Out of the horses mouth (Stuckey)

[deusXango]

Ugh Oh, Stuckey lovers, there seems to be a  fresh set of knowledgeable eyes on this "wonderful" player, and there's no knot in his tongue when it comes to talking about what he sees. You go Pete!!

The question that boggles my mind is, if there are already interior spacing problems, created by supremely talented big men, why would Cheeks decide to start a "bully guard" who's primary offensive move is to attack the basket? Why pair a guard who's only effective with the ball in his hands (to attack the rim), with a guard who's capable of running a team offense?

“I think we say that each and every year and we sit here and say, ‘Oh, this is the year!”-Rodney Stuckey
I was certain that nobody but Stuckey made that wild-eyed statement last year; some fans say that about him every year though. There are some fans saying that about him right now..."oh, this might be the year; it's a contract year and I'd love to see him turn it around."

Pete, you got support with this, but you're going to draw the ire of some also; name of the game.

[PistonPete]

"Stuckey’s scoring average and minutes have dropped for four straight seasons, from career bests of 16.6 and 34.2 for the undermanned 2009-10 Pistons to 11.5 and 29 last season. He spent the off-season focused on becoming even stronger – already one of his biggest advantages – and will come to camp in the best shape of his career. A constant among the coaches he’s answered to over his Pistons tenure is their belief that Stuckey is at his best when he is in attack mode. The composition of the roster this year might make it easier for him to consistently do so."

Really??? How about you develop a runner, a floater, a teardrop, "cough cough" a JUMPSHOT. Really???This is your offseason plan. SMH Don't the Pistons brass have the brains to tell this dude "Hey, you're strong enough."

Then there is the attitude:


“On paper, we’re good,” Stuckey said last week at the practice facility. “I think we say that each and every year and we sit here and say, ‘Oh, this is the year!’ ”

I hope this is not the kind of leadership Mo Cheeks is looking for from Stuckey

Everybody else is excited. Can't you see the clear talent upgrade dude? You're right there in the thick of it. Got a new coach that for some reasons puts your name in his mouth. And this is all you can say. Is it because the focus this year is not on you Stuckey.

Ya know Tay had that promising career start and he never got into second gear. He had that go-to post up move never learned anything else. Shot never got better. Never embraced a true 3&D role, Never learned to develop his right hand.

PIstons brass, unlike San Antonio organization for their borderline players (Danny Green), did not put a solid developent plan in place. Same with Stuckey. Nada.

Dude doesnt need to get stronger unless he's auditioning to replace Maxielle. They are about the same height? Hmmm. Stay tuned.

[deusXango]

Sebastian, you made a great post, until the trade suggestion; after deciding to sign Ibaka, and trading Harden, because of the CAP, do you really think OKC will trade Ibaka? Serge Ibaka is OKC's only frontline defense!!

Back before Josh Smith signed with the Pistons, it was widely rumored that it would take a max deal to sign him, therefore we should pass in favor of Igoudala; it didn't take a max deal to bring Smith to Detroit and I don't think it'll take a max deal to keep Monroe here. I love 'da Moose's game, but he needs to improve on more than a reliable 15 foot jump shot (that's doable); his end to end foot speed, shot-blocking ability, and lateral quickness are things that'll be considered at the bargaining table (between his agent and Joe) and I expect he'll sign a reasonable contract to remain a Piston.

You made a great point by pointing out the fact that Monroe is more center than "pick and pop" four; we're suddenly blessed with two great centers in Monroe and Drummond, and all it's going to take is some great coaching to get them to co-exist for the good of the team. The Pistons don't get this type of gift everyday, if ever. Don't trade Monroe; let's see what our frontline morphs into.

[deusXango]

"5. Whither Rodney? -- Rodney Stuckey has the longest uninterrupted Pistons tenure, a role filled the last two seasons by Tayshaun Prince (traded) and Jason Maxiell (left via free agency).  He is on an expiring contract.  He is the third or fourth point guard and he isn't a shooting guard.  He also is the last remaining active participant in the 2010-11 mutiny against ex-coach John Kuester.  Where he plays, if he stays, is all in question.

