How Stuckey and Perkins fit going forward ...

[Sebastian]

Sebastian.
Damn man, I don't know what to say.
Right after last nights draft, and the young, untried, talent we have on hand, to build on, you mention Rodney Stuckey AND Kendrick Perkins, as pieces to stifle the progress?! I was tired and falling off to sleep when I read that; woke my ass right up. I'm saving the best for last.

Charlie Villanueva represents next years CAP relief (which can be used to resign Monroe) and after coming this far with him, what's the last year really costing us? He's also a stretch 4 who accounts for quite a few of our 3's last year; maybe we can get some of the same service from him during the course of the year. Slava Kravtsov showed me that he can be a more than capable 3rd line center, and at $1.5 million, he's cheap; what does Perkins cost for basically the same service? Perkins major talent is looking ugly, and acting bad, and that sh!t don't translate into wins! Not only did Mitchell make Maxiell unnecessary, but Jerebko as well, and guarantees a spot for Slava on the team. Drummond is center #1, Monroe is #2, and Slava is #3; Mitchell backs up both of the starting big men. When Drummond goes to the bench, Monroe slides over to center and Mitchell comes in at PF; whoever goes to the bench, Mitchell is the PF to come in without the team losing any POP. That three headed monster leaves very little PT for a 3rd string center, and paying millions for a practice dummy is ridiculous.

If Joe D can acquire Al-Farouq Aminu to play SF, we suddenly have elite level athleticism, rebounding, and scoring from our SF's (Aminu, Mitchell, Middleton, and maybe Singler) combined efforts. Remember, Joe believes in players capable of playing multiple positions, so Mitchell will see PT at both forward spots. Even if Joe doesn't pursue Aminu, he's got to spend the money somewhere, and fans have been against us paying anyone, who's not a superstar, a max contract; the recent interest in Eric Bledsoe says that when/if we trade for him, it's going to cost us some dough to sign him to an extension when we get him. This brings me to my final point.

Eric Bledsoe pushes Knight to the bench, and Payton Siva has removed Bynum from consideration for being resigned; how many PG's are we going to carry? How many SG's. Really, WTF do we need Stuckey for, other than trade bait? If Bledsoe and/or Aminu comes here, Stuckey, Jerebko, and possibly Singler, are long gone (nobody wants CV and again we need the CAP relief for putting up with him for so long). I'm not going to rail on Stuckey, I'll only say that anyone who can find an imaginary reason to keep him on the team, for one more year, is living in the past. This roster breakdown explains more than anything I can say, about the team being vastly improved.
C- Drummond/Monroe/Kravtsov
PF-Monroe/Mitchell/Villanueva
SF-Middleton/Mitchell/Singler
SG-Caldwell-Pope/Knight/English
PG-Bledsoe/Knight/Siva
That's a 12 man roster and Cheeks can play his rotation as he sees fit. That roster is totally free of the old and stale players who rode this team down the drain, and fans were tired of coming out to see; this is IMHO a smarter, faster, more athletic, and well balanced squad than has been fielded in quite some time. I personally don't see where Stuckey and Perkins can make it better.    

DX, I thought that it might come to this. Your inability to see how Stuckey and Perkins fit is understood and respected. First, off I like your thoughts of how Mitchell should be used. No disagreements, there. Also, Moose can indeed see minutes at the Center position. But, I don't necessarily agree with how you think B. Knight should be used and I don't particularly like the potential conflicts that could occur between Bledsoe and Knight. I don't see Bledsoe and Knight on the same team at their current chronological ages is necessarily a good thing.

But. back to the utility of Stuckey and Perkins.

Allow me the opportunity to strike through my interest in Perkins, as I thought the final year (2014-2015) was a team option, it is not. Perkins is owed through the 2014-2015 season. So, I would pass on Perkins. Maybe, try to find out if Greg Oden can play, again, and offer a slightly more lucrative contract than what the Heat or Cavs have rumored to pay him.

But, Stuckey could very easily become a legitimate candidate for 6th-man of the Year.

First off, I think that B. Knight should start. He can handle starters minutes at the PG position. Knight can easily average 15.7 pts, 6.2 ast, per game. I really think that Mo' will be a positive influence and greater teacher to Knight.

And, Stuckey's age and time in the League serves as a buffer to the potential growth of Knight. Bledsoe's presence would stifle the growth of Knight. Besides, Bledsoe will probably be moved to Orlando for Afflalo about the same time Chris Paul signs his new contract with the Clippers.

But, you can't tell me that Stuckey when given a defined job description, as the 6th man on this team that Stuckey can give US: 15 pts, 5 ast and 5 rbs every night (maybe 3 rbs) if he's the first guard off the bench; playing about 31 minutes each night. And, yes, it will be a contract season for Stuckey. The guy turns 28 in April. He will want another contract at $6-8 million/3-4 years.

Honestly, I sincerely think he can be a key player on the roster. If the time comes that I have to take back what I have projected for Stuckey, then I will like it like a man with internet access.

