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Trade Talk

Post  Phil1980boy Today at 12:48 am

You telling me WIGGIE STILL F.U.C.K.I.N.G. INJURED!!?!?!?!? DAMN, What A BUM!!

Don't care who the Pistons trade. Don't move Luke Kennard. You about to see this season that the kid is A OFFICIAL BALLER now that he has A head coach who plays young players.
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Trade talk

Post  Sparma Yesterday at 11:11 pm

BallinD wrote:
"Not gonna throw Kennard to the Wolves."   Good line, BallinD.

It's the kind of trade that's really stupid, unless you're close to a championship like the 'Stros with Verlander.

One thing I'll say in its favor: I believe Kennard is at peak value right now.  Murph wants him to fill in at PG?  I do too, but I've got doubts based on seeing him getting crowded again and again.

Best case for Kennard is borderline All Star, as I see it.  Now that's real value, not to be dispensed lightly.  Jimmy B's the genuine article though, already an All Star and a defensive star.

Trouble is, he's definitely want out of the D after a year.  

Am I remembering wrongly that the Celts ended up with Al Jefferson in the Rasheed trade?  Thing is, the '04 Pistons were really good, or the verge of true excellence.  That's when you go for it.

Even with AD-Blake-Butler I think the Celts, 76ers, and maybe the Raptors would be favored ahead of us in the East.

Don't worry, the Wolves wouldn't go for it (i.e. Reggie J/ Leuer/ Kennard for Jimmy B).  They'd probably want a 1st rounder thrown in.  Whereas we'd only be willing to give up a 2nd rounder, the one we have coming in 2026.

Lions up 20-10 on the dynasty of this generation.  Might there be life there after all?

We don’t need to do the Middleton again with Kennard.  But whatever we can do to dump Weggie, I’m all for it.  I also say no to Blaktfor Jimmy straight up.  Why would he stay if Blake’s gone.
Sparma wrote:How close would Reggie J & Leuer & Kennard get you to one year of Butler?  Good trade?  Bad trade?  I'd probably do it.  Obviously it's giving up Kennard that would hurt.

It's the kind of trade the Houston Astros were so reluctant to make before springing for Verlander.

Anyway, the Timberwolves would probably want more.  I wonder if Galloway could help it work, along with Kennard.  Some kind of package of Leuer, Galloway, Kennard, and Stanley J.?  Not the kind of trade I'd like to make, but the team seems ready to go for bust.  Some additional players would need to come back to make the rosters work.

Stanley J.'s a tough one.  If he keeps up his level of play, he not worth an expensive extension; if he breaks out this season, the team probably can't afford him unless they give up on resigning Reggie B (please no!)
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Nope

Post  BallinD Yesterday at 10:39 pm

Not gonna throw Kennard to the Wolves. We don’t need to do the Middleton again with Kennard. But whatever we can do to dump Weggie, I’m all for it. I also say no to Blaktfor Jimmy straight up. Why would he stay if Blake’s gone.
Sparma wrote:How close would Reggie J & Leuer & Kennard get you to one year of Butler?  Good trade?  Bad trade?  I'd probably do it.  Obviously it's giving up Kennard that would hurt.

It's the kind of trade the Houston Astros were so reluctant to make before springing for Verlander.

Anyway, the Timberwolves would probably want more.  I wonder if Galloway could help it work, along with Kennard.  Some kind of package of Leuer, Galloway, Kennard, and Stanley J.?  Not the kind of trade I'd like to make, but the team seems ready to go for bust.  Some additional players would need to come back to make the rosters work.

Stanley J.'s a tough one.  If he keeps up his level of play, he not worth an expensive extension; if he breaks out this season, the team probably can't afford him unless they give up on resigning Reggie B (please no!)
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Trade?

Post  Sparma Yesterday at 9:04 pm

How close would Reggie J & Leuer & Kennard get you to one year of Butler? Good trade? Bad trade? I'd probably do it. Obviously it's giving up Kennard that would hurt.

It's the kind of trade the Houston Astros were so reluctant to make before springing for Verlander.

Anyway, the Timberwolves would probably want more. I wonder if Galloway could help it work, along with Kennard. Some kind of package of Leuer, Galloway, Kennard, and Stanley J.? Not the kind of trade I'd like to make, but the team seems ready to go for bust. Some additional players would need to come back to make the rosters work.

