Johnson's post game interview

[cool breeze]

Stanley said Eric Moreland was the Piston's MVP. It is who Stanley Johnson plays with that determines if he will or will not get a chance to show his potential as a player. He does not play well with this current starting group. Who does? I think Ballin's and Sparma's statements regarding floor spacing is true. However, this starting unit is still horrible in my opinion. The Pistons looked sluggish at the start of the game. The Bucks were getting easy shots in the paint. Ish Smith could not guard Eric B.. The starters looked to be too dependent on Blake Griffin. The iso stuff was really lame. It looked to me that the Pistons were going to get blown out again until the 2nd unit took the floor. This time Blake Griffin went to the bench and Eric Moreland did his thing which was disrupt any shot attempts in the paint. It was Eric Moreland combining with an amazing performance by Stanley Johnson who did not anyone he guarded to score in the first half. And the guy he guarded the most was the Bucks superstar Giannis who was unable to drive the ball against Johnson all night long. The other guy who changed things was Buycks. He was scratching and clawing quick as a rabbit on defense and he ran the offense well. But who can forget the incredible energy Eric Moreland showed the fans in the first half of that game. He ended up with a double double and was a key passer in the motion offense.

I hate saying this but the Pistons play much better without Blake Griffin. He is trying to do too much. In the 2nd half when Detroit was trying to run the motion offense, AD had to instruct Blake where he needed to be. Blake stands above the free throw line. He takes up Drummond's space when the ball is supposed to go into the hands of Drummond at the free throw line. But Blake was standing there looking as if he had no idea what was supposed to happen or where the ball was designed to go so wing cutters could make their moves.

There was no doubt that the 2nd unit without any of the starters was the superior basketball team last night relating to either the Pistons starters or the Bucks starters. Their high commitment to working their butts off to get loose balls and defensive rebounds was refreshing. Their commitment to playing hard nosed defense was amazing.

One final comment about Johnson's post game interview. When asked about what he did to turn things around from his bad performance in the Toronto game, Stanley said that he is still trying to figure himself out relating to how he can be most effective as an NBA player. He didn't come out and say it but I will. If you play with dysfunctional players as a young developing player instead of solid knowledgable high basketball IQ vets, and you are forced to stand alone in the baseline corner because the coach runs a lame offense, then it will take an extremely long time to figure things out. I go back to Pope and his development. KCP played a lot of minutes with dysfunctional players who ran a dysfunctional offense created by SVG and his assistant coaches. KCP spent his entire stay with the Pistons standing in the baseline corner. SVG adored his point guards who dribbled around trying to create instead of the entire team being involved with team movement. I still don't hold much hope for this Piston team. They showed a lot of movement on offense and hard core effort and smarts on defense in this game. But that has happened a few times before. It seems that the coaches and some of the highest paid players forget what needs to be done to win games. They revert back to their comfort zone and become losers. This coach is a big part of causing the dysfunction in my mind. Will he trot out Blake Griffin to be the MAN or will he blend Griffin into the motion offense and get Griffin to give a better effort on defense? Also, will AD mature enough to become a more effective defender and defensive rebounder. When Moreland comes in and plays really hard and has some success, Drummond then appears to pick up his effort on defense too. I was happy that SVG left the 2nd unit out on the floor in the 4th quarter instead of bringing back any of the starters. That decision was encouraging that maybe SVG will do the right thing and bench his starters if they start slacking off.

Kennard is going through his share of bad luck and bad times on the floor. He is not getting the shots he likes. His defense is suffering too. Lute needs to keep his confidence and find a way to help this team when he does get in the game. It appears that Henry Ellenson has experienced another season with little to no development. Isn't it time to get him down to the G league for some playing time? Nobody can be effective when you sit on the bench for long periods of time. It was no fluke that Henry looked like an outstanding prospect in the first regular game of the season when he scored 17 points. Ellenson had been in game shape and had been playing in the pre season games and in the summer league. Now he is invisible as if he is not really on the team. Good win. I hope the coach learned something from this win but doubt he did.

[Sparma]

Detroit announced at 9-1 against opponents on B2Bs (now 10-1). But the Bucks were 9-3 (now 9-4) playing the second game of B2Bs.

In search of the spacing that BallinD's featured, SVG's starting of Ennis rather than Stanley J makes sense. Ennis at 36.9 for career from 3, a tick below that this year. Kelser later commented on Stanley doing great off the bench. Outstanding game by him. Good adjustment by SVG.

With the Bucks up 18-15, Kelser commented: "They're piling up the points inside." Yet the Pistons ended up way outscoring them inside. More credit to SVG?! Team playing hard!?

Good win. They've got two winnable games coming up v Orlando and reeling Heat. IF they can win those two, the playoffs should be back within reach.

[Note: I expect to have years ahead to be negative about the team, given their grim prospects beyond next year, so am trying to be positive today.]

[BallinD]

Not because we won, but because we played a team on the second night of a B2B. Line em up. Any other B2B teams looking for a beatdown? Wanna try us? We Can Do This!

[cool breeze]

I played one season on a high school football team that lost the first 4 games of the season. We met the following Monday with the coach before practice which was a day we always practiced with no pads. There was silence in the room when the coach entered. We all feared him. He had a mustache like Adolf Hitler but we all knew he really cared about each player becoming the best football player we could end up being before our playing days ended. This coach seldom had a losing team. Our team had suffered a lot of injuries that put some good players out for the season before the first game was over. I can't remember everything this coach said to us but I do remember one statement that I had not heard before. " How much suffering do you want to experience? After losing any football game you not only hurt everywhere because of the amount of physical contact you endure but your brain hurts and you suffer because your spirit has been defeated. Somehow a light bulb was turned on in our heads as we realized that the coach saw right through us and knew our pain. He wasn't bitching us out as usual. He just said we are going full pads today. We knocked each other almost unconscious in that practice. Then in the next game, we were a different team. Even one skinning tall guy who had to play in the offensive line because of injuries was kicking ass and taking names in that game.

