Butch and the Kid

[deusXango]

Y'all, I look at Kennard as our prized rookie, because from what I see he does not play like a typical lottery rookie, what with his handles, feel for the game, poise and of course shooting!!  I have not been this excited about a Pistons rookie since Drummond, and I expect him to be an impact player on the perimeter, from the eye test.  He just looks like a "Player."

Kennard: “Avery is such a smart player, so to go against a guy like that every day, you feel like you learn so much every possession against him or with him,” Kennard said Wednesday. “He’s a competitor and plays so hard, you follow that because he gives everybody a sense of urgency when he’s on the floor.

“Being able to watch him (on defense) and what he does on the floor and what he thinks about the game while it’s going on, you can take part of what he does and put it in your own game.”

Don't get me wrong, I don't hate Reggie; I love the Pistons. I was there for the dark and frustrating days in Cobo, to the tough minded "Bad Boys" days. I watched one of the best players of his time leave it all on the floor, in that ugly ass teal, before bolting to the sunny skies of Florida and out of the ashes rose up another champion, we fans could embrace for representing the spirit of Detroit, the "Going to Work Crew" of 2004. I love the Pistons, but the recent Pistons haven't brought me the pride I so enjoy!

BallinD has taken me back to, what I believe is a most logical and intriguing suggestion, starting Bradley and Kennard. What's the difference in starting a backcourt that's high scoring and defensively sound vs. a backcourt that the #1 defender is the smallest man in the starting lineup and the PG is the weakest? The answer should be obvious. Sight unseen, I believe Kennard is a stronger defender than Jackson right now. How many lottery teams are searching for minutes for their prize rookie, regardless of what imaginary shortcomings their coach finds? The real question is, who has the highest I.Q. and more team oriented at PG, Bradley or Jackson? Both are sound ball handlers, but defense is the mantra of the coach, who plays the stingiest defense? Every great backcourt that the Pistons have had (Isiah and Joe/Chauncey and Rip), spent a lot of time together and shared a great rapport; Kennard seems to be Bradleys' man (positions aside) more so than Jackson. Bradley PG and Kennard SG!

Next year sign Avery to what he's worth to us and remember Luke is playing on a rookie contract. Galloway should be what he was signed to be...a bench player. IMHO he's potentially a great 6th man, completing a formidable three guard rotation; if all goes well, Galloway and Bullock should "kill" opposing 2nd unit backcourts. We've got shooters and scorers, who can defend, in the backcourt.

Talk about addition through subtraction, just as we subtracted KCP and Morris from the roster, it increased the quality of the team, I.Q. wise, the subtraction of Jackson will do the same for the improved play of Drummond. It'll give him a team to anchor and play to his strengths. Every guard we have is capable of running the P & R so that alone isn't a reason to overly depend on an asthmatic, gimpy kneed, $15 million PG, who may not deliver...it's time to move on, if you love the home team.

[BallinD]

Y'all, I look at Kennard as our prized rookie, because from what I see he does not play like a typical lottery rookie, what with his handles, feel for the game, poise and of course shooting!!  I have not been this excited about a Pistons rookie since Drummond, and I expect him to be an impact player on the perimeter, from the eye test.  He just looks like a "Player."

I ask, who would you rather have mentoring and going against Kennard in practice; I say Bradley hands down.  I loved KCP's efforts, but his IQ and skills are not on the same level, though he is faster and taller. Even Oracle is coming around...

Cool That article also mentions how much Kennard is learning from Avery Bradley. Avery is going to be the greatest thing the Pistons have had in a long time. He is a leader and is a outstanding communicator just as the article stated. Bradley is just the player a guy like Kennard needs. Thanks for being a good guy Avery. Too bad Johnson didn't have a mentor like Bradley in his first two seasons. Bradley will lead by example as his basketball IQ is not only really high but he is a player who is highly motivated. I was hoping against hope that Bradley would start at point guard with Kennard starting at the 2. Then add Johnson at small forward and Piston defense could be a beautiful thing. Hopefully SVG will get the combinations down right this time. It will be interesting to see how Galloway fits in and also Tolliver should be fun to watch again.

WTF: I hope the Kennard build up isn't a bunch of fluff from SVG and that what he say's is true about how hard it'll be not giving him PT.   I have a lot of confidence in this kid that goes far beyond the obvious stuff.   My gut say's this kid will be great if giving the opportunity and it sound like that's what SVG is talking about doing.  

Kennard could have easily gone top 10 and I think in hindsight a lot of teams might regret that they passed on him before the season is over but that largely depends on how SVG handles him.  If SVG does the right thing as I suspect and that is trade Reggie real soon then I see no reason not to start Kennard at SG and move Bradley to PG.


Kennard: “Avery is such a smart player, so to go against a guy like that every day, you feel like you learn so much every possession against him or with him,” Kennard said Wednesday. “He’s a competitor and plays so hard, you follow that because he gives everybody a sense of urgency when he’s on the floor.

“Being able to watch him (on defense) and what he does on the floor and what he thinks about the game while it’s going on, you can take part of what he does and put it in your own game.”

[BallinD]

Y'all, I look at Kennard as our prized rookie, because from what I see he does not play like a typical lottery rookie, what with his handles, feel for the game, poise and of course shooting!!  I have not been this excited about a Pistons rookie since Drummond, and I expect him to be an impact player on the perimeter, from the eye test.  He just looks like a "Player."