Stanley J.'s a tough one. If he keeps up his level of play, he not worth an expensive extension; if he breaks out this season, the team probably can't afford him unless they give up on resigning Reggie B (please no!)
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RJ

Post  Murph on Sat Sep 22, 2018 5:17 pm

If I had to guess, I doubt that Reggie's ankle is still hurting to the point where he'll miss regular season games. I think he's just hedging going into the pre-season. He probably doesn't feel up for all the conditioning, and wants to ease into training camp. I'll bet that once the pre-season games roll around, Reggie will play in most of them, and will begin the season as our starting PG, baring any new injuries.

That said, if he does miss time, I agree that Ish should stay with the 2nd unit, and that the Pistons should start Kennard at PG, along with Bullock at SG and Robinson at SF.

Brown is the guy I'd eventually like to see start at PG, but I doubt Casey will rush him into a starting roll, and he probably isn't ready anyway.
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This Year

Post  BallinD on Sat Sep 22, 2018 4:50 pm

Has probably the most promise of any in a while, probably since the year after our last playoff debacle in Cleveland.  

Wondering if League Pass should be a go or a go-to-hell kinda thing?!?!
Wondering if we finally get a PG?!?!
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The Donald; Reggie J

Post  Sparma on Thu Sep 20, 2018 8:53 pm

The Trump camp should hire you as a spokesperson! Day to day, I'd think a huge challenge for his defenders would be not only justifying his rash pronouncements, but retaining their coherence in such a way that they fit plausibly with ongoing policy aims. Or maybe it's getting the big impact with his most ardent supporters that his statements deliver while reassuring more moderate supporters that ongoing policy aims are being served.

Anyway, on the Pistons front, I need to figure out whether my win prediction's affected by the news of Reggie J's ongoing physical woes. Not much of a fan, but they clearly played better with him out there last year (as opposed to the preceding season).

If Reggie J's ailing into the season, I wonder if they might be better off with Calderon out there with the first unit rather than Ish. Calderon must be horrible on D by now, given how bad he already was on that end when he last played here, at a much younger age. Still, I'm wondering if the first unit functions better with him out there rather than Ish, certainly on O, especially if it turns out that Blake can handle point Forward duties ably this year.


Murph wrote:I wouldn't exactly use the phrase "lying ignoramus".  But yes, Trump continually makes verbal gaffes.  He is not a professional politician;  he was a CEO of his own companies.  He has never had to be careful with his words, and it shows.  In addition, he is getting elderly.  He is 72 years old, which IMO contributes to his sometime tortured lexicon.

Nevertheless, the Trump has brilliant instincts.  He apparently is a policy genius, or else knows who to appoint and listen to in his cabinet concerning policy.  I think is foreign policy team of Pompeo, Mattis, Haley and Kelly are brilliant.  They seem to know who and when to threaten (Kim Yong Un), and when to back off (Asaad).  And his economic team of Mnuchin, Ross, Kurshner and Mulveyney are equally accomplished.

The net result is that Trump is a policy savant.  


Contrast Trump with Obama.  Obama was the opposite.  Obama was incredibly articulate and measured in his rhetoric, but IMO, made many serious policy blunders, particularly when it came to foreign policy.  And Obama was apt to listen to terrible advice from incompetent cabinet members such as Hillary Clinton and John Kerry.


Anyway...on to basketball.  Only 3 more days until training camp opens!

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Let's get this party started

Post  deusXango on Thu Sep 20, 2018 5:58 pm

BallinD, I can support the idea of Kennard and Brown auditioning for PG however, we've got two promising rookies in the 2nd round that could very well be the redemption of past failures in the draft; lowering the payroll, developing the untapped youth (Kennard, Thomas, Brown, Rob 3, and Ellenson), could bode well for the future and get us in the playoffs now.

Walker and Randle are not who I'm campaigning for, just a couple of f'instances until the front office can get their sh!t together....it's time to move in a competitive direction. Think on this:

PG Walker-Brown
SG Kennard-Thomas
SF Bullock-Robinson III
PF Griffin-Randle
C  Drummond-Ellenson
Insert your own favorite players here.

If Bullock performs like last year or improves, he should be rewarded with a decent contract. Kennard should be unleashed and I'm counting on Casey turning Kennard and Bullock into something special. Quiet as it's kept, the rookies are NBA ready and all they need is someone (Casey) to have confidence in them; the rookies and Rob 3 should provide the Pistons with some stellar bench play, locking down opposing perimeter players and putting points on the board. It's time for Ellenson to toughen up, man up, and play defense or...….