[Oracle]

I was SHOCKED to see almost EXACTLY what I posted in this article, so of course I think he nailed it!

I really suggest that those that didn't think what I was saying made any sense, take a look. No, that doesn't mean I know more than anyone else, I got it just as wrong as everybody else(except Seb) but I just felt strongly about what Joe did, AFTER he did it.

The moral(I guess) is that if you don't have foresight, at least have a little hindsight

Shawn Windsor: Joe Dumars loves Trey Burke, but U-M guard wasn't best fit for Pistons

[Oracle]

Trade targets
Players the Pistons might make a play for:
Wilson Chandler, F, Nuggets
Eric Bledson, G, Clippers
Rajon Rondo, G, Celtics
Luol Deng, F, Bulls
Danny Granger, F, Pacers


Full details here: http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20130628/SPORTS0102/306280127#ixzz2XZ3dt7E8

[Oracle]

Just when you thought it was safe to bend over again in the NBA, this happens!!!

Nets interested in signing free-agent center Jason Collins

Disclaimer:
I'm not hating on Collins, I just find it hard to resist a joke now and again.

[Oracle]

Don, I was so glad to hear Solomon Hill's name called in the first round, and by Indiana no less, because you were concerned he wasn't getting enough attention. The Draymon Greene comparisons were not what I saw in the film clips; the guy is a beast! Congratulations to the men of the desert.

Sebastian, Oracle, I see that Orlando was in talks with the Clippers about Bledsoe, before the draft, and Aaron Afflalo was the trade piece going to L.A. This may come as a shock to you guys but, at the bargaining table with Joe, they want Knight, as a sweetener, to take Stuckey! That suggests to me that outside of Detroit, Stuckey is not viewed to be as good as Afflalo. It also means that GM's think they can pick the Fat Man's pocket. - I don't think we win that one, Afflalo is way more attractive, and Orlando can add filler! BTW, I said earlier that they would want Knight in there because he would prolly be the key to the deal working! I wouldn't want to do that, but you at least have to look at the rest of the deal!

WTF does Iguodala's name keep coming up as a FA acquisition for? I mean, hasn't the teams potential gone past what we would've needed Iggy for? Magic City time.

Yeah, they need to table that Iggy talk! Aminu is better right now, IMO, and if he's not, his upside is at least going in the right direction! Iggy's game is in decline, maybe not serious decline, but one year he just won't be worth crap and he'll still be here!

BTW, I like the way you're thinking in that lineup, but I don't have the complete adverse reaction to Perkins that you do!

Sure Perkins got undressed on national TV by Memphis's bigs, but it wasn't just him! I think he would be more effective here backing up our guys! However this may be a moot point because I don't want to pay him too much and Slava is a full season away from being almost as good!

[deusXango]

Don, I was so glad to hear Solomon Hill's name called in the first round, and by Indiana no less, because you were concerned he wasn't getting enough attention. The Draymon Greene comparisons were not what I saw in the film clips; the guy is a beast! Congratulations to the men of the desert.

Sebastian, Oracle, I see that Orlando was in talks with the Clippers about Bledsoe, before the draft, and Aaron Afflalo was the trade piece going to L.A. This may come as a shock to you guys but, at the bargaining table with Joe, they want Knight, as a sweetener, to take Stuckey! That suggests to me that outside of Detroit, Stuckey is not viewed to be as good as Afflalo. It also means that GM's think they can pick the Fat Man's pocket.

WTF does Iguodala's name keep coming up as a FA acquisition for? I mean, hasn't the teams potential gone past what we would've needed Iggy for? Magic City time.

[deusXango]

Sebastian.
Damn man, I don't know what to say.
Right after last nights draft, and the young, untried, talent we have on hand, to build on, you mention Rodney Stuckey AND Kendrick Perkins, as pieces to stifle the progress?! I was tired and falling off to sleep when I read that; woke my ass right up. I'm saving the best for last.

Charlie Villanueva represents next years CAP relief (which can be used to resign Monroe) and after coming this far with him, what's the last year really costing us? He's also a stretch 4 who accounts for quite a few of our 3's last year; maybe we can get some of the same service from him during the course of the year. Slava Kravtsov showed me that he can be a more than capable 3rd line center, and at $1.5 million, he's cheap; what does Perkins cost for basically the same service? Perkins major talent is looking ugly, and acting bad, and that sh!t don't translate into wins! Not only did Mitchell make Maxiell unnecessary, but Jerebko as well, and guarantees a spot for Slava on the team. Drummond is center #1, Monroe is #2, and Slava is #3; Mitchell backs up both of the starting big men. When Drummond goes to the bench, Monroe slides over to center and Mitchell comes in at PF; whoever goes to the bench, Mitchell is the PF to come in without the team losing any POP. That three headed monster leaves very little PT for a 3rd string center, and paying millions for a practice dummy is ridiculous.

