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Smith

Post  Oracle on Fri Mar 15, 2013 2:54 pm

"Smith is a good player and would complement our team, but not with a sky-is-the-limit-contract." - Lemonpen

That about sums up how I feel on the subject!

I think Smith could fit here, but not as a max player! He's a very good player, but he's no Alpha Male Stud that you just throw the ball to and get game winners!

But he is good for a few highlight plays from time to time!
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Re: FORUM

Post  deusXango on Fri Mar 15, 2013 3:20 pm

Oracle wrote:
WISEFAN wrote:
deusXango wrote:At the time of his firing in New Jersey, what was the talent base like? What was the veteran makeup of the Nets at the time of Lil' Larry's infamous start that got his ass fired? I'm so sick of hearing the excuses about our youth being the reason he can't function at a high level, make sound decisions, or set a rightous rotation, I don't know what to do! Lil' Larry took the type talent we've talked about and stunk up the Meadowlands with it....he's a glorified waterboy, not a top flight professional basketball coach, and we all know it. I'm back to Nate McMillan or Bill Laimbeer as head coach!

DX I want you to go back and look at the Nets roster from 2006 up until the time he was fired. I hope this isn't the kind of talent we're all hoping for. I'm not debating the level of coach both you and Oracle are saying LF is, or that we wouldn't have a slightly better record with a different coach. While LF is an obvious issue so is the make up of this team. I just think the LF level of blaming is over-kill when there are 80 other things wrong with this team.

Two things! Look at the Nets lineup for 2007-2008, with JKidd, Krystic, Maglorie, Jefferson, Devin Harris, Vince Carter, Jason Collins & more, and Frank was only to go 34-48 in the East? What are you talking about?

The last thing is this. A lot of the problems you see aren't player problems, they're coaching problems, you just don't seem to recognize them, and then blame players!

Take Stuckey(but almost anyone else will do), even the dumb ass media continue to blame him for a poor season. You can blame him for giving up, and I do, but I also see why he gets frustrated!

Stuckey went through a very productive period when he first went to the 2nd team. That experiment worked well for a lot of players. However, once it really became successful, Frank went away from what was working and tried something different.

There's no problem with trying something different, but ONLY if you're experimenting! Once the experiments are over, you're supposed to go back to what worked... Frank never does!

Then people blame the players, but the players are being put into situations where they're most likely to fail, and when they do they sour on the coach and everything else.

That allows guys like Monroe, who is getting the "Stuckey" love treatment for now, to jump out and complain. however, once he stops getting a pass on everything, he'll sour just like Stuckey!
Experimenting? Why the hell has every facet of the rotation been shuffled around this season but, our starting PF? Is one to assume that this is the best player on the Pistons? Lil' Larry has been a consistant asshole, plus he's very limited as a professional basketball coach. He reminds me of the other Brown brother who coached the Pistons; Herb Brown.
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Josh Smith's contract

Post  deusXango on Fri Mar 15, 2013 4:05 pm

I don't really know what J-Smooth's contract demands are and I don't care, all I know is we need him to pair with Andre Drummond in the starting lineup, and he deserves to be the highest paid Piston coming in through FA signing. I look at what CV and J.J. are being paid to sit around on the bench for long stretches of time (and neither one could compare to Smith helping Drummond), I look at what Maxiell is being paid to masquerade as a starting PF and what Maggette is recieving to be a spectator, and wonder why some talk about what we shouldn't pay Smith, if it isn't personal. When your payroll is what ours has been, mediocre players have been stealing money, and Smith ain't mediocre. We're not paying an All-Star, we're paying a competitive player not to be mediocre, who may well end up being an All-Star for us.

Josh Smith. Let's talk about the true value of this man. Next year Andre Drummond should be making a big splash in the NBA and quite possibly the front-runner for "Most Improved Player" because of the way Lil' Larry played him this year (under 20 minutes a game), and coming out the gate he should have what Monroe never had, a hellafied PF that'd have his back during his developmental stage as a starting center. Run with him, rebound and block shots with him, and give him feeds around the basket for easy scores. Smith has yet to play with a true center the caliber of Drummond (that alone should renew his interest in giving 110%), and together they would almost immediately become the most feared duo in the east. Andre Drummond is the future and who we're building around; what wouldn't you pay for what I've stated to become a reality? That's what J-Smooth's contract should look like.
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Talent Where?

