .. especially on offense .. He had a bad night .. I forgive him!

Actually .. I would rather discuss why Bynum was even in the game at that point? I was watching it .. but .. Didnt we have 3 guards in at the time? And with the lead, shouldnt we have had a better defensive player in than Bynum?

[Oracle]

Wrong, one player made a mistake, the other did what 100% of NBA players, and anyone with a basketball bone in their body would do... attempt to stop a easy score on the other end!

That's a HUGE difference!

BTW, I don't care how you want to spin this, it doesn't matter to me, people can do what they want.

However, when that knife cuts your way, I just expect you to apply the same standard you just applied!

Let's just blame the person that got put in a position they never asked for because another player made a dumb ass play!

Yeah, makes perfect sense to me!

[Oracle]

Frank did something he rarely does, and something I didn't think he was capable of managing!

Frank played 11 deep into his lineup!

This is smart coaching! JJ & CV aren't the same type of player, so I never understood why playing one excluded the other!

If Frank could do this on a regular basis, he might discover/learn how to utilize players based on who the other team puts on the floor.

Maybe Frank could actually adapt his lineup during a game to better offset these awful runs we're so accoustomed to seeing.

Maybe... Naaaaaah, I must be dreaming!

[Grizz2]

Wrong, one player made a mistake, the other did what 100% of NBA players, and anyone with a basketball bone in their body would do... attempt to stop a easy score on the other end!

That's a HUGE difference!

BTW, I don't care how you want to spin this, it doesn't matter to me, people can do what they want.

However, when that knife cuts your way, I just expect you to apply the same standard you just applied!

Let's just blame the person that got put in a position they never asked for because another player made a dumb ass play!

Yeah, makes perfect sense to me!

It does make sense to say both players made mistakes ... You have the last word on this .. 1 .. 2. .. 3... Go ..

[Murph]

I unfortunately missed last night's game. It's looked like a good one.

From the box score I see Calderon had 18 assits, Monroe had 26 pts and another double-double and Knight had a career high 32. Knight is really adjusting to that SG spot.

And Kim English had the best game of his brief professional career. In fact, English has scored 10 points 2 games in a row. He is becoming a regular in the rotation, playing 12 minutes a game in the month of Feb.

[lemonpen]

Could last night be a be an example of not knowing how much something is loved until it seemed lost.

In his post game intrview the night he was injured Knight admitted this was the first time anything like this (injury) has happened and he didn't quite know what to expect. I wonder if the uncertainty and absence hasn't created a new level of appreciation & drive.

BK7 was a different guy last night. He ran like vintage Rip. He demanded the ball. I can't wait to see if this continues.

[lemonpen]

Fellas, I just don’t see anything special with him. Last night he didn’t really extend beyond the area he occupied to rebound or challenge shots. Matter of fact any attempted engagement into the action seemed a step late and somewhat meekly initiated. Washington’s rather ordinary and unaccomplished bigs were far quicker, more aggressive and played at a higher skill level than Slava.

But, I’ll keep watching.

[lemonpen]

Been saying it outside of the Forum so now I’ll stand fully on that limb.

Within 2 years Moose will be one of the top 3 post players in the league.

Aside from the developing jumper Monroe’s game around the rim has become quite crafty. He will likely remain vertically challenged but dude continues to expand his lefty / righty arsenal. The addition of Jose seems to further open angles to quickly dive toward the basket.

He might become a modern day Elton Brand (in his prime).

[merc]

Been saying it outside of the Forum so now I’ll stand fully on that limb.

Within 2 years Moose will be one of the top 3 post players in the league.

Aside from the developing jumper Monroe’s game around the rim has become quite crafty. He will likely remain vertically challenged but dude continues to expand his lefty / righty arsenal. The addition of Jose seems to further open angles to quickly dive toward the basket.

He might become a modern day Elton Brand (in his prime).

You're right LP, what surprises me is how well he's adapted to using his right hand (scouting reports said it was non existent)... IMO the biggest improvement will come from perimeter shooting... he knows very well that his future with Dre depends on it.... which raises the question, how much will teams clog the middle with Dre's lack of range?

[merc]

From Langlois mailbag... " If Carter-Williams is going to be a lottery pick, it’s because teams see a rangy point guard, not a skinny, physically challenged shooting guard. If teams aren’t relatively certain he can play point guard in the NBA, then he’s just another guy."
Maybe someone should let Keith know that he weighs 4 lbs less than our skinny SG Knight.

[Oracle]

Could last night be a be an example of not knowing how much something is loved until it seemed lost.

