Rebuilding

A lot does depend on Drummond, Don. We agree on that. I actually think they can rebuild, even with both Andre and Blake, if they're absolutely committed to go with the youth around them. Blake's deal no longer looks interminable with a couple years left after this season. My guess is that he comes back next year as a pretty good player, maybe 17 ppg and a leader. If so, a team might be willing to take him on as an expiring contract the year after next.

I see Gores as the biggest problem. I just don't see him having a commitment to long term planning, even now.

cool breeze wrote:

Sparma wrote:Vince Ellis reports that the team's reluctant to trade Rose unless they get a really sweet deal because they want to have a "competitive" team next year.

With Gores hovering, it looks like this win as soon as possible mentality that prevents long term planning is going to go on and on.

Stefanski seems to have a long term vision but his owner's in the way.

Sparma you wrote this post while I was writing mine. Note my thought about AD's options. His best option might be to play for one more season with Detroit not because he wants to but because that might be his best option money wise. If that is the case, then maybe the owner is correct. No rebuild is possible unless the Pistons move AD. It just delays the process one more year. It is a long shot that Blake will return to his former self. The Pistons have never won with AD playing center. But to trade Rose if our two money consuming players are still on board will really make the owner look silly because the Pistons will suck more without Rose than with him. Moving AD incredibly important yet almost impossible. Which playoff team wants to make a trade for AD and hope he won't ruin that team's chemistry. It is not that AD is not a good rebounder. How will he impact team chemistry for a team that is already competitive? It all goes back to overall basketball IQ as to how a player coming in on a trade can positively impact an already above average team. I imagine that AD would be worried as to if he might screw up the works on another high achieving team. AD is used to playing on losing low basketball IQ teams. Damn it all we are condemned to below average the way I see it but i hope that I am wrong and posters like Murph and dX are right. The absolute worst thing that can happen is signing AD to a new contract. This owner has a long history of going against the experts. That is why he is still the butt of  a lot of jokes when experts talk about the Blake Griffin trade.

Sparma wrote:Vince Ellis reports that the team's reluctant to trade Rose unless they get a really sweet deal because they want to have a "competitive" team next year.

With Gores hovering, it looks like this win as soon as possible mentality that prevents long term planning is going to go on and on.

Stefanski seems to have a long term vision but his owner's in the way.

Sparma you wrote this post while I was writing mine. Note my thought about AD's options. His best option might be to play for one more season with Detroit not because he wants to but because that might be his best option money wise. If that is the case, then maybe the owner is correct. No rebuild is possible unless the Pistons move AD. It just delays the process one more year. It is a long shot that Blake will return to his former self. The Pistons have never won with AD playing center. But to trade Rose if our two money consuming players are still on board will really make the owner look silly because the Pistons will suck more without Rose than with him. Moving AD incredibly important yet almost impossible. Which playoff team wants to make a trade for AD and hope he won't ruin that team's chemistry. It is not that AD is not a good rebounder. How will he impact team chemistry for a team that is already competitive? It all goes back to overall basketball IQ as to how a player coming in on a trade can positively impact an already above average team. I imagine that AD would be worried as to if he might screw up the works on another high achieving team. AD is used to playing on losing low basketball IQ teams. Damn it all we are condemned to below average the way I see it but i hope that I am wrong and posters like Murph and dX are right. The absolute worst thing that can happen is signing AD to a new contract. This owner has a long history of going against the experts. That is why he is still the butt of a lot of jokes when experts talk about the Blake Griffin trade.

I just checked out as many trade rumors as I could find and came up with zero chance that the Pistons will end up trading Drummond. Perhaps Drummond's best decision would be to exercise his option and make the $28Mil next season. AD just doesn't fit the mold of a player who takes up $28M or more. Like I have always said, AD's overall value to any NBA team might not exceed $12Mil or less regardless of the fact that he is an outstanding rebounder. Other factors are involved that any GM must consider on how AD's overall game will affect a NBA team. His dismal performance in the playoffs last spring will be a reminder to those teams who have in the past thought of making a trade with Detroit for AD. You simply need to have a high overall basketball IQ to command the top tier salary category in the NBA. No owner can make a player into a star just by handing that player a large amount of money. Take Memphis for example which was mentioned as a trade partner involving AD. They are creating a team that has great team chemistry even though they are a very young team. All of their players who get playing time are all in all of the time. They are not part time players looking for stats. Those young kids want to win and show it with the energy they provide on the court. If AD cam aboard making $20 to 35 mil a season, how would that set with the young players who play hard and smart now in their early days as NBA players? Will they want to play as hard if their center slacks off for portions of games, is late getting back in transition or causing a turnover trying out his dribbling on that move from the baseline 8 feet from the basket? He gets the ball stolen on that move more times than not. He does it because he cannot figure out how to shoot a jump shot effectively. How can you be an ISO MAN if you don't have enough tools in the tool shed? Why hasn't the coaching staff said please don't do that anymore?