I ask, who would you rather have mentoring and going against Kennard in practice; I say Bradley hands down.  I loved KCP's efforts, but his IQ and skills are not on the same level, though he is faster and taller. Even Oracle is coming around...

Cool That article also mentions how much Kennard is learning from Avery Bradley. Avery is going to be the greatest thing the Pistons have had in a long time. He is a leader and is a outstanding communicator just as the article stated. Bradley is just the player a guy like Kennard needs. Thanks for being a good guy Avery. Too bad Johnson didn't have a mentor like Bradley in his first two seasons. Bradley will lead by example as his basketball IQ is not only really high but he is a player who is highly motivated. I was hoping against hope that Bradley would start at point guard with Kennard starting at the 2. Then add Johnson at small forward and Piston defense could be a beautiful thing. Hopefully SVG will get the combinations down right this time. It will be interesting to see how Galloway fits in and also Tolliver should be fun to watch again.

WTF: I hope the Kennard build up isn't a bunch of fluff from SVG and that what he say's is true about how hard it'll be not giving him PT.   I have a lot of confidence in this kid that goes far beyond the obvious stuff.   My gut say's this kid will be great if giving the opportunity and it sound like that's what SVG is talking about doing.  

Kennard could have easily gone top 10 and I think in hindsight a lot of teams might regret that they passed on him before the season is over but that largely depends on how SVG handles him.  If SVG does the right thing as I suspect and that is trade Reggie real soon then I see no reason not to start Kennard at SG and move Bradley to PG.


Kennard: “Avery is such a smart player, so to go against a guy like that every day, you feel like you learn so much every possession against him or with him,” Kennard said Wednesday. “He’s a competitor and plays so hard, you follow that because he gives everybody a sense of urgency when he’s on the floor.

“Being able to watch him (on defense) and what he does on the floor and what he thinks about the game while it’s going on, you can take part of what he does and put it in your own game.”

[cool breeze]

Here we go, as SVG starts with the excuses, even before the first game, SMH!

Van Gundy did hedge a little in saying he could see a way the rookie isn’t on the floor when the season begins Oct. 18 at Little Caesars Arena when the Charlotte Hornets visit.

But he sounds doubtful of that outcome.

“We've got good depth at the wings, so it's possible he could end up out of the rotation,” Van Gundy said. “He's just really good. He's got great skills, he can shoot and pass, and he's just got a very good feel for the game, even defense. The game comes pretty easily to him, particularly on the offensive end.”

Hard for SVG to keep a 10 million dollar man Jon Leuer on the bench. SVG cannot admit any mistakes when it concerns signing free agents. He has Boban to worry about so SVG must hope that nobody will notice when he plays Leuer at the start of the season. Thanks for providing SVG's comments. The plan must be to start Leuer at power forward and move Tobias Harris to small forward. Kennard will have to average 30 points a game in the pre season perhaps to make SVG's rotation. That combination of AD and JL didn't work last season and it won't work this season. Still it is great to see AD has lost that much weight and according to the posted story today, AD is working his butt off even with a sprained ankle.

That article also mentions how much Kennard is learning from Avery Bradley. Avery is going to be the greatest thing the Pistons have had in a long time. He is a leader and is a outstanding communicator just as the article stated. Bradley is just the player a guy like Kennard needs. Thanks for being a good guy Avery. Too bad Johnson didn't have a mentor like Bradley in his first two seasons. Bradley will lead by example as his basketball IQ is not only really high but he is a player who is highly motivated. I was hoping against hope that Bradley would start at point guard with Kennard starting at the 2. Then add Johnson at small forward and Piston defense could be a beautiful thing. Hopefully SVG will get the combinations down right this time. It will be interesting to see how Galloway fits in and also Tolliver should be fun to watch again.

[Oracle]

Here we go, as SVG starts with the excuses, even before the first game, SMH!

Van Gundy did hedge a little in saying he could see a way the rookie isn’t on the floor when the season begins Oct. 18 at Little Caesars Arena when the Charlotte Hornets visit.

But he sounds doubtful of that outcome.

“We've got good depth at the wings, so it's possible he could end up out of the rotation,” Van Gundy said. “He's just really good. He's got great skills, he can shoot and pass, and he's just got a very good feel for the game, even defense. The game comes pretty easily to him, particularly on the offensive end.”

[WTF]

Former Hollywood action star and new Russian citizen Steven Seagal bashed the recent wave of "disgusting" NFL player protests and defended Russian President Vladimir Putin -- in a live interview from Moscow with the Kremlin in the background.

"For anyone to think that Vladimir Putin had anything to do with fixing the elections, or even that the Russians have that kind of technology, is stupid," Seagal told Piers Morgan on ITV's "Good Morning Britain" Wednesday. "This kind of propaganda is really a diversion."
Seagal, who accepted Russian citizenship from Putin in 2016, praised the Russian president as "a great world leader" and "brilliant tactician."

Now this some funny ****

[WTF]

I hope the Kennard build up isn't a bunch of fluff from SVG and that what he say's is true about how hard it'll be not giving him PT.   I have a lot of confidence in this kid that goes far beyond the obvious stuff.   My gut say's this kid will be great if giving the opportunity and it sound like that's what SVG is talking about doing.   

Kennard could have easily gone top 10 and I think in hindsight a lot of teams might regret that they passed on him before the season is over but that largely depends on how SVG handles him.  If SVG does the right thing as I suspect and that is trade Reggie real soon then I see no reason not to start Kennard at SG and move Bradley to PG.