6. Divine intervention -- The Vatican hasn't called, but if rookie shooting guard Kentavious Caldwell-Pope can find his way into the starting lineup sooner than later, everyone would be happier for it."-David Mayo, MLive Sports

Wise, it seems that Don and I aren't the only ones who're not blinded by the fact that Stuckey is in the way, and "sliding" him over to SG won't automatically erase that fact. Just as he tries to bully players on the court (unsuccessfully I might add), he may be trying to bully a team mate out of his rightful position (because he's a rookie). Everyone who's watched him play at SG realize that his production numbers won't "slide over" from PG. Those items represent 1/3rd of the "keys to watch as training camp gets under way."

[WTF]

Moose presently isn't worth a max deal and quite frankly I don't see it happening. Moose would have to really take a serious leap in his game this season in order it to be even considered. There's still a big question mark as to if he's already peaked or not so unless his mid-range game has pick up not likely.

He say's he coming into the season lighter, stronger and in the best shape of his career I can only hope that mid-range game has improved as well. If he's carrying this team in a dominate fashion give him the max, but he's playing he's just a piece in the bigger scheme of things then Joe should pay him that way.

[Sebastian]

Not extending Greg Monroe with a max deal by October 31, by itself is not a terrible decision. Allowing the market to determine Moose's next contract, again is not a bad idea.

One would have to think that WE will see the best Greg Monroe has to offer, as he is essentially playing in a contract season. I think that Moose is essential to the composition of OUR roster going forward. His greatest value is in the fact that he is closer to being a center, more so than a "pick-and-pop" four.

As much as WE all love Dre' Drummond, Dre will be under his rookie contract for a few more years and can use the partnership with a player like Moose, by his side.

Think about it Pistons Pals, there is really no one to trade Moose with. Blake Griffin or DeMarcus Cousins is not going to be traded. Tim Duncan or Pau Gasol are not even consideration. LeMarcus Aldridge is 27 or 28 and still has 2 years 14-15 million per year remaining.

The only trade that I would consider doing, today, would be Moose, Jerebko, and Peyton Siva for Serge Ibaka, Hesheem Thabeet, and future 2nd round pick.

http://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6338331

Ibaka would help to take OUR defense to an unreal level. Ibaka is 24 and has a developing offensive game. Ibaka is locked into a $12.5 million contract through 2017. And, a #9 Pistons jersey is vacant. Maybe trading Moose would help to hasten the development of Dre. And, moving Jerebko and Siva would reduce the log jams at their respective positions.

OKC would do the deal, because they are in dire need of a low-post option. Moose is a friend of Jeff Green, who is still friends with KD. Also, the Thunder could use a Stretch-4 option on their roster. Jerebko would add a dimension to their roster that they need to compete with Western Conference foes. I know the Peyton Siva fans would be upset that he would be included, but remember Joe resigned Will B. and signed Chauncey to two years. Stuckey is in a contract year and could be resigned, if he is a consistent 15 pts, 5 ast, 3 rebounds player that he could very easily be. There is simply no need for Siva.

Joe has another decision to make.

[deusXango]

All of our big men seem to be serious and take no sh!t types; my money is on Josh Smith, Josh Harrellson, Tony Mitchell, and yes, Charlie V. for bad asses of the first order, and Greg Monroe, and Andre Drummond as strong arm peace makers.

The only guard who may get a little chippy is KCP, because of the tenacity on defense he plays with, the rest are rather wimpy when it comes to intimidation if you ask me.

I have to agree on Charlie he's no push over.  Chauncey's no push over but to well respected to be looked at as a tough guy.  Now DX you can't tell me that is you saw Stuckey and Bynum sporting hoodies in a dark alley that you wouldn't run.  

Wise, they had people running from the Palace dressed in short pants, under bright lights, hell yes I'd run from hoodies in the dark. 

[deusXango]

IMO when you're drafting in the Top 10 you would like for that player to come in slated to a starting position. What I'm not getting is that everyone was screaming before the draft that is was weak and there were not potential starter in the draft beyond Burke who Mr. Dumars passed on.  Not sure why all of a sudden KCP has become a must start type of player.
Ben McLemore was drafted right before KCP, and Trey Burke was drafted right after him and they both are slated to start for their teams; did Joe soil himself again?