I'm promoting the concept of "addition through subtraction" when it comes to the current roster, I'm also promoting development of youth, allowing chemistry to form, and playing a set rotation consistently. The promised offense sounds exciting, fits the personnel the Pistons have, and will keep defenses on their heels. The key is the ball not sticking.
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Around The Way

Post  BallinD on Thu Sep 20, 2018 3:03 pm

DX, I'm with Kennard and Bruce Brown auditioning for PG, and keeping Ish running the second unit. Can we see what those two can do, while keeping an eye out for anyone interesting out there in the NBA universe. Right now we have a plethora of wings and a dearth of PGs.

Can Casey as pg whisperer unlock the Galloway?

Point forward to the fore, even more now than ever.

Get some balance.
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I'm off the chain in case you forgot

Post  deusXango on Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:36 pm

We ALL know that this team is phuqued as long as we pin our hopes on Reggie Jackson guiding it successfully through a season; he's already demonstrated that he doesn't have what it takes to maximize the talent that's assembled around him, nor can he remain on the court due to these "jack-in-the-box" health issues....we've yet to be hit with a season ending asthma attack but, a PG with bad wheels, going against todays starting PG's, is the poster child of Doom & Gloom!

Tolliver, Ilyasova, Morris, Harris, and Tolliver again, all capable 6' 10" PF's brought in to be contributing big men, only to be traded or just let go and we're left with Jon Leuer; no way in Hades will I be sold on Leuer being the best of the lot! I only left Josh Smith off the list because of the coaching he received while in Detroit....my personal feeling is it sucked, plus SVG/Gores are still paying him to be invisible. Drummond and Griffin need/deserve a far more talented and dependable backup big man than Jon Leuer.

How difficult can it be to turn Reggie Jackson, Jon Leuer, Stanley Johnson, Langston Galloway, Ish Smith, and our 2020 or 21 first round draft pick into a quality starting PG and PF to backup our starting big men? Kemba Walker and Julius Randle anyone?
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Re: FORUM

Post  deusXango on Wed Sep 19, 2018 5:46 pm

finger wag
Murph wrote:I wouldn't exactly use the phrase "lying ignoramus".  But yes, Trump continually makes verbal gaffes.  He is not a professional politician;  he was a CEO of his own companies.  He has never had to be careful with his words, and it shows.  In addition, he is getting elderly.  He is 72 years old, which IMO contributes to his sometime tortured lexicon.

Nevertheless, the Trump has brilliant instincts.  He apparently is a policy genius, or else knows who to appoint and listen to in his cabinet concerning policy.  I think is foreign policy team of Pompeo, Mattis, Haley and Kelly are brilliant.  They seem to know who and when to threaten (Kim Yong Un), and when to back off (Asaad).  And his economic team of Mnuchin, Ross, Kurshner and Mulveyney are equally accomplished.

The net result is that Trump is a policy savant.  


Contrast Trump with Obama.  Obama was the opposite.  Obama was incredibly articulate and measured in his rhetoric, but IMO, made many serious policy blunders, particularly when it came to foreign policy.  And Obama was apt to listen to terrible advice from incompetent cabinet members such as Hillary Clinton and John Kerry.


Anyway...on to basketball.  Only 3 more days until training camp opens!


That's what I'm talking about, Detroit Sports Talk. Where the hell is Don?
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Big Two

Post  BallinD on Wed Sep 19, 2018 5:21 pm

May want to put that Big Three talk on hold until Groundhogs Day is over.

Calderon or Ish to the fore, and Bruce Brown might wanna buckle up.

Apparently Weggie hasn't been on the court yet this summer...sheesh. So much for my trade prediction.facepalm
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Re: FORUM

Post  Murph on Wed Sep 19, 2018 3:07 pm

I wouldn't exactly use the phrase "lying ignoramus". But yes, Trump continually makes verbal gaffes. He is not a professional politician; he was a CEO of his own companies. He has never had to be careful with his words, and it shows. In addition, he is getting elderly. He is 72 years old, which IMO contributes to his sometime tortured lexicon.

