Height

[Sparma]

Out of curiosity, in continuation of our discussion of draft combine stats, I went looking for Brandon Knight's shoeless height. Knight's 6'1.5" without shoes (at draft time, he came in at 6'3.25" in shoes). Shoes add 1.75 inches to his height.

Rodney Stuckey was 6'3.75" without shoes, 6'4.5 in shoes. He gains a mere .75 in shoes.

So, Knight catches up to Stuckey by an inch in height in shoes.

Will Bynum measures 5'10.5 without shoes, 5.11.5 in shoes, gaining an inch, rather than Knight's 1.75.

Not sure what it means. Probably nothing now that these guys have been in the league for a while. It does fortify my subjective sense that Knight's a bit small to be a fulltime SG.

Beyond that, there's the curiosity that shoes add .75, 1, and 1.75 inches to the respective heights of our guards (I'm not finding the disparity for our 6'3" Jose Calderon, likely because he didn't take part in the draft combine). Add in Greg Monroe's 1.25 gain and Andre Drummond's 2 inch gain (!) and we're about at the full complement of possible gains from shoes at the draft, all showing up on the Piston roster. I'm too lazy to look for the 1.5 gain, but I'll guess we have it too because it's one of the most common increments at the draft combine.

[merc]

I'm starting to warm up to this kid... he plays good D with solid lateral foot movement... his length gives him a chance to see the whole floor... shooting from range?... this league is full of guys that came into the L and improved... his advantage is that his shots won't be challanged.
I'm giving him a nod as a strong possibility... especially being paired with BK.

[merc]

We've seen some great defenders at the PG position over the years... guys like Walt Frazier, The Glove, and Alvin Robertson... Mo Cheeks was in this class... he was the kind of player that could create fear in opposing PG's (even Zeke)... so he has that blood in him... however as he grew into the coaching ranks he was known more as a players coach... not a motivator or a tactician... if there is such a thing he was soft as the Sixers HC.
Since his named is being tossed around as the leading candidate I hope my eyes were wrong and he wasn't given a roster worth competing (which included A.I. & CWEbb)... His mentor was LB so he's steeped in the fundamentals of defense leading to offense.
Mo had a couple good years with the Blazers and was given the shaft after a bad start in his third year.
Maybe his brightest moment to-date was helping the lil girl sing the anthem :^)
Thinkin' we can do better... he'd be a great assistant.

[deusXango]

"Oracle I am still wondering why so many Piston fans believe that MCW is a real NBA player. Sure he is bigger but how did that translate to his play in college? Did he ever dominate any basketball game in college? I felt he was only an average college player with no confidence in his outside shot. Can he defend in the pro game? If so how long will it take? " - Don

Don, good questions, but when you insert your answers, I think you're off a bit.

The questions you ask about domination in college ignores the system MCW plays in! That system will always leave questions of dominance and defense for the same reason... they play like the 2004 Pistons, as a team!

What you should be judging him by is how successful he helped make that team, and if you look at how many teams were left playing in the entire country when they went out, you simply can't keep denying facts!

In this draft he's almost as good as any of the lottery candidates except for a few, so if you have questions about him(and you should), you'll likely question the rest as well(and we both do)!

Michael Crater-Williams is a great pick at #8 providing Joe works the deal with Dallas for the #13 also. My feeling is that Dumars will continue to sit on his ass, so draft the best big that falls to us (Zeller or Bennett), and sign Shaun Livingston as a FA (this is a true test of the magic Arnie Kander can perform). A totally healthy and much wiser PG, we've yet to see; coming into the league he was a monster of a talent, before his injury.

[Oracle]

"Oracle I am still wondering why so many Piston fans believe that MCW is a real NBA player. Sure he is bigger but how did that translate to his play in college? Did he ever dominate any basketball game in college? I felt he was only an average college player with no confidence in his outside shot. Can he defend in the pro game? If so how long will it take? " - Don

Don, good questions, but when you insert your answers, I think you're off a bit.

The questions you ask about domination in college ignores the system MCW plays in! That system will always leave questions of dominance and defense for the same reason... they play like the 2004 Pistons, as a team!

What you should be judging him by is how successful he helped make that team, and if you look at how many teams were left playing in the entire country when they went out, you simply can't keep denying facts!