Post  WTF on Fri Mar 15, 2013 4:06 pm

Two things! Look at the Nets lineup for 2007-2008, with JKidd, Krystic, Maglorie, Jefferson, Devin Harris, Vince Carter, Jason Collins & more, and Frank was only to go 34-48 in the East? What are you talking about?

Krystic was a rookie, Devin and Kidd wasn't on the team at the same time remember Dallas sent Harris to Jersey for Kidd, Jason Collins for real I rather have Maxiell and Charlie. Jefferson was a serious decline and Carter wasn't that far behind him, Maglorie see comments on Collins. What team were they better then during the 2007-2008 season? Surely not better than the Pistons, Celtics, Heat, 76er, or Magic. Don't act as if they were anywhere close to being more than what they where a 34-48 team.
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TREY BURKE, VICTOR OLADIPO, OTTO PORTER JR.

Post  deusXango on Fri Mar 15, 2013 4:16 pm

To draft those three is totally out of the question but, 2 out of 3? Whoever you pick, you can't go wrong with Smith and Drummond anchoring the "D."
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Re: FORUM

Post  WTF on Fri Mar 15, 2013 4:35 pm

Based on the NBA’s salary rules, the maximum contract he can receive would be five years and about $94 million. Is he worth 18 Million a season for the next 5 seasons? IMO Yes he is.

“I feel I bring a lot to the table. I have a lot of versatility. For what I do and what I give this ball club, I feel like I’m worth it.” - Josh Smith

But you all we're okay with the 95 Million Joe coughed up to Ben Gordon and Charlie after earning the right to pay AI 22 Million for 1 season, but all hell will break loose if he offered up 94 to J.Smith. facepalm

The DNA on Smith reeks of Piston DNA from top to bottom, just like James Harden did. Oops we didn't sign Harden we keep Stuckey, JMax, Charlie and added Mags sh!t that's about 25-30 million in the toilet right there.
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Re: FORUM

Post  WTF on Fri Mar 15, 2013 4:49 pm

Although Smith has never been selected to an All-Star Game, he boasts career averages of 15.2 points, 8.0 rebounds, 3.1 assists, 2.2 blocks and 1.3 steals.

Three times more than what we gotten out our 6'5 PF JMax for 5 season at 5 million a pop and Smith can't get a max deal here? He's averaging 18-9 this season.

Man if I knew I could get 18 and 9, plus the defense out of any player on this team it would be worth the max. Oops did I mention he does this playing 2 position SF and PF.
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Wise

Post  Oracle on Fri Mar 15, 2013 10:34 pm

WISEFAN wrote:Although Smith has never been selected to an All-Star Game, he boasts career averages of 15.2 points, 8.0 rebounds, 3.1 assists, 2.2 blocks and 1.3 steals.

Three times more than what we gotten out our 6'5 PF JMax for 5 season at 5 million a pop and Smith can't get a max deal here? He's averaging 18-9 this season.

Man if I knew I could get 18 and 9, plus the defense out of any player on this team it would be worth the max. Oops did I mention he does this playing 2 position SF and PF.

I've learned that when you're in this state, nothing gets through, LOL!

When you want to support your position, you put down players, point to every concievable weakenss and try your best to tear them down, no matter how good they are.

Then when you want to have a player, you blow past the obvious and build a case that ignores every red flag on the planet.

As soon as you start with ignoring the fact that there is obviously something missing in Josh Smith(as Lemonpen was implying), you've lost the argument big time!

You dissed the NJ players without once looking at their numbers, but oh, that doesn't matter, and Josh Smith gets no play from his peers or the NBA elite, but HIS numbers tell the whole story?

You're too funny!
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Wisefan

Post  lemonpen on Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:59 pm

WISEFAN wrote:Based on the NBA’s salary rules, the maximum contract he can receive would be five years and about $94 million. Is he worth 18 Million a season for the next 5 seasons? IMO Yes he is.

“I feel I bring a lot to the table. I have a lot of versatility. For what I do and what I give this ball club, I feel like I’m worth it.” - Josh Smith

But you all we're okay with the 95 Million Joe coughed up to Ben Gordon and Charlie after earning the right to pay AI 22 Million for 1 season, but all hell will break loose if he offered up 94 to J.Smith. facepalm

The DNA on Smith reeks of Piston DNA from top to bottom, just like James Harden did. Oops we didn't sign Harden we keep Stuckey, JMax, Charlie and added Mags sh!t that's about 25-30 million in the toilet right there.