I keep looking at Stuckey stats and again I have to say that if any other SG in the league gave us 13.6 pts, almost 4ast and 3 boards this would be applauded.  we only find Stuckey disappointing because he underachieved but mainly because Joe over sold him.   Keep in mind that only 2 seasons ago he was averaging 16.9 pts almost 6 ast and 4 rebounds and no one had an issue with those numbers.  I'm just not sure were you're thinking KCP is better than Stuckey  at this moment.
Those are PG numbers you're talking about, or if you will, combo guard numbers, whereas KCP is strictly a SG, nothing fancy or confusing. Speaking of Burke, the same thing would be happening to him if he were a Piston and Stuckey was still on the roster, only thing different would be the position. His Summer League performance would only add fuel to the fire, and he would be hung in effigy by now.  

The only reason why Drummond should have started was Maxiell any above average player at center like Big Ben and Drummond may not have smelled the court last season.
It's doubtful Drummond would have been drafted if we had a young Big Ben, and Maxiell didn't play center, he played PF, where Monroe should have been starting!! Lil' Larry's gone, so I ain't going to get into that.
 

[WTF]

All of our big men seem to be serious and take no sh!t types; my money is on Josh Smith, Josh Harrellson, Tony Mitchell, and yes, Charlie V. for bad asses of the first order, and Greg Monroe, and Andre Drummond as strong arm peace makers.

The only guard who may get a little chippy is KCP, because of the tenacity on defense he plays with, the rest are rather wimpy when it comes to intimidation if you ask me.

I have to agree on Charlie he's no push over. Chauncey's no push over but to well respected to be looked at as a tough guy. Now DX you can't tell me that is you saw Stuckey and Bynum sporting hoodies in a dark alley that you wouldn't run.  

[WTF]

IMO when you're drafting in the Top 10 you would like for that player to come in slated to a starting position. What I'm not getting is that everyone was screaming before the draft that is was weak and there were not potential starter in the draft beyond Burke who Mr. Dumars passed on. Not sure why all of a sudden KCP has become a must start type of player.

I keep looking at Stuckey stats and again I have to say that if any other SG in the league gave us 13.6 pts, almost 4ast and 3 boards this would be applauded. we only find Stuckey disappointing because he underachieved but mainly because Joe over sold him. Keep in mind that only 2 seasons ago he was averaging 16.9 pts almost 6 ast and 4 rebounds and no one had an issue with those numbers. I'm just not sure were you're thinking KCP is better than Stuckey at this moment.

The only reason why Drummond should have started was Maxiell any above average player at center like Big Ben and Drummond may not have smelled the court last season.

[deusXango]

All of our big men seem to be serious and take no sh!t types; my money is on Josh Smith, Josh Harrellson, Tony Mitchell, and yes, Charlie V. for bad asses of the first order, and Greg Monroe, and Andre Drummond as strong arm peace makers.

The only guard who may get a little chippy is KCP, because of the tenacity on defense he plays with, the rest are rather wimpy when it comes to intimidation if you ask me.

[deusXango]

For Joe Dumars to be a HOF guard, and to have played next to one of the games all time greats, he's consistently shown piss-poor judgment when it comes to selecting guards lately (even the returning of Chauncey Billups is flawed, no matter how you cut it); the most promising guards on the team, with the exception of Jennings, are slated to play behind Billups, Stuckey, Bynum, and quite possibly Singler. None of the Pistons guards made the Sporting News top 15, SG or PG!! All of our projected starting big men were ranked in their respective positions.

I know that I swore off bashing Stuckey, and this is not a bash, but a honest question, why has Joe held on to this player for so long? Why did he resign Will Bynum, particularly at the amount he did? Why did he bring Chauncey back, only to trade for Jennings? Was Jennings the best he could do with the trade resources on hand at the time? Not one ranked SG and our lottery pick is due to start the season on the bench; sure 'da Moose started his career on the bench, but was it really necessary? Drummond started his career on the bench and played minimal minutes, but was it wise? Those excuses suck for not starting KCP, with this new and improved team, when we just bottomed out at 29 wins!! It's not only about playing him with Jennings, but the entire starting unit, because of the defensive prowess they promise to have; his shot will come, but he's impressed me with a willingness to play hard-nosed, bulldog defense already.

