FORUM
+10
lemonpen
FlyDog
Go Stones!
Sebastian
Phil-Good
merc
deusXango
Oracle
WTF
Fennis Dembo
14 posters
Page 11 of 40
Page 11 of 40 • 
1 ... 7 ... 10, 11, 12 ... 25 ... 40
Re: FORUM
cool breeze Tue Apr 12, 2016 1:04 pm
WTF wrote:Oracle wrote:This pic is disturbing, as everyone celebrates and Dre sulks!
I wish they curb this excitement down some until they actually truly win something. This team got either the Raptors or Cav's coming and might not win a game if not properly focused.
I just read what Ballin D said which was outstanding. Then you bring me back to reality with that picture that says a thousand words. Andre was not part of the Crunch Time 5. He had to watch from the bench. Is he blaming anyone but himself? I don't think so. He can't be mad at Stan Van Gundy. Andre is sad because he feels that he has failed himself. Getting down on yourself which Drummond has a habit of doing, only makes you perform at a lower level. Every basketball player has done it. Hard work removes this trait that can eat you up. Many turn to drugs and never recover. I noticed Stanley Johnson, who is out of the rotation, jumping around giving out high 5s at the same moment that Andre Drummond looked depressed at the moment all the players finally knew that had made the playoffs.
Andre went off on his own ignoring the advise of a professional shooting coach who was trying to force him to acquire better fundamental shooting habits. Too much information says Andre. He was frustrated. So we continued to watch Andre at the foul line using the same technique that got him into this situation in the first place. Baynes is also in the games at the end because he plays solid low post defense. There are two big areas free throw shooting and defense that Andre Drummond needs to clean up before the start of next season if he does sign a new contract. If he does that, Andre will not have that pitiful look on his face again. Still Andre should have been thinking of his team first instead of himself at that moment in time. CHARACTER! Which players have it?
cool breeze- Posts : 3817
Join date : 2011-12-21
Playoff Fallout
BallinD Mon Apr 11, 2016 10:16 pm
Congrats SVG/Pistons. With a little luck and continued strategic positioning, on the executive front, can't hurt our free agent, talent acquisition this year. I could see us pushing toward a 3rd or 4th seed next year.
Players will recognize I believe, that we will likely be the youngest team in the playoffs with one of the best franchises in the business (most will be slow to recognize this, but I truly believe our franchise is on the way to becoming elite status under Gores and SVG), we should be able to continue to stockpile talent, now to become elite, not just competent.
Pau Gasol, Noah, Horford...can we get one of these. Word is Jimmy Butler may be available. I think a young veteran would be best, but young rookie contract talent should also be targeted.
In SVG we trust, and the Future is Bright!
Players will recognize I believe, that we will likely be the youngest team in the playoffs with one of the best franchises in the business (most will be slow to recognize this, but I truly believe our franchise is on the way to becoming elite status under Gores and SVG), we should be able to continue to stockpile talent, now to become elite, not just competent.
Pau Gasol, Noah, Horford...can we get one of these. Word is Jimmy Butler may be available. I think a young veteran would be best, but young rookie contract talent should also be targeted.
In SVG we trust, and the Future is Bright!
BallinD- Posts : 945
Join date : 2015-10-29
Location : Milky Way
We need to keep the core together & build chemistry, but...
WTF Mon Apr 11, 2016 8:05 pm
Oracle wrote:This pic is disturbing, as everyone celebrates and Dre sulks!
I wish they curb this excitement down some until they actually truly win something. This team got either the Raptors or Cav's coming and might not win a game if not properly focused.
WTF- Posts : 4722
Join date : 2011-12-13
Stan Van Gundy has good reason to call out some players and they should appreciate the fact that he cares about their improvement
cool breeze Mon Apr 11, 2016 7:13 pm
It seems that people always go back to the situation between Dwight Howard and Stan Van Gundy and say, Stan is too nasty to his players and there is a fine line relating to what you can get away with when it comes to NBA players. I think those days are over now and thank God for that. In the old days, it was true that coaches had little impact on anything at all and had to be careful not to piss off the wrong players. And those players were usually the players who were unpredictable on the court. Maybe they were smoking weed on the way to practice now and then. Or maybe they had a fifth of Jack Daniels in their athletic bag and took a nip before the warm ups. The cool thing Mr. Gores did was put Stan Van Gundy in a position of real power. Players can't screw around and get away with it or they will be replaced quickly. These players really show they care about the TEAM and their fans and the coach and Piston boss.
So how have things turned out for the mouthy Dwight Howard since he left Orlando? He is just another bum who never reached his potential. Dwight was always a delight for me to watch when Mr. Big Shot's team played Orlando. Dwight never was smart enough to learn much from anyone and especially coaches who were trying to help him improve. That Piston team made a fool out of Howard. If we have players who are like Dwight, then I hope Stan Van Gundy gives them a one way ticket out of town before next season. I hate watching players who have never try to learn the fundamentals of the game. It becomes real dull to watch guys who have no clue as to what they are supposed to do on defense. They just have never had the mental toughness to take criticism in any form in high school or college so why could anyone expect they would change after signing a big contract? GMs are a lot smarter now. They spend a lot of time trying peal away the surface layer and find out about the true character of any basketball player in the draft. It seems that Stan Van Gundy's staff is one of the best in the league.
Now if a player does go to a good basketball program in college, they get yelled at everyday and if they don't do what their coaches ask of them, they suffer the consequences. It is real sad that Brandon Jennings decided to go overseas instead of playing college basketball. He never learned how to compete on the defensive end. During his stay in Detroit, Jennings actually learned a few things from Van Gundy. But if you develop bad habits on defense it is very difficult to break those habits. That is why I worry about Andre Drummond ever being capable of learning the defensive rotations and being able to react quickly to situations the right way. Drummond didn't get much at all out of his one year on a college team. I don't believe he learned one damn thing relating to playing basketball. Last summer he elected to work hard on his offensive low post game. He did put in the hard work and came back this season showing some real skill at times on offense with the exception of free throw shooting. Stan can never harp enough on this young man. And Andre should appreciate the fact that SVG really cares about his players progress. Andre needs to spend this coming summer working with a coach who can get Andre up to speed with his mental approach to defense. Know where to rotate and what the keys are. Help your teammates by communicating more in the paint. Box out and get your arms up and move your feet. Anticipate the play your opponent is trying to run. In most games he didn't do any of those things very well and never could concentrate for an entire game. Teams have manhandled Andre Drummond on defense this season like they did last season. He is too slow to react and this big weakness will be exploited in the playoffs more than his free throw shooting weakness.
If Andre listens to Stan Van Gundy and works his tail off and becomes motivated as a defender, there is no stopping this Piston team or Andre Drummond from being a top notch NBA stud. And he will never get there unless he has a coach like Stan nipping at his heals all the time. Embrace the fact that some coaches actually love helping players reach their potential. After a player ends his career, he will always look back and wonder what could have been. If only that player would have had the brains to listen and accept coaching that could have helped them get the most out of the game of basketball. No team wins with a Dwight Howard type mentality. Look at him now.
We seem to have players on this Piston team who really care and are willing to do whatever it takes to get better. These players all know that they gave away a lot of games and could have a lot higher seed in the playoffs. This still is the worst free throw shooting team in the league and they somehow made the playoffs. Cleaning up stuff is all mental and they know it. Now if they make a quick exit in the first round, Piston players must learn from it. Take a few weeks off and get back to work under the direction of a good coach. Good luck players!
So how have things turned out for the mouthy Dwight Howard since he left Orlando? He is just another bum who never reached his potential. Dwight was always a delight for me to watch when Mr. Big Shot's team played Orlando. Dwight never was smart enough to learn much from anyone and especially coaches who were trying to help him improve. That Piston team made a fool out of Howard. If we have players who are like Dwight, then I hope Stan Van Gundy gives them a one way ticket out of town before next season. I hate watching players who have never try to learn the fundamentals of the game. It becomes real dull to watch guys who have no clue as to what they are supposed to do on defense. They just have never had the mental toughness to take criticism in any form in high school or college so why could anyone expect they would change after signing a big contract? GMs are a lot smarter now. They spend a lot of time trying peal away the surface layer and find out about the true character of any basketball player in the draft. It seems that Stan Van Gundy's staff is one of the best in the league.