In this draft he's almost as good as any of the lottery candidates except for a few, so if you have questions about him(and you should), you'll likely question the rest as well(and we both do)!

[Oracle]

I have to laugh at this thought. Why is Cheeks now a prime candidate to become the Pistons head coach? He looks tired to me. Is the real truth perhaps that none of the good coaches want this job as head coach for the Pistons? One of the important things to me is who will the next coach bring in as assistants? I really don't believe Frank had many good assistants do you? So who will Cheeks bring in? Those assistant coaches do all of the work especially working with the young guys and running practice. So the Pistons would hire Cheeks but not hire Zeke. Is that right Mr. Owner? How can Gores brag to his social network that he has hired Cheeks? Cheeks has a good personality to be an assistant not a head coach. Thomas and Laimbeer are not good enough but Cheeks is the MAN. Now that is funny. Welcome to the carnival Piston fans.

I couldn't agree more, this search is resembling a joke, with Gores, Joe and Jackson being the 3 stooges or the 3 monkeys that see, hear, and know nothing!

BTW, Cheeks does look awfully tired in every picture I've seen of him in OKC, and that wasn't the case before! But the wind seems to be blowing some sweet fumes off his arse, and has Joe and Gores sniffing!

I guarantee that Zeke or Laimbeer would do well with this team, and as a bonus either of them will start filling that arena up again, and that's nothing to sneeze at!

[cool breeze]

I have to laugh at this thought. Why is Cheeks now a prime candidate to become the Pistons head coach? He looks tired to me. Is the real truth perhaps that none of the good coaches want this job as head coach for the Pistons? One of the important things to me is who will the next coach bring in as assistants? I really don't believe Frank had many good assistants do you? So who will Cheeks bring in? Those assistant coaches do all of the work especially working with the young guys and running practice. So the Pistons would hire Cheeks but not hire Zeke. Is that right Mr. Owner? How can Gores brag to his social network that he has hired Cheeks? Cheeks has a good personality to be an assistant not a head coach. Thomas and Laimbeer are not good enough but Cheeks is the MAN. Now that is funny. Welcome to the carnival Piston fans.

[cool breeze]

I'm thinking the Heat lose at home in this one even if the ref overly assist them in this game. Should be a good game. Pacers take this series with a double overtime win.

I don't trust the Pacers, they're a talented but mentally weak team! They are looking good in this series due to them matching up with Miami better than any team in the east!

SA would sweep the Pacers easily!

However, the Pacers pose a real threat to our Pistons in the future because they're built like us but have clearly superior talent at some positions and arguably super talent at the others.

In addition, they won't continue to be mentally weak because most of that is due to youth and inexperience!

We absolutely will need a guard like MCW to be competitive in our own division, and it's has to be a priority for Drummond to get some kind of shooting ability(baby hook, floater, etc.) just inside of the FT line at a minimum.

Hibbert is looking good in this series, but if he had a big body to have to play against, he won't be nearly as successful!

Speaking of Hibbert, is it now bad to say that you aren't homosexual?

Wisefan don't forget about the officials who will be calling everything in critical moments in favor of Miami. Labron fouled out in this last game on the second of two drives to the basket using his elbow as a weapon against Pacer defensive men. That won't happen in this 7th game matchup. Labron can charge on every drive without worry of a call going against him. And don't forget about Wade who gets away with obvious fouls on defense especially in the paint. Stern will want the Heat playing in the finals because the front office like Vincent Goodwill believe that the fans on the fence want to see the stars play ball. I am not saying that Indiana cannot win this game but if they expect a good outcome, they will need to play their best basketball game of their lives if that happens. The Indiana guards will need to be perfect hitting long range shots to open up the paint.

Oracle I am still wondering why so many Piston fans believe that MCW is a real NBA player. Sure he is bigger but how did that translate to his play in college? Did he ever dominate any basketball game in college? I felt he was only an average college player with no confidence in his outside shot. Can he defend in the pro game? If so how long will it take? I still believe that Detroit needs a few vet players at the skill positions and the team cannot afford to play another untested young guy especially at point guard unless he is a player with a personality like Burke. MCW might not make it in the NBA at all. Detroit needs to upgrade the supporting caste with a banger inside and a back up point guard like Collision or Jack. Then add a high scoring proven NBA scorer like Evans to the mix and we have a more competitive team. I can't see where MCW makes us more competitive. He is not ready for the NBA either on offense or defense to play the most difficult position of all. I would trade the first pick or draft a big man.