If Joe D can acquire Al-Farouq Aminu to play SF, we suddenly have elite level athleticism, rebounding, and scoring from our SF's (Aminu, Mitchell, Middleton, and maybe Singler) combined efforts. Remember, Joe believes in players capable of playing multiple positions, so Mitchell will see PT at both forward spots. Even if Joe doesn't pursue Aminu, he's got to spend the money somewhere, and fans have been against us paying anyone, who's not a superstar, a max contract; the recent interest in Eric Bledsoe says that when/if we trade for him, it's going to cost us some dough to sign him to an extension when we get him. This brings me to my final point.

Eric Bledsoe pushes Knight to the bench, and Payton Siva has removed Bynum from consideration for being resigned; how many PG's are we going to carry? How many SG's. Really, WTF do we need Stuckey for, other than trade bait? If Bledsoe and/or Aminu comes here, Stuckey, Jerebko, and possibly Singler, are long gone (nobody wants CV and again we need the CAP relief for putting up with him for so long). I'm not going to rail on Stuckey, I'll only say that anyone who can find an imaginary reason to keep him on the team, for one more year, is living in the past. This roster breakdown explains more than anything I can say, about the team being vastly improved.
C- Drummond/Monroe/Kravtsov
PF-Monroe/Mitchell/Villanueva
SF-Middleton/Mitchell/Singler
SG-Caldwell-Pope/Knight/English
PG-Bledsoe/Knight/Siva
That's a 12 man roster and Cheeks can play his rotation as he sees fit. That roster is totally free of the old and stale players who rode this team down the drain, and fans were tired of coming out to see; this is IMHO a smarter, faster, more athletic, and well balanced squad than has been fielded in quite some time. I personally don't see where Stuckey and Perkins can make it better.

[cool breeze]

I am a bit puzzled by some of your comments. I read where someone wanted to make Stuckey captain of the team and make him a starter again. What in hell is that based on because there is no evidence that Stuckey would ever put in the work it takes to become a real NBA starter. Do we just throw away all the past history and blame certain players bad play on old departed coaching staffs? Maybe one of you guys might be a agent for Stuckey. Do you actually watch the games closely and take a look at emotion on the court by players? I see Knight really feeling down when things are not going right. He wants to win badly. However, I have never seen such an expression on Stuckey's face. Win or lose, it just doesn't matter of course because it is the coaches fault and never Stuckey's fault. Stuckey has never given any of his heart and soul for any Piston coach so far but you think now he will? I don't like those type of players. They need to have the right stuff all by themselves and bring that to help the team in any way they can. And Stuckey has never done that.

Knight: This is what I anticipate happening next year. I expect Knight to start at point guard where he belongs. If there are better players around him, he will be better on offense. He is already a standout defender.

Singler: It seems that almost everyone disliked Singler when Detroit picked him in the second round except for a few of us. He is from Duke and some Detroit fans hate Duke. He is too slow perhaps. But he won an NCAA championship and he was MVP. That means nothing then what about the foreign team he played for before last season when he was a key guy on that team that won a championship? But how do you explain why Frank's coaching staff felt so strongly about what Singler brought to the team last year? They couldn't keep him out of the lineup. When Prince was a Piston, Singler couldn't start at small forward so he beat out all of the shooting guards. The coaches needed Singler to be in the games because they knew that their jobs were at stake and Singler was a guy who was always the same. He is smart, he knows where to be on both offense and defense. He is a great help defender and he has a reputation as being a good shooter, passer and rebounder. Last season his weakness was lack of consistency in his outside shot. However, no plays were created for him on offense. A friend of mine has informed that Singler has really been working his butt off this summer to improve shooting percentage at the spots he got the ball last season. He keeps trying to mold his game to Battier's game. If Smith is signed by Detroit, then Singler might be sitting more. However, I believe that he is one of those players who can make a good team better because he is a team orientated guy who is always the same. He shows up and he works hard and he keeps improving. It is no fluke when you see who is in the starting lineup or who is in a rotation. This stuff is worked out on the court and all the players know who can play and who should be on the bench. Whoever Detroit brings in as a free agent or though trade must beat out Singler at the 3. That means they must play great defense, pass the ball well, make few mistakes and not screw with team chemistry as well as shoot the ball effectively. That is how the coaches will approach it and having a type of person like Singler on the team is a great thing because everyone improves especially the player who is able to beat him out of that starting job.

Middleton:
Is KCP a sure fire starter next season? He played college on a real loser last season. Because the team had so little talent KCP was free to so whatever he wanted on offense. If he had played at UCLA like Muhammad, there would have been pressure on him to hit big shots and fit in with other players who demanded attention. Can he even make the rotation? I sure don't know if he can. Middleton looks like a better player to me and he has one year of experience in the NBA and will be fighting for that job because he is on the fringe as far as his contract is concerned. If Dumars doesn't sign another shooting guard, I expect Middleton to win that job easily unless somehow Stuckey stays around. KCP is not ready to just drop by and get that starting job until the other players trust him. I am not saying he can't do it but I suspect he is a long shot to be a reliable player next season.