Now if a player does go to a good basketball program in college, they get yelled at everyday and if they don't do what their coaches ask of them, they suffer the consequences. It is real sad that Brandon Jennings decided to go overseas instead of playing college basketball. He never learned how to compete on the defensive end. During his stay in Detroit, Jennings actually learned a few things from Van Gundy. But if you develop bad habits on defense it is very difficult to break those habits. That is why I worry about Andre Drummond ever being capable of learning the defensive rotations and being able to react quickly to situations the right way. Drummond didn't get much at all out of his one year on a college team. I don't believe he learned one damn thing relating to playing basketball. Last summer he elected to work hard on his offensive low post game. He did put in the hard work and came back this season showing some real skill at times on offense with the exception of free throw shooting. Stan can never harp enough on this young man. And Andre should appreciate the fact that SVG really cares about his players progress. Andre needs to spend this coming summer working with a coach who can get Andre up to speed with his mental approach to defense. Know where to rotate and what the keys are. Help your teammates by communicating more in the paint. Box out and get your arms up and move your feet. Anticipate the play your opponent is trying to run. In most games he didn't do any of those things very well and never could concentrate for an entire game. Teams have manhandled Andre Drummond on defense this season like they did last season. He is too slow to react and this big weakness will be exploited in the playoffs more than his free throw shooting weakness.
If Andre listens to Stan Van Gundy and works his tail off and becomes motivated as a defender, there is no stopping this Piston team or Andre Drummond from being a top notch NBA stud. And he will never get there unless he has a coach like Stan nipping at his heals all the time. Embrace the fact that some coaches actually love helping players reach their potential. After a player ends his career, he will always look back and wonder what could have been. If only that player would have had the brains to listen and accept coaching that could have helped them get the most out of the game of basketball. No team wins with a Dwight Howard type mentality. Look at him now.
We seem to have players on this Piston team who really care and are willing to do whatever it takes to get better. These players all know that they gave away a lot of games and could have a lot higher seed in the playoffs. This still is the worst free throw shooting team in the league and they somehow made the playoffs. Cleaning up stuff is all mental and they know it. Now if they make a quick exit in the first round, Piston players must learn from it. Take a few weeks off and get back to work under the direction of a good coach. Good luck players!
cool breeze- Posts : 3817
Join date : 2011-12-21
More Stuff...
Oracle Sun Apr 10, 2016 11:06 pm
Congrats to the Warriors for tying the Bulls with 72 wins, and having a shot to set a new record... truly amazing!
@Fly - You said it and I agree! I would have taken them backing in, but winning the way they did with a huge game on the road in Chicago and a victory over their tormentor, the Wiz, was a big step for this franchise! To be honest, I hoped they would do it this way, but I didn't think it was possible!
@Ballin - You were nice, but it sure would help if I could READ
@Lemon - 1. IMO, we will compete in the playoffs, I just hope SVG realizes that they will need rest, and spends the remainder of the season getting the bench better. I'm not sure we can do what he's likely to try... shorten the rotation in the playoffs. The starters are already running on fumes, but the saving grace may be that there is generally a lot of time between games in the first round.
2. Drummond's FT's? I'm lost, maybe staring at a reward if he hits them would work? How about this if he hits 50%?
3. Seeding? We'll likely be 8th because Indy will win enough to make it so, and that's where I want to be. I think we matchup better with the Cavs!
4. We absolutely need to look at this core a lot longer! KCP, Reggie & Drummond are babies and just starting to learn their place in the NBA, although Reggie is further along. Morris & Harris are more mature, but still just getting to the next level. In short they're all keepers for at least the next two years barring any Godfather type deals crossing SVG's desk!
The main reason, IMO, is that we can't keep resetting the chemistry equation ever freaking year, we need a group of guys getting used to playing together. That doesn't mean that if a really good player becomes available we don't pull the trigger, it just means that any moves have to make really good sense.
Individual performances should be weighed, but not overly used to judge. I hope we see more team play than individual play because we tend to lose when we go too much ISO.
5. SVG, IMO, may not be the right coach unless he can resist being overly critical. Howard eventually tuned him out because SVG runs to the press and cries wolf way too much, players don't like that. Larry Brown could destroy a player in the press, but he used it sparingly, and mostly to motivate players he knew had great talent.
6. Draft? Happy to say at this time of the year, I haven't focused on the draft too much. Usually at the end of the season that's all we can look forward to... Happy to say that isn't the case this year
It's a delicate balance, let's see if he can strike it.
@Fly - You said it and I agree! I would have taken them backing in, but winning the way they did with a huge game on the road in Chicago and a victory over their tormentor, the Wiz, was a big step for this franchise! To be honest, I hoped they would do it this way, but I didn't think it was possible!
@Ballin - You were nice, but it sure would help if I could READ
@Lemon - 1. IMO, we will compete in the playoffs, I just hope SVG realizes that they will need rest, and spends the remainder of the season getting the bench better. I'm not sure we can do what he's likely to try... shorten the rotation in the playoffs. The starters are already running on fumes, but the saving grace may be that there is generally a lot of time between games in the first round.
2. Drummond's FT's? I'm lost, maybe staring at a reward if he hits them would work? How about this if he hits 50%?
3. Seeding? We'll likely be 8th because Indy will win enough to make it so, and that's where I want to be. I think we matchup better with the Cavs!
4. We absolutely need to look at this core a lot longer! KCP, Reggie & Drummond are babies and just starting to learn their place in the NBA, although Reggie is further along. Morris & Harris are more mature, but still just getting to the next level. In short they're all keepers for at least the next two years barring any Godfather type deals crossing SVG's desk!
The main reason, IMO, is that we can't keep resetting the chemistry equation ever freaking year, we need a group of guys getting used to playing together. That doesn't mean that if a really good player becomes available we don't pull the trigger, it just means that any moves have to make really good sense.
Individual performances should be weighed, but not overly used to judge. I hope we see more team play than individual play because we tend to lose when we go too much ISO.
5. SVG, IMO, may not be the right coach unless he can resist being overly critical. Howard eventually tuned him out because SVG runs to the press and cries wolf way too much, players don't like that. Larry Brown could destroy a player in the press, but he used it sparingly, and mostly to motivate players he knew had great talent.
6. Draft? Happy to say at this time of the year, I haven't focused on the draft too much. Usually at the end of the season that's all we can look forward to... Happy to say that isn't the case this year
It's a delicate balance, let's see if he can strike it.
Oracle- Posts : 7504
Join date : 2011-12-21
Re: FORUM
cool breeze Sun Apr 10, 2016 6:48 pm
lemonpen wrote:Team:
We passed the smell test by keeping ourselves in playoff contention through the All Star break. We stepped up further by successfully completing the stretch run and qualifying for the playoffs. Now we face the third test. Can we compete well in the playoffs. Wins would be an added bonus that increase our level of experience.
Dre FT Shooting:
I ask you shooting gurus to closely watch Drum Drum (as Mahorn calls him) dribble the ball prior to hoisting the free throw. It sure looks like he uses a perfect free throw shooting form when dribbling. He extends from the elbow, flicks his wrist, spins the ball, and releases the left hand cleanly. The bounce is true and returns precisely to his shooting hand. Then he does something completely different when shooting up upward. Check it out.
Seeding:
Do we rest or push for the 7th seed ?? Does it matter ??
Individual Performance
Should we place a strong emphasis on how well individuals play in the second season. Should their futures hinge on it.
IMO if we see our opponent as THE chief obstacle for years to come, much like the Bad Boys viewed the Celtics, I guess individual performance does matter. Otherwise not so much.
I don't know that any of our core group has come close to their peak. Do we owe ourselves a longer look at them.
SVG:
Will Stan be head coach long enough to see us through to the Finals. Stan has had to ride them hard and has a ways to go. He also has a somewhat pointed and abrasive nature when delivering truth. Is there a risk the team may tune him out as our championship capability grows. Will we ultimately require a coaching change to git-er-done.
Draft:
Would any of you who have seen the kid from Oakland U risk a pick on their PG as our backup. Or, does Dinwittie still have value.
Maybe SVG will settle into management more after next season. Wish he could steal Boston's coach.
cool breeze- Posts : 3817
Join date : 2011-12-21
Playoffs
Sparma Sun Apr 10, 2016 2:34 pm
Congrats to the Pistons. I was overly pessimistic from beginning to end this season, after overestimating their win total for years.
Sparma- Posts : 2561
Join date : 2011-12-17
Stuff
lemonpen Sun Apr 10, 2016 11:10 am
Team:
We passed the smell test by keeping ourselves in playoff contention through the All Star break. We stepped up further by successfully completing the stretch run and qualifying for the playoffs. Now we face the third test. Can we compete well in the playoffs. Wins would be an added bonus that increase our level of experience.
Dre FT Shooting:
I ask you shooting gurus to closely watch Drum Drum (as Mahorn calls him) dribble the ball prior to hoisting the free throw. It sure looks like he uses a perfect free throw shooting form when dribbling. He extends from the elbow, flicks his wrist, spins the ball, and releases the left hand cleanly. The bounce is true and returns precisely to his shooting hand. Then he does something completely different when shooting up upward. Check it out.
