How Many Times

[BallinD]

Too many times to count, Reggie calls his own number and shoots without passing the ball to any of his teamates, any fool can see it is affecting chemistry, ball movement, offensive continuity Ish is running the offense in the second quarter, pushing the ball and stimulating ball movement. The team just looks so much better with Ish out there. It's not about the stats. When he pushes the ball, we seem to play better defense.

Can we Trade Reggie?

I am on record now predicting a trade.

[Sparma]

Even though the Pistons (at 14-14) sit closest to my preseason prediction, I'm inclined to think they'll pull it together soon to move out beyond .500 for good.  Can't see them getting to 50 wins now (they'd need to go 36-16), but I don't think I'll be winning the pool with my 42-40 guess.

Looking ahead, the tentative CBA deal may shed some light on our future.  I heard a commentator predict that the average salary may move to 8, then 10 mil soon.  The middle class of players stand to benefit most evidently, while max deals will be held artificially low, below market value (even for our owned flawed AD).

Implications?  First, I think KCP will soon prove to be a value at 20 mil, compared to the average player sitting at 8 or 10 mil.  I haven't thought it worth giving him that kind of contract, but if the middle class will be overpaid, maybe it's worth paying the upper middle class (KCP) in gold.  

Secondly, I think (along with others) that Detroit's got a roster suitable for making a big deal, for a star (even if a superstar's out of reach).  Such trades, for Detroit (as opposed to the Lakers of yore) are tough to pull off, although we did it with Sheed.  SVG's done a great job as exec, but he's also been plucking low hanging fruit, trading for players the other team didn't want badly for some reason (Morris, Harris).  This will need to be a different kind of trade, in which a premium is paid.  In the olden days, teams out of contention were eager to rid themselves of big contracts even of some productive players.  Now, I'm not so sure, because the top players will be underpaid.  It'll be tough to get one.  My guess is that the best odds are getting someone beyond his prime.  Carmelo time?  I don't see a young Shaq being traded, unless that player manages to force the issue.  And if that happens, that player won't be heading to Detroit unless the Pistons are on the verge of being genuine contenders.  One big deal's needed, but the odds of it succeeding appear to be declining due to the looming market.

[cool breeze]

I hate to say it but, it needs to be said, Reggie Jackson is a major disruption to the Pistons offense, even at his best, and contributes nothing to the defense. That and the fact their coach sits, arms folded, and snoozes through Reggie's idiotic act, points to the fact that we need a change. SVG ain't going nowhere soon so........

When does an unguarded, between the legs dribble, make any basketball sense? Is it practicing an "ankle breaking" move? Why does it never come? When the "leader" and primary ball handler dribbles out half the 24 second clock before making the first pass, what is that saying to the team? I mean, how do you defend that in the locker room to your teammates, should it come up? Action speaks louder than words and his actions says, damn y'all, it's all about me!

The other night The Warriors put on a fantastic display of ball sharing (the first 25 baskets in the game were assisted on!); my question is this: What's wrong with us??!! There's no one on the Pistons that can score like Golden States scorers...not even close, so why do we keep jacking up stupid ass shots from the outside, and not sharing the ball? 34 out of 37 baskets scored were assisted on. Whoever is responsible for the ball "sticking" needs to come off the floor, and the way Reggie's playing is not contributing to his return to playing team ball, much less conditioning. Come on SVG, earn your dollars.

GO PISTONS!!

dX it looks to me that Reggie is playing scared. Your observation is right on relating to the between the legs dribble for no reason other than to attempt to create some confidence in yourself. I believe Stan Van Gundy is partly responsible when he decided to start Reggie on his first game back. It might have been a bit easier if Reggie could have blended in with the 2nd unit playing no more than 10 minutes for a week or two. I sense Jackson is feeling big pressure and his style is not fitting in with the make up of this Piston team. Your description " Reggie Jackson is a major disruption to the Piston offense" is something that SVG cannot deny. Reggie is trying to re create the magic he had at the end of games last season. What he should have focused on in the off season is learning how to play the point guard position including learning from his mistakes on the defensive end last season. And Smith is playing copy cat trying to mimic Jackson's style. That is what got Smith into so much trouble earlier in the season. Smith settled down and cut down on his turnovers about two weeks before Jackson made his comeback. Now the best point guard on the team is sitting on the bench as a third stringer. He came in and played so much better than either of Stan's favorites. All the players who played with the 3rd stringer looked so much better too.