[Oracle]

I'm thinking the Heat lose at home in this one even if the ref overly assist them in this game. Should be a good game. Pacers take this series with a double overtime win.

I don't trust the Pacers, they're a talented but mentally weak team! They are looking good in this series due to them matching up with Miami better than any team in the east!

SA would sweep the Pacers easily!

However, the Pacers pose a real threat to our Pistons in the future because they're built like us but have clearly superior talent at some positions and arguably super talent at the others.

In addition, they won't continue to be mentally weak because most of that is due to youth and inexperience!

We absolutely will need a guard like MCW to be competitive in our own division, and it's has to be a priority for Drummond to get some kind of shooting ability(baby hook, floater, etc.) just inside of the FT line at a minimum.

Hibbert is looking good in this series, but if he had a big body to have to play against, he won't be nearly as successful!

Speaking of Hibbert, is it now bad to say that you aren't homosexual?

[Oracle]

Mo Cheeks over McMillan? Seriously?

They say it's likely because Gores likes him?

This has got to be a joke!

Cheeks, maybe, if McMillian isn't around, but..........................

I always been an advocate for hiring Cheeks since the Coaching Circus came to town with the hiring of Curry as head coach. Now before you all bemoan this hiring of Cheeks if it indeed happens, it was Cheeks indirectly coaching OKC as lead assistant. He might not had the title of head coach but he put his stamp on that team.

Don't get me wrong I can take either being hired, but I don't see much difference in either and if we were going on record alone then Gundy out ranks them both.

I agree on Van Gundy, I do think he's probably the best overall match for our talent, while I think Cheeks would be the best match for our PG's.

However, if it's just between Cheeks & McMillian, I think Nate is the better match for the team as a whole than Cheeks.

[cool breeze]

I sometimes compare the Detroit Pistons to the Arizona wildcats regarding fan support and community interest. A recent national study was published regarding which college schools had the best following for basketball. Arizona was second to all schools losing out to Louisville. The basketball program here supports all of the other sports including football. This is the opposite from big football schools such as Michigan and MSU. Additionally, the basketball supporters give so much money to the U of A athletic department that no additional tax payer money is needed. Every basketball game is a sell out. Why you might ask. Basketball here does not compete with other professional sports such as the Red Wings vs Pistons in the winter months. But there are other cities that have universities where the seats are empty like the Palace. What does the basketball coach and the athletic director do differently? THEY SELL THE BASKETBALL PROGRAM. Even in the summer months of off season there will be a story in the local paper or something on the television sports news programs on the local channels or the radio. There is constant talk about the new players and what they are doing to improve and personal stories about the players so the local people will fall in love with those players and support them fully. It is incredible how poorly the Detroit Pistons owner doesn't do more to sell the Pistons especially with the seat empty or almost empty. There needs to be more news stories about the players and the plan for a successful future before the owner will see an increase in season ticket sales. There is more competition for interest by sports fans in professional sports and yet the owner and Joe Dumars does nothing to increase interest by providing news stories about what is going on and what the various people in charge think about the team. Is it true that we Piston fans on this forum spend more time trying to figure out what the Detroit Pistons should do to improve? We are not getting paid and have no financial interest. It seems a given that the Detroit Pistons management team are either ignorant of basic business fundamentals or lazy cocky fools. How many times have we said to ourselves WHY DO WE CARE BECAUSE THOSE IN CHARGE DON'T?

[WTF]

I'm thinking the Heat lose at home in this one even if the ref overly assist them in this game. Should be a good game. Pacers take this series with a double overtime win.

[WTF]

Mo Cheeks over McMillan? Seriously?

They say it's likely because Gores likes him?

This has got to be a joke!

Cheeks, maybe, if McMillian isn't around, but..........................

I always been an advocate for hiring Cheeks since the Coaching Circus came to town with the hiring of Curry as head coach. Now before you all bemoan this hiring of Cheeks if it indeed happens, it was Cheeks indirectly coaching OKC as lead assistant. He might not had the title of head coach but he put his stamp on that team.