Seeding:
Do we rest or push for the 7th seed ?? Does it matter ??
Individual Performance
Should we place a strong emphasis on how well individuals play in the second season. Should their futures hinge on it.
IMO if we see our opponent as THE chief obstacle for years to come, much like the Bad Boys viewed the Celtics, I guess individual performance does matter. Otherwise not so much.
I don't know that any of our core group has come close to their peak. Do we owe ourselves a longer look at them.
SVG:
Will Stan be head coach long enough to see us through to the Finals. Stan has had to ride them hard and has a ways to go. He also has a somewhat pointed and abrasive nature when delivering truth. Is there a risk the team may tune him out as our championship capability grows. Will we ultimately require a coaching change to git-er-done.
Draft:
Would any of you who have seen the kid from Oakland U risk a pick on their PG as our backup. Or, does Dinwittie still have value.
We passed the smell test by keeping ourselves in playoff contention through the All Star break. We stepped up further by successfully completing the stretch run and qualifying for the playoffs. Now we face the third test. Can we compete well in the playoffs. Wins would be an added bonus that increase our level of experience.
Dre FT Shooting:
I ask you shooting gurus to closely watch Drum Drum (as Mahorn calls him) dribble the ball prior to hoisting the free throw. It sure looks like he uses a perfect free throw shooting form when dribbling. He extends from the elbow, flicks his wrist, spins the ball, and releases the left hand cleanly. The bounce is true and returns precisely to his shooting hand. Then he does something completely different when shooting up upward. Check it out.
Seeding:
Do we rest or push for the 7th seed ?? Does it matter ??
Individual Performance
Should we place a strong emphasis on how well individuals play in the second season. Should their futures hinge on it.
IMO if we see our opponent as THE chief obstacle for years to come, much like the Bad Boys viewed the Celtics, I guess individual performance does matter. Otherwise not so much.
I don't know that any of our core group has come close to their peak. Do we owe ourselves a longer look at them.
SVG:
Will Stan be head coach long enough to see us through to the Finals. Stan has had to ride them hard and has a ways to go. He also has a somewhat pointed and abrasive nature when delivering truth. Is there a risk the team may tune him out as our championship capability grows. Will we ultimately require a coaching change to git-er-done.
Draft:
Would any of you who have seen the kid from Oakland U risk a pick on their PG as our backup. Or, does Dinwittie still have value.
lemonpen- Posts : 1624
Join date : 2011-12-27
Location : Southfield, MI
That Pic IS Disturbing. What a baby....
FlyDog Sun Apr 10, 2016 9:05 am
Good to see this team not backing in. Beating the Bulls and Wizards to cement their spot was sweet.
FlyDog- Posts : 764
Join date : 2011-12-14
Age : 53
Location : Fort Myers, FL (Lil Pakistan)
"This pic is disturbing, as everyone celebrates and Dre sulks!"
Phil-Good Sun Apr 10, 2016 6:25 am
Drummonds is not happy because he knows his FT shooting issue has to be fixed. Go to the underhand style or something. But with all that being said, good job Drummonds. You were A STEAL at the #9 PICK!! Highway robbery! We appreciate what you have done for this organization. 
The Pistons are only 2 steps away from going back to the NBA Finals.
1st thing first. Good HEALTH!!!
1A step. Get back to that good old, kick you in the azz, punch you in the mouth, shut that azz down, Detroit Pistons defense. The Pistons need A defensive wizard next to Drummonds. A guy who can block shots and defend small-ball-forwards. A Surge Ibaka kind of guy. Good shooter and A great shot blocker. Also, Ibaka is unhappy in OK City. He sick of Durant and Westbrook taking 99.9% of all the shots. Anyway, this player will come via draft, or trade. This player will not come from internal improvement. Detroit needs to find this guy FAST!
2nd. A pure scorer. A closer. A guy who can put the ball in the basket and help Reggie Jackson carry the team when needed without the EGO! A Jamal Crawford, Jo Johnson, type of guy.This player could already be on the roster. This player could be Stanley Johnson, Hillard or Tobis Harris one day soon. The Pistons can get by without this guy if they got that defensive wizard but this kind of player pushed Detroit into NBA Finals territory.
Good Luck GUYS!!
The Pistons are only 2 steps away from going back to the NBA Finals.
1st thing first. Good HEALTH!!!
1A step. Get back to that good old, kick you in the azz, punch you in the mouth, shut that azz down, Detroit Pistons defense. The Pistons need A defensive wizard next to Drummonds. A guy who can block shots and defend small-ball-forwards. A Surge Ibaka kind of guy. Good shooter and A great shot blocker. Also, Ibaka is unhappy in OK City. He sick of Durant and Westbrook taking 99.9% of all the shots. Anyway, this player will come via draft, or trade. This player will not come from internal improvement. Detroit needs to find this guy FAST!
2nd. A pure scorer. A closer. A guy who can put the ball in the basket and help Reggie Jackson carry the team when needed without the EGO! A Jamal Crawford, Jo Johnson, type of guy.This player could already be on the roster. This player could be Stanley Johnson, Hillard or Tobis Harris one day soon. The Pistons can get by without this guy if they got that defensive wizard but this kind of player pushed Detroit into NBA Finals territory.
Good Luck GUYS!!
Phil-Good- Posts : 1192
Join date : 2012-01-05
LOL
BallinD Sun Apr 10, 2016 1:09 am
What I meant was talking me down from the ledge (not gonna jump yet, even though I am concerned).
BallinD- Posts : 945
Join date : 2015-10-29
Location : Milky Way
Not taking you down, and I love your spirit...
Oracle Sat Apr 09, 2016 11:52 pm
BallinD wrote:Oracle, wise words, and I do not disagree, but I will pose a caveat or two in the spirit of debate:
Your Two Main Points
Number 1 is the almost total lack of bench production(this is the biggie)! Why is this a problem? Well, if we can cut 5-7 minutes off of the playing time of Morris, KCP & Reggie, we're going to see their production on both ends of the floor blow up, with Reggie being the biggest beneficiary. If Reggie gets his minutes radically reduced, we're going to see him go into his Superman act much more often like he did to start the season!
Because BBall is a rhythm game, I agree and disagree. If a player needs time to get rhythm and his minutes are "radically reduced," it may be counterproductive at times, not all the time, but at times, yes. Big Ballers like big minutes. I like Sparma's idea of going to get Conley to support RJ, and would love it if we could get Bazemore from ATL, Speights from GS, Teletovic, or Kevin Maretin to round out our core. I'm sure there are others.
This is a valid point! Like everything in life, the coach needs to strike the right balance, but cutting minutes, from my experience has little to no effect on rhythm because nothing changes for the player. tTey start games, come out, re-enter, etc., exactly the same way they normally do, just not for as many minutes, and we're talking about 5-7 minutes spread out over a full game, that's not a lot.
Conley may want to start, but I would love to have him coming off the bench, and the list of guys you named would be welcome additions, but likely costly.
Morris & KCP's ability to defend would increase, and their jumpers would be better and more accurate. We need a bench that can give the starters more rest, and not have to play either Morris or KCP more minutes with the bench to keep them up to NBA standards! We have to have the weakest bench in the league, and as soon as we have to go to them, any lead is gone!
Weak bench, true, but some of it is Stan's doing, his stubbornness and reluctance to even listen to his assistant coaches in the case of Bullock, and perhaps Hilliard as well. I know Bullock didn't have a great game vs Washington, but he did have 5 rebounds in the first half when his shot was not falling...he only put up 2 shots, and he does pass the eye test as a solid rotation piece needing more PT to see what we got, again As in Kris Middleton, who got no love and fewer minutes, Baynes play speaks for itself. Tolliver has been down and up, mostly down, and we have already all agreed that SJ's play of late has been sorely disappointing. Blake is out of gas, true, but did Stan go get DJ Augustin off waivers for the stretch run?? what about Marcus Thornton, Mr. Instant Offense? No. To me he is more of a short rotation kind of coach. I will agree that we need firepower and defense off the bench, but we already may have it on our team in Baynes, SJ, Bullock and adding another stud will definitely help, but is not a cure unless we can find another Jamal Crawford.
I totally agree, it's a lot of Stan's fault although I will cut him some slack because of the great results. My point is NOT who's at fault, it's what's the reality. The reality is that the bench is bad, for whatever reason, and that fact ripples into the starting lineup making them less effective.
When we won in 2004, we had a bench that could take down most starting units! It kept the starters fresh and potent enough to close out games with high energy. The nest year they just ran out of gas against the Spurs with no real bench, and we were never really the same although that team was way better conditioned than this team.