I have read all the positive posts and pleas to re sign our All Star center by AD fans on this forum for a long time and am still puzzled.But it is only natural to build up an emotional attachment with players they have watched for a long period of time. My emotion went to Stanley Johnson, Rodney Knight, Middleton and at times Henry Ellenson. Now I like Wood playing in the front court but we do need big athletic defensive monster to guard the paint in coming years when the Pistons come up from the ashes. There will be some great athletes available in the drafts. If the Pistons can just stay away from large contracts, and lose while rebuilding a new team fans will respect management more than they do now. AD will slow that process and no effort would be made to secure an exceptional defensive minded athletic cardio fit center if he is resigned. Unfortunately, his value is extremely low as I have predicted for the last 3 seasons. He might just stay and collect a huge pay check next season. That might be his best offer in free agency unless Piston management makes another big mistake by putting all their eggs in one basket blowing all their cash in front court slow pokes. Please don't make that mistake. Also, although AD is still a young guy his legs are not young. He has a lot of NBA seasons behind him. Big guys who carry a lot of weight to not have longevity in the NBA as a rule.

Meanwhile congrats to Sevi. All he needed was playing time that he didn't get last season.

I am mixed relating to trading Rose who has been the most positive thing that has happened in Piston Land. He is a great influence on the young guys.Rose plays hard on both ends of the floor and young players see that just as other young players we have had in the past saw Reggie Jackson taking time off on defense. If AD exercises his option for one more year for $28 mil there can be no rebuild for next season. If that happens then the Pistons should keep Rose and hope Blake can become an effective player again and try to win as many games as possible. But if Detroit can score in a trade with AD and Galloway then trading Rose is a no brainer as we are looking at 3 to 6 years before the Pistons will be capable of becoming a strong NBA team again. Winning again big can happen with patience and commitment to a real rebuild. Is the owner strong enough to do it? It would really be fun to watch a total commitment to rebuild though the draft. I would be extremely excited as a fan as would many.

Vince Ellis reports that the team's reluctant to trade Rose unless they get a really sweet deal because they want to have a "competitive" team next year.

With Gores hovering, it looks like this win as soon as possible mentality that prevents long term planning is going to go on and on.

Stefanski seems to have a long term vision but his owner's in the way.

Ballin and others great job. I was watching the Memphis game and couldn't help but laugh when Dillon Brooks completely humiliated Reggie Jackson. In the past Piston management would go to the Chicago combine and determine who their picks would be for the most part. Their scouts were 2nd rate at best as well. You can't determine a player's worth by seeing how high he can jump. When I looked at the draft board and saw Brooks available in the 2nd round I couldn't believe it. This guy had proved himself to the world as a college player. He was a fantastic leader, passer, clutch shooter and gritty defender who put his Oregon team on his shoulders to the point where they almost won the championship even with a long list of injuries to his teammates. Brooks was clearly a real basketball player who had heart and hated to lose. He goes in the 2nd round. Meanwhile Alonzo Trier was another clutch player on his team but went unnoticed and was not drafted at all. Hats off to the professionals who drafted Brooks. Meanwhile we had SVG and his butt buddy holding the GM title prancing around together at the Chicago combine the same place where Joe Dumars found his gem in the rough, Jason Maxiell and used an important pick on him.

Brooks had Reggie Jackson for lunch. But if anyone could stay awake at the end of that game, did you notice that the Pistons had nobody who could guard any point guard, 2 guard or small forward on the floor in crunch time. The game was close until the last 5 minutes. But the Pistons had Jackson, Galloway and Rose out there playing at the same time and even inserted our first round pick for a couple of minutes taking out Morris. What a dysfunctional group on defense. I was thinking great job because the Pistons need to keep losing to have any hope in the draft. The draft should be the top priority for this owner now and I think Mr. Gores finally might be in agreement.