[WTF]

Great exchange on hot button political/ sports issues of the day.  You guys have gone beyond the polarizing discourse that's, sadly, so characteristic in contemporary American society.  Impressive stuff.

It is impressive that we can do what the nation appears to be incapable of right now... take on tough subjects respectfully.

Props to everyone!

We aren't idol worshipers or like communist, who tow the line because someone demands it... We're Americans!

Even still there a certain level of pain that comes with these types of discussions.   A lot of times tolerance fades and then we're back to one-sided conversation.   Still great that we can have these conversations beyond our norm of basketball.

[Oracle]

IMO, Drummond losing 30 pounds will do more for his game than that rogue booger operation!

Reggie is important, but a fully engaged Drummond will energize everyone and open a lot of opportunities for this team. Some of the greatest teams are led from either the PG or Center position.

Then there's the comments from Kennard about Bradly in practice that's really encouraging. He said that Bradley is vocal, intense, and when he's on the floor, the other players feel the need to match that intensity.

That's good news in that he's leading with his game... I'm starting to believe!

[Oracle]

Great exchange on hot button political/ sports issues of the day.  You guys have gone beyond the polarizing discourse that's, sadly, so characteristic in contemporary American society.  Impressive stuff.

It is impressive that we can do what the nation appears to be incapable of right now... take on tough subjects respectfully.

Props to everyone!

We aren't idol worshipers or like communist, who tow the line because someone demands it... We're Americans!

[cool breeze]

There are a lot of vets still living and they remember their fallen comrades. Families who are grieving over their lost loved ones lost in battle serving our country do believe the country has been damaged now that race has been brought into the picture relating to our flag and national anthem. Some could care less if the flag were burned in front of them on their way to a game. Others will cringe and they will never return. When I was a kid we always had to stand for the pledge of allegiance in elementary school. If we joined the Cub Scouts, Girl Scouts or Boy scouts we had to pledge that we would be good citizens and do our best to God and our Country. Remember that anyone? Now kids are taught to hate our country. The Louisiana Purchase shows how evil America is to Hispanics says a public high school teacher to stir up hate and indoctrinate his students. Last week a 3rd grade football team were told to take a knee on the football field in California and the coach made sure that a television film crew was there to film it. 3rd graders are supposed to be care free aren't they? Why are kids being forced to participate in politics? There is an agenda in the public schools. It used to be a violation of the teaches oath to give your students your own personal political viewpoint. Now it is the norm regardless of the subject. And nothing is said about how lives are destroyed because of teen aged pregnancy and failure to graduate from high school. Somehow people on school boards today do not think that is important.

A nerve has been touched and it might simmer down a bit but will never go away.  What used to be a fun (going to pro and perhaps college football and basketball games) is now an event about race. People are tired of the propaganda and will get as far away from that as possible. Few older people want to re live the 1960s. Maybe although I didn't like it then, perhaps the disco era should brought back into play to calm the waters. Peace and harmony and happy music could be used to stop those who want to pit Americans against each other. A cool vibe in the air might work until the media latches on to the latest monster event to get the hate rolling again. Many say the organization sponsored by George Sorus known as Black Lives Matter has a foot hold in our society in a big way. George Soros and other powerful people and nations could care less about Black lives. He and others have different motives. George likes to capitalize financially after he creates a revolution. The end game is to destroy or remove the US Constitution. A nation of laws will be a nation of emotions. The old Soviet Union spent a lot of the Lend Lease money American tax payers gave to Russia in WW2 and used it to create a revolution here starting in 1928 and through WW2. Now we have George and other clever media type foreign billionaires who love the idea of separating Americans into groups by creating lies for each group to embrace as truth so hate will flourish. They have done it in other countries and now they are on their way to capture the biggest prize of all the USA.  Divide and conquer does work. Meanwhile all of us from every race sit back and have our heads in the sand. Create a false narrative, hire protestors and transport them to the latest alleged monster and create a riot. The riot in Ferguson resulted in many honorable black small business owners losing everything while the Mayor and Governor stood back and wouldn't allow the police or National Guard to protect the stores that were destroyed. Who cares about facts? Ride those powerful emotions. Drive home a false narrative. Ignore what the eye witnesses said and testified to who were Black. Believe the criminal who was the buddy of the guy the police officer shot and make sure the networks get him on camera showing how it didn't really happen when he raised his arms. Soon everyone was raising their arms in protest. Maybe if they didn't do it they would be targeted for a beating or worse. To this day perhaps millions of Americans believe the false narrative that the media created to cause mass hysteria. So are the players taking a knee for what happened in Ferguson? Or are they taking a knee to create awareness that the two biggest reasons why people in poverty from all races remain there because of poor parenting or lack of parenting? Unforced errors we talk about in sports applies to real life as well. Just avoiding being involved in teenage pregnancy and or dropping out and not finishing high school goes a long way in securing a happy life. Hard work also is important which many lost souls try hard to avoid. What is the graduation rate in most big cities in the USA? Wouldn't a normal person believe that something is really wrong with the public education system to have such a high drop out rate? Why is this this issue not big with protestors? The answer is people are so indoctrinated now that they have to be told what to believe and what to protest. They want to be the popular side to every issue. why bother taking the time to find the actual facts? Blaming others is really easy and fun. These people make the perfect victims for those who are behind the big revolution going on right now. How much of the media is owned by George Soros and others bent on our country's destruction? The end game is tearing up our constitution with our Bill of Rights. Did I say that before? If people want to fight for something then they should be engaged as SVG says in protecting our constitution and how it is interpreted. Rule by emotion has become popular in a big way. In our universities especially the state supported universities, academe has locked arms to encourage the end of intellectual diversity. Just throw a pie at a speaker or threaten their lives so they are afraid to speak because what they might tell students could make sense and differ from "New Speak" as described by George Orwell. Read "Inside the Third Reich" by Joseph Spear where he confirms that the rise of Hitler was driven by German college professors like Speer. Shout down anyone who disagrees with the propaganda academe has decared as "good". Simplify complex issues and create an emotional response that gullible students digest as "good" or "bad" according to the wishes of academe and their big club known as the media. Soon normal people who have not read a word about a complex subject such as climate change or the Paris Climate Accord and it's impact on Americans are either believers or non believers. Keep things real simple because Americans and the British as Joseph Stalin said were the most gullible people on the face of the Earth. Very little in life will ever be simple but people want it that way and they want to be on the popular side of every issue. Now instead of Joseph Stalin we have George Soros and others who are extremely rich and powerful who are working on the revolution. The revolution is not meant to help you in any way. It is all about them and power and the implementation of rigid control. That is the only way a Marxist state can be successful - rigid control. That means you are in for a good ass kicking by the new thought police. You will speak "New Speak" or go off to the concentration camp.  