Nevertheless, the Trump has brilliant instincts. He apparently is a policy genius, or else knows who to appoint and listen to in his cabinet concerning policy. I think is foreign policy team of Pompeo, Mattis, Haley and Kelly are brilliant. They seem to know who and when to threaten (Kim Yong Un), and when to back off (Asaad). And his economic team of Mnuchin, Ross, Kurshner and Mulveyney are equally accomplished.

The net result is that Trump is a policy savant.


Contrast Trump with Obama. Obama was the opposite. Obama was incredibly articulate and measured in his rhetoric, but IMO, made many serious policy blunders, particularly when it came to foreign policy. And Obama was apt to listen to terrible advice from incompetent cabinet members such as Hillary Clinton and John Kerry.


Anyway...on to basketball. Only 3 more days until training camp opens!

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Trump Presidency

Post  Sparma on Wed Sep 19, 2018 12:07 am

You've made about as good a case for the Trump presidency as I've heard, Murph. I wish there were an instant agreed upon fact checker on both sides, but there isn't as far as I know. If I'm following you, you're not really defending Trump against the charge of being a lying ignoramus (whereas Don will point to yet more deceitful behavior by Democrats y and z), but you're focused on the efficacy of the policies. Interesting stuff. A pretty good exchange, I'd say, that's kept the forum going during dull basketball days. That said, I'm sure we're all about ready to return to basketball. Or maybe we don't really want to given the lackluster seasons that likely lie ahead.

Murph wrote:And while we're on the topic of the Middle East, how about Obama's moronic Iran Nuclear Deal?  I mean Obama gave them back their $150 billion, and basically allowed them to proceed with developing nuclear centrifuges and missile delivery systems, without any verification or supervision whatsoever.  He was even kind enough to fly in $1.7 billion in untraceable cold hard cash, so the Iranians could sponsor any act of terror they desired, without it ever being traced back to them.  God only knows what happened to the cash.

Obama's dislike of Netanyahu and Israel is well documented.  IMO, the Iran Nuclear Deal was Obama's attempt to promote Iran as a nuclear power so that they could act as a political, military and nuclear counter-balance to Israel, in a kind of "mutual assured destruction" of the Middle East.

You can say what you want about the Israelis and their treatment of the Palestinians.  I am not in favor of Israel colonizing and eventually annexing the West Bank.   Nevertheless, it's a terrible, terrible idea to allow the Iranians to develop nuclear weapons.  Talk about Radical Islamic Terrorism...with nukes no less.


Anyway, needless to say, it took Trump no time at all to tear up that agreement.  I only hope it isn't too late.



I think it's safe to say that Obama and his Secretary of State stooges, Hillary and Kerry, were unmitigated foreign policy disasters.
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Blake

Post  Sparma on Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:58 pm

That's a great report by Casey on Blake.  Cause for optimism.

Admittedly, it's uncanny how often these hopeful pre-season updates turn out not to translate into increased success.

There are exceptions though where players really help themselves in the off-season.  I remember an already outstanding Carl Yastrzemski transforming himself into a '67 Triple Crown winner and MVP, mainly through weight training, if I'm remembering an SI story from 50 years ago correctly.

Also, I just listened to the excellent [Houston] Astroball (on Audible) that conveys, among other things, how combining analytical work [in the "Nerdroom"] with conventional eye tests and some challenging of the numbers contributed to their success.

JD Martinez was the one who got away, to Detroit.  Evidently, he adjusted his swing (into more of a power arc) and told them he'd figured things out in the winter, but then didn't get the promised ABs in spring training.  Once moved to Detroit, he immediately demonstrated his power [in spring training] then went on a magnificent run with the Tigers.  After feeling hurt originally about having been an upstanding team player, having worked hard at improving, but then not getting the promised opportunity, he later reconciled with the Houston front office.  Jeff Luhnow, Houston's brilliant GM, later congratulated him, wished him well, and told him they'd blown it by not giving JB the merited chance, and missing his emergence.

Anyway, I really hope Blake can improve over last year.  He put up very good numbers, but it's good to hear he's so keenly intent on improvement.
BallinD wrote:

Been watching a lot of comedy lately and more than a few roasts with one of my buddies.  Nothing like busting a gut to make this crazy world seem crazy-fun "cray cray" rather than maddeningly insane (which it actually is, IMHO).  

Gotta shout out to Blake on this one.  Go forth big fella and keep it intense, keep it legit, and keep it light, cause it's a long season.