It is time for Piston management to kick ass and take names in this next draft and the following two years as well. Three years of smart decision making and the Pistons could be back in the picture when talking about having a competitive basketball team in the playoffs. Regular season games are deceiving in many ways as the Pistons found out they they played the Bucks in the playoffs last season. Detroit needs to draft players who were the guts of their college teams. They need the type of players who opposing teams and their coaches were trying to stop in high pressure situations in those college games. I look at our number one pick who is only getting playing time because he was our number one pick last year. This guy is a project. He would have to fight his ass off to get any playing time in a good college program. Things are changing with the younger kids coming up. I have noticed with Arizona for example that Nico Mannion and Zeke Nnaji were ahead of most players in the PAC12 in development in all areas. However, in the early part of the season both were average at best defenders. Now both have become much better defenders at mid season. It is the veteran older players who are making the big mistakes not them. Both players are going to be really good NBA players. They both have the look of a fighter or a guy who hates to lose and who can elevate their games in critical parts of the game. The NBA players who specialize in getting stats always fail when it comes to making winning plays at critical points in games. The Piston GM and owner needs to identify this ingredient and never pick any player who doesn't show that they have that special gift. In the NBA, those are the players who become the most successful. Remember Zeke when he played for Indiana? He was the force and the Piston's GM at the time knew he had hit the jackpot when Isiah Thomas was not drafted number one overall that year. So Dillon Brooks was off the radar for the Pistons and every other NBA team in his draft season. How stupid they were for not paying attention to what actually goes on in these college games. How many times has our number one pick put his former team on his shoulders and somehow become a super hero? The fans at Oregon will never forget Dillon Brooks. I doubt Reggie Jackson will forget either.

BallinD, excellent, excellent post on rebuilding, I didn't know you had it in you LOL, (you're so brief in your comments). I enjoyed your efforts to include the Athletic article and make your usual astute comments. Damn, I hope and pray that Big Ed has a solid plan cooking and he has finally harnessed the Jackass aka Tom Gores.

*Do not resign Reggie Jackson or Langston Galloway; we don't need a teachers pet and professional patient on the Pistons.

My off the wall dream for a Drummond replacement and rotation; "Boogie" Cousins would come dirt cheap compared to what Dre is asking and would relish the opportunity to be returned to a starting role. Hopefully he's matured and is humbled enough to be an asset. Until Griffin has healed sufficiently enough to start, play Wood at PF and King at SF. Draft Tyrese Haliburton and give him the ball and start Svi at SG. Bone, Brown, Maker, Thomas, Sekou, and Scrubb make a damn good bench, depending on what FA's the brain trust manages to sign. Rebuild is underway.

Humpty Dumpty Sat on the wall.