I surrender. How can I debate that. clap
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IS HE WORTH ANOTHER GO-ROUND?

Post  deusXango on Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:28 am

"Rodney Stuckey regaining his shooting form for Detroit Pistons." Really? How many games left in this 82 game season? He's regaining, not regained?! Who gives a......well, I for one don't care; I've had enough. If anyone seriously don't think it's time to move on, I'd say you need a medication adjustment. Stuck sucks!!!
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GIVING A "SHOUT OUT" TO M'MAN WISE!

Post  deusXango on Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:58 am

For all those number crunchers, who've been trying to make a case for Lil' Larry by suggesting that New Jersey had less talent than we do now, when he was let go, here are some numbers for 'ya to ponder.

Richard Jefferon, played all 82 games and led the team in scoring with 22 pts. per game, shooting 47% from the field, and 80% from the line.
Vince Carter, played 76 games and was 2nd in scoring with a 21 pt. per night average, shooting 46% from the field, and 82% from the line.
Jason Kidd (the "old man") started all 51 games he was a Net, and averaged 11 pts. and dished out 10 assists a game.
Bostian Nachbar played 75 games (started 1) and averaged 10 pts./ Josh Boone started 53 of the 70 games he played and averaged 9 pts./ and Sean Williams made 29 starts out of 73 games played and averaged 9 pts. also.
The numbers show that our top six players are nowhere near matching what the Nets were about 2007-08, and both the defenses sucked equally. That piece about Jefferson and Carter being on the downside of their careers is so misleading; neither one had 10 years in the league at the time, and Vince Carter was a player people came out to watch play all across the country. I wish we had a player that plays defense on the perimeter like Jefferson did then, and average 22 pts. a night!!!

Wise, don't hang your head and don't believe the hype; you're right, Lil' Larry can't coach and it makes no difference in the teams makeup (vets or youth) he just don't have it, and the powers that be in Jersey got tired of his political bullsh!t and fired his ass. The question is, when will we get tired?
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NBADRAFTNET has Detroit taking Shabazz Muhammad with 6th pick

Post  cool breeze on Sat Mar 16, 2013 1:17 am

For those of you who can't stay up late and seldom watch PAC12 basketball, please believe that if Detroit does have the opportunity to draft Muhammad, this could be the player who takes the Pistons to the next level. This guy is only a freshman but boy is he tough, smart and stong. I have watched him perform in person twice this year and both times came away really impressed. He just doesn't make stupid mistakes. While he this draft site has him playing the small forward position, I see him at 6 foot 6 inches tall playing mostly the 2 guard but it won't matter where he plays because he is a consistant guy who can do it all scoring wise both inside and outside.

There are three U of Michigan players listed as first round guys. I just can't see it as much as I like to follow Michigan and Michigan State. Trey Burke has problems when he has to run an offense against a bigger defender. The NBA is full of bigger players who are extremely quick. And can he hold his own on defense in the NBA? I believe he should stay in college for at lest another season. The other two players are just too soft right now. Neither can play effective defense and will have difficulty getting off the bench in the NBA for at least 2 seasons. The media sure drives these draft sites. The PAC 12 league has some great players who really bring it on defense.

dX I wouldn't worry much about Stuckey returning next season. I am with you on this. Stuckey is a problem not a solution. Why would I say this because he is a mild mannered soft spoken man and a guy who is hard to dislike as a person. But I suspect that some of the younger guys have little respect for Stuckey's appoach to consistancy. The young guys are supposed to be inconsistant not players who were supposed to take a lead role like Stuckey. Dumars will have to take a long hard look at the vet players who didn't show up to lead the team early in the season from October to January. Those older guys were supposed to lead the way and show the young guys how to play the right way and do it every night. Stuckey just hasn't shown that at all ever. The only question regarding Stuckey is what can Dumars get in return for this player???

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Dx, Don, & Wise

Post  Oracle on Sat Mar 16, 2013 1:41 am

@Wise - At least we all agree that we would like to have Smith, we're just dicking over the price! BTW, follow your first mind on Frank, he's a good assistant coach, and that's not a bad thing. Maybe we can package both Frank and Stuckey, LOL!