To be honest, at their age, long minutes shouldn't be as big an issue as it is. A Larry Brown team was always capable of long minutes.
Number 2 is playing people out of position! You can't be competitive when you're playing a SF in the PF position unless you get a favorable matchup most nights. We've been lucky, but playing Harris at PF causes two problems. First he's defensively not capable of guarding decent 4's, and secondly, he won't be productive offensively after expending the effort to guard a 4.
SVG is doing a good juggling, but it's an act, and teams can see through it! Harris on Kevin Love? Oh, that's why we're the only team where Love goes off for damn near 30 a game.
Until, at a minimum, the bench issue is fixed, I've backed off on making sweeping comments on who can do what(and I have been guilty).
Many teams are going smaller, and playing two versatile forwards may be considered an advantage by some astute observers. I'm not gonna trot out GS as the model, but hey, if we could move the ball better, we could take more advantage of mismatches and switching. We could stand to push the pace as well, something Jennings used to do to great effect back in the day. Plus, look at it like this, if Love goes off on us, somebody else may be having a subpar game, and perhaps that is why we have had success with the Cavs this year. That being said, I would love a rotational long, lean pf in the mold of John Henson, or even a Kelly Olynik type guy who can do a bit of everything in the post and can shoot.
Totally agree, I want a long PF that can shoot the 3, and yes, we can muddle along with Harris against certain teams, but IMO, it's not fair to him or the team.
The reason I threw KCP in with Dre is they are two Dumars holdovers, whose challenges may be in their heads, and now would be the time to cut bait, if Stan is inclined to do so, I can't say whether he will or not, and I am open either way.
This would be the absolute worst time to move KCP! You can't get any value from a player that makes no money! If SVG wanted to trade KCP, he would have to do it AFTER he gets his raise, after next season.
IMO, there should be a law that stops people from wanting to move kids while they're on their rookie contract. Ok, I would make an exception is they really suck, but the purpose of those contracts are to allow teams to see what they have, why would you abort that process when it can only hurt your team?
BTW, we have players that are good enough to be on a playoff team in the most competitive conference in the NBA, despite the fact that they have a crappy bench and play slightly out of position, and are the 4th youngest team in the NBA.
We've got the beginning of something good going on here, and these core guys are just starting to develop some chemistry.
By next year, we should see normal growth, and a magnification of that because they'll know each other a lot better. KCP's trajectory should have him around 17ppg, expect better from Morris & Harris, and Reggie and Drummond!
Do we really want to screw too much with that chemistry? Only if we get an offer we can't refuse, otherwise, let's dance with the ones who brung us
Oracle- Posts : 7504
Join date : 2011-12-21
Whew! Thanks for Talking Me Down, But Hear Me Out
BallinD Sat Apr 09, 2016 10:18 pm
Oracle, wise words, and I do not disagree, but I will pose a caveat or two in the spirit of debate:
Your Two Main Points
Number 1 is the almost total lack of bench production(this is the biggie)! Why is this a problem? Well, if we can cut 5-7 minutes off of the playing time of Morris, KCP & Reggie, we're going to see their production on both ends of the floor blow up, with Reggie being the biggest beneficiary. If Reggie gets his minutes radically reduced, we're going to see him go into his Superman act much more often like he did to start the season!
Because BBall is a rhythm game, I agree and disagree. If a player needs time to get rhythm and his minutes are "radically reduced," it may be counterproductive at times, not all the time, but at times, yes. Big Ballers like big minutes. I like Sparma's idea of going to get Conley to support RJ, and would love it if we could get Bazemore from ATL, Speights from GS, Teletovic, or Kevin Maretin to round out our core. I'm sure there are others.
Morris & KCP's ability to defend would increase, and their jumpers would be better and more accurate. We need a bench that can give the starters more rest, and not have to play either Morris or KCP more minutes with the bench to keep them up to NBA standards! We have to have the weakest bench in the league, and as soon as we have to go to them, any lead is gone!
Weak bench, true, but some of it is Stan's doing, his stubbornness and reluctance to even listen to his assistant coaches in the case of Bullock, and perhaps Hilliard as well. I know Bullock didn't have a great game vs Washington, but he did have 5 rebounds in the first half when his shot was not falling...he only put up 2 shots, and he does pass the eye test as a solid rotation piece needing more PT to see what we got, again As in Kris Middleton, who got no love and fewer minutes, Baynes play speaks for itself. Tolliver has been down and up, mostly down, and we have already all agreed that SJ's play of late has been sorely disappointing. Blake is out of gas, true, but did Stan go get DJ Augustin off waivers for the stretch run?? what about Marcus Thornton, Mr. Instant Offense? No. To me he is more of a short rotation kind of coach. I will agree that we need firepower and defense off the bench, but we already may have it on our team in Baynes, SJ, Bullock and adding another stud will definitely help, but is not a cure unless we can find another Jamal Crawford.
Number 2 is playing people out of position! You can't be competitive when you're playing a SF in the PF position unless you get a favorable matchup most nights. We've been lucky, but playing Harris at PF causes two problems. First he's defensively not capable of guarding decent 4's, and secondly, he won't be productive offensively after expending the effort to guard a 4.
SVG is doing a good juggling, but it's an act, and teams can see through it! Harris on Kevin Love? Oh, that's why we're the only team where Love goes off for damn near 30 a game.
Until, at a minimum, the bench issue is fixed, I've backed off on making sweeping comments on who can do what(and I have been guilty).
Many teams are going smaller, and playing two versatile forwards may be considered an advantage by some astute observers. I'm not gonna trot out GS as the model, but hey, if we could move the ball better, we could take more advantage of mismatches and switching. We could stand to push the pace as well, something Jennings used to do to great effect back in the day. Plus, look at it like this, if Love goes off on us, somebody else may be having a subpar game, and perhaps that is why we have had success with the Cavs this year. That being said, I would love a rotational long, lean pf in the mold of John Henson, or even a Kelly Olynik type guy who can do a bit of everything in the post and can shoot.
The reason I threw KCP in with Dre is they are two Dumars holdovers, whose challenges may be in their heads, and now would be the time to cut bait, if Stan is inclined to do so, I can't say whether he will or not, and I am open either way.
Your Two Main Points
Number 1 is the almost total lack of bench production(this is the biggie)! Why is this a problem? Well, if we can cut 5-7 minutes off of the playing time of Morris, KCP & Reggie, we're going to see their production on both ends of the floor blow up, with Reggie being the biggest beneficiary. If Reggie gets his minutes radically reduced, we're going to see him go into his Superman act much more often like he did to start the season!
Because BBall is a rhythm game, I agree and disagree. If a player needs time to get rhythm and his minutes are "radically reduced," it may be counterproductive at times, not all the time, but at times, yes. Big Ballers like big minutes. I like Sparma's idea of going to get Conley to support RJ, and would love it if we could get Bazemore from ATL, Speights from GS, Teletovic, or Kevin Maretin to round out our core. I'm sure there are others.
Morris & KCP's ability to defend would increase, and their jumpers would be better and more accurate. We need a bench that can give the starters more rest, and not have to play either Morris or KCP more minutes with the bench to keep them up to NBA standards! We have to have the weakest bench in the league, and as soon as we have to go to them, any lead is gone!
Weak bench, true, but some of it is Stan's doing, his stubbornness and reluctance to even listen to his assistant coaches in the case of Bullock, and perhaps Hilliard as well. I know Bullock didn't have a great game vs Washington, but he did have 5 rebounds in the first half when his shot was not falling...he only put up 2 shots, and he does pass the eye test as a solid rotation piece needing more PT to see what we got, again As in Kris Middleton, who got no love and fewer minutes, Baynes play speaks for itself. Tolliver has been down and up, mostly down, and we have already all agreed that SJ's play of late has been sorely disappointing. Blake is out of gas, true, but did Stan go get DJ Augustin off waivers for the stretch run?? what about Marcus Thornton, Mr. Instant Offense? No. To me he is more of a short rotation kind of coach. I will agree that we need firepower and defense off the bench, but we already may have it on our team in Baynes, SJ, Bullock and adding another stud will definitely help, but is not a cure unless we can find another Jamal Crawford.
Number 2 is playing people out of position! You can't be competitive when you're playing a SF in the PF position unless you get a favorable matchup most nights. We've been lucky, but playing Harris at PF causes two problems. First he's defensively not capable of guarding decent 4's, and secondly, he won't be productive offensively after expending the effort to guard a 4.
SVG is doing a good juggling, but it's an act, and teams can see through it! Harris on Kevin Love? Oh, that's why we're the only team where Love goes off for damn near 30 a game.
Until, at a minimum, the bench issue is fixed, I've backed off on making sweeping comments on who can do what(and I have been guilty).