I lost interest in the NFL years ago perhaps because the Lions had such poor success. I would tune in for some of the playoff games but was never excited about the Super Bowl. However, many of my longtime friends have been big supporters of the NFL but now they are starting to drop out. I have friends from all races and they are all upset with this recent nonsense. My high school coach for football and basketball used to tell us never to talk about politics. IT gets you nowhere and only creates enemies. Sports are a way for people to come together not grow apart. If you have been lucky enough to ever play organized football or basketball you know that the only things that matter for a player is his teammates the team and the next game. For those players today who have contracts for millions of dollars, politics means more to them than the game or their teammates. They have been pressured into to make a statement on the field perhaps driven by a few players. The white players want to make a politically appropriate statement too. There is confusion as the players, the coaches, the players wives, the coaches wives, the owner and his wife all seem to have to come up with some position now on how they feel about things. The fans come out and spend big money to watch a game not learn how those people might feel about politics or race relations. Are we surrounded by idiots? Can propaganda be that effective where people jump at the slightest provocation and suffer great confusion trying to figure out the most popular position to take on Kneeling or not kneeling. Watching the Cowboys all squat down together looked to me like they were attending a funeral.

The NFL is a corrupt business entity. Players could not place a symbol on their uniforms after 9-11. The front office has all sorts of rules for players placed in effect so politics or causes will not be allowed to be part of the sport. Somehow the commissioner is AWOL on this big mess. And did you hear about how the NFL took millions of tax payer dollars paid by the military to advertise during NFL games? Tax payers not only pay for the stadiums or basketball arenas for pro football and basketball but they have to pay those front offices for the privilege to advertise to get recruits for the military that protects all citizens. Did Tom Gores really need Michigan tax payers to fund the new arena? The rich get richer and the tax payers get screwed again. Just had to have the arena in downtown Detroit and of course some chump trying to raise three kids on $50,000 or less a year can kick in a few bucks for Tom's team right? In 20 years the arena will show up on an accounting spread sheet showing zero value as a new generation builds a bigger arena for another billionaire owner. The arena will still be less than half full.

[Murph]

"I say live and let live. Let them sit who would sit or kneel. Hold Cops accountable, whether they are black or white. Turn on the damn dashcams so we can really see what we are supposedly waving the flag at. It's ugly, and it's real. We are held hostage to our modern police state and the hooligans are making it worse, but the real protesters (like Kaepernick) are making it better by helping to create a dialogue."


BallinD...excellent post. I hope we can all agree that the police have to be held accountable. If they're involved in a bad shooting, they should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. They should not be given special consideration because they're cops.

[Sparma]

Great exchange on hot button political/ sports issues of the day. You guys have gone beyond the polarizing discourse that's, sadly, so characteristic in contemporary American society. Impressive stuff.

[BallinD]

I love and respect your responses Wise and Murph, Cool and Oracle and I wish a more measured approach could be taken by all.  It seems like the Union is under fire as the old divide and conquer strategy is rolled out.  So they have people foaming at the mouth against each other.  This strategy is being rolled out for what, to strengthen one man's Political Base, while barking at the other one. Though if you really look at policy, there is not a dime's worth of difference in real policy, real actions, real caring between either one, Democrat or Republican.  The difference is more one of tone and rhetoric, than anything else.

And on the big questions, big issues, both sides do the same kowtow dance to bow down corporate interests instead of human interests.

I say live and let live.  Let them sit who would sit or kneel.  Hold Cops accountable, whether they are black or white.  Turn on the damn dashcams so we can really see what we are supposedly waving the flag at.  It's ugly, and it's real.  We are held hostage to our modern police state and the hooligans are making it worse, but the real protesters (like Kaepernick) are making it better by helping to create a dialogue.

There used to be sit-ins and they were interracial, whites and blacks and whoever else, sitting down to protest blatant inequality.  That was 50 years ago and now is it back to the future??