Kool-Aid: Casey on Blake

"Blake is a leader by nature, I think. And also, he’s a leader by example. He had probably the most impressive, organized workout regimen this summer that I’ve seen of any veteran player like him. He hired statisticians to come in and keep stats of his shooting, his stretching regimen. He brought in other workout players to simulate five other players so he had the whole gamut covered. That showed me, too, that he was organized and hopefully other players saw that and he led by example. Like Stan said last year, him coming in mid-season like that is almost impossible to come in and establish himself as a physical leader or leader by example or by your words. He’s done a lot of things as far as this summer organizing workouts in L.A. and doing different things to show his leadership."
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Fake News From Murph

Post  WTF on Tue Sep 18, 2018 6:37 pm

Murph wrote:You libs will say anything to make yourselves feel better.  Now you're trying to give Obama credit for Trump's economy two into the Trump Administration, when Obama's economy never grew faster than 2.6% on an annualized basis, and the unemployment rate never fell below 4.6% under Obama.  Most years, the unemployment rate averaged between 5% and 10% under Obama.   facepalm

We're currently growing at 4.2% with an unemployment rate of 3.9%.   tb

Those pesky facts again.


Um....and if you want to see the min wage at $15 an hour, and more climate accords, you're going to have win a few elections.

facepalm facepalm facepalm facepalm facepalm facepalm facepalm facepalm facepalm facepalm facepalm facepalm facepalm facepalm facepalm facepalm
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Re: FORUM

Post  BallinD on Tue Sep 18, 2018 3:52 pm



Been watching a lot of comedy lately and more than a few roasts with one of my buddies.  Nothing like busting a gut to make this crazy world seem crazy-fun "cray cray" rather than maddeningly insane (which it actually is, IMHO).  

Gotta shout out to Blake on this one.  Go forth big fella and keep it intense, keep it legit, and keep it light, cause it's a long season.

Kool-Aid: Casey on Blake

"Blake is a leader by nature, I think. And also, he’s a leader by example. He had probably the most impressive, organized workout regimen this summer that I’ve seen of any veteran player like him. He hired statisticians to come in and keep stats of his shooting, his stretching regimen. He brought in other workout players to simulate five other players so he had the whole gamut covered. That showed me, too, that he was organized and hopefully other players saw that and he led by example. Like Stan said last year, him coming in mid-season like that is almost impossible to come in and establish himself as a physical leader or leader by example or by your words. He’s done a lot of things as far as this summer organizing workouts in L.A. and doing different things to show his leadership."
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Re: FORUM

Post  Murph on Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:34 am

"I see you working brother and you've no idea how much I appreciate you keeping on point; this is a sports forum, not a dumb ass, insulting, backwoods 1950 mentality, political platform to sell Donald Trump on sports fans who're hungry for intelligent Detroit Sports Talk, like the forum was designed for!!! After reading the veiled racist posts, many of which are misleading in their content, I can't imagine what the author hopes to accomplish."

DX...several points here.  

1)  I didn't notice you calling for an end to the political talk on this forum when Wise, BallinD and Oracle were bashing Trump.  But now the you've gotten Don and myself riled up and posting pro-Trump stuff, you want to go back to sports.  I get it.

2)  I notice you didn't actually refute anything I posted.  You just called it "veiled racist posts" with "misleading content."  I get that also.

3)  I would be more than happy to go back to posting about sports.  I begged everyone to quit the political talk from the beginning.  But if ya'll want to argue politics, I'll argue 'til the cows come home.
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Re: FORUM

Post  BallinD on Tue Sep 18, 2018 4:04 am

DX Wrote:

I hope Casey gives him an opportunity like the one Donovan Mitchell got in Utah. With the offense running through Blake Griffin, I can see Luke as our starting PG....I remember the Warriors having a ball dominate, diva, as their PG, named Monta Ellis (forgotten man now) and trading him in favor of "no defense" playing Steph Curry, who could only shoot....the rest is history. Thoughts on trading our diva and giving Luke a chance.

My take:

Maybe after a preseason where  Reggie is featured enough to tease his former prowess, he can be traded and we can roll with Luke.  I love it, but that is me. I keep that idea in my secret hopes. I can see that even if it hurts us this year in the minds of some, we all know Reggie wont be here after he exhausts his contract, so why not get on with the "whooot whooot" and bring Luke up to speed.  I think he can do it, at least I think it would be fun to watch him try.  Personally, I believe Luke can be special.  We have examples of Curry and Harden who made that transition (not sayin he will be that great).  We are not going to win anything with Weggie at the helm, again that is just me speaking what I think and feel.  

