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Great Win

Post  BallinD Today at 12:09 am

It was unlikely, but this team showed heart down the stretch for Casey. Gotta love it and the final plays He drew up. I fear they will continue to be streaky, but if they play this hard, they might win enough. Great job by the Staminal!
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Bullock

Post  Sparma Yesterday at 11:17 pm

Bullock was 1 for 8 when he took what became the winning shot. Shooters shoot!
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Exciting win!

Post  Sparma Yesterday at 11:11 pm

Yes, consistently excellent D by Stanley on Kawhi.

Nice win for Casey.

And Bullock!

Two good inbound passes by Calderon at the end, really (with 2 seconds, then 1.2). The first, to Robinson, could have been.

Oracle wrote:What a win for the Pistons!!!

Stanley forced Leonard to dribble the ball off his foot with great defense with 2 seconds left!

We blew a alley oop and was left with 1.2 seconds and we make the shot!!!

They played their hearts out for this coach and that's a really good sign, and took out the BEST team in basketball in the process!!!

I'll sleep good tonight  lol lol lol lol
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OMG, Stanley Johnson is a Star defender!!!

Post  Oracle Yesterday at 11:04 pm

What a win for the Pistons!!!

Stanley forced Leonard to dribble the ball off his foot with great defense with 2 seconds left!

We blew a alley oop and was left with 1.2 seconds and we make the shot!!!

They played their hearts out for this coach and that's a really good sign, and took out the BEST team in basketball in the process!!!

I'll sleep good tonight  lol lol lol lol
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55 seconds left...

Post  Oracle Yesterday at 10:52 pm

Pistons up by 2 with the ball on a short clock, but this is a GOOD game!!!

Don, Stanley is playing GREAT defense on Leonard down the stretch, the kid is impressive defensively!
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Kung Pao Chicken

Post  Oracle Yesterday at 6:44 pm

@Murph: You're seeing the same thing I do! I think Blake feels like he landed in HELL. I don't think there's a person on this team that he has any real respect for, and looking at the talent he used to play with, it's hard to fault him. If you go position by position, other than Drummond, who's about a wash(maybe a bit better), every other position is a huge talent drop.

@Don: I'll be laughing my azz off while Stanley will be eating real authentic Kung Pao Chicken over in the China league, still bricking shots from deep.

Having said that, I don't wish him ill, I truly wish him the best, because I would prefer that we keep him, but he's got to show something.

Of course if his name was KCP, you'd have a 180 degree turn about his performance. You'd see a million defensive mistakes, bad basketball IQ and a severe case of donkey breath.
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Re: FORUM

Post  cool breeze Yesterday at 4:31 pm

Oracle wrote:Not the problem: These guys have not been the problem so far, Drummond, Reggie, Ish, all have been plus contributors.

Part of the Problem: These guys are problematic, Casey and Bullock, for different reasons

Seriously Hurting the team: This players are just rotten, Stanley Johnson

Honorable Mention: Kennard doing his best impression of Avery Bradley in the injury department and Blake running out of gas so early in the season.

Stanley is the worst player by far, but in our situation, we can't afford to lose him unless we decide to blow it up, in which case I don't want to see him brick another shot in a Pistons uniform.

Oracle Johnson is going to make you eat crow once he lands on another NBA team. You cannot actually be watching most of the games. Johnson has had several outstanding games so far this season. He is the only player on this team who knows how to defend his assigned man and who can help other teammates who cannot defend. He is always the 5th option in this offense so what in hell do you expect with happen when the coach has no plays for the weak side or strong side for that matter within the half court offense. There actually is no half court offense at all. The Pistons have a simpleton type of offense that is designed for AAU kids. Johnson has a high basketball IQ who is not a good fit for this coach or the players he is forced to play with. The Pistons are losing because Griffin, Drummond, Jackson, Smith, Bullock, Galloway, and Robinson are among the weakest defenders at their positions in the entire NBA. Some of those players might make a rotation on another team that is stacked with good defenders. But to have so many players on this roster who have the same defects makes it impossible to ever have a winning caliber team. Detroit's only chance to win is if Stanley Johnson becomes a prime time player. But if you play with either Jackson or Smith, Johnson is always going to suffer. Notice that when Calderon is playing point guard, Johnson becomes part of the offense. Otherwise Griffin, Jackson, Smith and others shut him out. That is why we are not seeing the real Stanley Johnson. I saw this same thing with Harris two seasons ago after the players only meeting. Harris lost his mojo big time. He could not hit a shot to save his life for the last half of the season. That affected his defense as well. But then he was playing with the same crew that Johnson is currently playing with. For Johnson's sake, the best thing that could happen for him is to be traded. For sure he is not coming back next season. And the kid has so much potential to kick ass and take names being he is experienced and is only 22 years old. No Johnson is not "rotten". He is a victim or casualty of being on the same team as the Piston stars as defined by Tom Gores. We lose so many young kids with great potential while keeping the left overs nobody else wants. Many teams want Stanley Johnson. He will get a lot of offers. And you are even picking on Kennard who also doesn't have any chance of success once he returns either. And don't forget Henry Ellenson who according to the head coach is all washed up because he didn't do well in the summer league games. How many games has he played in since he arrived in Piston land? I wish Johnson could ignore everything that is bad about his current team and play his ass off for every minute he gets, He should be playing much better and I have stated that before. But he needs out of this insanity created by Tom Gores.