I'm a vet and I'm not mad at anyone that don't want to stand for the anthem.  Hell I don't want to stand at times sometimes I just do out of habit but never because I believe the Flag is just and equal for all people.  

There are a lot of bad people hiding a bunch of bullshit behind waving the American Flag especially people like Trump.  There wasn't always 50 Stars on the American Flags and some of these same fucks if touting it if given the chance half the Stars would be gone.  


I'm not mad at a single entertainer be it in sports, movie, TV, Radio or whatever. If honoring Vet is the only reason to wave a flag how sad is that?  I can give you 25 reason why people will say screw your flag.   

I know some think players should be quiet, but no more quieter than a draft dodger, a Putin Lover,  who uses slave labor from China.  While Trump holds the flag in one hand doesn't he have a pussy in the other?  

American Flag should not only honor Vets, but also it's citizens.  It should represent compassion, love right along with Freedom for everyone of all race, sex and religion.   

There's a lot of EVIL behind that Flag and the Star Spangle Banner, and America The Beautiful has never been a representation of Blacks, Native Americans, or Mexicans and most immigrants in this country.   We probably get a better response and level of participation if they played One Nation Under of Groove and everyone threw their hands in the air waved them like they just don't care. 

[deusXango]

I never really watched the NFL in the first place.  I'm the kind of NFL fan that starts watching the 3rd week of the playoffs.   Even before it was clear that football causes severe, permanent brain damage, I always objected to the career ending knee injuries, neck injuries, broken collarbones etc.  And I always objected to how little most NFL players get paid to play a sport that ruins the quality of their lives, and shortens their lifespans.  I never let my son set foot on a football field for an organized game.

Now, does it irritate me that NFL players don't stand for the National Anthem?  Yes.  But a lot of things irritate me, and there's nothing I can do about most of them.  So I try not to get worked up about irritating things that I can't do anything about.  

And it is undeniable that NFL players have the constitutional right to sit or stand for the National Anthem as they see fit.  

Now, enter Donald Trump.  I assume Trump got up on the wrong side of the bed on Saturday morning, grabbed his phone and started to tweet about everything that irritates him, and the first things on that list were the NFL protests and Steph Curry declining a WH invitation.  So he calls for a boycott of the NFL, and gets into a twitter war with both Curry and Leborn.  WTF???  Talk about throwing gasoline on the fire...

Needless to say, Trump should have taken the high road.  He had nothing to gain by opening up this can or worms.  He should have kept quiet about the NFL protests that were dying on the vine, due to decreased attendance and TV ratings.  And he should have kept quiet about Curry.  I mean, why does Trump care if Curry visits the WH or not?  Instead, Trump interjected himself into both controversies, and made them about himself.  Now NFL players are no longer protesting the anthem and flag, they're protesting Trump, and Lebron is calling him a bum.   Congratulations Trump!      

Trump needs to court African-Americans, especially prominent African-Americans like Curry and Lebron, for political reasons and for the good of the country...not intentionally alienate them.

There are no good guys in this.  Everyone is going to lose.  Kaepernick is out of a job, the NFL is losing viewers and fans, and Trump is losing popularity.  And the country is losing whatever social fabric it had, that was holding it together.  This country is coming apart at the seams, and that's the real tragedy. 

Damn Murph, why don't you tell us how you really feel? This is not only the longest post I can remember coming from you, but honest, well thought out, touching on all the nonsense of the day (where some of our favorite sports are concerned), just one helluva great post! My hat's off to you for provoking thought, from me at least.

[Murph]

Meanwhile, the NFL owners come off smelling like a rose.  They get to pretend they're siding with the players, while they reap in total profits of $14 billion a year, and pay their players a pittance for playing a brutal sport that ruins their lives.

I mean the average NFL offensive lineman gets paid $1.2 million a year, to get his head bashed in on every single play in every single game and practice.  He retires after 3 years, with bad knees and brain damage, and probably dies of a heart attack or dementia by the age of 65.

Now compare that to the NBA where some nobody like Boban Marjanovic gets paid $5.9 million a year to collect splinters.

If the NFL players had any sense, they'd be protesting the NFL owners.

[Murph]

I never really watched the NFL in the first place.  I'm the kind of NFL fan that starts watching the 3rd week of the playoffs.   Even before it was clear that football causes severe, permanent brain damage, I always objected to the career ending knee injuries, neck injuries, broken collarbones etc.  And I always objected to how little most NFL players get paid to play a sport that ruins the quality of their lives, and shortens their lifespans.  I never let my son set foot on a football field for an organized game.

Now, does it irritate me that NFL players don't stand for the National Anthem?  Yes.  But a lot of things irritate me, and there's nothing I can do about most of them.  So I try not to get worked up about irritating things that I can't do anything about.  

And it is undeniable that NFL players have the constitutional right to sit or stand for the National Anthem as they see fit.  

Now, enter Donald Trump.  I assume Trump got up on the wrong side of the bed on Saturday morning, grabbed his phone and started to tweet about everything that irritates him, and the first things on that list were the NFL protests and Steph Curry declining a WH invitation.  So he calls for a boycott of the NFL, and gets into a twitter war with both Curry and Leborn.  WTF???  Talk about throwing gasoline on the fire...