I only bring up my experience because it was very noticeable that the current players on the Piston roster show significant signs of having the same feeling that my teammates felt long ago. They are frustrated and show visible signs of helplessness with the exception of AD and BG who were laughing together over something on the bench in the 4th quarter of the blowout loss to Charlotte. The players are not playing well together as a team or individually. They do not have a unified spirit. The coach always tells his team what the specific game plan is going to be against the next opponent. What I am seeing is that some of the same players are playing defense the same way with no adjustments for each game regardless of who the opponent has been. One player doing that is Andre Drummond who is the 2nd highest paid athlete on the team. If Dwight Howard stands out beyond the 3 point line, should AD go out close to him or switch and defend someone closer to the basket and then switch back on Howard when he rolls to the basket? Correct me if I am wrong but I didn't think that Howard was a 3 point threat. Either the head coach is telling some players just skip the meeting today on our game plan and do whatever you want to do during the next game or the players are ignoring the game plan. I wonder when that happens what the players are thinking who are trying to execute the game plan.

When some of us call out the team saying the team is showing major signs of dysfunction we mean that all of the players are not on the same page. When my old high school team decided to all get on the same page and listen carefully to what the coach wanted from each one of us, we started to form a real bond and we had each other's backs.Some of us had to sacrifice and play a different position to make the team better. Some of the players have been doing their own thing. They go out and get their stats after taking the advise of their agents instead of their coach. Many have been guilty of doing that same thing on other teams they have played on including their college teams. Is it possible for this group of individuals to get to the point where they have had enough and start calling out the players who are preventing the team from playing as a solid unit? Those players who do want to play the right way and do the right thing and are not looking to show off and just play to get stats, will have to stand up and be counted. I know that last season during the players only meeting that type of thing did take place one time. Maybe after tonight's game if the team is embarrassed as badly as they have been over the past few games, some of the players will call for a players only meeting. If the head coach or the owner tries to stand in their way like they did last season to protect their pets, then the players need to ignore their nonsense and try to create something new that works. The coach and owner can bench them if they want and trade them. Who cares because going to another team would be a blessing for some of our players.

This coaching staff is pushing all of the wrong buttons so far. The team chemistry could not be worse than it is now. The owner and the head coach have contributed to causing this mess with their dumb ass trades. There is only one way to go now and that is up. The only new player who should see the floor from now to the end of the season should be Blake Griffin. I do not believe that throwing Ennis or Nelson into the rotation has done anything positive. Blake Griffin should not being playing the role of a back up center either. That experiment has not worked. Blake Griffin should just be trying to fill the role that Tobias Harris filled but try to move closer to the basket before he shoots his jump shot. The Pistons should not be using anything other than the motion offense and it should be up to Griffin to make his mark within that type of offense. How can this head coach and his staff be this stupid to revert back to the stand around iso offense that has never worked. Everyone is deferring to Blake Griffin. The players look like they are a bunch of high school players with no coach who are playing in a pick up game with one NBA player. There are no signs of any team work either on offense or defense. Players like Bullock are not playing with sound discipline on either end of the floor. All players must get a lot smarter. This Piston team has less talent than most any other NBA team now. Therefore, they will need to play a lot harder than their opponents from here out. The coach will need to work with the players he has and get the best out of them until he is fired. Go out strong SVG and stop trying to appease the owner who has created this current mess. Sit anyone who is slacking. Then we fans will start watching again.

This team cannot tank. We have no number one pick. I wonder if the owner remembers that fact. The Clippers must think that Tom Gores is a complete idiot.

[WTF]

I still have to blame the fans because as consumers of a product they can determine quite a bit especially when it comes sport franchises.  Say what you want about the Fords and the Detroit Lions they put just enough on the Field that you're tittering on the idea this might be the year.   Fan at Die Hard Fans for that very reason but still gets more than it's fair share of criticism especially from the media.  However the Fan base will sellout Ford Field all wearing bags on their heads and collectively boo.  

These Casual Pistons Fans just falls in line with whatever the media spills out.  The media never ask of the tough questions they would levy at the Lions, Tiger and Wings hell even the Wolverines are held to a higher standard of expectations.  Breaking even will never be acceptable for any of these teams but this damn Pistons can be under .500 year after year and get very little criticism from either fans or the media.  

Why do we allow Gores and SVG to ruin this team without any resistance at all just once I would like to hear the media really go after SVG and Gores with tough questions, to call them out on their flaws and fuckups oppose to all the excuses.  Why do they allow SVG to decide what gets fed to the masses and allow him to scapegoat players instead of him taking responsibility for his failures.

I really hate the way we have been conditioned to settle, I hate the way we can no longer recognize what Pistons DNA is anymore,  I hate that we have no idea what stardom looks like after seeing the likes of Zeke, and Hill that we see AD as a franchise player.  What's is wrong, why are we accepting this.

[BallinD]

Rrrrrride the BBBBBBBBBOban train.  Doc finally figured it out, SVG never did.  He rode Boban to victory, everything that I've been saying, 18pts on 15 minutes, and no he didn't hijack the offense or crush the defense, but hey, at this point who cares, just get the fat man out of there.  I do watch LAC to see Boban and Tobias whenever they're on.  Boban is such a good guy and its easy to root for him.  He was exhausted after the game and spent some time signing autographs for fans.  When can't rooting for your faves be fun...when SVG is in the mix.

[Sparma]

Boban got a total of 1 minute in the 4 games preceding last night. With 15 minutes last night, he scores 18, along with 6 bounds. Can't any coach figure out how valuable this guy is when put to use properly? Credit to Pops (again), who seemed to have figured it out, also getting very good defensive ratings out of him.