Get ready for Dwane's next game plan featuring Leuer, Galloway, Smith, Jackson, Robinson, and Griffin. All of those listed players could never fight their way out of a paper bag when it came to playing defense. All are known as very weak defenders including Robinson who was always in foul trouble at Michigan. And among that group Robinson is far superior to all of them relating to playing defense. He has actually improved since leaving college. Even AD must be wishing for a one way ticket out of Detroit. I think Blake will give us a good effort for 3 out of every 10 games until the season is over. He will coast for the entire first half and then play bully ball in the 4th. The rest of the guys will jack up 3 point shots and dribble around a lot for their shots. Johnson is not part of that plan. That much is very clear to me now. So get off his back please.

Oracle I know you are just venting so perhaps I shouldn't take a poke at you for targeting Johnson for being "Rotten". I have to say that I don't recognize him as being the same player I watched in high school and college. This team sucks on most nights. This has been the way it has been for the last 3 years even with Tobias Harris. With that said, we all know now that it wasn't the fault of Harris as to why the Pistons collapsed while he was here. Harris has always had great character but someone or perhaps two players could be the "rotten" apples instead of Johnson. There is some cancer somewhere relating to players who create bad team chemistry. This coach has acted like a complete fool so far with his circus act. What else do we have in store for us???

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Re: FORUM

Post  cool breeze Yesterday at 3:39 pm

Murph wrote:Sorry to beat a dead horse, but I just can't get over how bad that Griffin trade was for the Pistons.  

As I stated yesterday, Tobias Harris having a career year and is still getting better.  But also, Boban is playing very well for the Clips in limited minutes.   And the Pistons #12 draft pick was eventually spent on Miles Bridges from Michigan State, who is having a great rookie season.   Shocked

What the Pistons should have done was trade Reggie Jackson along with Avery Bradley for a good starting PG, held onto their draft pick, and resigned Anthony Tolliver and Eric Moreland.  

Then we would have a rotation of:

PG acquired in a trade, Ish, Brown
Bullock, Kennard
Harris, Bridges, Johnson
Tolliver, Johnson, Leuer
Drummond, Moreland, Boban

And we wouldn't be all capped out from here to eternity.   mad


The other issue is that judging by Griffin's body language and facial expressions on the court and on the bench, he isn't having any fun and doesn't want to be here.  He was clearly hurt emotionally when the Clippers dumped him and his contract, and he hasn't recovered.  He stated how shocked and disappointed he was after the trade.  

And again, judging by his body language on the court and on bench, it is doubtful whether he likes his teammates either, including the Pistons other star, Drummond.  This is a dreadful situation that going to go on for the next 4 years, unless the Pistons can somehow unload his contract.

I watched my favorite former player from last season, Tobias Harris, when the Clips played Golden State on NBA TV. How about their starting center. He sure appears to play much like Ben Wallace. The guy was challenging every shot at the rim. How refreshing! And Harris is approaching elite status while playing teams far superior to those in the Eastern Conference.

Your comments on Blake Griffin is spot on. He is not playing with passion on defense and has not shown that he has a high basketball IQ on offense. It is as if he is frustrated so much with his teammates that he forces shots anywhere on the court. SVG was not in favor of the bogus trade the Piston ownership came up with to kill the future for the next 4 years for our Pistons. But for them to then not recognize the impact Tolliver and Moreland had on the team shows everyone that they are incompetent and reckless relating to how they make decisions. The two players this owner is determined to turn into big winners are AD and RJ. While Andre is playing hard consistently now, his impact on defense is not a difference maker. But then AD might be far better off playing on a different team. There is nothing to hope for but the 8th seed on the Eastern conference for the next 4 years.

Trade talk relating to Reggie Jackson means nothing. I would be shocked if any NBA team would take his contract unless the Pistons agreed to include AD. Nobody wants Blake Griffin. The Clippers didn't want him. He would not be a good fit for the current Clipper team that plays tenacious defense all of the time. They also play offense with pace and Blake couldn't keep up with that style. We have the dancers on defense who are afraid of contact especially the wing players and point guards. But there is no money left to secure better talent at point guard or the 2 or 3. We fans have slim hope for any positive change anytime soon. The day the news broke about the Blake Griffin trade after Bradley, Harris and Boban left for the West Coast, along with our number 1 draft pick, every Piston fan who actually had been watching the Pistons to that point should have known that this owner is crazy. As reported at the time, Mr. Gores son really loved Blake so that must have been the biggest reason for making the trade.