I laugh at the thought of the new 2nd round selection that some of you have placed in the starting lineup at the 3 before he has ever played a game in the summer league. He played in a scrub conference and was not outstanding on a bad team last season. His team played like crap and he did not always show up either in practice or games. Why is it that so many of you are impressed with players who played on teams that never won anything? We need players who have experienced winning. The really good college players try to get in a top program in college so they can compete at the highest level and play with other players who want to win a championship. Of the 3 picks only Dumars last pick put his ass on the line and attempted that type of thing and he ended up being on a championship team. Dumars didn't pick winners in this draft except for one guy SIVAIf . So the other two have a lot to prove before I will get excited about anything. Remember Larry Bird who played on that Indiana State team? He took them to the NCAA Finals. He turned a scrub team into a winning team. Did those first two draft selections last night do anything to improve their teams last season? Dumars could have taken Burke who was a proven winner and sure made his team better. His trade value was off the charts as well. But Joe decided to gamble again much like he did with Darko and Rodney White. I hope this time things turn out better for us fans and the Piston organization. Do those first two selections Joe made hate losing more than anything. If not, then they will be good company for Stuckey.

[cool breeze]

After not appearing on any draft boards Solomon Hill goes to a good Indiana team in the first round last night. I am so happy for this guy. As they say in Special Forces Ranger School, "Just do the right thing". That is what this guy did in his career in college. He sucked it up and did what his coach asked of him. He battled much bigger power forwards for this last two seasons when other younger players failed to hold their own in game situations. Yet he wanted to show how talented of a small forward he could be so that he could be drafted in the first round yet kept his mouth shut for the good of the team. All the experts counted him out except for one smart organization. This is what the Pacers GM Kevin Pritchard told reporters about their 23rd draft pick. "We like that he positioned down. I'm not sure he can defend a four in the NBA, but what we really like is that he can defend a three, two and one". Pritchard went on to say that he often talked with Hill's coach Sean Miller during the season and coach Miller kept telling him to watch the games and you will see that Hill is a winner, "an absolute winner". Pritchard said " we think he will fit our culture perfectly that way" and went on to state that he believes Hill will in the rotation right away. I am only writing this because I am so impressed with how Indiana does business. They do the right thing following certain players for an entire season closely and checking in with the players college coaches to make sure they do not miss anything. The Pacers are looking for guys who are team orientated guys who only care about winning. And they were the only team that picked up on Hill's assets and what he brings to a team. I have felt the same way about Hill for a long time and it is just great that a GM saw the same thing that I did.

[Sebastian]

Oracle, that was one great summation of last nights draft; the comparison of last years starting frontline vs. the possible frontline this coming season, as it relates to speed and athleticism, was truly exceptional. Last years team looked like their fast break was fueled by Geritol but, now we have a Red Bull fueled team, up and down the Palace floor. As much as Gores loves entertainment, he's got to be considering giving Joe a reprieve, after this draft.

Sebastian, sometime you leave me scratching my head with your suggestions and thoughts on what path the team should follow, and KC-P was one of the head scratchers; after looking at the big picture (and not the picture-in-the-picture), fully digesting what our overwhelming needs were, and the fact that this kid addresses those needs, my hat's off to you brother! I've got to acknowledge your incredible insight, and the staunch support you gave this young man all the way. Hell of a call bro'.

Murph, I can relate to the shock you're experiencing with the passing of Burke, in favor of KC-P but, once you step back and look at it with an open mind, you'll see Joe clearly demonstrating he has a pair; his statement about this "not being a popularity contest" was a little off center and cold but, remember he's been out of the media spotlight for a while. Allan Houston was a one trick pony? Think back, honestly, where we might have been if he remained a Piston, playing alongside Grant Hill, instead of Lindsey Hunter. Wouldn't it have been better for us if Hunter had gone to New York and signed the big contract instead of Houston? This kid Pope is a keeper and I think we'll all come to love what he does in a Pistons uniform.

We're in the hunt for the best PG that money can buy, and we've got money to spend and good/decent players to trade (Stuckey and Jerebko) to get him. I've heard Bledsoe's name mentioned, I've been shouting about Vasquez, and then there's always the possibility of bringing back Calderon, until the wheels fall off of him; this is where Joe & Mo show just how much they're on the same page, when a direction is decided on. Do they bring in a PG, or do they develop (truly develop) Knight?

Rasheed is going to be on the bench? Outstanding! We get him in every practice, with the big men, teaching the fundamentals that made him such a force, in his day, and Mahorn, a floating fixture, in and out of the gym, poking fun, dropping knowledge, and generally giving the team an added taste of championship mental toughness (Joe, Mo, Sheed, and Mahorn were all champions), I expect team chemistry to develop very quickly. It just gets better and better, as we go. This seems to be better than having Laimbeer coaching the team.