@Don - I haven't seen Shabazz Muhammad, but if you like him that much, I'll be sure to find out more! BTW, I do think the UM players are a bit overrated, especially outside of Burke. Burke is the best player on the team, and I like him a lot as a college player. I don't want to say he can't make it in the NBA, but I do believe he has a high hurdle to overcome with his size.

@DX - Great analysis DX, I knew when Wise brought up Jefferson that he clearly didn't have a clue about what was really going on. I didn't remember Carter being that good, but I did know he wasn't washed up then! Anyways, good work!
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Good Luck!

Post  Oracle on Sat Mar 16, 2013 4:38 am

LOS ANGELES (AP) -- The Los Angeles Clippers have signed forward DaJuan Summers to a 10-day contract.

He averaged 18.0 points and 7.6 rebounds for the Maine Red Claws of the NBA's D-League this season.

Summers played in 81 games for Detroit and New Orleans from 2009-12 after being the 35th overall pick in the NBA draft as an early entry candidate out of Georgetown. He averaged 3.4 points and 1.0 rebounds in those games.

The move was announced Friday.
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DX, lemonpen, and Oracle

Post  WTF on Sat Mar 16, 2013 10:41 am

I surrender, lets fire LF and keep the team intact we don't need no stinking J.Smoove when we got a Moose and can always resign Maxiell tb
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Confirmation Please

Post  WTF on Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:13 am

deusXango wrote:For all those number crunchers, who've been trying to make a case for Lil' Larry by suggesting that New Jersey had less talent than we do now, when he was let go, here are some numbers for 'ya to ponder.

Richard Jefferon, played all 82 games and led the team in scoring with 22 pts. per game, shooting 47% from the field, and 80% from the line.
Vince Carter, played 76 games and was 2nd in scoring with a 21 pt. per night average, shooting 46% from the field, and 82% from the line.
Jason Kidd (the "old man") started all 51 games he was a Net, and averaged 11 pts. and dished out 10 assists a game.
Bostian Nachbar played 75 games (started 1) and averaged 10 pts./ Josh Boone started 53 of the 70 games he played and averaged 9 pts./ and Sean Williams made 29 starts out of 73 games played and averaged 9 pts. also.
The numbers show that our top six players are nowhere near matching what the Nets were about 2007-08, and both the defenses sucked equally. That piece about Jefferson and Carter being on the downside of their careers is so misleading; neither one had 10 years in the league at the time, and Vince Carter was a player people came out to watch play all across the country. I wish we had a player that plays defense on the perimeter like Jefferson did then, and average 22 pts. a night!!!

Wise, don't hang your head and don't believe the hype; you're right, Lil' Larry can't coach and it makes no difference in the teams makeup (vets or youth) he just don't have it, and the powers that be in Jersey got tired of his political bullsh!t and fired his ass. The question is, when will we get tired?

SIKE! I'm not surrendering but will concede on both the numbers for Jefferson and Carter but beyond those two that club Stunk! Big Time When you look at that roster in it entirity it was just as bad if not worst off then we are now. There was 20 players in and out of that rosters that season, do we all remember why Kidd was traded from Jersey? Nevermind I'll remind you, Kidd wanted out of Jersey and was accused basically of blowing games and half-assing it to force that trade to Dallas.

The reason for my initial remarks was because of three names that were mention Collins, Maglorie, Williams which amounted to having three Jason Maxiell. I got the Jefferson thing mixed up because it was the following season he would suffer an injury and be out for an entire season (Jefferson never really recovered) and was traded the following season.
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I 2ND THAT ORACLE

Post  deusXango on Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:21 am

Oracle wrote:LOS ANGELES (AP) -- The Los Angeles Clippers have signed forward DaJuan Summers to a 10-day contract.

He averaged 18.0 points and 7.6 rebounds for the Maine Red Claws of the NBA's D-League this season.

Summers played in 81 games for Detroit and New Orleans from 2009-12 after being the 35th overall pick in the NBA draft as an early entry candidate out of Georgetown. He averaged 3.4 points and 1.0 rebounds in those games.

The move was announced Friday.
I wish Summers well also....always felt that we didn't give him a decent chance, and gave up on him much too soon. Amir Johnson, Aaron Afflalo, Vernon Macklin....y'all get the point.
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WHERE'S THE APPEAL OF LIL' LARRY, HUH?