James Edwards of the Athletic

Pistons trade tiers: Who's likely on the move? And is a rebuild finally upon us?
With the NBA’s trade deadline inching closer and conversations among competing organizations set to intensify, questions about the Pistons’ future still remain.
I can tell you this with 100 percent certainty, though: Detroit is interested in rebuilding. Of course, it takes two to tango.
The lack of a trade, and the overuse of some veteran players in recent weeks, has led to some wondering if the Pistons were standing pat in hopes of making a desperate push for one of the final Eastern Conference playoff spots. That is not the case. Instead, it appears that Detroit is strategically waiting for the final days leading up to the Feb. 6 deadline in order to put itself in a position to get the best return(s) possible.
Peeling back the layers, there was no need to get a deal done weeks before the deadline. Now in the final days and hours, teams may be more desperate or be willing to give up more to get a deal done. There was no sense in acting on a trade weeks out just because it was available. Detroit’s decision-makers have a duty to try and get the best return possible.
Now that we’ve laid all of that out, let’s dive into the Pistons’ trade chips, putting them into tiers that suggest the likeliness of them being dealt.
(Note: Not every player on the roster is listed, because I believe some are insignificant in deals.)
The most logical moves
Andre Drummond: Drummond’s availability is no secret. The 26-year-old center has been the subject of many trade rumors since Jan. 1, and the franchise hasn’t changed its mind on shopping him.
Not surprisingly, Drummond won’t be easy to move — not for the price the Pistons are looking for, at least. Not only is he a traditional center who is having a bit of a down year, but he has stated he plans to forgo his $28.7 million player option for next season in order to test free agency. No team with sense is going to give up a first-round pick or talented young player for a traditional center, especially one who might only be a two-month rental. Of course, a package deal could change the return, but I’m only looking through the scope of a single-player deal.
If Drummond is traded, I see the Pistons settling for a single asset, perhaps a second-round pick or iffy young prospect. I get the sense the franchise doesn’t want to hold onto him. Drummond isn’t likely to opt into his contract — he has until late June to do so — but given the lack of interest in him around the league, I wouldn’t be surprised if he changed course and took the payday.
Derrick Rose: Per several sources, the 31-year-old Rose — aside from one or two young players — is considered to be Detroit’s best asset at the deadline. The former MVP has scored 20-plus points for 13 straight games, which he’s never done before in his career. Playoff-contending teams have shown interest in Rose, but there’s a sense the Pistons, who don’t want to be a laughing stock during a rebuild, won’t trade him just to do it. They’ll want value — a first-round pick or an intriguing young prospect — to consider moving him.
I think Detroit will get something that it likes by the deadline, but if it doesn’t, it won’t be because the team didn’t listen to offers. The Pistons will have the summer to peruse offers or keep him as an effective veteran presence on what will likely be a young team.
Langston Galloway: Galloway is a 39.7 percent 3-point shooter who tries on defense and is on an expiring deal. All signs point to him being on the trade block, even though the 28-year-old is valued in Detroit as an ultimate professional. The 76ers have expressed some interest, per a source. I don’t think Galloway would bring the same return in a trade as Reggie Bullock did last year (Detroit got Svi Mykhailiuk and a 2021 second-round draft pick), but I could see the Pistons earning a second-round pick for him.
Markieff Morris: Much like Galloway, Morris is a veteran, gritty player with an above-average 3-ball. He could be beneficial to one of the NBA’s more elite teams. Morris, who has a $3.36 million player option for next year, would likely bring back a second-round pick in a single-player trade.
Could be traded…
Luke Kennard: This is where things get spicy. Before knee tendinitis sidelined him, Kennard was averaging a career-high 15.8 points and 4.1 assists while shooting 39.9 percent from 3 on a decent number of attempts. He has been considered part of the Pistons’ future. Yet a source said Kennard, who is guaranteed $5.2 million next season, has been made available in trade discussions.
Kennard has been injured every season since joining the NBA in 2017, and the Pistons soon have to decide whether they’re willing to pay him what he’ll likely command as a restricted free agent. He’s proven to be an effective offensive player, but his defense is still a concern. When you couple the injury history with his defensive deficiencies, it’s not out of the realm of possibilities for the Pistons to consider trading him over paying him.
Mykhailiuk has blossomed into a useful rotational piece, and both he and Kennard have some overlap in their games, though the latter is more polished and proven. Mykhailiuk has a minimal $1.66 million team option for next season and could possibly be had for a cheaper price than Kennard, who could bring back a solid return in a trade, when he finally does hit restricted free agency.
Finally: It’s possible Detroit could couple Drummond and Kennard together in a trade in order to bring back a grander return before the deadline.
I’m not saying Kennard will get traded, but consider this your warning in the event that he does.
Christian Wood: Wood is a young, intriguing big man on a vet-minimum deal. Teams around the NBA have seen his transformation this year. Wood looks to be part of the Pistons’ future in some capacity, but they will have to pay him this summer, and maybe they don’t want to give up what other teams are willing to. If that is the case, securing an asset now for his services could be the move.
I don’t see it happening, but, again, it wouldn’t surprise me.
Not going anywhere
Blake Griffin: This doesn’t really require yet another explanation. Griffin, a six-time All-Star, is likely done for the season after knee surgery.
Bruce Brown: The second-year guard, who has established himself as an effective on-ball defender and improving offensive player, appears to be someone the front office likes and is interested in nurturing. I don’t see him being traded.
Mykhailiuk: See the Kennard section. Mykhailiuk, a second-round pick in 2018, is shooting 42.6 percent from 3 this season. He’s shown gradual improvements defensively. I think the front office is high on him as well.
Sekou Doumbouya: The 19-year-old is the Pistons’ prized possession right now. No one is off the table in trade discussions, but for Doumbouya to be moved, a young player of All-Star quality would have to be coming back. I don’t see that deal manifesting for Detroit in the near future. Doumbouya has star potential. He may not be a superstar, but he may be good enough to develop into an All-Star multiple times down the road.
The front office isn’t going to punt on a tantalizing project like Doumbouya for nothing.
(Photo of Derrick Rose: Tim Fuller / USA Today)

We wont trade DRose (assumption) but we are making Luke available, perhaps to add some seasoning to the Dre Turd Sandwich. Is that rebuilding?

Can’t trade our other turd Sandwich (Casey) so we rearrange the deck chairs on the titanic and shove the accelerator full speed ahead. You’re right Sparma...hard to be a fan.

Pistons Fans Through Thick n Thin? Or is it simply the Thin Man doing his worst work in a vain attempt to please Gores, appease Casey and pray to the Gods of Blake Michigan. If this keeps up we will have a full blown tankathon going just so we can sign a middling PG and then draft another big to replace Dre, who is hell bent on sashaying up the court while cratering his trade value while Casey runs no simple plays to get Sekou a few shots, but instead wanna send him down to the GLeague where Bone can do so. Let’s get shots for our valued vets who we probably won’t even trade. Sit on the fence Humpty Dumpty...have a great fall.
Ouch...takes talent to be this stupid and maybe they should put Kenny Rogers on loop “Ya gotta know when to hold em, know when to fold em..”