DX, truth be told, Joe earned back some stripes, last night. He maintained a laser focus on the guys that he wanted and he snatched them up. Joe did not get caught up in all the tossing around of players, like Dallas, Minnesota (although Flip had a good night, too), and stupid ass Philly (trading an All-Star PG [Dre Holiday] for the young and currently broken Nerlens Noel, who looked mighty dejected when he was not selected #1.

Yeah, Joe is building a family at the Palace. Joe hired a coach, who lead a Moses and Doc to the Title in '83. A guy, who is still in the top 10 in steals and assist. Knight will do well under the guidance of Mo' Cheeks. Adding 'Sheed to the bench is a fuckin' coup! (Please pardon my language, but I am a bit excited.)

WE should be able to add Al-Farouq Aminu to the family without any problem and without great expense. I still would like to see Kendrick Perkins added to roster.
Moving Charlie V. and the Ukraine should get this done. I know, Perkins is the worst offensive starter in League, but WE could use his toughness to back-up Dre Drummond and Perkins would be a good practice partner to go against Dre Drummond to harden the Brama Bull up for the foes that he will be facing night after night. And, Perkins 6 fouls may come in handy, as well.

Then WE roll with OUR new family for 2-4 years and see where WE can go.

PG- Knight/Stuckey/Silva
SG- KCP/Middleton/English
SF- Aminu/Mitchell/Singler
PF- Moose/Jerebko
C- Dre/Perkins

This is roster than can grow together and money will be available to resign/extend Moose, B. Knight, and Dre, when the time comes; also, resign Stuckey after he wins the 6th-man of the Year award, next season. Other predictions:

1. Knight becomes a more reliable and steady PG.
2. KCP becomes the ROY.
3. Aminu becomes the Most Improved Player.
4. Moose makes the All-Star team.
5. Dre becomes a more steady and unstoppable force.
6. And, like I said, before Stuckey becomes a serious candidate, if not the winner of the 6th-man Award.
7. And, Mo' Cheeks wins Coach of the Year.
8. WE make a deep run into the second round, next year at worst.

The one thing that the aforementioned roster will need is for two players to become dominant leaders. Those two players are Moose and Stuckey. I would make both, captains.

This is a nice ass roster.

[Oracle]

At first I was shocked, I couldn't believe what I heard when we came off the clock! Later, it sank in, and I think that those that keep wondering "Why" will come to see the logic!

What you should be asking is why all of those GM's passed on Burke? If his talent was so great, how could 7 GM's pass on him? Now that's a good question, but an even better one is this...

Why did all of those GM's pass on ANY of the top 3 PG's, with one being called a "Franchise" PG? Either we're super smart, or everybody who's paid to make these decisions, who's jobs are on the line, are stupid! How far would Burke have fallen if he artificially hadn't been taken off the board at 9?

Note: as I'm typing this Goodwill Tweets:
@vgoodwill: Now the conversation about Trey Burke turns to unrealistic. Multiple picks in a "bad draft"? Funny

If you actually look at the situation, Joe didn't pass on Burke, Joe passed on point guards PERIOD!!! It obviously had nothing to do with Burke!

Obviously Joe believes that he will solve his PG problems in one of two ways! Use his money to address the situation while developing knight as his PG of the future, or trading knight for a superior PG!

The bottom line is that drafting yet another PG means 3-4 years before that PG is good enough for a playoff team, and we need a playoff team this year... Joe just Bitch Slapped Us, and we needed it!

I don't see the clippers giving up Bledsoe unless a PG is included in the deal, and Joe has a stock of good PG's with potential with Stuckey & Knight! Those two should net you some solid playoff caliber talent!

I'm not saying I want to trade Knight, I don't! I don't want to quit my job either, but I'm willing to entertain offers that I can't refuse... it's BUSINESS!

Besides, Burke is quick, but he isn't fast or athletic and he's useless on defense compared to the dudes we drafted! Drafting him produces instability, not stability and also instantly makes the PG position our weakest link in a year that we HAVE to make the playoffs.

NONE of the rookies drafted will have much of an impact next season... WAKE UP!!!

This talk of they better be this or that is silly! Wise, the guys you brought up weren't those guys in their rookie year... Please! That's your hurt feelings talking, not your basketball brain, and I know you know better!

Don, Joe explained what he did and why, and that two pick case wouldn't have made any sense! He had his goal, and he hit it, why would he do anything else?

This was a GREAT draft for the future and with luck, some of these guys will be able to come off the bench in garbage time, and maybe more late in the season... sorry if that bursts any balloons! We can, and we should fantasize about what they will be able to do, but unless somebody truly is a budding superstar, it won't be next season!

The real test is what Joe does with the money, that's where the action is, and also where any new starters will come from! Bledsoe has proven that he needs to start somewhere, all he needs is a shot!

Joe is likely targeting starting PG's & SG's, but backup bigs!

There are more shoes to drop....