Needless to say, Trump should have taken the high road.  He had nothing to gain by opening up this can or worms.  He should have kept quiet about the NFL protests that were dying on the vine, due to decreased attendance and TV ratings.  And he should have kept quiet about Curry.  I mean, why does Trump care if Curry visits the WH or not?  Instead, Trump interjected himself into both controversies, and made them about himself.  Now NFL players are no longer protesting the anthem and flag, they're protesting Trump, and Lebron is calling him a bum.   Congratulations Trump!      

Trump needs to court African-Americans, especially prominent African-Americans like Curry and Lebron, for political reasons and for the good of the country...not intentionally alienate them.

There are no good guys in this.  Everyone is going to lose.  Kaepernick is out of a job, the NFL is losing viewers and fans, and Trump is losing popularity.  And the country is losing whatever social fabric it had, that was holding it together.  This country is coming apart at the seams, and that's the real tragedy. 

[WTF]

I'm a vet and I'm not mad at anyone that don't want to stand for the anthem.  Hell I don't want to stand at times sometimes I just do out of habit but never because I believe the Flag is just and equal for all people.  

There are a lot of bad people hiding a bunch of bullshit behind waving the American Flag especially people like Trump.  There wasn't always 50 Stars on the American Flags and some of these same fucks if touting it if given the chance half the Stars would be gone.  


I'm not mad at a single entertainer be it in sports, movie, TV, Radio or whatever. If honoring Vet is the only reason to wave a flag how sad is that?  I can give you 25 reason why people will say screw your flag.   

I know some think players should be quiet, but no more quieter than a draft dodger, a Putin Lover,  who uses slave labor from China.  While Trump holds the flag in one hand doesn't he have a pussy in the other?  

American Flag should not only honor Vets, but also it's citizens.  It should represent compassion, love right along with Freedom for everyone of all race, sex and religion.   

There's a lot of EVIL behind that Flag and the Star Spangle Banner, and America The Beautiful has never been a representation of Blacks, Native Americans, or Mexicans and most immigrants in this country.   We probably get a better response and level of participation if they played One Nation Under of Groove and everyone threw their hands in the air waved them like they just don't care. 

[cool breeze]

If Labron really cared about less fortunate people than himself he would not be commenting on the flag. Honoring the flag is to honor all military people who gave their lives for the USA. All races are represented in that arena where you wear a uniform and promise to make the biggest sacrifice you can make for other Americans. Millions have made that sacrifice including thousands of volunteers from the State of Michigan in the Civil War fighting for someone's freedom. Now people want to make the ceremony about something other than that. While Labron is talking special forces soldiers from all races are climbing the mountains and risking their lives thinking that they are doing their duty to their country. You can't compare their sacrifice with anything else. 

Labron should hold a press conference along with all of the other pro athletes who want to be leaders in something other than their sport and say this.  All teenagers beware because you walk a thin line in today's world. I care about you and beg that you do not cause another teen aged pregnancy and then try to raise that kid with no education or experience to guide you. Dropping out of school, getting pregnant, and trying to survive in a home with insane parents who only care about the next drug experience has nothing to do with national politics. Those unforced errors made in the teen years destroy any chance of having a good life. Why don't the pro players start talking about that more instead of placing the blame on the government? Taking a knee at a sporting event doesn't tackle squat in the real world. The political world is not the real world. That is a place for cheap talk where Labron can get his mug on the camera to get more hero worship.

Says who? How in the world does the flag stand for military people only? It's the flag of the United States of America, and that EVERYBODY! A real patriot would know that and not get confused.

But let's go further, the flag is NOTHING but a symbol and symbols may be replaced at any time, as the flag has been over the years.

However here's the biggest misconception of fake patriots.

It's NOT the job of the people to honor the flag or America.

It's America's job to be a place that people want to honor... PERIOD!

Don't get it twisted!

Pop gave a compelling and must see speech about White privilege. Until people understand that, you'll never understand LeBron. BTW, LeBron has a LOT to lose by speaking out, but his bravery is met by some with hate... whatever!

All I know is the war I had to fight in involved white, black and Hispanic buddies of mine who were brought home with a flag over their casket. We were all Brothers. We kidded each other about our race but knew we were all the same kids helping each other to stay alive. Since the Revolutionary War the flag as stood as a symbol as you said. But the flag was the symbol of unity for for the country. In the past until this current time in history, when the flag was raised most Americans of all races would reflect on those who gave their lives wearing an American uniform. It was something that brought us together not apart. We were all supposed to have this feeling regardless of our personal situation at any given moment in time that we were damn lucky to be American citizens. Why in this era are people complaining about white privilege? What in hell does that mean now today? What happened to the melting pot concept? That was a good concept where people from all backgrounds leave their baggage behind and we all blend into something good. Now we are a nation of groups. And we are really gullible ready to blame others for our misfortune and forget the big picture. We are ready for a totalitarian society. We are ripe for a nation based on emotion rather than laws. Whenever I hear a politician from either party call our country a democracy, i cringe because that was what Hitler said he wanted in Germany and Lenin said in Russia. We are a constitutional Republic. Of course we depend on the judgment of those who interpret those laws but at least there is a debate as opposed to what you get with Marxism. But that is what a lot of people think will be a better option. That is where this is all headed. One super hero leader will take us all to the promise land. We can worship that leader and burn our flag. So we will keep marching with this theme that we are all different instead of having a lot in common to be thankful for. Each group will hate the other group until one group defeats the rest of the groups. A democracy is when our of 10 people who get together who are all hungry vote and 6 of the 10 will eat the other 4. That is a system based on emotion where there are o written laws. People are working hard to destroy our laws that provide individual protection from the government. What other country has a Bill of Rights?