Many teams are going smaller, and playing two versatile forwards may be considered an advantage by some astute observers. I'm not gonna trot out GS as the model, but hey, if we could move the ball better, we could take more advantage of mismatches and switching. We could stand to push the pace as well, something Jennings used to do to great effect back in the day. Plus, look at it like this, if Love goes off on us, somebody else may be having a subpar game, and perhaps that is why we have had success with the Cavs this year. That being said, I would love a rotational long, lean pf in the mold of John Henson, or even a Kelly Olynik type guy who can do a bit of everything in the post and can shoot.
The reason I threw KCP in with Dre is they are two Dumars holdovers, whose challenges may be in their heads, and now would be the time to cut bait, if Stan is inclined to do so, I can't say whether he will or not, and I am open either way.
BallinD- Posts : 945
Join date : 2015-10-29
Location : Milky Way
We need to keep the core together & build chemistry, but...
Oracle Sat Apr 09, 2016 7:36 pm
This pic is disturbing, as everyone celebrates and Dre sulks!
Oracle- Posts : 7504
Join date : 2011-12-21
Ballin
Oracle Sat Apr 09, 2016 6:59 pm
Drummond & KCP are two different issues, and not the main problem this team faces. There are two glaring holes in this team, and until they're fixed, almost any conclusion you draw will be based on faulty data.
For example, Reggie was recently being questioned from every angle when he was deep into his slump. KCP was solidly our 3rd leading scorer then went down and took a good bit to recover his scoring. Stanley hasn't been the same since his injury. But even these things aren't big issues, but these are.
Number 1 is the almost total lack of bench production(this is the biggie)! Why is this a problem? Well, if we can cut 5-7 minutes off of the playing time of Morris, KCP & Reggie, we're going to see their production on both ends of the floor blow up, with Reggie being the biggest beneficiary. If Reggie gets his minutes radically reduced, we're going to see him go into his Superman act much more often like he did to start the season!
Morris & KCP's ability to defend would increase, and their jumpers would be better and more accurate. We need a bench that can give the starters more rest, and not have to play either Morris or KCP more minutes with the bench to keep them up to NBA standards! We have to have the weakest bench in the league, and as soon as we have to go to them, any lead is gone!
Number 2 is playing people out of position! You can't be competitive when you're playing a SF in the PF position unless you get a favorable matchup most nights. We've been lucky, but playing Harris at PF causes two problems. First he's defensively not capable of guarding decent 4's, and secondly, he won't be productive offensively after expending the effort to guard a 4.
SVG is doing a good juggling, but it's an act, and teams can see through it! Harris on Kevin Love? Oh, that's why we're the only team where Love goes off for damn near 30 a game.
Until, at a minimum, the bench issue is fixed, I've backed off on making sweeping comments on who can do what(and I have been guilty).
However, Drummond is quite another situation! I don't pretend to understand what his deal is, but I've got to think that he's struggling with his place in a world where his lack of FT shooting puts his entire career in peril.
In any game, if he works hard and becomes a dominant factor, he likely fears that that will trigger hack a Dre. If he does little, maybe they won't do it, but it's damned if you do and damned if you don't.
Having said that, I'm totally lost as to why he can't be really up for the most important game of the season to get us into the playoffs. Reggie wasn't having any of losing that game, he put us on his back and drug us across the finish line. Assist to Baynes for hitting all of his FT's to put the Wiz away! Drummond needs help more than additional problems from fans, and I think SVG will recognize that a 22 year old kid is going to have a hard time dealing with some grown up issues.
Bottom Line: I think the starters are fine, even though there are questions, I think you resolve the issues that affect them(poor bench), then see what happens. The only big issues for the starters is at the PF spot and how that will be handled. Maybe somebody becomes Manu Ginobili if we can snag a real starting PF, I don't know.
For example, Reggie was recently being questioned from every angle when he was deep into his slump. KCP was solidly our 3rd leading scorer then went down and took a good bit to recover his scoring. Stanley hasn't been the same since his injury. But even these things aren't big issues, but these are.
Number 1 is the almost total lack of bench production(this is the biggie)! Why is this a problem? Well, if we can cut 5-7 minutes off of the playing time of Morris, KCP & Reggie, we're going to see their production on both ends of the floor blow up, with Reggie being the biggest beneficiary. If Reggie gets his minutes radically reduced, we're going to see him go into his Superman act much more often like he did to start the season!
Morris & KCP's ability to defend would increase, and their jumpers would be better and more accurate. We need a bench that can give the starters more rest, and not have to play either Morris or KCP more minutes with the bench to keep them up to NBA standards! We have to have the weakest bench in the league, and as soon as we have to go to them, any lead is gone!
Number 2 is playing people out of position! You can't be competitive when you're playing a SF in the PF position unless you get a favorable matchup most nights. We've been lucky, but playing Harris at PF causes two problems. First he's defensively not capable of guarding decent 4's, and secondly, he won't be productive offensively after expending the effort to guard a 4.
SVG is doing a good juggling, but it's an act, and teams can see through it! Harris on Kevin Love? Oh, that's why we're the only team where Love goes off for damn near 30 a game.
Until, at a minimum, the bench issue is fixed, I've backed off on making sweeping comments on who can do what(and I have been guilty).
However, Drummond is quite another situation! I don't pretend to understand what his deal is, but I've got to think that he's struggling with his place in a world where his lack of FT shooting puts his entire career in peril.
In any game, if he works hard and becomes a dominant factor, he likely fears that that will trigger hack a Dre. If he does little, maybe they won't do it, but it's damned if you do and damned if you don't.
Having said that, I'm totally lost as to why he can't be really up for the most important game of the season to get us into the playoffs. Reggie wasn't having any of losing that game, he put us on his back and drug us across the finish line. Assist to Baynes for hitting all of his FT's to put the Wiz away! Drummond needs help more than additional problems from fans, and I think SVG will recognize that a 22 year old kid is going to have a hard time dealing with some grown up issues.
Bottom Line: I think the starters are fine, even though there are questions, I think you resolve the issues that affect them(poor bench), then see what happens. The only big issues for the starters is at the PF spot and how that will be handled. Maybe somebody becomes Manu Ginobili if we can snag a real starting PF, I don't know.
Oracle- Posts : 7504
Join date : 2011-12-21
Drummond N KCP? Yin and Yang
BallinD Sat Apr 09, 2016 5:18 pm
Should we be worried? Is Stan worried? The upcoming playoffs will tell what we have in Andre Drummond and KCP. Are they really key components of our core moving forward? On the surface, hell yes! Our All Star and our Defensive Stopper. Below the surface, their shortcomings could be part of the iceberg that sank the Titanic?
The Good Thing Is Stan Van Bower can move completely on from the Dumars Era, transforming this club, and building around the Reggies, Tobias, Stanley, Baynes and Mook for now with an infusion of new pieces, if they decided that is needed.
The Drummond we see these days is a far cry from the Andre the Giant who ruled the league in the exciting first month of this season. He started out with comparisons to Moses Malone, Olajuwan, even Wilt. He is a shell of that player. The comparisons were most notable for his rebounding and offensive rebounding and points out of the gate. He has settled down into 16.8 pts, 14.8 Rbs, 1.4 blocks and 1.5 steals, 21.5 PER, but has been noticeably lethargic post all star break. I thought and said the All Star designation would be a double edged sword for him, and feared he would become more complacent "let it go to his head," primarily because his production tailed off approaching the break and he appeared distracted by the attention and not focused on the winning.
Conditioning could also be a factor leading to his decline, and to be honest, very few thought he was "That Good" as he showed in those first weeks. He is that good, but not that hungry, that is the conundrum. If he can't seem to get up for the big games of his first All Star season and first shot at the playoffs, then what will whet his appetite????? This is why he fell into our laps on draft day.
Kudos for his expanded offensive repertoire. He appears to have worked hard and now has the ability in a better offensive system to be an 18-20 ppg scorer if he wants it. In looking at Dwight Howard circa 2016, we see the future if Dre continues his lackluster lethargy that has pundits around the league talking about his simple "LACK OF EFFORT."
KCP OTOH has all the effort, but his inconsistency is maddening and his court smarts are suspect, much of our concern about him is about the between the ears stuff, as is Andre's (potential head case). To his credit, KCP has upped his scoring avg from 5.9, to 12.7 to 14.5, showing consistent upticks in steals, but those are only 1.5 per game, though to be fair, SVG does de-emphasize steals and gambling in his defense. His PER is still well below league avg at 12.4. Can KCP continue his improvements, let the game come to him, strengthen so he can truly become an elite defender, play to his strengths of slashing, defending, attacking the rim and get his floater, pull up game in gear, stronger legs and slowing down should help improve his shooting, but WYSIWIG, he will probably never be a Kyle Korver or Klay Thompson type shooter.