[cool breeze]

But I have to admit, as I log on this morning, Tony Mitchell is a pleasant surprise.  He could very easily develop into a tough, highly athletic, starting SF, with Singler coming off the bench.  In fact, in many ways, I prefer Tony Mitchell to Anthony Bennett, who for some reason went #1.  Excellent pick, Joe.

And I like Siva at #56.  He's a tough kid also.



But I still can't get over the fact that Joe passed on a franchise PG....AGAIN.  I can't help but think we're going to regret passing on Burke for the next 12 or 15 years.

And I don't like Joe's quote, "This is not a popularity contest."   Not a popularity contest???  Well, Joe, if it's not a popularity contest, then maybe Gores should replace your sorry ass, because the only reason you're stilll GM of the Pistons is because you were popular in Detroit.  

Murph Dumars better hope that KCP does not turn out to be another Rodney White or it will cost him his job this time.

[cool breeze]

1St pick:
My feeling as the Piston's first pick was announced was why KCP? This was true especially after the Timberwolves drafted Burke on the next pick and it was immediately announced that Utah was willing to give two first round picks to obtain Burke. Did Dumars and his staff know what the GM knew in Minn.? If so, then Detroit could have drafted two quality shooting guards in Muhammad and Crabbe. Detroit needs more athletic skilled players. Muhammad has the entire package relating to shooting ability. He has the short range game and the long range skill. And he has the strong body to score inside. Crabbe is an amazing scorer like Muhammad and has both the short range game and great outside shooting ability especially when it counts at the end of games. Both Muhammad and Crabbe are clutch players. Meanwhile, KCP has a huge weakness relating to short range quickness and explosiveness. He prefers to jack it up from the outside instead of having the awareness or confidence of exploring openings to the basket. He has a negative assist to turnover ratio 1.8:2. He also played in a extremely weak conference on a weak team- remember Rodney White anyone?? Crabbe and Muhammad played on tough competitive teams with tough coaches. UCLA won the PAC12 conference championship. KCP can run the floor fast and has good defensive ability which must have been the deciding factor for Dumars. But what if Dumars didn't know that if he had drafted Burke he could have had two first round draft picks? How did the GM for Minn. know that and Joe Didn't? How many GMS would give that up considering the Pistons need for more talented players at every position?? I will pull for KCP to become a reliable player but am not confident this will happen. My guess is that Middleton will beat him out for that starting guard spot unless Dumars makes a trade for a vet shooter. I think that this pick was based on hope and prayer and worry that Joe didn't look at the competition KCP faced in college.

2nd Pick:
Tony Mitchell was listed as a first rounder on a lot of draft boards. This is another pick that might turn sour because Tony didn't play against high caliber competition in the Sun Belt Conference. He was extremely turn over prone while playing in that conference Piston fans. Still there is a mystery about this man. What I like about him is that he is active without the basketball and he makes great cuts to the basket to get open. Mitchell has a lot to learn but has the potential to become effective for Detroit.

3rd pick:

Out of all Piston selections, I like this pick the best. Siva is a solid smart basketball player. Now we might not see Bynum in a Piston uniform as well. Siva is a good defender and play maker. Excellent job here!

[WTF]

I'm not extremely distraught over Joe passing on Burke just feel he didn't make the best choice with that pick. It wasn't a bad pick just not that best pick IMO  

All I know is this kid better come out blazing like the next Ray Allen or Micheal Redd with the energy and stamina of Rip Hamilton and big time game winning ability and super-stardom of Reggie Miller. I hope this is what Joe sees in Pope that made him willing to pass on Burke.

I've felt strongly about Burke and Burke certainly felt Joe was about to call his name let hope this doesn't come back to hunt him. Burke was potentially the next Thomas  

[deusXango]

Oracle, that was one great summation of last nights draft; the comparison of last years starting frontline vs. the possible frontline this coming season, as it relates to speed and athleticism, was truly exceptional. Last years team looked like their fast break was fueled by Geritol but, now we have a Red Bull fueled team, up and down the Palace floor. As much as Gores loves entertainment, he's got to be considering giving Joe a reprieve, after this draft.

Sebastian, sometime you leave me scratching my head with your suggestions and thoughts on what path the team should follow, and KC-P was one of the head scratchers; after looking at the big picture (and not the picture-in-the-picture), fully digesting what our overwhelming needs were, and the fact that this kid addresses those needs, my hat's off to you brother! I've got to acknowledge your incredible insight, and the staunch support you gave this young man all the way. Hell of a call bro'.

Murph, I can relate to the shock you're experiencing with the passing of Burke, in favor of KC-P but, once you step back and look at it with an open mind, you'll see Joe clearly demonstrating he has a pair; his statement about this "not being a popularity contest" was a little off center and cold but, remember he's been out of the media spotlight for a while. Allan Houston was a one trick pony? Think back, honestly, where we might have been if he remained a Piston, playing alongside Grant Hill, instead of Lindsey Hunter. Wouldn't it have been better for us if Hunter had gone to New York and signed the big contract instead of Houston? This kid Pope is a keeper and I think we'll all come to love what he does in a Pistons uniform.