[Murph]

Dear Mr. Gores,  

You are a brilliant private equity fund manager.  You recognized that the Pistons were a huge bargain in in 2011, and bought the team for the bargain basement price of $300 million in the depths of the Great Recession.  It took a lot of liquid assets and a lot of balls to do that.  I tip my hat to you.

And the risk you took has paid off handsomely.  In their most recent evaluation of NBA franchises, Forbes Magazine valued the Pistons at $1.1 billion.    

But as a brilliant investor, it's important to understand exactly what your area of expertise is, and what is not your expertise.  I'm sure you are aware that you don't know all that much about the inner workings of professional basketball teams.  That's why you rely on outside council from people such as Mr. Tellem.  But Mr. Tellem's expertise is as a sports agent, not as an evaluator of professional basketball talent.

Furthermore, you don't seem to receive a lot of personal satisfaction from owning the Pistons, as other team owners do, such as Mr. Cuban.  You rarely even attend Pistons games.  That's understandable; I'm sure you're a very busy man.

Also, I know you are civic minded, and still hold a connection to the Michigan area.  You showed that through your generous donations to your hometown of Flint, even though you haven't lived in Flint in decades.  So I know you would be reluctant to relocate the Pistons to another city, which would leave Detroit without an NBA team, and would leave Piston fans disappointed and disillusions.

So Mr. Gores, please reconsider your ownership in the Detroit Pistons.  Buy low and sell high; that's your area of expertise.  That's what you do as an investor;  that's who you are.  You bought the Pistons at the perfect time, and now the team has increased in value by almost 400% in 7 short years.  

Mr. Gores, it's time to sell high.

Thank you for your consideration,
A Concerned Pistons Fan

[Phil-Good]

It's time for A change. This Organization has fallen to the joke of the League!

All this S.H.I.T when wrong with Mr I did not get the team.

Gores is A JOKE!

Van Gundy is desperate..

The Pistons are DEAD!

[BallinD]

David Blatt ...Fired got a Ship, good coaching mind.
Jerry Stackhouse ...G-League, Pistons DNA; Toronto Promising, but is he ready?
David Fizdale...fired
Ettore Messina (Spurs asst) Intriguing
Jay Wright (Villanova) Intriguing
Mark Jackson (probably not)
Jeff Van Gundy JK:fp): better than Stan, but don't want him.

[Sparma]

The five worst teams in the NBA have a combined losing streak of 0-34!! That tops the Lakers all-time streak of 33 (wins) in a row. That's almost impossible!

The next team has a one game win streak, but then come three more teams with an eight game losing streak, meaning that the bottom 9 teams have a combined streak of 1-42!! It's not so easy to tank effectively anymore.

(I'm going by Tankathon numbers).

Wish the Pistons had thrown their hat in with that lot.

[Sparma]

You're right, Don, that a lot of good stuff happened in the first half. Partway through I was thinking it was the most organized O I'd seen for a while by the Pistons. (Still, I doubt Toronto has lost to a team with a losing record at home that they had down by 6).

Secondly, I thought Avery brought some really good things to D early (then I lost confidence). In early games, they seemed to be talking a lot on D, moving a lot, and covering holes (much like Toronto did yesterday). Soccer analogy: you can help enormously as defender even if you're not all that good an individual defender. During his career, Germany's Franz Beckenbauer moved from O, to mid, to D, where he became a superstar. I think a bunch of guys were better individual defenders than him, but none had his organizational brilliance, also in initiating the move forward. No doubt, in their respective sports Franz was way better than Avery, but that gives a sense of the hope I had for Avery during the early run. The numbers and the eye test led me to lose confidence in Avery though as time went on. Could have been in part a health thing, but it looks like he's been in steady decline for several years.

Thirdly, concerning something you said a while ago: I don't think the Pistons needed to give up a first to get Griffin. Not sure what happened there because I think West was there by the time he signed, but I think West got the sense that they'd inked a bad, bad contract with excessively high risk. He (and Franks) would have settled for less. The three players would have done it, and I'd feel a lot better about it now.

We're bad on offense and defense, so not much to say.

When Andre left with 18 and 18, Blaha said he played hard and well, and Kelser concurred.  Beyond that....

Illustration of cause for misery: Stanley J (who's been stepping up his game) (a) takes a long shot out of his range and misses, then(b)  commits a goal tend on the other end, then (c) an offensive foul.  Think that was on three plays in a row.

If you're going to be vastly outplayed (as we were), please still play hard and smart (a la Miami).  This has gotten painful to watch.

Now the only question is becoming whether SVG gets another year.  I see him getting demoted in the front office, but still coaching next year, but with a short leash.  We're officially in "Wait till next year" territory, if we haven't been for some time.

Sparma I felt a bit more hopeful while watching the first half of this game. AD was engaged on defense. He looked completely different from the Charlotte game. Also, the team looked better on offense where players were moving without the ball and the point guard was not trying to create all of the offense using the dribble. A lot of shots by the Pistons were not falling but they all played hard. Toronto was on fire. However, in the 3rd the Pistons defense broke down a lot leaving Toronto with a lot of wide open looks. DeRosen went in and missed a dunk but what struck me was that there was no Piston in sight defending the paint. Two Piston players bumped into each other appearing not to know where they needed to be in the rotation. Toronto was sizzling from the outside but the Pistons helped them a lot by allowing uncontested shots. No defender in the area. Detroit fell behind by 20 points. Stanley Johnson had a melt down like you said. Every player looked frustrated and out of sync on offense. There was no movement by players in the half court offense. The offense looked exactly like it did against Charlotte where the team referred back to Ish Smith trying to create while other players stood around. All the pressure was on Blake Griffin to make something happen because Smith only passed the ball to Blake for almost the entire 3rd quarter.