I hope that Van Gundy has instructed the Drive to play Gbinije at the point guard position. It appears that Johnson, Ellenson and Gbinije all play really well when they don't play with the two current Piston point guards. All Jackson has to do is settle down and make sure his teammates get the right spacing in the half court offense and make the initial pass so the offense can get untracked. You can't look like a real basketball team if you hog the basketball for 20 seconds of the shot clock and of course shoot the long range bomb with 20 seconds on the shot clock. KCP also likes to loft the 3 point shot early in the shot clock at times too. And 70% of the time both players miss that shot and the result is a quick score by the Piston opponent. I thought that Jackson's defense was really bad last night but Pope was just as horrible. Leuer might have been the worst defender of the bunch. And of course Andre still can't manage to locate Gortat on the floor when he is on defense. How many 2nd chance attempts that resulted in scores were caused from Drummond's failure to keep Gortat boxed out and pushed away from the painted area? This game was a repeat of the same mistakes made by mentally weak Piston players and Washington can always count on an easy win because of that weakness. By the way, Morris maybe earned about 5 minutes of playing time last night as well. He was horrible but perhaps had the Wall Flu like the Piston guards.

The bottom line is that Stan Van Gundy must be really worried that his team is going to implode as the team chemistry goes down the toilet because of the insane guard play. My bet is that if he started the Pistons current 3rd stinger, the starters would look like a real team. But SVG likes the wild and crazy up tempo style and even though he doesn't have the type of NBA players needed to make that style work work he must stick with it because he has no point guard who can successfully run a half court offense. We will be seeing a lot of missed 3 point shots early in the shot clock this season. Some times his players will get lucky and everything will look like the team is on track. I say scrap it all and play the young guys and hope for the best two years from now. That means, Johnson, Ellenson, and Gbinije should get minutes from Morris, Pope, Jackson, Smith and Leuer.

[deusXango]

I hate to say it but, it needs to be said, Reggie Jackson is a major disruption to the Pistons offense, even at his best, and contributes nothing to the defense. That and the fact their coach sits, arms folded, and snoozes through Reggie's idiotic act, points to the fact that we need a change. SVG ain't going nowhere soon so........

When does an unguarded, between the legs dribble, make any basketball sense? Is it practicing an "ankle breaking" move? Why does it never come? When the "leader" and primary ball handler dribbles out half the 24 second clock before making the first pass, what is that saying to the team? I mean, how do you defend that in the locker room to your teammates, should it come up? Action speaks louder than words and his actions says, damn y'all, it's all about me!

The other night The Warriors put on a fantastic display of ball sharing (the first 25 baskets in the game were assisted on!); my question is this: What's wrong with us??!! There's no one on the Pistons that can score like Golden States scorers...not even close, so why do we keep jacking up stupid ass shots from the outside, and not sharing the ball? 34 out of 37 baskets scored were assisted on. Whoever is responsible for the ball "sticking" needs to come off the floor, and the way Reggie's playing is not contributing to his return to playing team ball, much less conditioning. Come on SVG, earn your dollars.

GO PISTONS!!

[Phil-Good]

I can break this game down really fast and easy.

Hello, my name is John Wall and I'm better then anybody on your entire team!

Reggie Jackson should take this AZZ whipping personal. John Wall whipped his azz!

John dominated Reggie and had that SHADY, John Wall smile, on his shady looking face while doing it.

John was so good I almost forgot about Beal Who played excellent as well.

Good home win for Washington. But at the end of the Day. Detroit will finish higher then Washington and kick Washington azz when it really counts.

Props to KCP. This guy is looking like A keeper. I'm happy to see him settle down and fall into KCP game and not Ray Allen or Reggie Miller.

[cool breeze]

First, let's set the ground rules! There's no description in SVG's contract that says he needs to be fair to every player, and if there was, he's never build a good team.

SVG "Gifted" Stanley Johnson more PT than any other rookie he's had... that wasn't fair! So when he finally is fair to Stanley, the complaints start flying from some poster, I don't want to mention any names(cough, Don, cough).

Did SVG need any reason other than Stanley couldn't play the game of basketball worth a crap? He felt compelled to give a reason, but I didn't need one, my eyes are still working these days.

IMO, the tough love needs to be increased judging from the comments Stanley keeps making, the kid is a bit delusional. Confidence is one thing, but he almost believes he walks on water and still knows more than the coach... that's bordering on insufferable arrogance.

Don, exactly how many personalities do you have? You're all over the map from day to day and sometimes from post to post. This team doesn't revolve around a near rookie who's a big


What position can he really play? Is he a head case? Is he as good as you and he thinks? We don't have answers to any of these questions yet, and they're all potential deal breakers.

Also, on what planet do you believe a team is who they'll be at 25% of the season by the end of the season.

It's alright to point out the issues, heaven knows we do have a few, but damn, you might want to give them some time to work on them before declaring everybody other than Stanley and the never played youngsters are the ones to save us from these awful veterans... sheesh!

Relax Don, there is a middle ground... the tooth is out there.

Oracle this post is insane. Did you even bother to watch this game against Washington? There is no way you could have watched this game and made those statements about the 20 year old Johnson unless you are blind or drunk. Stanley Johnson was outstanding in the 4th quarter of this game once the starters were benched. He was outstanding on both ends of the court once he was able to play with our 3rd string point guard. It is hard to stand out if you never receive a pass and have to stand on the baseline beyond the 3 point line knowing you will be ignored. Once Udrih came in with Johnson, Stanley scored from every area on the floor. Check the box score Oracle and see his shooting percentage. But even better, he played really good defense.