As for Blake, I also decided I would not want to make that trade. I'm excited to see what he can do here.
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Can we return to sanity?

Post  deusXango on Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:18 am

BallinD wrote:
Two Tweets


A guy named Sham:
Here's a comprehensive list of all the rookies in NBA history who have posted a 41/44/85 split with at least 70 games played:
Stephen Curry
Luke Kennard

By Lazarus Jackson:
No to the first point, yes to the second
(responding to )
    Halbridious:
Saw a couple of Jimmy Butler / Blake Griffin trades.  First I have to consider that a fairly lateral move talent-wise.  And I love Jimmy.  Secondly that leaves the pistons with almost no backup big man whatsoever and no true power forward.  So just stop with that particular trade.

I considered the same trade today before I saw this tweet. I like Blake, but Jimmy is younger, and has more value (he's a wing) Thoughts?
BallinD, this is not the time to be considering any lateral moves, talent wise, but why aren't the talking heads talking about trade possibilities for Reggie Jackson and Jon Leuer? For every excuse one can come up with for not trading those two clowns there must be ten reasons for keeping Blake Griffin and Andre Drummond together.

I see you working brother and you've no idea how much I appreciate you keeping on point; this is a sports forum, not a dumb ass, insulting, backwoods 1950 mentality, political platform to sell Donald Trump on sports fans who're hungry for intelligent Detroit Sports Talk, like the forum was designed for!!! After reading the veiled racist posts, many of which are misleading in their content, I can't imagine what the author hopes to accomplish. Damn, I miss Don's rants on Drummonds lack of defensive ability, at least it was basketball and not the promotion of madness.

Oh by the way, that Curry/Kennard comparative stat works for me as I'm a big fan of Luke Kennard and I hope his future takes an upward curve and I hope Casey gives him an opportunity like the one Donovan Mitchell got in Utah. With the offense running through Blake Griffin, I can see Luke as our starting PG....I remember the Warriors having a ball dominate, diva, as their PG, named Monta Ellis (forgotten man now) and trading him in favor of "no defense" playing Steph Curry, who could only shoot....the rest is history. Thoughts on trading our diva and giving Luke a chance.
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My Tweeps Are Saying

Post  BallinD on Mon Sep 17, 2018 11:24 pm

Two Tweets


A guy named Sham:
Here's a comprehensive list of all the rookies in NBA history who have posted a 41/44/85 split with at least 70 games played:
Stephen Curry
Luke Kennard

By Lazarus Jackson:
No to the first point, yes to the second
(responding to )
    Halbridious:
Saw a couple of Jimmy Butler / Blake Griffin trades.  First I have to consider that a fairly lateral move talent-wise.  And I love Jimmy.  Secondly that leaves the pistons with almost no backup big man whatsoever and no true power forward.  So just stop with that particular trade.

Me:
I considered the same trade today before I saw this tweet. I like Blake, but Jimmy is younger, and has more value (he's a wing) Thoughts?
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Iran

Post  Murph on Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:31 pm

And while we're on the topic of the Middle East, how about Obama's moronic Iran Nuclear Deal?  I mean Obama gave them back their $150 billion, and basically allowed them to proceed with developing nuclear centrifuges and missile delivery systems, without any verification or supervision whatsoever.  He was even kind enough to fly in $1.7 billion in untraceable cold hard cash, so the Iranians could sponsor any act of terror they desired, without it ever being traced back to them.  God only knows what happened to the cash.

Obama's dislike of Netanyahu and Israel is well documented.  IMO, the Iran Nuclear Deal was Obama's attempt to promote Iran as a nuclear power so that they could act as a political, military and nuclear counter-balance to Israel, in a kind of "mutual assured destruction" of the Middle East.

You can say what you want about the Israelis and their treatment of the Palestinians. I am not in favor of Israel colonizing and eventually annexing the West Bank. Nevertheless, it's a terrible, terrible idea to allow the Iranians to develop nuclear weapons. Talk about Radical Islamic Terrorism...with nukes no less.


Anyway, needless to say, it took Trump no time at all to tear up that agreement.  I only hope it isn't too late.