One bright spot in this team to me was the play of Buycks. I think the Pistons have a real keeper in this point guard. He is tough and confident in himself even though he is a fringe player in the eyes of SVG. Buycks, in my opinion should be the starting point guard. He can defend really well and does not try to dominate the basketball. Buycks also knows how to run a half court offense and throws sharp passes to the places on the floor where the ball should be going. It is time to bring Smith off the bench if only because of the liability he causes for the Piston defense.

This team misses Tobias Harris and Avery Bradley. I agree that Bradley had a sub par shooting experience in his stay with the Pistons but he was a high basketball IQ player who could do a lot of things really well relating to playing defense and recognizing situations in the half court offense. We now have a completely different team with Blake Griffin. the combination of AD and Blake does not fit with the modern NBA. I believe the only way to save this franchise is to trade Andre Drummond this summer. I am not sure he really is still in high demand and trading him could get the Pistons a high number one pick and some rotation players who could upgrade this roster. Griffin's contract cannot be moved. The Pistons are stuck dead in the water with Blake. But Griffin might play much better if he played with different kind of center. Piston management has made a big mistake creating a team where the big money has been dedicated to the center position at the expense getting an elite point guard and 2 guard. Detroit's only two championship teams were driven by outstanding point guards and 2 guards in both eras. Why Joe Dumars strayed off course is a big mystery. It is not easy to acquire All Star caliber point guards and 2 guards. Teams like the Pistons have to do it through the draft. It is time to give up on the Andre Drummond experiment. He will play much better for a top tier basketball team where he can fill a role and not be the big cheese type player. AD is not skilled enough or smart enough to ever put a team on his shoulders night in and night out to make the Pistons a winner. Nobody should expect that out of him. And nobody should expect that out of Blake Griffin. It doesn't matter who the coach is for this current team. It is impossible for this team to win. And the nonsense about Reggie Jackson being the difference maker is really silly. He would make the Pistons better than they currently are at this moment but Reggie is not Isiah or Chauncey. Both Zeke and Mr BigShot were capable of giving their team what was needed on any given night. Zeke could be a ball distributor or a shooter. He could recognize which teammate was having a good night and those who were not playing well on any given night. They were leaders and not just shooter. They also could make that critical steal on defense if needed.

I want to see a change in strategy for the Detroit Pistons. It will be necessary to go directly to the bottom of the league but who wants to have a fake team capable of fighting for the 8th playoff spot for half of a of the season and then crashing and burning when other teams beat them with superior talent and smarts. This is a repeat of last season. SVG's selection of players should get him fired. Yet this last trade was all about Tom Gores as the press indicated. SVG and his staff recommended against the trade for good reason. Tom Gores needs to clean house and find a younger and smarter front office staff along with a younger coach who can teach the younger players for a few years as the Pistons create an entirely new team. I would keep Johnson as should be graduating from college this season along with Kennard and Ellenson. For that matter I would keep Buycks too. Give the young players a lot of experience and other young guys to the roster. Play hard and learn how to play together through the losing period. Add that top tier point guard and 2 guard through the draft. Find a outstanding athletic big man who is talented on the defensive end. Lose big and maybe if some team has a high draft pick this summer, the Pistons could trade AD and start the process before next fall. If not we will be seeing the same thing next year and for several years to come. This is a reality check for the owner. He needs to hire a good GM and then stay out of basketball matters. This owners decision to add Blake Griffin to an already dysfunctional basketball team has created a real nightmare. As constructed, the Pistons are going nowhere with or without Reggie Jackson. The playoff spots will soon be decided and then teams will be resting their players. When Detroit is out of contention for the 8th spot, Reggie might return and our Pistons might win a string of games but it will be fools gold. Will this owner attempt to sucker us into believing that next season will bring glory with this same type of team we have now? I think he will. It is true that SVG has no answers after the Pistons latest loss. No coach could have any answers for this team as constructed. This is Tom Gores mess now. He made the team even more dysfunctional with the Blake Griffin trade. This is all on Tom this time. If I were the coach, I would bring out a new starting lineup and bring the starters off the bench for a few games. Maybe something radical could help the team form a better bond. This team has no bond. They have no identity. It is time to start the re construction of the Detroit Pistons.  

[cool breeze]

I'm so serious about this because this whole thing has become so insane these days. this is not the organization I grew up with and respected.  I'm really not caring anymore if this league exist any longer.

I keep saying this as an Old Head we have lowered the bar so low, watered down the league so much that it is now just an shell of what it use to be.  I do hate casual fans,  I hate them because these are the fans the league wants to cater to and has lost touch with what it once was because it keeps trying to reinvent itself every time you turn around.  

I remember the old playoff format do any of you remember the 5 game series?  remember watching teams play back to back with only a day off to travel, remember the 2-3-2 & games series?  I found nothing wrong with these things and it made things tough this is one of many reason why I love 80's over this current crap we see now.  I don't like that we made things easier for todays player and on top of that pay them outrages salaries.  

It use to be fun watching a playoff series and see games 1 and 2 played back to back on a Saturday and Sunday it made for some great weekends. No one was whining about have days off between games.  

The three point shooting is a joke,  the overall style of defense is a joke, one and done is a joke,  these super teams are a joke,  lack of fundamentals is a joke,  social media use by players is a joke.  Really basketball as a whole on any level is a joke now so if we loss basketball I wouldn't be all that upset about it.  

Who remember recruiting a player and knowing you'll have him the full 4 years of college/  weren't we more excited about NCAA games back then seeing Ewing at Gergetown 4 years, Sampson, Bowie, Hakeem, and so year after year before seeing them in a pro uniform.  Now we get one and done players making 125 million dollar knowing absolutely nothing of simple basic fundamentals..

We got dumb owners like Gore and so on,  owner that have no connection to traditions of the team,  when have you last heard the words Pistons DNA, but this isn't just a Pistons issue who talks about Celtic Pride,  or Laker legacy.  Everything is a trend or a fade its not even real anymore it's all for show and giggles.  Fabricated false bravado hidden in useless analytics that fans are buying into.   