Dre really needs floor spacers, and since the league has gameplanned our PnR to death, what are our options? We move the ball worse than almost all of the playoff teams I have seen, and worse than many non playoff teams, but we do have the Reggie.
So Stan Van Bower must ask himself, what do we have here, moving forward? He has been consistently businesslike as regards the roster and the Pistons Organization in general. Will there be a Sign and Trade in the cards if the malaise and the inconsistency continue? Can we move Drummond and KCP, thus completing the Sweep of Dumars shenanigans, out with the old and in with the new (high bball IQ, shooters, high effort.)
Hasan Whiteside is young, and reportedly somewhat of a head case as well, coming off the bench for Miami. He is at 14.1/11.9 with 3.7 blocks and his 25.9 PER speaks for itself. Can we get him somehow, some way? Do we want to?
Do we want to sign Andre and work some Stan Van Bower magic disappearing act on Dre and KCP?
Do we want to use some of that money on a young veteran to help stabilize this team?
Thoughts?
The Good Thing Is Stan Van Bower can move completely on from the Dumars Era, transforming this club, and building around the Reggies, Tobias, Stanley, Baynes and Mook for now with an infusion of new pieces, if they decided that is needed.
The Drummond we see these days is a far cry from the Andre the Giant who ruled the league in the exciting first month of this season. He started out with comparisons to Moses Malone, Olajuwan, even Wilt. He is a shell of that player. The comparisons were most notable for his rebounding and offensive rebounding and points out of the gate. He has settled down into 16.8 pts, 14.8 Rbs, 1.4 blocks and 1.5 steals, 21.5 PER, but has been noticeably lethargic post all star break. I thought and said the All Star designation would be a double edged sword for him, and feared he would become more complacent "let it go to his head," primarily because his production tailed off approaching the break and he appeared distracted by the attention and not focused on the winning.
Conditioning could also be a factor leading to his decline, and to be honest, very few thought he was "That Good" as he showed in those first weeks. He is that good, but not that hungry, that is the conundrum. If he can't seem to get up for the big games of his first All Star season and first shot at the playoffs, then what will whet his appetite????? This is why he fell into our laps on draft day.
Kudos for his expanded offensive repertoire. He appears to have worked hard and now has the ability in a better offensive system to be an 18-20 ppg scorer if he wants it. In looking at Dwight Howard circa 2016, we see the future if Dre continues his lackluster lethargy that has pundits around the league talking about his simple "LACK OF EFFORT."
KCP OTOH has all the effort, but his inconsistency is maddening and his court smarts are suspect, much of our concern about him is about the between the ears stuff, as is Andre's (potential head case). To his credit, KCP has upped his scoring avg from 5.9, to 12.7 to 14.5, showing consistent upticks in steals, but those are only 1.5 per game, though to be fair, SVG does de-emphasize steals and gambling in his defense. His PER is still well below league avg at 12.4. Can KCP continue his improvements, let the game come to him, strengthen so he can truly become an elite defender, play to his strengths of slashing, defending, attacking the rim and get his floater, pull up game in gear, stronger legs and slowing down should help improve his shooting, but WYSIWIG, he will probably never be a Kyle Korver or Klay Thompson type shooter.
Dre really needs floor spacers, and since the league has gameplanned our PnR to death, what are our options? We move the ball worse than almost all of the playoff teams I have seen, and worse than many non playoff teams, but we do have the Reggie.
So Stan Van Bower must ask himself, what do we have here, moving forward? He has been consistently businesslike as regards the roster and the Pistons Organization in general. Will there be a Sign and Trade in the cards if the malaise and the inconsistency continue? Can we move Drummond and KCP, thus completing the Sweep of Dumars shenanigans, out with the old and in with the new (high bball IQ, shooters, high effort.)
Hasan Whiteside is young, and reportedly somewhat of a head case as well, coming off the bench for Miami. He is at 14.1/11.9 with 3.7 blocks and his 25.9 PER speaks for itself. Can we get him somehow, some way? Do we want to?
Do we want to sign Andre and work some Stan Van Bower magic disappearing act on Dre and KCP?
Do we want to use some of that money on a young veteran to help stabilize this team?
Thoughts?
BallinD- Posts : 945
Join date : 2015-10-29
Location : Milky Way
Thanks Reggie Jackson! Andre Drummond got the team going in the wrong direction but Reggie would not be denied a place in Piston history
cool breeze Sat Apr 09, 2016 10:19 am
Our Pistons were riding high with a comfortable lead and then Andre Drummond stood in the paint and watched Washington players shoot the ball time after time offering no resistance. Three offensive rebounds in one possession where the ball looked like a ping pong ball and never did Andre even attempt to get his hands above his hips. That lack of interest by Drummond was all Washington players needed to get themselves going coming back from oblivion to tie and then go ahead in Detroit's biggest game of the season. In the most important game in years, Andre Drummond looked like a lost puppy the entire game. How can Van Gundy play this guy? The stats relating to rebounds mean next to nothing if that player doesn't even know enough to get his arms up when opponent players enter the paint. Andre gets in a nice crouch looking like he is a real player. But when a much shorter player goes right in front within 3 feet of Andre that player can laugh knowing that Andre Drummond will not even bother to get his arms up to obstruct the shooters vision. I have never seen any starting high school center do what Andre does on defense and get one minute of playing time. Of all the players on this Piston team, Andre Drummond is the weakest link. He is the guy who will not think twice about slacking off when it counts. And why in hell does Andre switch off his man in the paint to help when that player is already being double teamed. Gortat just goes to the opposite side of the ball and bingo, he gets 3 passes in a row for layups. Andre never adjusts after his assigned man makes a fool of him. Andre Drummond might be really young but he has had a lot of experience. Even Greg Monroe, one the worst defenders that i have ever seen, is a better defender than Drummond most of the time. And Andre is capable of playing defense. He is capable of getting his arms up above his hips. He did have two games where he dominated on defense in the paint. My feeling is that Andre Drummond has mental issues and might not be coachable moving forward. Nobody blows assignments like that who has any mental toughness at all. And when Andre screws up at the foul line, he gets even worse on defense. It looks as if he is in a dream floating around the floor in a fog on defense. He has no idea at all as to what he is supposed to do relating to situations on defense. There is no anticipation or no signals going to Andre's brain. I can't imagine signing Andre Drummond to a max contract. We need a smart hard working player who can defend the paint well. If we had that, the rest of the players would shine. How can you go into this big game like Andre did? Was he sick? If so I am sorry for mentioning what I saw. Hats off to the rest of the team for playing so tough. It sure would be cool if the Piston coaches could reveal how tough it is to coach Andre Drummond. He can't be listening at all to anyone but a destructive voice inside his head. Making the playoffs was a miracle when thinking about how fundamentally unsound our All Star center really is this season. But I will still take him over Greg Monroe. I think he wants to be a better player but bad habits are difficult to break.
I was wondering why KCP did not adjust to what was going on in the game when he was guarding Beal. He never figured out the high screen. He over played Beal at the 3 point line and didn't position himself properly and failed to stay in front of Beal until the last 3 minutes. Let Beal shoot the 3 instead of shooting a 3 footer. You know you will get no help from Andre Drummond. You cannot allow dribble penetration if you are a guard playing on this team. Andre just cannot compute what he needs to do. It is 5 against 4 when Andre is on the floor. Other than that, Pope has been a real tough player for the last 10 days.
As our players get older, do you fans believe that they will get smarter? This is the unknown factor that the GM needs to get a handle on. How much mental growth is possible. I see guys like Harris who is so fundamentally sound and wonder what he is thinking relating to some of this teammates. Where have they been during all those teenage years of playing basketball? Who was Andre's high school coach? Who was his Jr High coach? Did they encourage Andre to keep his arms down to his side on defense? It is just irritating to watch if you know anything at all about playing basketball.
With all this negative stuff said, I am so happy a lot of Piston players stepped up in this game. They started out ready to play this important game and they played hard the entire game with the exception of Andre Drummond. He is the key man on this team. He will determine success or failure in years to come. Can he meet the challenge and become a hero all fans will remember like we do past players? I think we all will remember Reggie Jackson and this performance he had.
I was wondering why KCP did not adjust to what was going on in the game when he was guarding Beal. He never figured out the high screen. He over played Beal at the 3 point line and didn't position himself properly and failed to stay in front of Beal until the last 3 minutes. Let Beal shoot the 3 instead of shooting a 3 footer. You know you will get no help from Andre Drummond. You cannot allow dribble penetration if you are a guard playing on this team. Andre just cannot compute what he needs to do. It is 5 against 4 when Andre is on the floor. Other than that, Pope has been a real tough player for the last 10 days.