Media day is Monday, and the real work begins after that; I hope it's an open/competitive training camp and not a political arena, where the ass kissers and smoozers win the spots in the rotation. I'm really pulling for Cheeks to be a REAL coach and through his decisions with the team, he forces Joe to bring the roster into balance (too many PG's and only one true SG, which is a rookie, and too many small forwards of varying skillsets); waiting for the trade deadline is too deep into the season to make any changes (when was Chauncey traded, huh?), unless no one wants what we have to barter with.

GO PISTONS!!

[PistonPete]

1. So Smith looks scary like an elementary school style bully from Junior high.

2. I've seen Drums get chippy during summer league.

3. Monroe might be the sleeper.

4. KCP might want to audition for the perimeter enforcer.

5. Jerebko is the dark horse candidate.

[WTF]

Being a long time advocate for signing Josh Smith one of the main reason was he more than all potentially talk about acquisition to this team he showed having the most Pistons DNA (ala Sheed, Rodman, Big Ben and Corliss) of all of them.  I can only imagine that when other players look at Smith the first thing that comes to mind is "Not To Be Fu@k With"
 
Looking at Drummond though still very youthful it's only a matter of time before he has to decide if he wants to be another soft ass Dwight or a tough minded Alonzo.  I'm hoping for the latter and he really has nothing to wait for he can impose his will now and have that same intimidating effect as a young Alonzo.  
 
Yes, Yes, people a more motivated imposing Stuckey could be our Resident Bully. Offensively he already plays and attack the basket in bully fashion, if he can be just as tenacious defensively we may have something.  One thing we do know is that Stuckey won't back down and being 6'5 215 pounds of muscles no one really wants to pick a fight with him.  
 
I think with Sheed and Cheeks in the ears of these three can get all the mean and tough out of them

[lemonpen]

Don't live in Detroit anymore, left all my family.  Had to get in the sun, so I ended up in Phoenix.  I was in town a month ago and my brother coaxed me to go to a cabaret on the west side (in the hood) birthday party for one of his coworkers.  Big girl, well-breasted, flamboyant to the hilt.  Wore a low cut white ballerina dress down to the butt cheeks and a tiarra.  NOT pretty!

SMH, Me and my two brothers hung out by the door and watched the lime green pimp suits, the fuscia and hot pink peel on spandex, the pajama-looking body suits walk by.  We didn't go in.  Wearing jeans and shirts.  Just watched the show.  Jennings could have walked that catwalk and many others you might see in the hood.  Hilarious.

I think there is a place on retro bad boys team for that.  If Rodman could coexist with Zeke, Laims and Dumars, he can probably fit in here if he can ball, if he can got to work.  He's just a kid, a maybe, silly blinged out kid.  LA culture and all that. Maybe Chauncey can punch him in the mouth and get his head right.

BTW, all teams need an enforcer.  Who will the Pistons enforcer be?

Welcome aboard PistonPete. I had to do the same back in the early 90s and spent a decade a stones throw from Tobacco Road in NC.

You pose a good question. We were milktoast B4 Sheed arrived. Kenyon Martin punked us regularly, until the student met the teacher.
I don't know if we have a clearly determined badass yet. It will be interesting to see how things develop over time.

[PistonPete]

Don't live in Detroit anymore, left all my family. Had to get in the sun, so I ended up in Phoenix. I was in town a month ago and my brother coaxed me to go to a cabaret on the west side (in the hood) birthday party for one of his coworkers. Big girl, well-breasted, flamboyant to the hilt. Wore a low cut white ballerina dress down to the butt cheeks and a tiarra. NOT pretty!

SMH, Me and my two brothers hung out by the door and watched the lime green pimp suits, the fuscia and hot pink peel on spandex, the pajama-looking body suits walk by. We didn't go in. Wearing jeans and shirts. Just watched the show. Jennings could have walked that catwalk and many others you might see in the hood. Hilarious.

I think there is a place on retro bad boys team for that. If Rodman could coexist with Zeke, Laims and Dumars, he can probably fit in here if he can ball, if he can got to work. He's just a kid, a maybe, silly blinged out kid. LA culture and all that. Maybe Chauncey can punch him in the mouth and get his head right.