This **** is crazy

Many Piston fans old and young feel the same way WTF. This Piston team is a joke. How can we respect our highest paid players when they do not show respect for the game? This owners group do not know that they don't know squat about building a good basketball team. Now the hype is on Reggie Jackson of all players. How can anyone get excited about Reggie Jackson's return? This team looks retarded on defense. Being that Jackson might be the worst starting point guard defender in the NBA how will he help the defense get better? It will also take him a month to get in game shape.

I actually thought the Winter Olympics offered more fun for spectators. The women's hockey final between Canada and the USA was incredible. The women's team winning the first gold metal in the history of the Olympics for our country in cross country skiing sure was more exciting to watch than any NBA team. Plus the key woman on that team looked like a movie star and watching her in the interviews was beautiful as she showed that she has no ego and sure wasn't involved in her sport for the money. How greuling and painful cross country skiing is for the athletes. They all collapse and almost pass out at the finish line. Some athletes who used to play basketball in high school or college would almost reach the point of blackout because they were trying so hard.

If there is no management change, or ownership change along with several big trades involving the highest paid Pistons, then many of us will finally forget all about what is going on with the Pistons. Experts around the NBA are talking about the stupidity of the Pistons recent trades. Those trades have sucked the life out not only of the team but also the fan base. Nobody likes this team and cannot bond with the players. Enjoy the money players. You will not get the love but for sure they don't care about that.

[WTF]

I'm so serious about this because this whole thing has become so insane these days. this is not the organization I grew up with and respected.  I'm really not caring anymore if this league exist any longer.

I keep saying this as an Old Head we have lowered the bar so low, watered down the league so much that it is now just an shell of what it use to be.  I do hate casual fans,  I hate them because these are the fans the league wants to cater to and has lost touch with what it once was because it keeps trying to reinvent itself every time you turn around.  

I remember the old playoff format do any of you remember the 5 game series?  remember watching teams play back to back with only a day off to travel, remember the 2-3-2 & games series?  I found nothing wrong with these things and it made things tough this is one of many reason why I love 80's over this current crap we see now.  I don't like that we made things easier for todays player and on top of that pay them outrages salaries.  

It use to be fun watching a playoff series and see games 1 and 2 played back to back on a Saturday and Sunday it made for some great weekends. No one was whining about have days off between games.  

The three point shooting is a joke,  the overall style of defense is a joke, one and done is a joke,  these super teams are a joke,  lack of fundamentals is a joke,  social media use by players is a joke.  Really basketball as a whole on any level is a joke now so if we loss basketball I wouldn't be all that upset about it.  

Who remember recruiting a player and knowing you'll have him the full 4 years of college/  weren't we more excited about NCAA games back then seeing Ewing at Gergetown 4 years, Sampson, Bowie, Hakeem, and so year after year before seeing them in a pro uniform.  Now we get one and done players making 125 million dollar knowing absolutely nothing of simple basic fundamentals..

We got dumb owners like Gore and so on,  owner that have no connection to traditions of the team,  when have you last heard the words Pistons DNA, but this isn't just a Pistons issue who talks about Celtic Pride,  or Laker legacy.  Everything is a trend or a fade its not even real anymore it's all for show and giggles.  Fabricated false bravado hidden in useless analytics that fans are buying into.   

This **** is crazy

[cool breeze]

So we basically have no hope of having a winning season for the next 5 - 6 years.  Josh Smith's, RJ's, Leuer's and Galloway's contracts don't expire until the end of the 19-20 season.  And Griffin's contract won't expire until the end of the 21-22 season.  

After years of losing, there is no way Drummond will re-sign with the Pistons after the 20-21 season.  He'll still be in his prime, and will look to sign with a contender.

Then the rebuilding can begin in earnest.  And by now, I think were are all aware (except for Gores and Tellem) that the only way to build a contender in a small market like Detroit is through the draft, not by trading for other teams' washed up stars with bad contracts.

By 2022, if he hasn't move the team to Las Vegas, hopefully Gores will have sold the team to a strong owner located in Detroit (Gilbert?), who knows something about sports.  


In the meantime, we can all look forward to watching (or not watching) bad basketball.

Murph I agree and that is why I would think the time is right to trade Andre Drummond before next fall and preferably before the next draft. AD will finally have everything down before his next contract comes up as you said. He will be in his real prime. But this owner has created a lot of the dysfunction in the past. He might not agree to trade AD before next fall because of his so called personal relationship with AD. Does this owner have any common sense. Once SVG is gone, he will lose his most recent scape goat. The trade involving Harris and Bradley killed the Pistons current future. I am sure any GM could have gotten a better deal for Bradley and Harris and for sure didn't need to give away their draft pick for this dumb trade.

One other observation after watching Mitchell play a recent games. Since the All Star break Kennard has struggled big time. He cannot create his own shot in this lame offense currently being used. Kennard was more effective with the motion offense not the stand around iso offense. Mitchell could have been the point guard this team has been missing all along. If Mitchell had teamed up with the roster that included Bradley and Harris our Pistons might be 6 games over 500. we would still have our number one pick too. Right now the owner and head coach has placed all of their marbles on Griffin and Drummond to provide scoring. No All Star or above average players occupy the guard or small forward positions. My question is who in their right mind would create such a mess? Rich men who need a play thing maybe? I just don't get it. The Toronto game revealed that even when the Pistons give a great effort, they still will be blown out against an average to above average team. Of course Charlotte was another matter. That was a bad team beating the crap out of a dysfunctional lazy team. At the NBA level winning is about the mental attitude and aptitude players have to begin with. We have a dysfunctional below average IQ NBA team called the Detroit Pistons. Time to get a new plan and get what you can from any of our current assets if you can call them assets. AD should bring the Pistons something to start over with. That has to be done.