Tom Gores is the biggest reason why the Pistons suck. But we also have to give Stan Van Gundy a lot of credit as well for signing Jackson, Smith, Leuer, and Galloway to those killer contracts. And there can be no doubt that Casey is responsible for not wanting Tolliver and Moreland on his team this year. That shows me that Casey is not a person who really did his homework. Also, Casey is the person who is putting together those player combinations that are so bad opposing coaches must be laughing at him. When Jackson, Smith and Galloway are in the games at the same time, who cannot beat the Pistons???? Possibly on some off nights for opponents and when those 3 are shooting the lights out with low percentage shot attempts, Casey can brag that he knows what he is doing. What I see is that he has no control of his team at all. There are no consequences for players who turn the ball over a lot who have the big contracts.

For those who still want to blame Piston loses on Johnson take a look at the amount of minutes he got in the last game. While the team the Pistons were playing were scoring at will, Johnson, the only player on the team who can actually defend anyone, was on the bench for most of the game. He played around 15 to 17 minutes. Meanwhile the Clippers are playing their asses off on the defensive end and finally look like a formidable challenge for any NBA team right now. Stanley is the smartest player on this team in many ways. He is playing with the wrong players and the wrong coach. Johnson is the 5th option because this coach is too stupid to create plays for players on the weak side. If Johnson could be thrown a bone when is is standing on the weak side a few times per game, then he could drive baseline or off the wing and set up Drummond for easy dunks. But when Griffin is triple teamed he doesn't throw the ball to Johnson. Stanley has to depend on most all of his scoring by getting steals or running the lanes in transition. I stand by my belief that once Stanley Johnson leaves this group of losers and gets on a good team with a better coach, he is going to be a terrific player. Johnson is only 22 years old and plays every phase of the game well now but his confidence shooting the ball is still a work in progress. His release is finally really good. SVG's staff set his shooting back big time when they picked around with his release. It is only a matter of time now but the Pistons are not in a good financial position and the current roster would scare any young player away so Johnson's days are most likely numbered. He could be included as a throw in like Middleton in another Tom Gores block buster trade. I see why Johnson is not consistent based on what he has experienced since being drafted by the Pistons. It seems that everyone is very happy when either their contract expires or they get traded from the Pistons.

while we fans have no place to go, the Pistons are doomed to only get worse with their current roster of specialist shooters who can't shoot very well. The hiring of Casey was just another mistake by the owner. What should have happened is that the team retained SVG for another season but fired him from any front office involvement. At least SVG would have Tolliver and Moreland on the team this season. I read once when the hype was at a peak that Casey has the ability to adjust his strategy based on the type of roster he has to work with. Casey did have something to do with the composition of this roster and decided that he didn't want Tolliver and Moreland. And he doesn't like Johnson either it appears because Johnson is not making those 3 point shots often enough. Everything is based on shooting the 3 ball at any place on the floor even if all of the potential defenders are out of position and can't get back in transition. Tolliver selected the right time to shoot his 3 point shots and he could make those shots too.

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The Griffin Trade and How I Want Last Year's Team Back

Post  Murph Yesterday at 8:42 am

Sorry to beat a dead horse, but I just can't get over how bad that Griffin trade was for the Pistons.  

As I stated yesterday, Tobias Harris having a career year and is still getting better.  But also, Boban is playing very well for the Clips in limited minutes.   And the Pistons #12 draft pick was eventually spent on Miles Bridges from Michigan State, who is having a great rookie season.   Shocked

What the Pistons should have done was trade Reggie Jackson along with Avery Bradley for a good starting PG, held onto their draft pick, and resigned Anthony Tolliver and Eric Moreland.  

Then we would have a rotation of:

PG acquired in a trade, Ish, Brown
Bullock, Kennard
Harris, Bridges, Johnson
Tolliver, Johnson, Leuer
Drummond, Moreland, Boban

And we wouldn't be all capped out from here to eternity.   mad


The other issue is that judging by Griffin's body language and facial expressions on the court and on the bench, he isn't having any fun and doesn't want to be here.  He was clearly hurt emotionally when the Clippers dumped him and his contract, and he hasn't recovered.  He stated how shocked and disappointed he was after the trade.  

And again, judging by his body language on the court and on bench, it is doubtful whether he likes his teammates either, including the Pistons other star, Drummond.  This is a dreadful situation that going to go on for the next 4 years, unless the Pistons can somehow unload his contract.
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No Fool's Gold

Post  WTF on Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:05 pm

Oracle wrote:Stafford is a poor QB with a strong arm.

He's easily fooled the media, fans and my good buddy Wise by having Megatron make him look good for so many years! He hasn't been as good since...

It doesn't matter who you put around him, he can't hit receivers when it counts, and DX nailed it, the dude has no touch, it's gun the ball to the guy 3 feet in front of you or side arm the ball into the turf!

I get it why they had to pay him and why he's still around, but at some point they need to grow a pair and get rid of this clown.

BTW, I do agree that the team would have been better under Caldwell, but the loss of their BEST receiver has hurt them a lot.

I hope Casey gets better, but he did inherit this Frankenstein team of ill fitting parts.

There are times I wish I could be in charge of the Lions.  I won't argue that there are better QB's then Stafford but it the same sense I could argue that this guy could be a winner with the right things in place.  Most QB's if not all are flawed in mechanics I've seen QB's over years of watching the NFL that had far worse mechanics or played similarly.  Elway comes to mind as one of them but he has 2 super bowl rings in spite of.   