Why in hell has this political nonsense spilled over into the game of football and basketball. If you are a player, this is your chance to be on a team with a different background and color. To me that was a fun thing. Just like serving in the military, playing ball was a place where there was no color. Now there is color and all the agitators have succeeded in getting their political agenda into our innocent sporting events. Believe me the political revolutionaries are carrying out their plan for the takeover. They are trying to tear this country apart and we are so gullible we fail to see what is really going on. Taking a knee a symbol of the revolution created by people like Bill Ayers, Bernadine Dorn, Tom Hayden, Abby Hoffman. All of those revolutionaries tried to get recruits by protesting the Vietnam war. But they really could care less about that war if you have studied the de classified material from the FBI who infiltrated those groups. They were just trying to find a cause to get recruits for their Marist revolution. Each had their own vision of how it would be to the the ruler of the USA. Create false narratives people jump on it. This is much like the Rocky and Bowwinkle Show I watched as a kid where Boris Badinoff and Natasha would create a riot in every show while Rocky, Bowwinkle and Dr. Peabody would search out the truth and uncover their game plan and stop the mass hysteria. Was President Obama all bad? Is Donald Trump all bad? Do you have an emotional feeling when their names are mentioned? if so you are hooked just like that perch you might catch on hook with a worm on it. This might mean the end of professional football and basketball has we have known it. Now there will be individual protests with hate groups congregating in certain sections of the arena or football stadium. When they leave after the games, fighting will break out. Emotions will reach a peak not during the game but after when the fans get their turn to show their stuff. Pretty soon, the good people from all races will decide that going to a professional sporting event might not be the best thing for their kids. No they will stay home and not bother to watch on the tube anymore either. It would be the smart thing to do. But the masses full of rage with take over and those good people will be ground into dust.

[Oracle]

@Ballin - Very good post, and this is something that goes totally unreported.

The illusion of freedom is just that, belied by (driving while black), forced to pay for unjust wars, forced/criminal vaccinations, a medical policy that has created an opioid epidemic blowing up in our faces, which in turn is supported by the War in Afghanistan (nothing to do with terrorism, but everything to do with getting the opium poppy production back on line after the Taliban shut it down).  Fact is, the flag has been supporting totalitarian regimes around the world who do the same, such as the EU, Australia, Canada, Israel, and so on.

Bush, Obama and now Trump have the power to turn that poppy production totally off, but none of them do it! War on drugs my ass!!!

What's going on in Cleveland: Isaiah Thomas, Derrick Rose and Dwyane Wade on the same team with LeBron!!!

According to Shams Charania, one of the best shooting guards in NBA history will sign a one-year deal with the Cleveland Cavaliers.

After three seasons, he will reunite with the best player in the league and his friend, LeBron James.

[BallinD]

Mark Twain: "Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it."

It can be difficult to support the government all the time when it's decisions, expenditures and enforcement supports the ruling class in America to the detriment of the average person, who pays taxes and lives here under draconian laws, policies and ideals that are racist, cruel, inefficient and ineffective. Please acknowledge or research the facts that wars fought for MONEY at the behest of banksters who have been proven to loan money to both sides thus to foment conflict...divide (the people) and conquer, keep them under your thumb, strip-mine resources held by people of color, etc.  

The illusion of freedom is just that, belied by (driving while black), forced to pay for unjust wars, forced/criminal vaccinations, a medical policy that has created an opioid epidemic blowing up in our faces, which in turn is supported by the War in Afghanistan (nothing to do with terrorism, but everything to do with getting the opium poppy production back on line after the Taliban shut it down).  Fact is, the flag has been supporting totalitarian regimes around the world who do the same, such as the EU, Australia, Canada, Israel, and so on.  

I will stop with any politics here, but if we could actually be proud of what the "Flag" represents, then it would be easy to stand for it.  Most modern wars around the world in this era of the "War on Terrorism" have been waged against peoples of color and we have to look no further than our own backyard (USA, a corporate entity) to see how Natives and Blacks were subjegated and had centuries of revenue, freedom, lands stolen from them as the "Flag" waved freely.

George Carlin: "The American Dream, you have to be asleep to believe it."


The Great Gregg Popovich:

"I’m an individual. I live in this country. I have a right to say and do what I want. It has nothing to do with my position. Obviously, race is the elephant in the room, and we all understand that unless it is talked about constantly, it is not going to get better. People get bored, “Oh, is it that again? They are pulling the race card.” Because it’s uncomfortable, there has be an uncomfortable element in the discourse for anything to change. Whether it is LGBT movement, women’s suffrage, race, [it] doesn’t matter. People have to be made to feel uncomfortable; especially white people. We still have no clue of what being born white means.

If you read some of the recent literature, there is no such thing as whiteness. But we made it up. Not my original thought, but it’s true. Because you were born white, you have advantages systemically, culturally, psychology there. They have been built up for hundreds of years. Many people can’t look at it. [It] can’t be something on their plate on a daily basis. People want their status quo. People don’t want to give it up. Until it’s given up, it’s not going to be fixed."

Says who? How in the world does the flag stand for military people only? It's the flag of the United States of America, and that EVERYBODY! A real patriot would know that and not get confused.