[Murph]

So we basically have no hope of having a winning season for the next 5 - 6 years.  Josh Smith's, RJ's, Leuer's and Galloway's contracts don't expire until the end of the 19-20 season.  And Griffin's contract won't expire until the end of the 21-22 season.  

After years of losing, there is no way Drummond will re-sign with the Pistons after the 20-21 season.  He'll still be in his prime, and will look to sign with a contender.

Then the rebuilding can begin in earnest.  And by now, I think were are all aware (except for Gores and Tellem) that the only way to build a contender in a small market like Detroit is through the draft, not by trading for other teams' washed up stars with bad contracts.

By 2022, if he hasn't move the team to Las Vegas, hopefully Gores will have sold the team to a strong owner located in Detroit (Gilbert?), who knows something about sports.  


In the meantime, we can all look forward to watching (or not watching) bad basketball.

[cool breeze]

We're bad on offense and defense, so not much to say.

When Andre left with 18 and 18, Blaha said he played hard and well, and Kelser concurred.  Beyond that....

Illustration of cause for misery: Stanley J (who's been stepping up his game) (a) takes a long shot out of his range and misses, then(b)  commits a goal tend on the other end, then (c) an offensive foul.  Think that was on three plays in a row.

If you're going to be vastly outplayed (as we were), please still play hard and smart (a la Miami).  This has gotten painful to watch.

Now the only question is becoming whether SVG gets another year.  I see him getting demoted in the front office, but still coaching next year, but with a short leash.  We're officially in "Wait till next year" territory, if we haven't been for some time.

Sparma I felt a bit more hopeful while watching the first half of this game. AD was engaged on defense. He looked completely different from the Charlotte game. Also, the team looked better on offense where players were moving without the ball and the point guard was not trying to create all of the offense using the dribble. A lot of shots by the Pistons were not falling but they all played hard. Toronto was on fire. However, in the 3rd the Pistons defense broke down a lot leaving Toronto with a lot of wide open looks. DeRosen went in and missed a dunk but what struck me was that there was no Piston in sight defending the paint. Two Piston players bumped into each other appearing not to know where they needed to be in the rotation. Toronto was sizzling from the outside but the Pistons helped them a lot by allowing uncontested shots. No defender in the area. Detroit fell behind by 20 points. Stanley Johnson had a melt down like you said. Every player looked frustrated and out of sync on offense. There was no movement by players in the half court offense. The offense looked exactly like it did against Charlotte where the team referred back to Ish Smith trying to create while other players stood around. All the pressure was on Blake Griffin to make something happen because Smith only passed the ball to Blake for almost the entire 3rd quarter.

One bright spot in this team to me was the play of Buycks. I think the Pistons have a real keeper in this point guard. He is tough and confident in himself even though he is a fringe player in the eyes of SVG. Buycks, in my opinion should be the starting point guard. He can defend really well and does not try to dominate the basketball. Buycks also knows how to run a half court offense and throws sharp passes to the places on the floor where the ball should be going. It is time to bring Smith off the bench if only because of the liability he causes for the Piston defense.

This team misses Tobias Harris and Avery Bradley. I agree that Bradley had a sub par shooting experience in his stay with the Pistons but he was a high basketball IQ player who could do a lot of things really well relating to playing defense and recognizing situations in the half court offense. We now have a completely different team with Blake Griffin. the combination of AD and Blake does not fit with the modern NBA. I believe the only way to save this franchise is to trade Andre Drummond this summer. I am not sure he really is still in high demand and trading him could get the Pistons a high number one pick and some rotation players who could upgrade this roster. Griffin's contract cannot be moved. The Pistons are stuck dead in the water with Blake. But Griffin might play much better if he played with different kind of center. Piston management has made a big mistake creating a team where the big money has been dedicated to the center position at the expense getting an elite point guard and 2 guard. Detroit's only two championship teams were driven by outstanding point guards and 2 guards in both eras. Why Joe Dumars strayed off course is a big mystery. It is not easy to acquire All Star caliber point guards and 2 guards. Teams like the Pistons have to do it through the draft. It is time to give up on the Andre Drummond experiment. He will play much better for a top tier basketball team where he can fill a role and not be the big cheese type player. AD is not skilled enough or smart enough to ever put a team on his shoulders night in and night out to make the Pistons a winner. Nobody should expect that out of him. And nobody should expect that out of Blake Griffin. It doesn't matter who the coach is for this current team. It is impossible for this team to win. And the nonsense about Reggie Jackson being the difference maker is really silly. He would make the Pistons better than they currently are at this moment but Reggie is not Isiah or Chauncey. Both Zeke and Mr BigShot were capable of giving their team what was needed on any given night. Zeke could be a ball distributor or a shooter. He could recognize which teammate was having a good night and those who were not playing well on any given night. They were leaders and not just shooter. They also could make that critical steal on defense if needed.

I want to see a change in strategy for the Detroit Pistons. It will be necessary to go directly to the bottom of the league but who wants to have a fake team capable of fighting for the 8th playoff spot for half of a of the season and then crashing and burning when other teams beat them with superior talent and smarts. This is a repeat of last season. SVG's selection of players should get him fired. Yet this last trade was all about Tom Gores as the press indicated. SVG and his staff recommended against the trade for good reason. Tom Gores needs to clean house and find a younger and smarter front office staff along with a younger coach who can teach the younger players for a few years as the Pistons create an entirely new team. I would keep Johnson as should be graduating from college this season along with Kennard and Ellenson. For that matter I would keep Buycks too. Give the young players a lot of experience and other young guys to the roster. Play hard and learn how to play together through the losing period. Add that top tier point guard and 2 guard through the draft. Find a outstanding athletic big man who is talented on the defensive end. Lose big and maybe if some team has a high draft pick this summer, the Pistons could trade AD and start the process before next fall. If not we will be seeing the same thing next year and for several years to come. This is a reality check for the owner. He needs to hire a good GM and then stay out of basketball matters. This owners decision to add Blake Griffin to an already dysfunctional basketball team has created a real nightmare. As constructed, the Pistons are going nowhere with or without Reggie Jackson. The playoff spots will soon be decided and then teams will be resting their players. When Detroit is out of contention for the 8th spot, Reggie might return and our Pistons might win a string of games but it will be fools gold. Will this owner attempt to sucker us into believing that next season will bring glory with this same type of team we have now? I think he will. It is true that SVG has no answers after the Pistons latest loss. No coach could have any answers for this team as constructed. This is Tom Gores mess now. He made the team even more dysfunctional with the Blake Griffin trade. This is all on Tom this time. If I were the coach, I would bring out a new starting lineup and bring the starters off the bench for a few games. Maybe something radical could help the team form a better bond. This team has no bond. They have no identity. It is time to start the re construction of the Detroit Pistons.