I can only think of a handful of QB's that actually had touch throwing in all the years of watching football.  Farve was another crappy passer perhaps the worse ever but I think he has 2 super bowls under his belt.   

The thing that is different with all this guys is that they all had pieces around beyond just having a good receiver, They were all backed by excellent run games,  and exception defenses.  More importantly great coaches.   

Stafford remains be of other good QB's that were great but just couldn't win, not because they were bad they just didn't have all the pieces.  Gunslingers have always been my favorite type of QB.  I loved Bert Jones of the Baltimore Colts days, I liked Elway, Dan Fouts,  and Jim Zorn these were gunslingers but they were assisted by very decent run games and corp of WR not just one.

My thing was why Stafford couldn't have 2 Mega-trons, and a run game.  Bradshaw was a crappy QB but he had 3 HOF WR and Franco Harris anchored by the Steel Curtain.   Fouts had more than 3 good receiver but then he had the bi-focal wearing Chuck M in his backfield but even thing the Chargers never had all things needed to him to the promise land.   

For me I get an old school feel about Stafford because he reminds me of a lot of those guys,  some which have one and others that just never could but not because they were horrible QB's.   I mean you could put all the top QB's on this current roster and they wouldn't win because there's not a lick of balance anywhere on this rosters.  

This the first season Stafford stats have not landed him in the top 10, he's currently ranked 16 in the league but I put that on Patrice and ownership. All Stafford ever had going for him was Mega and a kicking game.  That's It!!!!!

Question does this make Barry a crappy RB because he never won either? IJS because he was a suffer similar problems of being on an in-completed team as well.   Give Stafford half of what most of some of the QB's have or some semblance of balance and the Lions could win.
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DX/Wise

Post  Oracle on Tue Nov 13, 2018 6:12 pm

Stafford is a poor QB with a strong arm.

He's easily fooled the media, fans and my good buddy Wise by having Megatron make him look good for so many years! He hasn't been as good since...

It doesn't matter who you put around him, he can't hit receivers when it counts, and DX nailed it, the dude has no touch, it's gun the ball to the guy 3 feet in front of you or side arm the ball into the turf!

I get it why they had to pay him and why he's still around, but at some point they need to grow a pair and get rid of this clown.

BTW, I do agree that the team would have been better under Caldwell, but the loss of their BEST receiver has hurt them a lot.

I hope Casey gets better, but he did inherit this Frankenstein team of ill fitting parts.
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State of the Pistons

Post  Oracle on Tue Nov 13, 2018 6:07 pm

Not the problem: These guys have not been the problem so far, Drummond, Reggie, Ish, all have been plus contributors.

Part of the Problem: These guys are problematic, Casey and Bullock, for different reasons

Seriously Hurting the team: This players are just rotten, Stanley Johnson

Honorable Mention: Kennard doing his best impression of Avery Bradley in the injury department and Blake running out of gas so early in the season.

Stanley is the worst player by far, but in our situation, we can't afford to lose him unless we decide to blow it up, in which case I don't want to see him brick another shot in a Pistons uniform.
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2 Cents

Post  WTF on Tue Nov 13, 2018 5:34 pm

DX wrote:I've never talked about the Lions, because I've been holding out hope that they'll eventually make some noise but, this year is the most disgusting (next to the 0-16 season) that I've witnessed and it ain't over!
STAFFORD: the highest paid meaningless stat machine in pro sports, but Drummond draws the heat. Neither one has any playoff victories...neither one makes the players around them better, and neither one is a real team leader. My problem with Stafford is this tremendous arm that's glorified so much lacks touch...it's not connected to his football brain...every pass is an offline rocket throw, whether a back, 5 yards deep (dropped pass) or a receiver 25 yards downfield (over throw or interception). No "touch passes," or timing routes (interceptions in the "red zone") or throws over the defensive backfield, eliminating the speed of his receivers. The face of the Lions.

I'll defend Stafford put some freaking players around him starting with RB quickly followed by a above average offline and he could win.  Also get a real coach QB's don't carry teams they lead them but if there are question marks all over the roster what's a leader to do.  

AD don't get this break while both are team sports football is a completely different beast,  and dependent on far to many variables but right now it's defense and coaching that's truly the Lions problem not the QB.   I can only imagine this team would be far better had they kept Caldwell.  

Almost can say the same thing about SVG and Casey because I don't see much difference yeah the team would still suck under SVG but maybe less
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By now Casey must know the capabilities of Reggie Jackson, Ish Smith, Langston Galloway, and Reggie Bullock. How can the coach play any combination of two of these players at the same time knowing that they are among the worst defensive players in the NBA

Post  cool breeze on Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:34 pm

This is frustrating as a fan to watch year after year the same type of inept defenders playing the point guard and two guard positions for the Pistons. I don't even count Pope as a high quality defensive player because he could not guard either Wall or Beal at any time when he played for the Pistons. But Pope is far superior as a defender than Jackson, Smith, Galloway, or Bullock. They keep getting beat off the dribble and cannot anticipate opponent half court set plays. Or are they just not very interested in playing defense? Who knows but I would suspect that Casey knows what he has and feels that he needs to play these players to prove to management just how bad they are as NBA players who will always hurt their team on the defensive end. Teams are loading up on Smith whenever he is in the game. His size is a big factor. My question for the coach is how does he decide who will guard who when he plays Jackson and Smith together? Who will guard the opponent's strongest guard? This is a joke of course. Just draw straws is the answer. Neither guard can guard any opponent guard in the NBA for any length of time.