BTW, all teams need an enforcer. Who will the Pistons enforcer be?

[PistonPete]

Thanks for the warm welcome fellas. It's great to be here. Great to be in a place where everybody bleeds Pistons with a passion and most importantly an informed viewpoint. I checked the old News forum back in the day, but they shut it down b4 I joined, so I found this poking arund on the web.

To me this is the most exciting year in maybe 5 years. Now there is hope. The patient (Dumars) has a pulse. My son and I had written the Pistons off, but Dumars resurrected himself, got rid of Tay and Daye, regained a pulse.
He got up off the gurney this summer and here we are. Is he a procrastinator like many of us who wait till our back up against the wall to act, or was it a matter of timing, or a little of both.

I know Stuck is your boy. Hope he uses his size and strength to play some hellacious D and pushes the ball, and it will be all good.

[WTF]

Okay those aren't exactly Polka Dots but close enough.

Do any of you remember the 80's rapper Kwame? (High Top Fade and Polka Dot Attire) Females thought that **** was freaking sexy. I got much play back in the day sporting a variety Polka Dot Attire. Man I had the sharpest Ralph Lauren silk Polka Dot tie, in fact I still have it (timeless) folks.

I once had my sister make me an Polka Dot outfit, and I look at those old pictures I think I damn I was rocking that **** but not everyone can pull off wearing certain things. I use to kill colors like pink and yellow and to this day will still sport these colors. Today I rock that tie with a yellow Ralph Lauren sweater vest and a pair of jeans or khakis and women think it's fly as hell.

But there are rules to this, because I'll never wear pink or yellow pants, nor socks. Jennings broke the polka dot rule for Over Dotting and compounded the matter with the boots which reeks Metro Sexual Now as I said those aren't dots but its hard making out the symbol but I have a Ralph Lauren shirt that has the polo symbol on it like polka dots.

As you can see I can't keep My Arse out of the Ralph Lauren Stores and catalogs  

[Sebastian]

to the best damn Pistons Forum on the Internet. Express yourself, young man!

WE tip it off Tuesday (10/1) with a better collection of talent (1-15), than probably ever before. The Palace will be rockin', this season, and OUR Pistons will be a Top-10 NBA League Pass must see team, no doubt.

WE got Mo', Henry Bibby, Sheed', the guy that coached the summer league team that Mo' brought with him from OKC, and Player/Coach Chaunce on the bench and in the ear of the roster. Don't get me wrong, this ain't the best bench in the history of the NBA, but it is damn better than who WE have had sitting in those seats, since LB's tenure.

WE are going to the playoffs, this season Pistons Pals and WE are going with a respectful record (50-32). WE have got to be at least 21 wins better than last season.

And speaking of seats, there will be asses in the Palace seats, this season. Folks killed me when they would say that the Ben Gordon/Maggette trade was a bad transaction. I totally disagreed and I assume so did Gores. That man has got to start seeing a ROI on his purchase of the Pistons; and besides Gladys Knight, the Four Tops, and MC Hammer just want do it in 2013-2014.

[cool breeze]

LOL, Collins???

That's radical... and funny  

But don't get too upset about his selection of clothes!

I laugh at pictures of people in my family that wore Bell Bottoms! I mean, how did they look in the mirror and say yeah, this is a great fashion choice

But my kids look at me during that whole 80's fashion thing and wonder WTF were we thinking!

Fashion comes and goes, and it's hard for one generation to judge another's choice, even though most find the others STRANGE, LOL!

Having said that, I LOVE the hair styles and clothes that women wore in the 40's!

I like Film Noir, and man there were some beautiful women back then!

You are right Oracle. I have gone too far with this. But the photo is a give away that Jennings must have spent hours preparing himself to look special. I just have never had any male friends who were so into themselves that they would spend time that way. So what goes through Brandon Jennings mind? He must not have had parents around much. I am still looking for some magic from Siva. I am in to the character thing when it comes to sports. That is why I really liked Knight so much. Jennings is really fun to watch as a player for sure. I will just have to block all the other stuff out.

[Oracle]

LOL, Collins???

That's radical... and funny  

But don't get too upset about his selection of clothes!