As our players get older, do you fans believe that they will get smarter? This is the unknown factor that the GM needs to get a handle on. How much mental growth is possible. I see guys like Harris who is so fundamentally sound and wonder what he is thinking relating to some of this teammates. Where have they been during all those teenage years of playing basketball? Who was Andre's high school coach? Who was his Jr High coach? Did they encourage Andre to keep his arms down to his side on defense? It is just irritating to watch if you know anything at all about playing basketball.
With all this negative stuff said, I am so happy a lot of Piston players stepped up in this game. They started out ready to play this important game and they played hard the entire game with the exception of Andre Drummond. He is the key man on this team. He will determine success or failure in years to come. Can he meet the challenge and become a hero all fans will remember like we do past players? I think we all will remember Reggie Jackson and this performance he had.
cool breeze- Posts : 3817
Join date : 2011-12-21
Heading towards the finish line, we're 43-37
Oracle Sat Apr 09, 2016 7:16 am
And we're likely to finish with either 44 or 45 wins, so here's the predictions.
| Member | Wins |
| Lemonpen | 49 |
| Sebastian | 48 |
| BallinD | 47 |
| Merc | 45 |
| DX | 45 |
| Oracle | 44 |
| Wise | 44 |
| Sissy | 43 |
| Fennis | 42 |
| Phil1980boy | 42 |
| Stones | 41 |
| Murph | 40 |
| Fly | 40 |
| Cool Breeze | 38 |
| Sparma | |
| Others | |
| Vince Ellis | 35 |
| Perry A. Farrell | 36 |
| Drew Sharp | 38 |
Oracle- Posts : 7504
Join date : 2011-12-21
Flawed? Did you say Flawed???
Oracle Sat Apr 09, 2016 7:13 am
You're damned right this team is flawed!
We have two SF's, so we force one to play PF, and trust me Harris is no PF!
I haven't seen abuse that bad in years when Markeiff basically ate Harris's lunch almost every possession! Shooting over him, backing him down to get any damn thing he wanted. It was like Harris was facing Bubba and getting bent over and worked over... it was UGLY!
Even worse, Markieff, IMO, is a borderline PF himself! Monroe had PF size, and would basically laugh at being guarded by a lightweight like that. I;ve been saying that we need a real PF, even if he comes off the bench, but it's an issue that can cause problems in the starting lineup, one of these SF's may need to be moved or come off the bench, IMO!
So PF is a real weakness, but the bigger issue is the bench!
Baynes is about the only bench player worth keeping! Steve Blake needs to go, and other than Stanley, Hilliard and possibly Dinwiddie, the rest can pack up too!
For our starters, this is Huge! We're going to lose in the first round, I can't see how or who we cold beat of the possible matchups, but it's not about if we lose, but how!
We need to see who really steps up when the spotlight is burning, and who can't handle it!
Will KCP show his stuff, will Stanley come alive? Can somebody convince Dre to stop taking sleeping pills before games? Folks has gots to know sh!t .
I have no doubt they'll make us proud, and this experience will do wonders for a young team getting their first taste of both winning AND the playoffs in a single year!
As I said earlier in the year, I'm glad the east is so much better this year, it makes making the playoffs really mean something, rather than making the playoffs with a sub 500 record, that's bad!
I actually think we have a better chance against the Cavs, but SVG is right, a 7th place finish is just better on the resume if we can secure it!
You said it Seb, now let's go out there and get some FAME!!!
We have two SF's, so we force one to play PF, and trust me Harris is no PF!
I haven't seen abuse that bad in years when Markeiff basically ate Harris's lunch almost every possession! Shooting over him, backing him down to get any damn thing he wanted. It was like Harris was facing Bubba and getting bent over and worked over... it was UGLY!
Even worse, Markieff, IMO, is a borderline PF himself! Monroe had PF size, and would basically laugh at being guarded by a lightweight like that. I;ve been saying that we need a real PF, even if he comes off the bench, but it's an issue that can cause problems in the starting lineup, one of these SF's may need to be moved or come off the bench, IMO!
So PF is a real weakness, but the bigger issue is the bench!
Baynes is about the only bench player worth keeping! Steve Blake needs to go, and other than Stanley, Hilliard and possibly Dinwiddie, the rest can pack up too!
For our starters, this is Huge! We're going to lose in the first round, I can't see how or who we cold beat of the possible matchups, but it's not about if we lose, but how!
We need to see who really steps up when the spotlight is burning, and who can't handle it!
Will KCP show his stuff, will Stanley come alive? Can somebody convince Dre to stop taking sleeping pills before games? Folks has gots to know sh!t
.I have no doubt they'll make us proud, and this experience will do wonders for a young team getting their first taste of both winning AND the playoffs in a single year!
As I said earlier in the year, I'm glad the east is so much better this year, it makes making the playoffs really mean something, rather than making the playoffs with a sub 500 record, that's bad!
I actually think we have a better chance against the Cavs, but SVG is right, a 7th place finish is just better on the resume if we can secure it!
You said it Seb, now let's go out there and get some FAME!!!
Sebastian wrote:Yo Pistons Pals, it has been a long, long time. Tonight, WE've got to give it up to OUR Pistons and to GM Stan/HC SVG.
But truth be told OUR Pistons are a flawed team, but you've got to make it to the Second Season to get the chance to win that Larry.
And, WE all know that the Regular Season is when you make your name, but the Playoffs is where players make their fame.
The only players on OUR roster who have ever sniffed the playoffs are: Reggie as 7th or 8th option with two (Durant and Westbrook) the top five players in the League, Baynes, who was a backup to the backup (Splitter), Fuckin' Jodie Meeks that year he played with Sixers and he hasn't played any this season, not one damn dribble, and and certainly least Joel Anthony.
These playoffs will be good for Tobias, Morris, Dre, and KCP. It would be great to advance to the 2nd Round, but realistically losing in 7 in the 1st Round may be as far as WE can go.
A strong showing in the Playoffs would be great for OUR core.
SVG has got to get Stanley back onto the floor, enough of the DNP-CDs!
Oracle- Posts : 7504
Join date : 2011-12-21
Congratulations, Pistons!!!
Sebastian Sat Apr 09, 2016 3:25 am
Yo Pistons Pals, it has been a long, long time. Tonight, WE've got to give it up to OUR Pistons and to GM Stan/HC SVG.
But truth be told OUR Pistons are a flawed team, but you've got to make it to the Second Season to get the chance to win that Larry.
And, WE all know that the Regular Season is when you make your name, but the Playoffs is where players make their fame.
The only players on OUR roster who have ever sniffed the playoffs are: Reggie as 7th or 8th option with two (Durant and Westbrook) the top five players in the League, Baynes, who was a backup to the backup (Splitter), Fuckin' Jodie Meeks that year he played with Sixers and he hasn't played any this season, not one damn dribble, and and certainly least Joel Anthony.
These playoffs will be good for Tobias, Morris, Dre, and KCP. It would be great to advance to the 2nd Round, but realistically losing in 7 in the 1st Round may be as far as WE can go.
A strong showing in the Playoffs would be great for OUR core.
SVG has got to get Stanley back onto the floor, enough of the DNP-CDs!
But truth be told OUR Pistons are a flawed team, but you've got to make it to the Second Season to get the chance to win that Larry.
And, WE all know that the Regular Season is when you make your name, but the Playoffs is where players make their fame.
The only players on OUR roster who have ever sniffed the playoffs are: Reggie as 7th or 8th option with two (Durant and Westbrook) the top five players in the League, Baynes, who was a backup to the backup (Splitter), Fuckin' Jodie Meeks that year he played with Sixers and he hasn't played any this season, not one damn dribble, and and certainly least Joel Anthony.
These playoffs will be good for Tobias, Morris, Dre, and KCP. It would be great to advance to the 2nd Round, but realistically losing in 7 in the 1st Round may be as far as WE can go.
A strong showing in the Playoffs would be great for OUR core.
SVG has got to get Stanley back onto the floor, enough of the DNP-CDs!
Sebastian- Posts : 1278
Join date : 2011-12-16
Location : Durham, NC
Go Pistons
BallinD Sat Apr 09, 2016 2:08 am
Haven't watched the game so not much to say, cept Great Win! Got the monkey off our back!
Reggie did it again. Take that John Wall you hater; oh wait...he didn't play. Well, take that anyway! I'm worth the $80 Mil
Reggie did it again. Take that John Wall you hater; oh wait...he didn't play. Well, take that anyway! I'm worth the $80 Mil
BallinD- Posts : 945
Join date : 2015-10-29
Location : Milky Way
Always bet on...