Fans want to trade Stanley Johnson who is 22 years old and is by far the most capable defender on this Piston team. Johnson has been inconsistent on the offensive end scoring. But his passing is outstanding and his knowledge as to where to be on the floor is outstanding. Meanwhile, Galloway, Jackson, Smith, and Bullock often look like chickens with their heads cut off the way they fail to get to the right spots, fail to set screens for other players, and have no conscious thoughts about getting back fast when they miss those low percentage three point shots and by the time they do set up, opponents blow by them easily leaving players like AD in a helpless position. All of the players mentioned use there arms and hands too much instead of moving their legs which of course takes more hard work. So is Casey playing these guys together to show the Piston Front office that they need to get real creative to dump at least two if not more of the 4 players that I have mentioned. No team can win with these players. And they are getting a ton of playing time with the Pistons.

Will Luke Kennard ever get healthy enough to help this team? Could he play point guard and do a better job than Jackson and Smith? Calderon looks to be in great shape and moves his feet much faster on defense than any of the 4 players that I have listed above. Is he too old to play 20 minutes a game? I believe he can play more minutes and the team would have a better chance of winning. The other beef that I have is how Jackson and Smith dominate the ball during a last possession in a quarter. They both decide as soon as the ball in inbounded regardless of the amount of time in the shot clock that they personally will dribble the ball until they get the final shot. By now every team in the league know their tendencies of being ball hogs. The coach could of course create a play that could involve another player which might shock opponents who believe the Pistons have the dumbest team in the NBA by now.

When will Piston players who have no defender within 5 yards just take a few steps in towards the basket before shooting the ball? I blame this coach who insists on the players having a lot of fun instead of focusing on ways to win games. Maybe our players are so retarded that Casey believes that he can't keep the players motivated to do any more than just show up unless the players are allowed to play with no discipline or restrictions. There are no consequences for players who cannot guard any opponent as long as they agree to shoot the 3 point shot.

This might be the pre game talk by Casey. Please pretty please shoot the 3 for me. I love it. That is my style as a head coach so don't disappoint me. We loved playing that way in Toronto. Everyone had fun and I want you guys to have fun. I beg you keep on shooting it and I don't care if you are not able to get your legs set and tend to lean to the side when going up for the 3 ball. By the way Lanston you do a great job with that and I love it when you shoot those contested 3point shots. That is why we play you so much money. The fans love it. The owner loves it. Nobody cares if we lose 50% of the time. Nobody cares if you players don't bother to study game film or prepare yourselves for specific opponents from night to night. It is much better for you players to not worry about anything before our games. Just clear you heads and think about what you are going to do after the games. Then you won't feel as much pressure. Don't worry about the details. You are now in the NBA with guaranteed contracts. The fans are stupid. They will tolerate anything. For this game we plan to win by playing Ish and Reggie together as much as possible. You guys can really dribble and shoot it. I love the excitement both of you studs provide the fans when you are out there. I think you two can out shoot any team in the league so I don't worry about defense. Your responsibility is to shoot it. Now remember it is dog eat dog as far as I am concerned with you players. I play the players who shoot it the most so I want you to know that. If you are passing up throwing the ball to a wide open teammate, just know that I am watching how many points you score. The fans keep track of that stuff too so you won't be very popular in Detroit if you don't get your scoring average up. We study those stats but don't concentrate on your misses from beyond the 3 point line. Just don't miss any shots around the basket or pull up jumpers inside the 3 point line. I hate it when you are not shooting 3s.

Our Pistons are in good hands. Everyone is having fun now. Last year was a bitch. Players hated that coach. This year our game strategy is really cool. The players don't worry about anything. We should beat all the rebuilding teams this season most of the time. Who knows how good we can be next season. There is a lot of optimism out there regarding the Pistons chances of making the playoffs in the Eastern Conference.

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Wildeyed trade idea and some misc. and sundry

Post  deusXango on Tue Nov 13, 2018 3:47 am

From the Sunday Funnies to todays Graphic Novels, there wasn't a more diverse, great, story teller than the late Mr. Stan Lee, and he worked with some of the most revered illustrators in the industry during his career; thank you, Oracle, for remembering a special talent that I was blessed to enjoy.

Sidebar. I was in basic training (Ft. Knox, Ky.) when the news came that we had lost the great Mr. Walt Disney...I was devastated then also...this man made it possible for me to watch a flower grow.