[Sparma]

We're bad on offense and defense, so not much to say.

When Andre left with 18 and 18, Blaha said he played hard and well, and Kelser concurred. Beyond that....

Illustration of cause for misery: Stanley J (who's been stepping up his game) (a) takes a long shot out of his range and misses, then(b) commits a goal tend on the other end, then (c) an offensive foul. Think that was on three plays in a row.

If you're going to be vastly outplayed (as we were), please still play hard and smart (a la Miami). This has gotten painful to watch.

Now the only question is becoming whether SVG gets another year. I see him getting demoted in the front office, but still coaching next year, but with a short leash. We're officially in "Wait till next year" territory, if we haven't been for some time.

[cool breeze]

SVG looked funereal before the game bumping fists with players.  Very uncoachly.  Seriously.

How come our fairly ordinary opponents keep looking like world beaters against us?  Batum with several beautiful passes.

Great drive up the court by Drummond, but wrong time to celebrate.

Scary thought: Drummond's our best player.  I'd hoped it'd be Griffin, who's more polished and skilled for sure, but no.  Drummond (who may go to the HoF if he makes c. 5 All Star games and is among the all time rebounding leaders, hardly out of reach) needs to be your 2nd or 3rd best player to be really successful, I'm not delusional enough to say otherwise.

Most disappointing Piston regular season ever, at least after that 14-6 start?  (still no rival to the single play fiasco's of the Laimbeer "foul", Isiah's inbound, or Sheed's non-cover).

Silver lining: Buycks and Ellenson played real well down the stretch, as did the whole team for the last six minutes.  Both of them deserve more minutes.

Good that you noticed that both Buycks and Ellenson played well. What game was SVG watching? I'll bet he didn't notice either player. SVG had thrown in the towel and I was disappointed that he didn't get up and walk the sidelines when Buycks and Ellenson were playing. Another point about lack of recognition skills by the head coach was how badly Bullock played on both offense and defense in the first half. Bullock was launching long range contested shots never attempting to use the dribble or the pass. Somehow SVG couldn't find the energy to substitute Kennard and let Bullock rest on the bench and think about his decision making and lack of energy on defense.

Your point relating to AD was good as well. It is so evident that AD only wants to show off. He is not about to ever get interested in playing defense in the paint. Lately since the All Star break Drummond has been venturing out past the free throw line too much. He then attempts to act like he is trying to defend a guard on the pick and roll. The problem has been that the guard, usually Smith has done a good job getting over the high screen. Last night, Dwight Howard went out and set screens. AD was trying to hawk the ball and go down full court after a steal to show off his ball handling skills for the Charlotte fans. He did it one time. However, that was not the first time he attempted to get a steal around the 3 point line. That cannot be in any coaches game plan. What happens is AD forces a switch with the guard instead of rolling down with Howard or the back up center to prevent an easy pass in the paint. So I saw Smith or another Piston guard trying to defend Howard or the back up Hornet's center in the paint. Blake was not there. The Pistons had guards defending centers and power forwards in the paint. When AD doesn't get a steal he creates insanity with rotations. AD is going off on his own playing for his stats not his team. Like the last game, opposing centers were consistently beating Drummond from baseline to baseline including the aging Dwight Howard who was smiling all night long. AD is protected by the owner. he believes that he can create his own game plan and can ignore all the coaches. This has always been the way AD has handled his coaches. Ask his coaches at UCONN. They had the same experience. AD is not a coachable player. No team will ever win with him. He makes all of his teammates look worse than they are. We can blame the head coach for a lot of things but it is time to recognize that who is causing the dysfunction. And Griffin was no better on the defensive end last night. He never challenged one shot that I saw.

One observation relating to Johnson. I can see that he is fuming. SVG has reverted to his old offense. That means that Johnson or his replacement is no longer part of the offense. They are to stand in the baseline corner. I watched Johnson not touch the basketball in the first half for over 5 minutes. What were his teammates doing during that time period? Most were standing in place watching one player after the other try to go one on one not in the paint but going one on one around the 3 point line. Griffin did shoot shots around the free throw line but none of his shots came from movement by his teammates. There is a good reason why Detroit is getting their ass kicked. No teamwork on offense that leads to too many long range contested shots that lead to easy transition baskets by their opponents.

Murph stated that he has decided not to watch another Piston game this season. That is a very good idea. This team looks exactly like last season's team going into March. The dead giveaway was the fact that the Pistons gave up 70 first half points. They offered next to no resistance in the first quarter. The announcers said that some of the problems involved the 2nd unit. They did look horrible in the 2nd quarter but the starters set the tone at the very start of that basketball game. I thought the team played hard against Boston, not for the entire game but at least during a lot of moments of that game. Against Charlotte our starters looked like they had never played together and everyone had the flu. Who would attend a Piston game after that performance? Maybe real Piston fans would attend if the head coach played Ellenson and Buycks along with another player doing well in the G League. We fans feel no hope and have no trust in these players or the coaching staff or the owner.