Oracle Fri Apr 08, 2016 10:56 pm
Jack!!!
Reggie Jackson refused to let SVG's poor coaching sink this team! He stepped up and whipped the Wizards ass!
39 points with 9 assists... WOW!!!
SVG's coaching really baffles me! We know that if the starters don't have it, we're done, but why not try all of your options when the bench isn't producing???
He sat there and let the Wizards wipe out our lead when the bench couldn't score to save their lives!
SVG, this is CHESS, not CHECKERS, you have to think!
Drummond is the weakest All Star I've seen, he's a huge weak link for us!
But we're in, so I guess I should stop bitching
It's been many moons... Playoffs here we come!!!
Reggie Jackson refused to let SVG's poor coaching sink this team! He stepped up and whipped the Wizards ass!
39 points with 9 assists... WOW!!!
SVG's coaching really baffles me! We know that if the starters don't have it, we're done, but why not try all of your options when the bench isn't producing???
He sat there and let the Wizards wipe out our lead when the bench couldn't score to save their lives!
SVG, this is CHESS, not CHECKERS, you have to think!
Drummond is the weakest All Star I've seen, he's a huge weak link for us!
But we're in, so I guess I should stop bitching
It's been many moons... Playoffs here we come!!!
Oracle- Posts : 7504
Join date : 2011-12-21
Stuff
lemonpen Fri Apr 08, 2016 4:18 pm
Oracle wrote:lemonpen wrote:Playoffs:
Bulls are 3 gms back with 3 to go and we are 3-1 against them. We win the first tie-breaker. We are in, so why do I keep seeing a magic number of "1". Someone help me understand.
What I never understood was the focus on the Bulls, when the Wizards were the real threat. We need to win one or the Wizards need to lose one because if we lose our next 3 and the Wizards win their next 3, they tie us and would hold the tie breaker. We're far from out of the woods right now, and screwed if we lose tonight!
Stanley:
Honestly, I'm a bit disappointed. I hoped he'd become more polished by this point. His offensive game is a bit clunky and mechanical. IMO his rookie season has not answered my questions as to his ability to be a starting SF. I understand the growing frustration with our rookie, and it's wider and deeper than I thought. Stanley said he was the best player in the draft, and he isn't even good enough to be picked at his spot if we did it over. Stanley is selling wolf tickets to Kevin Durant? Kids need to stay out of grown folks business. BTW, he's not even close to be a starting anything, let alone SF!
Andre "Big Baby" Drummond:
Pouting on the bench ???? You selfish blankity blank. Wake up a figure it out. WE CAN"T WIN MUCH when your historically crappy ft shooting makes you a 43 minute man. Unless of course you can avg 20/20 in 3 quarters. Damn kids. Drummond & Stanley talk too much for the game they bring.
Bullock:
Yeah, what everyone else has said.
Sixers:
Ding Dong the wicked witch is dead. Their fans can breath again as management begins to revive the once proud franchise.
Having said that about Stanley, he is a rookie, so I take these things with a grain of salt! At least he isn't outing his Bro's to their wives on video(cough, cough *** Lakers).
I still don't like the DNPCD deal. Reducing minutes was called for, the DNPCD feels like a demotion or punishment, just one mans opinion.
Thanks. I miscounted the number of games the Wiz have remaining.
I can live with a few DNPCDs as long as we're gonna play these games down to the wire, with a playoff berth hanging in the balance. Maybe we clinch tonight and SVG expands the rotation.
lemonpen- Posts : 1624
Join date : 2011-12-27
Location : Southfield, MI
Just Get The Win Stan
BallinD Fri Apr 08, 2016 4:07 pm
Curious to see how we respond tonite. It's quite possible the Wizards will be the hungrier team, sad but true.
Washington has bullied us and taken our lunch money all season. Morris said to reporters what we all have seen, they play better vs us. Wall disdains Reggie and Gortat feasts on a lethargic Dre. That's gotta change. Come on Stan pull some coaching Wizardry out and play the matchups to our advantage.
I liked how he went with creative matchhups down the stretch vs Orlando. You gotta coach this one too.
The lesser (??) Morris is due for a good game for us.
If Tobias is hot, ride him a bit. More PnR with he and Andre, less from Reggie.
Sessions is slippery, so if Wall is out, no reprieve. He went off for 18-13 vs Brooklyn. We dont need another JJ Berea nightmare, fix it Stan, gameplan for that, but who will stop perimeter penetration??
Not for throwing Stanley under the bus at all Cool. I like his defense and presence on the floor. Just shut up and please make your uncontested layups and defend and rebound, you will be all right. He does have Pistons DNA .
Right now the other Reggie is the better player; more poise, playmaking and shooting. The D may be on the rookie's advantage, but not by much. Bullock is long and has shown he can put the ball on the floor and make plays. I think he deserves a shot, even though we did not draft him.
BTW, I don't think SJ'sonfidence can be hurt by this DNP. IMO its not a confidence issue, moreso a Focus issue. Concentrate on finishing at the rim, defending and rebounding. Stan had to admonish him about that earlier in the season, so another reminder won't hurt. Hope he will be one of our warriors going forward. warriors
Washington has bullied us and taken our lunch money all season. Morris said to reporters what we all have seen, they play better vs us. Wall disdains Reggie and Gortat feasts on a lethargic Dre. That's gotta change. Come on Stan pull some coaching Wizardry out and play the matchups to our advantage.
I liked how he went with creative matchhups down the stretch vs Orlando. You gotta coach this one too.
The lesser (??) Morris is due for a good game for us.
If Tobias is hot, ride him a bit. More PnR with he and Andre, less from Reggie.
Sessions is slippery, so if Wall is out, no reprieve. He went off for 18-13 vs Brooklyn. We dont need another JJ Berea nightmare, fix it Stan, gameplan for that, but who will stop perimeter penetration??
Not for throwing Stanley under the bus at all Cool. I like his defense and presence on the floor. Just shut up and please make your uncontested layups and defend and rebound, you will be all right. He does have Pistons DNA .
Right now the other Reggie is the better player; more poise, playmaking and shooting. The D may be on the rookie's advantage, but not by much. Bullock is long and has shown he can put the ball on the floor and make plays. I think he deserves a shot, even though we did not draft him.
BTW, I don't think SJ'sonfidence can be hurt by this DNP. IMO its not a confidence issue, moreso a Focus issue. Concentrate on finishing at the rim, defending and rebounding. Stan had to admonish him about that earlier in the season, so another reminder won't hurt. Hope he will be one of our warriors going forward. warriors
BallinD- Posts : 945
Join date : 2015-10-29
Location : Milky Way
Lemonpen
Oracle Fri Apr 08, 2016 3:06 pm
lemonpen wrote:Playoffs:
Bulls are 3 gms back with 3 to go and we are 3-1 against them. We win the first tie-breaker. We are in, so why do I keep seeing a magic number of "1". Someone help me understand.
What I never understood was the focus on the Bulls, when the Wizards were the real threat. We need to win one or the Wizards need to lose one because if we lose our next 3 and the Wizards win their next 3, they tie us and would hold the tie breaker. We're far from out of the woods right now, and screwed if we lose tonight!
Stanley:
Honestly, I'm a bit disappointed. I hoped he'd become more polished by this point. His offensive game is a bit clunky and mechanical. IMO his rookie season has not answered my questions as to his ability to be a starting SF. I understand the growing frustration with our rookie, and it's wider and deeper than I thought. Stanley said he was the best player in the draft, and he isn't even good enough to be picked at his spot if we did it over. Stanley is selling wolf tickets to Kevin Durant? Kids need to stay out of grown folks business. BTW, he's not even close to be a starting anything, let alone SF!
Andre "Big Baby" Drummond:
Pouting on the bench ???? You selfish blankity blank. Wake up a figure it out. WE CAN"T WIN MUCH when your historically crappy ft shooting makes you a 43 minute man. Unless of course you can avg 20/20 in 3 quarters. Damn kids. Drummond & Stanley talk too much for the game they bring.
Bullock:
Yeah, what everyone else has said.
Sixers:
Ding Dong the wicked witch is dead. Their fans can breath again as management begins to revive the once proud franchise.
Having said that about Stanley, he is a rookie, so I take these things with a grain of salt! At least he isn't outing his Bro's to their wives on video(cough, cough *** Lakers).
I still don't like the DNPCD deal. Reducing minutes was called for, the DNPCD feels like a demotion or punishment, just one mans opinion.
Oracle- Posts : 7504
Join date : 2011-12-21
Page 11 of 40 • 1 ... 7 ... 10, 11, 12 ... 25 ... 40
Page 11 of 40
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum|
|
|