Before things get totally out of hand, make a blockbuster trade! I've been harping on trading Reggie and Leuer, but together they ain't blockbuster material; Blake Griffin and Stanley Johnson to the Lakers (to play with The King) for Kuzma, Hart, and Ingram. Who cares what goes on in the west, but we'd become instantly relevant in the east! Magic IMHO ain't all that in the front office and we need an infusion of young, top flight, talent, that we've missed out on over the years. Come on Big Ed, get us back in the game. We're playing .500 ball now and will probably be there, with the completed trade, by the trade deadline, but coming together as a team with young legs. This season and next, with Blake and Stanley, we will not be contending to get in the ECF, much less a top 4 team in the east.

Fans talk sh!t about Drummond for not blocking enough shots, protecting the rim, hitting FT, and lately he's been criticized for an outrageous double-double output, because those are meaningless stats (he's doing it with smoke and mirrors folks) and the bottom line is always about his contract and how he's not playing up to it. Not a G**damn peep about Jon Leuer and his contract, like he's doing volunteer work, year after year. Make of that what you will. When it comes to trades, it's like he's untouchable; the spirit of SVG lives on.

I've never talked about the Lions, because I've been holding out hope that they'll eventually make some noise but, this year is the most disgusting (next to the 0-16 season) that I've witnessed and it ain't over!
STAFFORD: the highest paid meaningless stat machine in pro sports, but Drummond draws the heat. Neither one has any playoff victories...neither one makes the players around them better, and neither one is a real team leader. My problem with Stafford is this tremendous arm that's glorified so much lacks touch...it's not connected to his football brain...every pass is an offline rocket throw, whether a back, 5 yards deep (dropped pass) or a receiver 25 yards downfield (over throw or interception). No "touch passes," or timing routes (interceptions in the "red zone") or throws over the defensive backfield, eliminating the speed of his receivers. The face of the Lions.

QUINN: is going out of the world backwards and suffering with a bad case of vagina envy ("Mama" Ford seems to know more about construction of a winner than he or any of the other men in charge do). Fixing sh!t that ain't broke, and doing what is in vogue in Detroit pro sport franchises, giving away talent to water down our competitive effectiveness in the name of cost cutting all while one player eats up the majority of the payroll. I'm not saying Patricia is a bad coach but, I do recognize that he's a rookie, unproven, coach replacing a veteran coach who was getting the most out of minimal talent. Why did we hold onto Ameer Abdulla (Mr. East/West) for so long and now that we have Kerryon Johnson, he can't carry the ball 20-25 times a game? That's on Jim Bob, riiight. He did snooker a 3rd round pick out of Philly. On it goes, we're a mess from the top down.
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RIP Stan Lee

Post  Oracle on Mon Nov 12, 2018 5:56 pm

Creator and Master of the Marvel Universe.

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Murph

Post  Oracle on Mon Nov 12, 2018 5:45 pm

Excellent observations on the defense!

Griffin: OMG, I was thinking the same thing, he's worn down having to do everything, but I didn't want to say it yet.

Hell to the Yeah: I'd trade Harris for Griffin and not even blink an eye right now.  We'd need a big man to replace him but I'm good with that trade.
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Re: FORUM

Post  cool breeze on Mon Nov 12, 2018 2:00 pm

Murph wrote:Oracle....excellent post.  I agree with this post 100%.  

But there is even more to the argument.  DEFENSIVE INTENSITY.  We aren't a very good defensive team.  We aren't even as good defensively as we were last season.  Casey seems unable or unwilling to address our defensive woes, and the first place to start would be to improve Drummond's footwork and positioning.  Drummond clearly has a great deal of potential defensively, that is not being developed by Casey.  

The other factor that hurts us defensively is our guards.  Ish, Jackson and Galloway are never going to be great defenders.  For one thing, they're too short.  Bullock is a poor defender also.  This is obviously not Casey's fault.  He inherited our guards from Van Gundy.  But until we gradually turn over our roster, and replace our defensively lacking guards with better defenders, our defense is going to suck.  Brown and Thomas, who actually got in a game earlier in the week, are a good start. but they need to develop over the course of several seasons.


Oracle wrote:"This team needed a kick in the ass not another coach that wants to have his players jack up 3's" - Wise

I was reading one of the articles, and the reason they keep jacking up 3's is that the analytics tell them that at some point they'll start dropping.

This is a prime example reading "Advanced Stats for Idiots" and trying to run a NBA team!

The advanced stats are 100% correct, but they're only accurate if you have players that are normally 3 point shooters. Stanley Johnson can keep jacking up 3's until he drops and he'll still be shooting 20-28%, the logic breaks down.

And by what logic do you keep jacking them up? What happened to the old proven technique of getting something to go down first, take a few easy shots, then try a 3 later.

I still see coaching as what will make or break this team. If we start hitting 3's Casey will look good, if not, maybe Grand Rapids could use a former coach of the year.

Murph I remember the time when you were begging the Pistons to draft Walker. Who can forget Kemba's run in the NCAA tournament? And I think there was a time when The Pistons could have made a trade for Walker as well. "Don't call me Stupid" which was a line in a famous movie might be appropriate for the Piston front office.