But let's go further, the flag is NOTHING but a symbol and symbols may be replaced at any time, as the flag has been over the years.

However here's the biggest misconception of fake patriots.

It's NOT the job of the people to honor the flag or America.

It's America's job to be a place that people want to honor... PERIOD!

Don't get it twisted!

Pop gave a compelling and must see speech about White privilege. Until people understand that, you'll never understand LeBron. BTW, LeBron has a LOT to lose by speaking out, but his bravery is met by some with hate... whatever!

[BallinD]

The injury report; It can be taken two ways. A blessing in disguise, or a silver lining.

Guards Reggie Jackson and Langston Galloway, the two players dealing with knee injuries, went through all of the morning session but will be held out of Tuesday' night practice.

$22 million tied up in two gimpy guards, that can't make back-to-back practices? Stan Van Gundy, you the man, but you really need to learn how to stay out of your own way.

I read the piece on "The Top 30 Point Guards 2017-18" and Ricky Rubio came in #14 and Reggie Jackson came in #24...what again was the reason SVG turned down that trade? It's decisions like that make me feel that SVG isn't fit to run the Pistons organization, with or without accountability.

Wise, I hope your mojo is working and the predicted pre-season trade takes place; I've got the feeling something vital is missing from the team.

I can tell it's the end of the day; pre-season has started and I'm excited!!

OTOH, with Galloway and Weggie out we have a potential silver lining where Kennard and Ish and hopefully Bradley get a shot at running a bunch of offense as primary or secondary ball handlers and SVG is forced to give that idea the attention it deserves. Getting them some serious burn will only help us in the long run, if there is to be a long run... and I hope there is at least to the second round, what with all this new chemistry on the upswing and all this shooting and all this talent.

[Oracle]

I really think these guys will do very well, and here's why.

1. I believe Drummond will bring it big time this year. He doesn't have to become a defensive wizard, just give more effort defensively and the rest will come.
2. Bradley will help Stanley defensively and vice versa. This gives us a good shot against good teams and should devastate most of the weak sisters in the east.
3. Boban will be a match up nightmare for weak teams, good teams will figure him out, but that's alright.
4. Harris will be Harris, steady and not very exciting, but he's the glue needed in a complementary player

Here's the bad...

1. If Luke stumbles, even a little, SVG has populated this team with a LOT of vets, and he'll play them early and often.
2. Ditto for Ellenson, but in his case, he may not even get a fair shot. SVG has the usual excuses he'll pull out of his ass.
3. If Wise is wrong and Reggie stays, the longer it takes him to get him mojo back, the less likely he'll be worth a dime. The good news is that we won't need him with all of these damn guards(good observation Lemon)

Bottom line is that the east is so weak, it's going to be a struggle to NOT make the playoffs. We would almost have to have a complete collapse.

[deusXango]

Guards Reggie Jackson and Langston Galloway, the two players dealing with knee injuries, went through all of the morning session but will be held out of Tuesday' night practice.

$22 million tied up in two gimpy guards, that can't make back-to-back practices? Stan Van Gundy, you the man, but you really need to learn how to stay out of your own way.

I read the piece on "The Top 30 Point Guards 2017-18" and Ricky Rubio came in #14 and Reggie Jackson came in #24...what again was the reason SVG turned down that trade? It's decisions like that make me feel that SVG isn't fit to run the Pistons organization, with or without accountability.

Wise, I hope your mojo is working and the predicted pre-season trade takes place; I've got the feeling something vital is missing from the team.

I can tell it's the end of the day; pre-season has started and I'm excited!!

[Oracle]

If Labron really cared about less fortunate people than himself he would not be commenting on the flag. Honoring the flag is to honor all military people who gave their lives for the USA. All races are represented in that arena where you wear a uniform and promise to make the biggest sacrifice you can make for other Americans. Millions have made that sacrifice including thousands of volunteers from the State of Michigan in the Civil War fighting for someone's freedom. Now people want to make the ceremony about something other than that. While Labron is talking special forces soldiers from all races are climbing the mountains and risking their lives thinking that they are doing their duty to their country. You can't compare their sacrifice with anything else. 

Labron should hold a press conference along with all of the other pro athletes who want to be leaders in something other than their sport and say this.  All teenagers beware because you walk a thin line in today's world. I care about you and beg that you do not cause another teen aged pregnancy and then try to raise that kid with no education or experience to guide you. Dropping out of school, getting pregnant, and trying to survive in a home with insane parents who only care about the next drug experience has nothing to do with national politics. Those unforced errors made in the teen years destroy any chance of having a good life. Why don't the pro players start talking about that more instead of placing the blame on the government? Taking a knee at a sporting event doesn't tackle squat in the real world. The political world is not the real world. That is a place for cheap talk where Labron can get his mug on the camera to get more hero worship.

Says who? How in the world does the flag stand for military people only? It's the flag of the United States of America, and that EVERYBODY! A real patriot would know that and not get confused.

But let's go further, the flag is NOTHING but a symbol and symbols may be replaced at any time, as the flag has been over the years.

However here's the biggest misconception of fake patriots.

It's NOT the job of the people to honor the flag or America.

It's America's job to be a place that people want to honor... PERIOD!

Don't get it twisted!

Pop gave a compelling and must see speech about White privilege. Until people understand that, you'll never understand LeBron. BTW, LeBron has a LOT to lose by speaking out, but his bravery is met by some with hate... whatever!

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