Post  deusXango on Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:53 am

WISEFAN wrote:I surrender, lets fire LF and keep the team intact we don't need no stinking J.Smoove when we got a Moose and can always resign Maxiell tb
WHAT?! Wise, I really am surprised at this unreasonable tantrum you just threw; this ain't you. Moreso than the "cold" Lil' Larry is the biggest turnoff for any potential FA's Dumars would try to sign. If Calderon doesn't re-sign with us, I'm gonna blame it on his lack of respect for Lil' Larry's grasp of implementing offensive principals; his lack of direction can be seen better by professional players with high basketball I.Q.'s, than it is by the casual fan. You keep Lil' Larry, then the possibility of us re-signing Maxiell is sooo much greater than if he was gone! The little leprechaun doesn't have the "stones" to bring Monroe and Knight off the bench, if we got a superior SG and PF on the team; he'd start the year with Monroe at center and Drummond on the bench, I betcha.

One last point Wise, what happened to the veteran team that was ruling the division that Lil' Larry inherited? Why did those vets give up and begin abandoning ship as time went on? The effect he seems to have is that players get worse under his direction as time goes on; do we want what's been happening with our youngsters to infect whatever upgrades Dumars makes during the offseason?
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LOL!

Post  WTF on Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:52 pm

deusXango wrote:
WISEFAN wrote:I surrender, lets fire LF and keep the team intact we don't need no stinking J.Smoove when we got a Moose and can always resign Maxiell tb
WHAT?! Wise, I really am surprised at this unreasonable tantrum you just threw; this ain't you. Moreso than the "cold" Lil' Larry is the biggest turnoff for any potential FA's Dumars would try to sign. If Calderon doesn't re-sign with us, I'm gonna blame it on his lack of respect for Lil' Larry's grasp of implementing offensive principals; his lack of direction can be seen better by professional players with high basketball I.Q.'s, than it is by the casual fan. You keep Lil' Larry, then the possibility of us re-signing Maxiell is sooo much greater than if he was gone! The little leprechaun doesn't have the "stones" to bring Monroe and Knight off the bench, if we got a superior SG and PF on the team; he'd start the year with Monroe at center and Drummond on the bench, I betcha.

One last point Wise, what happened to the veteran team that was ruling the division that Lil' Larry inherited? Why did those vets give up and begin abandoning ship as time went on? The effect he seems to have is that players get worse under his direction as time goes on; do we want what's been happening with our youngsters to infect whatever upgrades Dumars makes during the offseason?

You know I'm on board with getting rid of Lil Larry and bringing in a better coach. Look I even agree to a certain degree with what you and many others say I just don't stop at it being Lil Larry's fault alone. This is as much as Joe's fault as it is Lil Larry's.

I just don't see on one hand the majority of fans wanting to trade half the roster for its variety of flaws and then say Lil aint crap for being able to produce. I'll give on the Lil Larry not being a motivator, I'll give on Lil Larry not being the technician needed because he coaches in theory and not reality more times than not. But I won't crucify him on rotations and player development because that is Joe's doing not Franks. Joe insisted on Knight starting not Lil Larry, Joe insisted on bringing Drummond along slowly not little Lil Larry.

You can't blame Lil Larry for the production of Charlie, Stuckey, Maxiell and Bynum these are veterans, Maxiell was the same sh!tty player under 4 (Flip, Curry, Kuester and now Lil Larry) Stuckey decline began under Kuester watch not Lil Larry's watch. I never expected Lil Larry to fix what Curry and Kuester couldn't (Joe's Sh!tty Rosters)

To some degree this reminds me of my days of defending Flip Saunders, everyone wanted a title out of him and seemed to forget how we went the 2 previous season to the finals (We had a bench) Now everyone expects Lil Larry to be a playoff coach with a roster full of role players and rookies.
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Two out, bottom of the 9th, down by 3.

Post  deusXango on Sat Mar 16, 2013 3:21 pm

Wise, Lil' Larry has hit into a double play, taking out Gores and himself on the play; Joe's coming to the plate. We need to draft a stud SG (Oladipo) or stud SF (Porter Jr.), re-sign our own FA (Calderon), and convince the best available big man to come here (Smith). Those three moves are doable and would put us into extra innings, with Joe being safe for awhile longer.