Don't get me wrong I can take either being hired, but I don't see much difference in either and if we were going on record alone then Gundy out ranks them both.

[Oracle]

Mo Cheeks over McMillan? Seriously?

They say it's likely because Gores likes him?

This has got to be a joke!

Cheeks, maybe, if McMillian isn't around, but..........................

[merc]

This is bitter sweet...
Bitter= What could have been for his future not knowing what could have happened if he was healthy with a decent supporting cast
Sweet= The best trade pawn you could ask for... directly relating to our ship run.

Greed, family... whatever it was, ya still gotta appreciate the player and his talents... HOF?

[Oracle]

Right coaches for right teams: Picking a coach for each of the teams currently looking for one

In the PLEASE don't trust anything he says department, I give you this... - Report: Rockets getting 'hopeful signs' about landing Dwight Howard

Can you spell Damage Control? - Clippers' front office claims responsibility for Del Negro decision

[Oracle]

Fit to be passed on that is!

[Oracle]

Terry Porter and Clyde Drexler. Magic Johnson and Byron Scott from yesterday. Russell Westbrook and Thabo Sefolosha. Jeremy Lin and James Harden who're competing today. These were/are heady, skilled, and overpowering backcourts that relied on basketball smarts as much as size and athleticism to compete and excel in the NBA. If the Pistons drafted Michael Carter-Williams (6' 6") and their next coach saw fit to try starting Khris Middleton (6' 7") next to him in the backcourt, the Pistons would have the biggest and potentially one of the best to play the game in the days to come. Add to that 6' 3" combo guard Brandon Knight coming off the bench and the Pistons 3 guard rotation would be a load to contend with. - DX

Chauncey 6"5 and Rip 6"7 weren't to shabby as a large backcourt tandem. Hey!!!! I know a SG that might work really well with a Carter-Williams this kid name Aaron Affalo

Wise, I got much love for our heroes (Chauncey and Rip) but, I had the pleasure of meeting them during the championship year and this is what I noticed; I'm standing a honest 6' 0" and looking Chauncey straight in the eye but, Rip was looking down at me (when he occasionally looked at me, his eyes always wandered when he talked to anyone). I'm thinking 6' 0" and 6' 7" wouldn't qualify anymore than Isaiah and Joe would and I think they were awesome as players but, not that tall.

I'd love to get my hands on Afflalo again but, that's a deal to be done another day; I'd want Stuckey gone by the time Aaron returned though!!

DX, Chauncey was a pretty close to 6'5 if not actually 6'5. He was bigger than most of the PG in league no way the league could be that off on his listed height.

That may be a little generous, but at the introduction of Chauncey, Joe said that he was taller than 6'3, and that Chauncey had him by a little.

That puts Chauncey just under 6'5!

It was RIP that wasn't 6'7, and Sheed would regularly joke about! RIP was just under 6'6 in shoes!

[WTF]

Terry Porter and Clyde Drexler. Magic Johnson and Byron Scott from yesterday. Russell Westbrook and Thabo Sefolosha. Jeremy Lin and James Harden who're competing today. These were/are heady, skilled, and overpowering backcourts that relied on basketball smarts as much as size and athleticism to compete and excel in the NBA. If the Pistons drafted Michael Carter-Williams (6' 6") and their next coach saw fit to try starting Khris Middleton (6' 7") next to him in the backcourt, the Pistons would have the biggest and potentially one of the best to play the game in the days to come. Add to that 6' 3" combo guard Brandon Knight coming off the bench and the Pistons 3 guard rotation would be a load to contend with. - DX

Chauncey 6"5 and Rip 6"7 weren't to shabby as a large backcourt tandem. Hey!!!! I know a SG that might work really well with a Carter-Williams this kid name Aaron Affalo

Wise, I got much love for our heroes (Chauncey and Rip) but, I had the pleasure of meeting them during the championship year and this is what I noticed; I'm standing a honest 6' 0" and looking Chauncey straight in the eye but, Rip was looking down at me (when he occasionally looked at me, his eyes always wandered when he talked to anyone). I'm thinking 6' 0" and 6' 7" wouldn't qualify anymore than Isaiah and Joe would and I think they were awesome as players but, not that tall.