In his post game intrview the night he was injured Knight admitted this was the first time anything like this (injury) has happened and he didn't quite know what to expect. I wonder if the uncertainty and absence hasn't created a new level of appreciation & drive.

BK7 was a different guy last night. He ran like vintage Rip. He demanded the ball. I can't wait to see if this continues.

I also think that sitting out allows you to gain a perspective that you can't get when you're constantly playing.

Just as quarterbacks benefit from carrying around a clipboard for awhile, Knight may have had the time to see the game through a different lens!

[Oracle]

"It does make sense to say both players made mistakes ... You have the last word on this .. 1 .. 2. .. 3... Go .." - Grizz

Grizz, let's get out our trusty dictionaries and look up the word mistake!

A mistake is doing something your didn't intend to do!

Now follow along with you crib notes... Calderon made a mistake when he threw the pass to a Wizards player!

It is NOT a mistake when you do something intentionally... Bynum intentionally fouled a player because Calderon made a mistake!

That ends our lesson for today friends!

[Oracle]

You kept asking that question, which makes me wonder if you even saw the game.

We had a big lead, and suddenly the Wizards when on a run. If you saw the game, our problem was that we couldn't score!

The offending play by Calderon was in the fading seconds of the 4th, we had the ball, and all we needed was a score!

Can you guess why we would have Bynum in there?

[WTF]

The announcers for Indiana and Atlants pointed out something that I have known for a long time about this group of Pistons. I have to say that I was upset to see Calderon go under screens and give up open looks often. The big three are Stuckey, Bynum and Calderon. Knight never does it. English never does it. I haven't caught Middleton yet. Good coaches look for stuff like that. They also look to see if the big men are going out too far on pop outs and if they are recovering quickly enough. I am sure that Bill Laimbeer wouldn't tolerate that kind of basic lack of effort and knowledge on defense. I recall watching his team in the WNBA play great fundamental defense and that is why they were so great. Can anyone tell me what coaching staffs at the NBA level actually do as far a coaching is concerned? If guys are making basic errors that determine games, then before the game is lost, why not sub in for the offender right away and have an assistant coach talk to the player about the error. That is what the head coach at Arizona does and U of Michigan and MSU as well. Most all coaches do it so why in hell does Frank just stand with this puzzled look on his face. He has the look that he is over his head and doesn't know what to do. If things are going badly for a team, you talk to them about the fundamentals and watch closely to see what basic thing certain players are doing wrong so the player gets on the right page. I was watching Jeff Teague last night and couldn't help but enjoy the way he plays. He does almost everything the right way. Stuckey does it his way. Bynum does it his way. Calderon is also doing his way. All do it the wrong way. And our big men have so many basic things wrong with their games, that I would have to write 200 words to describe how fundamentally unsound they are as a group. Jerebco seems to be the most fundamentally sound of all the big men. But he needs more weight to play against all NBA teams effectively. Still Jerebco played a outstanding game last night and showed this stupid coach what a fool he has been this entire season. The one good thing Frank did was sit Charlie V for the entire second half of the game.

These young Piston players must not be very smart or hungry. All English and Middleton have to do is play like hell on defense. And they didn't do it last night. Why can't young players get that? They are so bent on scoring instead of seeing the opportunity especially on this team of weak defenders. Just show the coach you are busting your ass on defense and you can get playing time. Yet last night I saw Middleton and English as well as the big Russian seem out of breath and too tired to get their hands up or sprint out to a shooter. With that said, Frank should go with Kravtsov, Middleton and English for extended minutes. He needs to sit Maxiell and Charlie V. Frank should be starting either Jerebco or Kravtsov at power forward to play next to Monroe. This current starting group without Knight is the worst starting unit in the league. And Maxiell causes most of the problems although he works his tail off. I watched Calderon try to lob passes to Maxiell for the past three games and it can't be done sports fans.

I think pointing out the facts and the basic errors that shouldn't be made at the NBA level is something that gets under the skin of the players and the coaching staff. That is why I like to do it. They don't care if sites like this one includes general statements about how fans hate the coach or certain players. When you point out the facts that puts heat on Joe Dumars to get off his dead ass as well as this lazy coaching staff. How many players have improved this season from the work this coaching staff has put in? They can say Drummond but that is it as far as I can see. And no vet player is held accountable for lazy play or mental errors.

I want to say that the area I've is more overstating of the obivious and missing all the facts. First every female player that enters the WNBA is more fundamentally sound and much smarter than their male counter-parts largely in part because theyt stayed in school the entire 4 years.