I laugh at pictures of people in my family that wore Bell Bottoms! I mean, how did they look in the mirror and say yeah, this is a great fashion choice

But my kids look at me during that whole 80's fashion thing and wonder WTF were we thinking!

Fashion comes and goes, and it's hard for one generation to judge another's choice, even though most find the others STRANGE, LOL!

Having said that, I LOVE the hair styles and clothes that women wore in the 40's!

I like Film Noir, and man there were some beautiful women back then!

[cool breeze]

Check out that polka dotted jump suit.  Anyone who wears a polka dotted  jump suit is just asking to be punched in the face.   


Have some DIGNITY man!  You're the starting point guard for the Detroit Pistons!  You wouldn't have caught Zeke or Dave Bing wearing a polka dotted jump suit.  Ever.       

After my wife took a look at Jennings clothing choice, she advised that perhaps the Pistons should sign Collins for one year to room on the road with our new point guard. In some ways I agree with her. Disregarding the sexy outfit, it does not appear that Jennings believes that wearing excessive jewelry is superficial will make him into a really special person who will draw a lot of attention from those ladies and men who sleep all day and start putting on the makeup around 6:00PM with a little sniff here and a little sniff there before party time. Collins might stabilize this young man and teach him basic things that he has obviously missed growing up. And Jason would get a kick out of picking out Brandon's outfits and help him with makeup etc. How will I get this image out of my mind when I watch Brandon wearing a Piston uniform?

I relate with people like Isiah Thomas and John Stockton. Has this game passed me by? Will Joe Dumars dress similar to Jennings this season to show support or will he have limited time available because of his obligations to Rodney Stuckey? If Collins is not available, maybe Dumars can get a call through to Dennis Rodman in North Korea to help keep Brandon on the right track. Please Peyton Siva, I beg you to somehow beat this clown out at some point of the season. Brandon Jennings is in to himself in a big way as many of his past teammates have said especially on the Bucks team. Maybe he has a split personality and the good one will come to life when he plays. I will need to have that perspective to be able to watch him play. Great job with this selection Mr. Dumars.

[Murph]

Murph, I apologize because you didn't say anything about Jennings character, and my remark was out of context; I also realize that you were joking...friends!? 

DX...no worries. You are and continue to remain one of my preferred posters on this forum, with your balanced and fair-minded observations (except about Stuckey  ).

[PistonPete]

When the fans are screaming "Deeeeetroit Basketball" It might be the big ooops to Drums or Smoove, the fast break with KCP or Stuck finishing (if he's really motivated like he says) or string music from BBBBillups, BJ, (he needs a new nickname yesterday) or Datome, hopefully Singler. It all starts with defense though.

It is interesting that Bibby is supposedly a defensive first guy, and I think Sheed is too, though maybe 50-50 tilted toward balance. With these guys on the coaching staff as well as Cheeks being known as a stout defender, back in the day, we have the potential to be a defensive juggernaut. Shot-blocking and rebounding potential in the D this year is off the charts with the addition of Smoove. The other end of the stick is KCP, hopefully with quick hands and Jennings with quick hands and a change of heart.

Time will tell. Defense will solve a lot of spacing issues if it can lead us to get out and run. For all those who want Chauncey to start or Stuckey, those guys were never known for their defense, period! Nor for pushing the ball to get easy buckets. I think if we want to jump quickly toward the elite, the "D" in the D has to be the prime focus.

Here's a snippet of what SI has to say. They argue the Stones can be one of the top 5 most improved defenses in the league this year.

SI.COM: "In addition, Detroit has the personnel (with Smith, Monroe and Drummond) to be a top defensive-rebounding team and the sort of quick, irritating defenders (Smith and fellow newcomers in guards Brandon Jennings, and Kentavious Caldwell-Pope) who should force turnovers more regularly. The pieces may not be in place for Detroit to be especially stifling just yet (top 10 in defensive efficiency seems too lofty a goal), but the Pistons are at the very least capable of more consistent and acceptable coverage"

[WTF]

Looks like Cheeks is his own man as he completes his coaching staff. Seems like most of these guys were part of his staff from his time in Portland. Not understanding no lead assistant on his staff though.

Welcome Pistons Pete

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