I'd love to get my hands on Afflalo again but, that's a deal to be done another day; I'd want Stuckey gone by the time Aaron returned though!!

DX, Chauncey was a pretty close to 6'5 if not actually 6'5. He was bigger than most of the PG in league no way the league could be that off on his listed height.

[deusXango]

The main selling point of obtaining the CAP space over the last year and not making any moves of consequence to maintain it, was to better the quality of the team. In addition to signing FA's (which is the obvious but, there are some fans who don't want to spend for the best) it was reported that Joe would use some of that money to absorb some huge unwanted contract from another team, so that they could lower their payroll and we benefit at the same time. The Dallas Mavericks fit that bill right now!! Gores people should be talking to Cuban's people to get her done right now before the room gets crowded with offers! Neither team is in the playoffs so what's the hold up? The Pistons don't need a coach in place to acquire another lottery pick, and Marion would be a healthy surprise replacing Maxiell in the lineup for the new coach. Oracle, I agree with you, that jump shot of Marion's is dog ugly but, there's no denying his defensive prowess and energy; he's a basketball smart player also. Joe needs to get off his fat ass and do something instead of looking out the f^@king window!

[deusXango]

What A fool you are Gores. You bring A known enemy into our proud Organization. You are A boy trying to play in A mans game Gores.

I'm not MAD at Phil Jackson at all for saying everything he said. His loyalty is to Michael Jordan and the LA Lakers. Known enemies of the Detroit Pistons organization for decades now.


**** you Gores! No respect for you for bringing in Phil Jackson to basically spit on my proud Detroit Pistons. **** YOU FOR REAL GORES!

FUUUUUUCKING ROOKIE!!!

[deusXango]

Terry Porter and Clyde Drexler. Magic Johnson and Byron Scott from yesterday. Russell Westbrook and Thabo Sefolosha. Jeremy Lin and James Harden who're competing today. These were/are heady, skilled, and overpowering backcourts that relied on basketball smarts as much as size and athleticism to compete and excel in the NBA. If the Pistons drafted Michael Carter-Williams (6' 6") and their next coach saw fit to try starting Khris Middleton (6' 7") next to him in the backcourt, the Pistons would have the biggest and potentially one of the best to play the game in the days to come. Add to that 6' 3" combo guard Brandon Knight coming off the bench and the Pistons 3 guard rotation would be a load to contend with. - DX

Chauncey 6"5 and Rip 6"7 weren't to shabby as a large backcourt tandem. Hey!!!! I know a SG that might work really well with a Carter-Williams this kid name Aaron Affalo

Wise, I got much love for our heroes (Chauncey and Rip) but, I had the pleasure of meeting them during the championship year and this is what I noticed; I'm standing a honest 6' 0" and looking Chauncey straight in the eye but, Rip was looking down at me (when he occasionally looked at me, his eyes always wandered when he talked to anyone). I'm thinking 6' 0" and 6' 7" wouldn't qualify anymore than Isaiah and Joe would and I think they were awesome as players but, not that tall.

I'd love to get my hands on Afflalo again but, that's a deal to be done another day; I'd want Stuckey gone by the time Aaron returned though!!

[Phil-Good]

What A fool you are Gores. You bring A known enemy into our proud Organization. You are A boy trying to play in A mans game Gores.

I'm not MAD at Phil Jackson at all for saying everything he said. His loyalty is to Michael Jordan and the LA Lakers. Known enemies of the Detroit Pistons organization for decades now.


**** you Gores! No respect for you for bringing in Phil Jackson to basically spit on my proud Detroit Pistons. **** YOU FOR REAL GORES!

FUUUUUUCKING ROOKIE!!!

[Oracle]

"However, Paul would have to be remarkably oblivious to Sterling's history (including but not even close to limited to: not taking blame for a fire in one of his buildings until a court forced him to, showing off the "beautiful black bodies" of players in the locker room to friends, and accusations of fostering "a plantation mentality" with the Clippers) not to have already known that he might be working for a person of questionable morals and ethics." - Does it matter that Chris Paul is upset with the Los Angeles Clippers?

[Oracle]

'Mookie' Blaylock, 46, on life support

BTW, is Stockton better than Zeke? - Top 10 point guards in NBA history

IMO, Hell No!!!

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