It wasn't anything that Bill did its just that those women alreay knew how to play the right way. Bill would not have the same success if these were male knuckle-heads leaving after a year of college.

Now I do agree we have some menatlly challenge players.

[WTF]

"It does make sense to say both players made mistakes ... You have the last word on this .. 1 .. 2. .. 3... Go .." - Grizz

Grizz, let's get out our trusty dictionaries and look up the word mistake!

A mistake is doing something your didn't intend to do!

Now follow along with you crib notes... Calderon made a mistake when he threw the pass to a Wizards player!

It is NOT a mistake when you do something intentionally... Bynum intentionally fouled a player because Calderon made a mistake!

That ends our lesson for today friends!

Grizz is just more emotional thus blinded by emotions LMAO, at least you see now why Grizz pushes to the brink of all my homocidal post When he gets all emotional about Knight

[cool breeze]

You kept asking that question, which makes me wonder if you even saw the game.

We had a big lead, and suddenly the Wizards when on a run. If you saw the game, our problem was that we couldn't score!

The offending play by Calderon was in the fading seconds of the 4th, we had the ball, and all we needed was a score!

Can you guess why we would have Bynum in there?

Oracle I was worried when Bynum entered the game because he had a horrible game any way you cut it. Bynum played 13.40 minutes and was responsible for causing at lot of turnovers and missed opportunities by not passing to open players when he had the ball. Of course his defense is always among the worst of all NBA players. However, I believe that coach Frank brought Bynum in the game for the same reason that you stated. English would have been a better option in my humble opinion. English played really well in that game which was not noticed by Frank. English played 11.40 minutes and scored 10 points without turnover the basketball while playing outstanding defense. As English is always the forgotten man for crunch time play, Frank knew that Stuckey had another stinker game much worse than even Bynum. Stuckey played 19.51 minutes under Frank's unwatchful mind while making blunder after blunder on defense on pick and roll plays. The Wizzards actually targeted the side of the floor where Stuckey and Monroe were playing on. Stuckey's effort was flat and he scored an amazing 2 points with all that playing time. This is the player Joe Dumars hand picked to lead Detroit to the promise land and the basis for trading away Billups. We all watched the amazing Brandon Knight and the effort alone was worth the price of a high priced ticket. Match Brandon's effort with Stuckey and you can see that Stuckey who is a really fast player when he wants to be just doesn't like the game of basketball the way Knight does. In Frank's simple mind though, the choice of players to bring in is set in stone regardless of how well guys like English might be playing. It had to be either Bynum or Stuckey and even the coach has had his fill of Stuckey's lack of basic effort.

[WTF]

You kept asking that question, which makes me wonder if you even saw the game.

We had a big lead, and suddenly the Wizards when on a run. If you saw the game, our problem was that we couldn't score!

The offending play by Calderon was in the fading seconds of the 4th, we had the ball, and all we needed was a score!

Can you guess why we would have Bynum in there?

Oracle I was worried when Bynum entered the game because he had a horrible game any way you cut it. Bynum played 13.40 minutes and was responsible for causing at lot of turnovers and missed opportunities by not passing to open players when he had the ball. Of course his defense is always among the worst of all NBA players. However, I believe that coach Frank brought Bynum in the game for the same reason that you stated. English would have been a better option in my humble opinion. English played really well in that game which was not noticed by Frank. English played 11.40 minutes and scored 10 points without turnover the basketball while playing outstanding defense. As English is always the forgotten man for crunch time play, Frank knew that Stuckey had another stinker game much worse than even Bynum. Stuckey played 19.51 minutes under Frank's unwatchful mind while making blunder after blunder on defense on pick and roll plays. The Wizzards actually targeted the side of the floor where Stuckey and Monroe were playing on. Stuckey's effort was flat and he scored an amazing 2 points with all that playing time. This is the player Joe Dumars hand picked to lead Detroit to the promise land and the basis for trading away Billups. We all watched the amazing Brandon Knight and the effort alone was worth the price of a high priced ticket. Match Brandon's effort with Stuckey and you can see that Stuckey who is a really fast player when he wants to be just doesn't like the game of basketball the way Knight does. In Frank's simple mind though, the choice of players to bring in is set in stone regardless of how well guys like English might be playing. It had to be either Bynum or Stuckey and even the coach has had his fill of Stuckey's lack of basic effort.

There you go again cool breeze. Bynum had 2 less TO's than Knight (4) and Monroe (5) In his TO to AST Ratio was better that Knight. Can you just once stop over-stating just to prove your point and at least be equal and fair in that criticism of players.

[cool breeze]

Frank did something he rarely does, and something I didn't think he was capable of managing!