The play that would put us over the top and take some doing is the willingness to allow Maxiell, Bynum, and Maggette without compensation, and hoping there is enough value in Stuckey, Villanueva, and Jerebko's expiring contracts to get a 3rd team (who's contending and in need of veteran help or pending CAP relief) to help us pull off acquiring Otto Porter Jr. or Derrick Williams. Going into the 2013-14 season with that collection of talent is a great incentative for a top flight coach to come to Detroit. Joe's job is done, Gores has saved face, the lines are getting longer around the Palace, and all we had to do was the obvious; Gores admits his mistake in hiring Lil' Larry by allowing Joe to fire him (something he's good at), let the mediocre walk, and trade the sentimental favorites who are clogging up the progress of the team (all in the misguided name of "patience").

Dream Team 2013

A 3 big rotation of Drummond, Smith, and Monroe with Drummond and Smith starting and Monroe playing at least 30 minutes a night.
A SF of Porter Jr. or D-Wiliams backed by Singler and Middleton. Our offensive scoring punch would be centered on the SF play.
A 3 guard rotation of Calderon, Oladipo, and Knight with Calderon and Oladipo starting and Knight playing at least 30 minutes a night.
The actively playing rotation would be completed with Kravstov and English.
The 2nd unit of Kravtsov, Monroe, Singler, Middleton, and BK7 is, in a lot of ways, as good as our present starters.
The projected starters of:
C- Drummond
PF-Smith
SF-Porter Jr. or Williams
SG-Oladipo
PG-Calderon
is a well balanced unit whos' calling card would be fierce defensive play leading to fast break, high scoring basketball. On the bench?
I'd love to see Nate McMillan as HC with a staff of Rod Strickland, Bill Laimbeer, and Rick Mahorn teaching the young players the ropes. Home Run!!!
footnote: There's been a ground swell of support to sign Igoudala and Mayo as FA's; I think that's stupid and a waste of money. Iggy is getting up in age and I think that Oladipo brings to the table what he does for a cheaper price. I don't believe that O.J. Mayo is a more important player to us than say, Derrick Williams. If Joe does go in that direction I'm going to be very disappointed.
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Re: FORUM

Post  Oracle on Sat Mar 16, 2013 4:18 pm

WISEFAN wrote:You know I'm on board with getting rid of Lil Larry and bringing in a better coach. Look I even agree to a certain degree with what you and many others say I just don't stop at it being Lil Larry's fault alone. This is as much as Joe's fault as it is Lil Larry's.

I just don't see on one hand the majority of fans wanting to trade half the roster for its variety of flaws and then say Lil aint crap for being able to produce. I'll give on the Lil Larry not being a motivator, I'll give on Lil Larry not being the technician needed because he coaches in theory and not reality more times than not. But I won't crucify him on rotations and player development because that is Joe's doing not Franks. Joe insisted on Knight starting not Lil Larry, Joe insisted on bringing Drummond along slowly not little Lil Larry.

You can't blame Lil Larry for the production of Charlie, Stuckey, Maxiell and Bynum these are veterans, Maxiell was the same sh!tty player under 4 (Flip, Curry, Kuester and now Lil Larry) Stuckey decline began under Kuester watch not Lil Larry's watch. I never expected Lil Larry to fix what Curry and Kuester couldn't (Joe's Sh!tty Rosters)

To some degree this reminds me of my days of defending Flip Saunders, everyone wanted a title out of him and seemed to forget how we went the 2 previous season to the finals (We had a bench) Now everyone expects Lil Larry to be a playoff coach with a roster full of role players and rookies.

Wise, how can one person be so wrong so often Smile

Who said it was only Franks fault? It's possible that it can be both Franks fault and that we have a faulty roster at the same time without contradiction. It just requires that you hold both concepts in your head at the same time and not confuse them.

If I give two guys instructions to get one million dollars with a team that they control, but a few of the instructions are faulty, however, one guys corrects the instructions and his team gets the million bucks, he's obviously the better leader!

The other guy could have possibly done it if his team was better and ignored his instructions to figure out the correct ones, but that still won't make the leader better!

A leader that has clarity of vision is better because he'll impose a system! Systems perform better than the individual parts and if you get better parts, everything improves. With Frank, it's hit or miss, but he'll eventually be exposed.

Finally, you're just out to lunch on your own team! We didn't have a bench in 2005, we had one in 2004! So your argument completely falls apart... again!