We're in the hunt for the best PG that money can buy, and we've got money to spend and good/decent players to trade (Stuckey and Jerebko) to get him. I've heard Bledsoe's name mentioned, I've been shouting about Vasquez, and then there's always the possibility of bringing back Calderon, until the wheels fall off of him; this is where Joe & Mo show just how much they're on the same page, when a direction is decided on. Do they bring in a PG, or do they develop (truly develop) Knight?

Rasheed is going to be on the bench? Outstanding! We get him in every practice, with the big men, teaching the fundamentals that made him such a force, in his day, and Mahorn, a floating fixture, in and out of the gym, poking fun, dropping knowledge, and generally giving the team an added taste of championship mental toughness (Joe, Mo, Sheed, and Mahorn were all champions), I expect team chemistry to develop very quickly. It just gets better and better, as we go. This seems to be better than having Laimbeer coaching the team.

[Murph]

You know who Caldwell-Pope reminds me of?...not Rip...but a poor man's Allan Houston.  And I always considered Houston to be a one dimensional jump shooter.  

I do like KCP's rebounding numbers at Georgia.

Oh well...it's not Calwell-Pope's fault that Joe passed on Burke.  I should get over it, and hope for the best.


And it could always be worse.  We could have the Cavs' GM.  Who is that boob anyway?  Tristan Thompson???  Dion Waiters???  Anthony Benett???  Geesh.  That guy's an idiot.

[Murph]

But I have to admit, as I log on this morning, Tony Mitchell is a pleasant surprise.  He could very easily develop into a tough, highly athletic, starting SF, with Singler coming off the bench.  In fact, in many ways, I prefer Tony Mitchell to Anthony Bennett, who for some reason went #1.  Excellent pick, Joe.

And I like Siva at #56.  He's a tough kid also.



But I still can't get over the fact that Joe passed on a franchise PG....AGAIN.  I can't help but think we're going to regret passing on Burke for the next 12 or 15 years.

And I don't like Joe's quote, "This is not a popularity contest."   Not a popularity contest???  Well, Joe, if it's not a popularity contest, then maybe Gores should replace your sorry ass, because the only reason you're stilll GM of the Pistons is because you were popular in Detroit.  

[Oracle]

So it could turn out to be a GRAND SLAM!!!!

Wow, what a draft by a dude we almost left by the road for dead!

First a shout out to DX for that GREAT post he made! DX, I loved your honest reflection on the draft and Joe! If Joe keeps this up, we may have to pass the plate to buy that dude a Krispy Cream franchise!

Joe proved beyond a doubt he's one great basketball mind tonight! In one night, he showed us the future, and how he's learned from the past!

1. Brandon Knight - Joe made a stupid mistake in trading away Afflalo, a hard worker and budding star, he showed tonight that he won't blow it with Knight! He may not be sure if Knight will ever be the PG he needs, but he knows that Knight is a player with great heart, determination, and more importantly skill!

Adding additional speed and skill around Knight does a few things. Firstly, Knight's assists will rise dramatically as the shooters magically improve his assist numbers. Imagine where Chauncey's assists would have been without Mr. Automatic, RIP Hamilton. PG's need alpha scorers!

Additionally, Joe recognized that BK7 has exceptional speed, so he also surrounded him with guys that have near equivalent speed! With Drummond, KCP & Knight in a starting lineup, the speed is off the hook on the fast break, and all 3 possess great athleticism... that's an exciting group, especially when you add Mitchel to the mix!

Compare that group to playing with Monroe, Prince & Maxiell... Yikes, now that's a career killer !

But Knight isn't home free yet! Joe's job is on the line, and Joe has interest in Bledsoe, which would immediately take Knight out of the starting lineup and coming off the bench! Knight isn't at Bledsoe's level yet, and I think he could accept that move!

2. KCP - He actually does make Stuckey obsolete at this point! He'll take some time to pick up the system, but since Cheeks is using a new system, everybody will sort of be in the same boat! But shooting doesn't change, the court is the same size, as is the basket, you just need to learn how to clear space to get that shot off, and we always seem to be able to free someone up for an open shot!

Ok, we all wanted Burke except for Seb(smart call Seb), who turned out to be right on the money! Joe took a big risk, but it looks like a great call because he was smarter than we were! While we and everybody else in the basketball world was focused on point guards, nobody with an NBA team was! The first team to take a PG was right after us, and they didn't even want him(Burke)!

3. Mitchel - I confess I haven't see one second of this dude in a real game, but I've seen the highlights, the measurements and heard the hype and it all sounds good. But those can fool you! But when Drummond & Monroe, who were totally quiet all night suddenly jumped up and yelled "Steal Pick", I knew there was something there! We are now a VERY athletic and fast team, and that's a HUGE change from the past!