Frank played 11 deep into his lineup!

This is smart coaching! JJ & CV aren't the same type of player, so I never understood why playing one excluded the other!

If Frank could do this on a regular basis, he might discover/learn how to utilize players based on who the other team puts on the floor.

Maybe Frank could actually adapt his lineup during a game to better offset these awful runs we're so accoustomed to seeing.

Maybe... Naaaaaah, I must be dreaming!

Another good post Oracle. I felt the same way. My ranting on Charlie V will not make him go away due to his hefty contract. So now the coach is experimenting a bit while using both players. I prefer Jerebco and wonder what his game would be like if he hadn't been locked to the bench for months. He was very active last night and we are now seeing the old Jerebco. If Charlie is poping 3s in some games than he picks it up and plays with more energy. Maxiell played 25.5 minutes and scored 4 points but he had several blocks in that game. Still, I was liking Jerebco's defensive effort and became upset when Maxiell returned to finish the game out with 6 minutes remaining. Reducing Maxiell's minutes down to maybe 16 or 17 would be a smart thing in my opinion. He would have more energy and I am seeing where Calderon in this last game was able to feed Maxiell the ball closer to the basket. That is difficult because of Maxiell's size. As critical as I have been regarding Maxiell and how he fits into Piston future, I can't help but admire his overall effort. Maxiell is a good man who cares but I hope he doesn't get another contract unless it is for small money. Frank has been a real bastard with some of the players this season. And it hasn't helped improve the team.

[cool breeze]

You kept asking that question, which makes me wonder if you even saw the game.

We had a big lead, and suddenly the Wizards when on a run. If you saw the game, our problem was that we couldn't score!

The offending play by Calderon was in the fading seconds of the 4th, we had the ball, and all we needed was a score!

Can you guess why we would have Bynum in there?

Oracle I was worried when Bynum entered the game because he had a horrible game any way you cut it. Bynum played 13.40 minutes and was responsible for causing at lot of turnovers and missed opportunities by not passing to open players when he had the ball. Of course his defense is always among the worst of all NBA players. However, I believe that coach Frank brought Bynum in the game for the same reason that you stated. English would have been a better option in my humble opinion. English played really well in that game which was not noticed by Frank. English played 11.40 minutes and scored 10 points without turnover the basketball while playing outstanding defense. As English is always the forgotten man for crunch time play, Frank knew that Stuckey had another stinker game much worse than even Bynum. Stuckey played 19.51 minutes under Frank's unwatchful mind while making blunder after blunder on defense on pick and roll plays. The Wizzards actually targeted the side of the floor where Stuckey and Monroe were playing on. Stuckey's effort was flat and he scored an amazing 2 points with all that playing time. This is the player Joe Dumars hand picked to lead Detroit to the promise land and the basis for trading away Billups. We all watched the amazing Brandon Knight and the effort alone was worth the price of a high priced ticket. Match Brandon's effort with Stuckey and you can see that Stuckey who is a really fast player when he wants to be just doesn't like the game of basketball the way Knight does. In Frank's simple mind though, the choice of players to bring in is set in stone regardless of how well guys like English might be playing. It had to be either Bynum or Stuckey and even the coach has had his fill of Stuckey's lack of basic effort.

There you go again cool breeze. Bynum had 2 less TO's than Knight (4) and Monroe (5) In his TO to AST Ratio was better that Knight. Can you just once stop over-stating just to prove your point and at least be equal and fair in that criticism of players.

Wisefan you couldn't have watched this last game or you would not have made this foolish comment. Bynum was horrible in every way in this last game. He made major mistakes. If you want to show the stats then write down the minutes played by Monroe and Knight as well as their impact on the game regarding scoring, passing and defense? Monroe made many blunders on defense last night. And Knight admitted to making several mistakes on defense as well in his post game interview. But those guys were studs in that game. It is amazing that you tried to use the comparison including Bynum in the same breath as Monroe and Knight. That was funny.

[cool breeze]

Been saying it outside of the Forum so now I’ll stand fully on that limb.

Within 2 years Moose will be one of the top 3 post players in the league.

Aside from the developing jumper Monroe’s game around the rim has become quite crafty. He will likely remain vertically challenged but dude continues to expand his lefty / righty arsenal. The addition of Jose seems to further open angles to quickly dive toward the basket.

He might become a modern day Elton Brand (in his prime).