As I said, follow your first instincts, and when you feel the need to look for those intangibles to bolster your arguments.... just stop, lol!
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Oracle

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ANYBODY SEE THAT SH!T TO THE RIGHT?

Post  deusXango on Sat Mar 16, 2013 4:34 pm

"Detroit Pistons Jason Maxiell Continues His Amazing Season" reads the headline for Rant Sports...is this an amazing season for a starting PF by anyones standards? I'm actually afraid to read this article, for fear of being subjected to some super scientific subliminals. Damn!!
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DAMN! DAMN! DAMN!

Post  WTF on Sat Mar 16, 2013 4:47 pm

Oracle wrote:
WISEFAN wrote:You know I'm on board with getting rid of Lil Larry and bringing in a better coach. Look I even agree to a certain degree with what you and many others say I just don't stop at it being Lil Larry's fault alone. This is as much as Joe's fault as it is Lil Larry's.

I just don't see on one hand the majority of fans wanting to trade half the roster for its variety of flaws and then say Lil aint crap for being able to produce. I'll give on the Lil Larry not being a motivator, I'll give on Lil Larry not being the technician needed because he coaches in theory and not reality more times than not. But I won't crucify him on rotations and player development because that is Joe's doing not Franks. Joe insisted on Knight starting not Lil Larry, Joe insisted on bringing Drummond along slowly not little Lil Larry.

You can't blame Lil Larry for the production of Charlie, Stuckey, Maxiell and Bynum these are veterans, Maxiell was the same sh!tty player under 4 (Flip, Curry, Kuester and now Lil Larry) Stuckey decline began under Kuester watch not Lil Larry's watch. I never expected Lil Larry to fix what Curry and Kuester couldn't (Joe's Sh!tty Rosters)

To some degree this reminds me of my days of defending Flip Saunders, everyone wanted a title out of him and seemed to forget how we went the 2 previous season to the finals (We had a bench) Now everyone expects Lil Larry to be a playoff coach with a roster full of role players and rookies.

Wise, how can one person be so wrong so often Smile

Who said it was only Franks fault? It's possible that it can be both Franks fault and that we have a faulty roster at the same time without contradiction. It just requires that you hold both concepts in your head at the same time and not confuse them.

If I give two guys instructions to get one million dollars with a team that they control, but a few of the instructions are faulty, however, one guys corrects the instructions and his team gets the million bucks, he's obviously the better leader!

The other guy could have possibly done it if his team was better and ignored his instructions to figure out the correct ones, but that still won't make the leader better!

A leader that has clarity of vision is better because he'll impose a system! Systems perform better than the individual parts and if you get better parts, everything improves. With Frank, it's hit or miss, but he'll eventually be exposed.

Finally, you're just out to lunch on your own team! We didn't have a bench in 2005, we had one in 2004! So your argument completely falls apart... again!

As I said, follow your first instincts, and when you feel the need to look for those intangibles to bolster your arguments.... just stop, lol!

As Flo said with the passing of James LOL!

Come on Oracle that bench in 2005 had McDysse, Campbell, Hunter, Arroyo and Coleman which was a far better cry than anything that Flip ever had. Though both Coleman and Campbell were on the last leg of their respective playing careers they were far better than anything Flip had.

Now on your analogy on two guys getting instruction that's all theory considering we only have one guy so you have to make an assumption on the theoretical second guy. If this and If that lol! That's okay because we all do it and it makes for great debating.

It's not that I'm wrong I'm just out numbered

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Yeah I See It But I Don't Believe It

Post  WTF on Sat Mar 16, 2013 4:49 pm

deusXango wrote:"Detroit Pistons Jason Maxiell Continues His Amazing Season" reads the headline for Rant Sports...is this an amazing season for a starting PF by anyones standards? I'm actually afraid to read this article, for fear of being subjected to some super scientific subliminals. Damn!!

I'm not reading that Sh!t either
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Re: FORUM

Post  cool breeze on Sat Mar 16, 2013 6:11 pm

deusXango wrote:"Detroit Pistons Jason Maxiell Continues His Amazing Season" reads the headline for Rant Sports...is this an amazing season for a starting PF by anyones standards? I'm actually afraid to read this article, for fear of being subjected to some super scientific subliminals. Damn!!

Did Joe Dumars write that article or maybe Joe's son dX?

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Re: FORUM

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