I think it's safe to say that Obama and his Secretary of State stooges, Hillary and Kerry, were unmitigated foreign policy disasters.


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ISIS

Post  Murph on Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:21 pm

And how about Obama's and John Kerry's handling of ISIS?  First, in a neo-conservative effort to overthrown Assad in Syria, Obama armed the wrong rebels. Obama literally armed and sponsored the rise of ISIS.  Then Obama completely ignored the problem for years, famously calling ISIS the "JV team".

Then ISIS grew completely out of control, and took over more than half of Syria and parts of Iraq, and in so doing committed heinous acts of terror and displaced millions of Syrian refugees.  So what did Obama do?  Well, he talked Angela Merkel and the Germans, along with the rest of the Euro-trash, into taking in millions of those refugees, including thousands of ISIS fighters who had infiltrated.  Geesh, that was brilliant.

And still Obama treated ISIS with kidd gloves, allowing them to fester and metastasize in Syria and throughout the Middle East, Europe and the rest of the world. ISIS was the inspiration behind the San Bernardino terror attack, the Orlando nightclub terror attack and many other attacks here in the United States, and countless others throughout Europe and the rest of the world.

And still Obama nothing.  He refused to even utter the words "Radical Islamic Terrorism."  It was almost as if he wanted to see radical Islamic terrorists rise to power, overthrow Assad, and take control of Syria and the Middle East.  You don't suppose...?  I mean no one could have been that incompetent by accident...could they?


Anyway, regardless of Obama's motivations, it took Trump about 6 months to bomb ISIS into oblivion, clean up Obama's mess, and restore order to the Middle East.  clap


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Late to the party

Post  Sparma on Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:57 pm

cool breeze wrote:
WTF and others want to kneel during the National Anthem and love Mr. K and Nike. Others like me want to show respect for those in the armed forces and law enforcement who have given their lives.
BallinD: Show respect like your president does, right?!?! Link to Washington Examiner Article about trump sitting and chatting during National Anthem: Trump Sits This One Out (Anthem) Do as I say, not as I do, huh. Clever!

I've never voted for a Republican presidential candidate, and surely wasn't tempted with Trump.

On many social issues, I'm a bleeding heart liberal.

Still, I feel somewhat torn on the kneeling issue:

Pro: a) there's plenty to protest, plenty that stands in need of protesting, b) the players have the right to protest (well, not in the NBA on the sideline, but that's a different story), c) I take players at their word when they say they intend no disrespect to the flag.

But, caveat: the fact that no offence is intended doesn't mean that none is taken, even legitimately so. The reaction to their action isn't within their control. If many report feeling the honor of the national anthem and of flag is diminished, that's their prerogative. The protesters don't control the symbolism of the flag in its entirety, but merely their actions. Symbols aren't controlled by one set of actors.

Pro: Trump's got to be a buffoon even too often for (most of) his supporters to stomach, and readily solicits a reaction.

Caveat: Even though Trump himself didn't show respect, that doesn't necessarily mean he not tapping into a sentiment that's important to many (and with which I sympathize).

Pro: the owners brought the political into the arena to begin with by starting with the national anthem and organizing rituals around it. Given that initiative it seems too late to ask not to bring politics into sport. They got the ball rolling, now they don't like where it's headed. A reaction could have be expected, especially among those who find the lyrics of the national anthem suspect.

Caveat: A. Bartlett Giamatti wrote a book about baseball as an attempt to recover paradise (Take Time for Paradise). I had a sense of the recovery of paradise when walking into lit up Tiger Stadium as an eight year old with Willie Horton as the first larger than life player I saw on the field. A magical moment that I haven't been able to recapture since. So yes, part of me would like to separate sports from politics, even as another part of me realizes that's not tenable anymore.

My two cents.
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Nonsense

Post  Murph on Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:41 pm

You libs will say anything to make yourselves feel better.  Now you're trying to give Obama credit for Trump's economy two into the Trump Administration, when Obama's economy never grew faster than 2.6% on an annualized basis, and the unemployment rate never fell below 4.6% under Obama.  Most years, the unemployment rate averaged between 5% and 10% under Obama.   facepalm

We're currently growing at 4.2% with an unemployment rate of 3.9%.   tb

Those pesky facts again.


Um....and if you want to see the min wage at $15 an hour, and more climate accords, you're going to have win a few elections.
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