[WTF]

No Stan it's not racist at all unless you're referring to the color green then perhaps yeah it is.  I really don't care how it's viewed the truth is that 18 year olds need to go to college in fact I think they need to extend the requirements to 2 years  and done.   Yeah if the GL was truly used the way it was intended to be use then perhaps bring players in at 18 would make sense 
.   

Organization draft thee young players and never fully give them the chance to grow because they because they can't wait and want instant KG's and Bron's  before these guys are ready.  Then they treat them like you yourself treated Ellenson, Dinwiddie, and now Kennard when they all would have been better off if they spent a full season playing in the GL.  

Don't hate on baseball and hockey because they're smart enough to use the minors to grow their players.  The one and done is likely saving NBA teams and owners from themselves because they're stupid just like you.  

Also don't blame the NCAAA either because the one and done hurts them more than it helps.  Use to be a time when they could count on their recruits playing no less than 3 seasons.  Yet we wonder why illegal recruitment is occurring at these major colleges ASU, MSU, Duke and I'm sure plenty more to come.

[cool breeze]

Can anyone remember going to the bench after your ass has been kicked to the point where the coach has given up hope and puts you on the bench and then you have the balls to joke and laugh? We old time Piston fans are steaming and only watching because Henry Ellenson has finally entered the game while our two mega stars are not affected at all. They get paid regardless of what happens. Who cares? This was a who cares game for our two franchise players. Neither player could have spent one minute preparing mentally to play the game before it started. Both AD and BG gave below minimum effort on defense in the first half. Charlotte scored 70 points with many coming inside the paint. AD offers no resistance and the entire league knows it. AD is a part time player. He is never prepared before the game starts and drifts in and out of consciousness throughout the game. I could care less about his offense effort. It means nothing if he insists on being a pasty on defense. Both players should have been benched in the first half and never brought back. This coach has to send a message. It is not only Griffin and AD. It was clear that Bullock did not prepare to play this game either. He was settling for long range shots in the first half when the Hornets got the lead up to 30 points never thinking about putting the ball on the floor to get closer to the basket or creating something for a teammate. He was just as unaffected by his lousy play on both offense and defense as AD and BG.

I never saw Tobias not give a great effort in any game he played for the Pistons. Now we have a player in the mold of Andre Drummond in Blake Griffin. This team is impossible to watch anymore. It seems clear that this team has horrible team chemistry. The highest paid players provide no leadership and continue to show that they are low basketball IQ retards. While I thought the point guard position was our worst weakness now it is clear that these players are lost souls who hate playing with each other. This might be the softest Piston team that I have ever witnessed. You can see that SVG has lost hope. He knows who he is working with now. This is a nightmare and the owner is most responsible because he was behind the trade for Blake Griffin and refused to trade AD. Keep on laughing. I hope nobody shows up for the next home game.

[Murph]

The only silver lining in all of this is that now hopefully Gores will not hire Arn Tellem as GM.  Tellem gave Gores disasterous advice to trade for Griffin.

Wise...this is not the fans fault.  No Pistons fan in their right mind would have traded for Griffin and his $173 million contract.  And very few would have hired SVG as coach or GM, let alone both.

The Clips are 6-2 since they dumped Griffin.


It is baseball season yet?

[WTF]

Looking at the side articles and seeing words like Road Kill,  Laugher, Desperate, Blitzed at this point in a season should have you all pissed especially after dropping 173 Million or what's left of it.    

It's the fans fault because we did not hold this organization to the high standards it once had.   Many fans fed into the media excuses, false hopes, homer hyping of this team since 2010.    There was a time not to long ago many of us would be screaming to trade a player like AD,  many killed Joe on the Josh signing only half of what Blake is getting now.   While I don't want to see a playoff push happen, I'm not blind to the fact that it should be happening after acquiring a player that's making 35 million a season and having another that's making 25 million a season.

It's only gets worse when the head coach openly admits he's at a loss in trying to figure things out.  It crazy Pistons fans even Lions fans know when to start wearing the paper bags over heads but not you suckers 

[Sparma]

SVG looked funereal before the game bumping fists with players. Very uncoachly. Seriously.

How come our fairly ordinary opponents keep looking like world beaters against us? Batum with several beautiful passes.

Great drive up the court by Drummond, but wrong time to celebrate.

Scary thought: Drummond's our best player. I'd hoped it'd be Griffin, who's more polished and skilled for sure, but no. Drummond (who may go to the HoF if he makes c. 5 All Star games and is among the all time rebounding leaders, hardly out of reach) needs to be your 2nd or 3rd best player to be really successful, I'm not delusional enough to say otherwise.

Most disappointing Piston regular season ever, at least after that 14-6 start? (still no rival to the single play fiasco's of the Laimbeer "foul", Isiah's inbound, or Sheed's non-cover).

Silver lining: Buycks and Ellenson played real well down the stretch, as did the whole team for the last six minutes. Both of them deserve more minutes.

[Phil-Good]

First we was mad at Joe. But I remember Joe was told "we better make the playoffs." Then here comes Josh Smith...

Now Van Gundy has been tasked with trying to short cut the rebuilding process and in the NBA you can't short cut the process. In comes Blake.


The Pistons will not make the playoffs. Jeff Bower is smart to be looking for A new job because Van Gundy's time in Detroit should be coming to A end.

The Blake Trade didn't change anything. But now this organization lost A first round pick and major cap space for the next 4 years!

I blame GORES!! He A terrible owner who has no CLUE about S.H.I.T concerning NBA basketball.

Go out and get A GM who understands what Pistons basketball is all about.

Go get A up and coming head coach who can grow along with the young core. (Jason Kidd)??

This is most important: DON'T SHORT CUT THE REBUILDING PROCESS!


Stop worrying about making the PLAYOFFS! Nobody cares about making the playoffs. Everybody cares about kicking people a.s.s in the playoffs! Not just getting there.

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