I agree with you on this post Lemonpen. Monroe has taken on a very difficult job of being the key player in the Piston offense. He handles the ball as much as the point guard in some games. If he had a Josh Smith to pass the ball to, Monroe would not be turning it over so much but you can see with this group that Monroe is getting smarter as the season progresses. His big weakness is defense. In time his defense will get better. However, I have this gut feeling that if the coaching staff changed things around a bit, Monroe would appear to be a better defender. Use a defense to fit your team instead of forcing the team to play a defensive system designed for different type players. Limit the distance Monroe travels outside the paint to defend potential pick and roll plays. Give up the outside shot until someone gets hot and avoid the easy baskets in the paint. This will improve the overall defense and not wear down Monroe as much. I see that he doesn't even attempt to try to recover from pop outs because he is drained physically. As he gets older, Monroe will be able to move out and recover better and know just how far out he can go before he becomes a liability for the overall team defense.

[cool breeze]

First off I loved seeing Brandon Knight's blazing speed on the court again last night. He was so fast and clever who would not enjoy that spark he has. You can tell that he loves the game and wants to play the right way. He is a great teammate and a leader. If any of you watched his post game interview, then you must feel the same way that I do about this guy. He is humble and driven. He openly listed several mistakes he made on offense and defense. This guy really cares.

On the other end of the spectrum, you have Stuckey. Is he injured? Does he have a problem with his vision? I was wondering that because on two ocasions, Jerebco came out to set a screen on the pick and roll play. Stuckey had the ball. Jerebco set the screen and rolled to the basket and both times had clearly screened his man off within three feet from the basket. Stuckey knows that he is suppose to look for the guy rolling. My grandmother, in her day, could have made a easy bounce pass to Jerebco which would have lead to an easy score. Jerebco was calling for the ball both times yet Stuckey ignored him and both times Stuckey's refusal to pass the ball to the open man resulted in zero points for those possessions. The first time occurred at the 1.15 mark of the first quarter if any of you still have that game taped and want to see it. So what in hell does that mean Piston fans? Why didn't Stuckey pass the basketball to Jerebco? It was clear to me that he didn't want to play ball with Jerebco and was in the freeze out mode. It appears to me that this is just another example proving that Stuckey has another agenda. He is not playing all out and is being selective regarding who he shares the ball with on offense. Stuckey has the ability to be a great defender but he just doesn't care about being an average defender. He is blending in and waiting for the season to be over. Or Stuckey is in a lot of pain from an unknown injury and just can't concentrate. If that is the case then Frank should be checking that out and giving Stuckey some rest. This team can get a lot better but not when some players are more interested in mind games.

[lemonpen]

How many times do you recall seeing Rodney Stuckey involved in a fast break. My feeble mind struggles to even recall a half-dozen times over the course of the season. How can it be that a SG would not be one of the first three guys out and running.

[lemonpen]

Could last night be a be an example of not knowing how much something is loved until it seemed lost.

In his post game intrview the night he was injured Knight admitted this was the first time anything like this (injury) has happened and he didn't quite know what to expect. I wonder if the uncertainty and absence hasn't created a new level of appreciation & drive.

BK7 was a different guy last night. He ran like vintage Rip. He demanded the ball. I can't wait to see if this continues.

I also think that sitting out allows you to gain a perspective that you can't get when you're constantly playing.

Just as quarterbacks benefit from carrying around a clipboard for awhile, Knight may have had the time to see the game through a different lens!

Yeah, it looks like you guys who supported sitting BK7 for a while may have the foundation for an I told you so moment.

So, let her rip. [Only admins are allowed to see this image]

[Sparma]

Not sure about your fastbreak question, although I'd at least say that Stuckey's not any kind of fastbreak specialist. He's certainly effectively charging the basket and it's easier to do that in transition.

Speaking of running, do you remember when Stuckey -- as PG -- so badly wanted to up the tempo? What I'm confident of is that Stuckey does a poor job running off of the ball, even though he'd be fully capable of doing so. Did we ever figure out what his outburst leading to suspension was about? Thought there was something about difficulty playing with someone. If so, my thought would be that'd have to be Bynum, because Stuckey's pretty ineffectual when Bynum takes firm command of the ball. Maddening as that refusal to run away from the ball is, it's understandable in that (a) he continues to have a mediocre outside shot and (b) Bynum doesn't seek him out in his sweet spot (as he's attempted to do with Drummond and even with Kravtsov). If a Calderon hit Stuckey with passes in transition, with an unbalanced D creating openings to the basket, I think we'd see a lot more running from Stuckey.

Some bad habits result from systematic problems (why run if you're not going to get the ball when and where you want it?); some weaknesses can be covered by good PG play (Stuckey's mediocre shooting wouldn't stick out so much next to Calderon).

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