What's odd is that at 6'9 he's listed as a SG(Prospect Profile)! They say he could play and defend all 5 positions, which shows that his athletics is off the hook, but IMO, he would be a BEASTLY 3 that could legitimately play the 4 as well!

4. Siva - DX nailed it when he called him the "Louisville pest"! He is going to be great coming off the bench because he'll play defense and can also score when needed! I hated him in the title game, but still admired his talent! We didn't get Burke but we got the guard that beat Burke!

As I said, Joe is round 3rd, and by that I mean that if he nails the FA/Trading, he'll have hit a GRAND SLAM!

The best way to evaluate how much you like a draft is to ask yourself if you would put anybody back! I don't want to, I love all 3 picks!

Fantastic job Joe... Go Pistons!!!

[deusXango]

Joe Dumars reads this forum; good for Joe! Last nights drafting by the Pistons blew my mind; I can't remember the last time when they put their picks to such good use. Joe addressed a lot of needs, made the best possible picks every time IMO, and demonstrated that he is indeed a great basketball mind.

I wanted Trey Burke so bad that I was blinded to numerous team needs and made erroneous judgments; that's what being a homer did to me. Welcome Mr. Caldwell-Pope! KC-P is coming to a team that ranked at the bottom of the barrel in long range shooting and efficiency; T-Burke, as the primary ball handler, couldn't be expected to bring those numbers up by himself or in tandem with our potential shooters, without being a ball hog. This pick takes Knight out of the running for starting as a SG, and makes Stuckey obsolete (trade bait), as a high scorer. Suddenly with Knight, Middleton, English, and the addition of KC-P, the Pistons seem set with capable wing shooters. We can see a turn around in those abysmal numbers, and more ball sharing.

I'd been beating the drum for Cody Zeller all week, because of the perceived fit with Monroe and Drummond; his size, speed, and athleticism made him the perfect fit to spell the two big men who are the foundation of the team. The flaw in that (even though it makes sense) is using a lottery pick for a bench player; we hit the jackpot with Tony Mitchell!! He may be more athletic than Zeller, he's certainly stronger, and means more (intimidation wise) to completing the three-headed monster in the middle that I imagined. There's a big difference between #4 and #37 in terms of money and commitment; with proper coaching, we may very well find that we have a superior player than the one who went #1 in the draft. Maxiell shouldn't be coming back, Jerebko is now obsolete (trade bait), and CV is now a high priced 12th man (like Maggette last year). Josh Smith is no longer an option that I can champion to come here, and this was all made possible by an astute decision at #37; it seems that Joe can think on his feet.

I lived in fear of MC-W coming here (as was widely advertised) and held out hope that we take McCallum at #37 but, when he went #36 I didn't know what to do; at #56 Joe took Payton Siva, the "Louisville pest." This is a player, PG at that, I can see sticking to the team for damn near every reason other than shooting; this is the anti-Will Bynum. He's bigger, plays pesky defense, makes sound decisions with the ball, and cheaper to boot. He's a team first player, and that's refreshing.

What Joe does with the CAP money this summer, when the pursuit of free agents begin in earnest, I have every confidence that he won't duplicate the mistakes he made the last time he went FA shopping. It's over, I'm excited, and I think I'll go to bed and get some rest.

[WTF]

Okay I like the Siva pick up because I didn't think he would last that long. I like 4 years guys he has to be fundamentally strong.

[Oracle]

@Keith_Langlois: Starting Summer League lineup: 5-Drummond; 4-Mitchell; 3-Middleton; 2-English/KCP; 1-Siva

@Keith_Langlois: About 60 NBA scouts attended N Texas vs. Lehigh to see Mitchell & McCollum. McCollum missed game (foot), Mitchell didn't start.

@Keith_Langlois: Pistons open Summer League play in Orlando on Sunday, July 7. Assume NBA-TV will carry, or stream, at least.

[Sparma]

I would have taken Burke once he slid, but if KCP really can both shoot and play D he'll be a valuable addition on a roster built around Drummond. Nice that both Drummond and Monroe jumped in enthusiastically on the Mitchell pick. Siva's fiery and fast, but a long shot (notably, Chad Ford called the pick in advance); it's amazing that trading Alex Acker years ago could deliver that possibility.

Joe's future remains in jeapardy, but he's given himself and the team a shot, depending on he can get done over the summer.

[Sebastian]

Peyton Siva (6'0" PG), a discount to resigning Will B. Another good pick. Joe took his Thursday afternoon nap in a Red Roof Inn:

#8 KCP, #37 Tony Mitchell, and #56 Peyton Siva

Great job, Joe!

[Oracle]

Peyton Siva!

A little small, but looked good in the final four!

[Sebastian]

Man how sweet would that be with Sheed on the bench with Cheeks. Man I'm loving this almost take away some of the pain of not drafting Burke

I'm not a Twitter guy, but if this is true and comes to fruition, it would be a hell of an addition!

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