Piston DEFENSE is horrible. In this matchup for those of us who watched the game saw the obvious which the Piston's head coach, D. Casey must have missed. In the first half Jackson, Galloway and Smith could not guard any player on the court. The combination of those three players playing on the floor at the same side is suicide. If you want to lose just play those three players together. Smith has been playing horribly on both ends. When he came into the game he started the slide downward when he completely changed the Piston offense to a one on one get your own shot and forget the other players type of offense. But his defense was so bad I felt sorry for him. The combination of Parker and Walker made complete fools out of our skill players. And I should add Reggie Bullock to that list of players who cannot defend very well. Bullock made up for his defensive mistakes by making a ton of 3 pointers. But even if Bullock and Galloway make low percentage shots, they cannot make up for their defensive lapses. Reggie Jackson tried to duel it out with Walker which was a joke.

I also agree with you about Griffin. He looked real tired at the beginning of the game and failed to give an honest effort on defense. And he is not doing well lately with his bully ball game either. Griffin draws a double team and doesn't take advantage of the advantage the Pistons have in those situations. But this is the fault of the head coach in my opinion. The Pistons could get a ton of good mid range shots when Griffin is doubled. But you have to give your players some plays and show them how to work effectively on the weak side of the court. Instead when Blake does pass the ball, he passes it out to somebody beyond the 3 point line and instead of moving in when un guarded to take an easier shot, the team strategy is to take the 3. When the Pistons miss that means their opponent is going to get some great looks in transition.

Andre Drummond played hard and was effective in the paint on offense. AD can become an elite defender. If he wants to get Embid to eat crow, he will have to work even harder to prove himself as a defender. But AD did not cost the Pistons this game. It was a combination of things involving the head coach and his player combinations especially this nonsense involving his insistence of playing Smith and Jackson together. What a fool. The Hornets will beat the Pistons 9 out of 10 games if Casey doesn't wise up. And of course Griffin did nothing to improve the Pistons chances of winning this game. He was a lazy ass most of the night and was not playing like a smart player at any time in the game.

Stanley Johnson appeared to show his age again in this game. I don't think he was prepared to be an impact player. He just showed up for the most part. But the coach has determined that Johnson is the 5th option in the Pistons half court offense so maybe that is why Johnson just shows up and hopes for the best result. Stanley needs to think he can be a difference maker but that takes mental preparation before the game. I was disappointed in his all around effort.

The bottom line is that no NBA team can win without top rated skill players who occupy the point guard and 2 guard positions. The Pistons are using the worst possible combination of point guards ( Jackson-Smith). Those two players are more responsible for the Pistons current history over the last 3 years of being losers than any other thing in my opinion. Both are specialists who dominate the basketball too much and play perhaps the worst defense of all point guards in the NBA. Opposing teams target our point guards. When you bring in Smith after Jackson gets his ass beat on defense, can you imagine how opposing teams are licking their chops? Meanwhile Casey ignores what he must see happening when the Pistons go into a tail spin.

Casey is giving minutes based on the amount of his player's contracts with the exception of Leuer. Congratulations to Jon Leuer who is financially set for life thanks to SVG and Tom Gores. I wish him well but he is not good enough to be an effective NBA players. Why wait any longer? The Pistons might consider releasing Leuer and spacing out his contract amount like they did with Josh Smith. Activate Henry Ellenson or find another player in the G League. At least let Henry play in the G League for the rest of the season. He looks pitiful in his street clothes. The Pistons couldn't have done a worse job in handling this young big man. He is broken and has no confidence now. This is all on SVG and D. Casey.

Final grade for the coaching staff in this game is F. It should have not taken more than one minute to see that his player combinations with Galloway, Smith, Jackson or Galloway, Smith, Bullock had not chance to match up with the Hornets skill players defensively. Calderon was on the bench for the entire first half.

Griffin's final grade is D in my opinion. Damn it all you are so right about the season Tobias Harris is having now that he does not have to play with the Pistons two point guards, Smith and jackson. The Piston's owner can not hide from that blunder. This was all on Tom Gores. The Clippers are still laughing at him. Tom Gores owns the farm team for the Clippers. Maybe he will trade Andre Drummond to the Clippers for a 2nd round pick.

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Griffin

Post  Murph on Mon Nov 12, 2018 8:15 am

Blake Griffin seems worn out already.  We're only 12 games into the season, and Griffin's shooting percentage and scoring average are plummeting every game.  And last night's flagrant 2 on Monk was a clear indication of Griffin's frustration.  I cannot believe we're saddled with this guy and his $36 million a year average salary for the next 4 years.

Meanwhile, Tobias Harris is enjoying the best season of his career by far.  This year, Harris is putting up career highs in points, rebounds, blocks, FG% and 3 point %.

He's been the Clippers MVP so far this season.

Is there anyone out there who would not trade Griffin for Harris straight up?  Forget about the wasted 1st round pick.
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Kemba

Post  Murph on Mon Nov 12, 2018 7:40 am

Every time I see Kemba Walker play, my head explodes.  I just can't believed we passed on Walker to draft Brandon Knight.  Walker had single handedly carried the UConn Huskies to a National Championship in 20012, much in the same way Melo carried Syracuse to the championship in '04.  So clearly we should pass on both those guys...   facepalm

Walker is enjoying the best season of his career by far.  He's scoring 28 ppg, and dishing 6 apg.  And remember when the knock on Walker was that he was a volume shooter who shot at a low percentage?  Well he's currently shooting 46% from the floor, 38% from the 3 pt line and 87% from the FT line.  Much better than our PGs.

I gotta believe Walker is going to end up scoring 20,000 points in his career, and that along with his National Championship at UConn will get him elected to the Hall of Fame in Springfield.

Nice job Joe on passing on Walker when we desperately needed a PG.  Sad
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Defense

Post  Murph on Mon Nov 12, 2018 5:57 am

Oracle....excellent post.  I agree with this post 100%.  

But there is even more to the argument.  DEFENSIVE INTENSITY.  We aren't a very good defensive team.  We aren't even as good defensively as we were last season.  Casey seems unable or unwilling to address our defensive woes, and the first place to start would be to improve Drummond's footwork and positioning.  Drummond clearly has a great deal of potential defensively, that is not being developed by Casey.  

The other factor that hurts us defensively is our guards.  Ish, Jackson and Galloway are never going to be great defenders.  For one thing, they're too short.  Bullock is a poor defender also. This is obviously not Casey's fault.  He inherited our guards from Van Gundy.  But until we gradually turn over our roster, and replace our defensively lacking guards with better defenders, our defense is going to suck.  Brown and Thomas, who actually got in a game earlier in the week, are a good start. but they need to develop over the course of several seasons.


Oracle wrote:"This team needed a kick in the ass not another coach that wants to have his players jack up 3's" - Wise

I was reading one of the articles, and the reason they keep jacking up 3's is that the analytics tell them that at some point they'll start dropping.

This is a prime example reading "Advanced Stats for Idiots" and trying to run a NBA team!

The advanced stats are 100% correct, but they're only accurate if you have players that are normally 3 point shooters. Stanley Johnson can keep jacking up 3's until he drops and he'll still be shooting 20-28%, the logic breaks down.

And by what logic do you keep jacking them up? What happened to the old proven technique of getting something to go down first, take a few easy shots, then try a 3 later.

I still see coaching as what will make or break this team. If we start hitting 3's Casey will look good, if not, maybe Grand Rapids could use a former coach of the year.
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Oracle

Post  Sparma on Mon Nov 12, 2018 12:14 am

I was poking fun. Sometimes shooters dramatically improve, as with AD's FTs last year, but career %, particularly from distance, is generally a pretty good guideline as to what to expect during the course of the year. Casey seems in denial, but then part of his job is to show trust in his guys even when the evidence isn't there (a part of a coach's job that Stan didn't buy into much!).

Oracle wrote:That's total BS, IMO.

If the shots weren't falling, what the f**k else did you try? If I hear that lame excuse again I'm going to puke!
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Since when is "The shots weren't falling" a legitimate excuse???

Post  Oracle on Sun Nov 11, 2018 11:04 pm

That's total BS, IMO.

If the shots weren't falling, what the f**k else did you try? If I hear that lame excuse again I'm going to puke!
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Wise

Post  Oracle on Sun Nov 11, 2018 11:02 pm

"This team needed a kick in the ass not another coach that wants to have his players jack up 3's" - Wise

I was reading one of the articles, and the reason they keep jacking up 3's is that the analytics tell them that at some point they'll start dropping.

This is a prime example reading "Advanced Stats for Idiots" and trying to run a NBA team!

The advanced stats are 100% correct, but they're only accurate if you have players that are normally 3 point shooters. Stanley Johnson can keep jacking up 3's until he drops and he'll still be shooting 20-28%, the logic breaks down.

And by what logic do you keep jacking them up? What happened to the old proven technique of getting something to go down first, take a few easy shots, then try a 3 later.

I still see coaching as what will make or break this team. If we start hitting 3's Casey will look good, if not, maybe Grand Rapids could use a former coach of the year.
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WTF & Oracle

Post  Sparma on Sun Nov 11, 2018 9:22 pm

WTF: "Thank God for the Michigan Wolverines!!!!!!! It seems the only thing I can actually cheer and feel good about.  Go Blue!!!!!!!"

Yes! No Red Wings to bail us out this year. And Tigers are planning to be bad at least a couple more years. Wait till next year for the Lions? Evidently, they'll be able to splash a lot of FA cash in the summer. They don't seem that far away, but we've seen their self-sabotaging act before.

Oracle writes: "BTW, I also believe that there are deals out there to move Blake, Leuer and Reggie to regain financial flexibility or solid young players and picks." I'd be for that! They seem sold on the win [a little] now mentality. I think Gores made a very deliberate choice in bringing in Casey, who seems to share his conviction that the team can do real well now (if only those shots fall...).



The Lions mistake was firing Caldwell this defense stinks under Patrice and the offense if horrible.  Wasn't he suppose to bring defense expertise with him well I don't see it.   

The Pistons I just think I'll ever enjoy this group of players period Kennard and GRIII are the only players I like.  I certainly don't like this coach why for the life of me will I ever understand not giving Zeke and Bill both opportunities made sense.  This team needed a kick in the ass not another coach that wants to have his players jack up 3's[/quote]
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