To come away with this insane rant against Stanley Johnson when it was the starters who had their asses handed to them big time shows me that you must have had a bad day at work Oracle and fell asleep during the game. I couldn't blame anyone for falling asleep watching this game. But to call out someone who actually played really well in the 2nd half is puzzling. The group of players that SVG trusts does not include Stanley Johnson just yet. However, it seems to me that he better re evaluate the talent that he currently has in the starting lineup. The talent level is not good enough and all of the starters are really experienced players. Some of the teams that currently have losing records are grooming their young talented players giving them the playing time to secure a better future and a possible NBA championship. This group of designated Piston starters are not talented enough to ever win a championship. SVG is just grooming a team capable or securing the 8 spot in the playoffs. It is better to give players like Johnson and Ellenson a bigger role now and possibly lose more games this season and take that chance in order to secure a much better future. If the team is controlled by the current group of starters than expect very little out of Johnson because he is not currently one of the team leaders and has no significant role on this team. If you watched the game you would have watched some horrible basketball by our starting group. How can the coach trust them after that performance? The opposing starters are clearly better in every area. It isn't even close.

[cool breeze]

I can't recall when our Pistons were even able to play a close game against Washington when Wall wasn't injured and didn't play. And this time it wasn't only Wall. All of Washington guards were able to dominate our Pistons. Right now Detroit has no organized offense at all. I counted the amount of times Stanley Johnson actually touched the basketball in the 2nd quarter and I believe he only received one lame pass at the wrong time in the shot clock. How many times did any of you fans see a Piston player set a screen on offense?

Lauer got his ass kicked on the pick and roll plays all night long. The Pistons made no adjustments at halftime and came out in the 3rd quarter making the same mistakes on defense. And on offense, the skill players seemed to ignore the idea that somebody should get into the paint instead of just jacking up low percentage long range bombs against heavy pressure. Who wouldn't have an easy time defending the Pistons. Our guard play is horrible. How many wide open shots did the Washington guards have in this game?

It wasn't until Udrih entered the game for the first time in two weeks. It was refreshing to see a real point guard in a Piston uniform. We have no point guards on this team other than Detroit's 3rd string guard who must freak out having to watch his teammates lame attempts to run an offense. Once Udrih came in the game changed in a remarkably good way for the Pistons. Johnson gets a nice pass on the baseline and he drives and scores. Udrih, Hilliard, Johnson, Baynes and Leuer made a big comeback in a short period of time. Wall had to return after laughing and resting on the bench with our starters on the court. The difference was the type of defense played by Udrih, Johnson and Hilliard. And they played offense with all 5 players on most possessions. Win or lose, that group was fun to watch unlike the starters.

Lack of effort by Morris, Pope, Jackson and Smith on defense allowed Washington to play the entire first half with only one turnover. There was no pressure at all on the Washington guards. I am having my doubts that Morris can guard a lot of small forwards in today's game too. And Lauer was downright horrible in his anticipation on pick and roll plays. This is a team with no superstars. For the Pistons to win, they must be a superior defensive team. Instead, our Pistons gave up 122 points. Wall is not the only player who seems to always out smart our Piston players. Gortat had his way against Andre Drummond once again. He seems always get superior position when Washington is on offense and Drummond is caught too far under the basket when shots go up. When with this team start boxing out and insist on all 5 Piston players to get their asses in the paint to secure defensive rebounds. How many games has this Piston team lost because of 2nd chance opportunities?

Van Gundy does to have a team that is capable or running a half court offense. The players he is using have too low of a basketball IQ to execute in the half court offense. And being that the starters are inferior defensive players, opposing teams usually score which kills any chances of running an up tempo style. The result of the inept strategy being used is the fact that this Piston team spent the entire 3rd quarter without even trying to penetrate the painted area. The players were content to launch the contested 3 point shots. The plays were easily defended because this team is so predictable. We have weak point guards and only one active guy in Harris who knows how to break down a defense. And Harris couldn't get untracked in the 2nd half so the Pistons were screwed. Failure to know how to defend as a team and bogus mindless turnovers caused from insane passes by Lauer and Jackson took this team out of contention early in the 3rd quarter. SVG should have cleared his bench much earlier.

Does Van Gundy actually think that his team will win one game from Washington this season unless Wall goes down with an injury? I see a lot of future blowouts whenever these two teams match up. So nothing has changed for the better for our Detroit Pistons in many years when it comes to playing Washington. When will the Pistons get some NBA stars in uniform who play the guard positions? How many NBA teams ever win much of anything without stars in those two guard spots?

[merc]

It's safe to say the league is in a state of parity... only the elites deserve separation... this team is good... just not that good.

[Oracle]

First, let's set the ground rules! There's no description in SVG's contract that says he needs to be fair to every player, and if there was, he's never build a good team.

SVG "Gifted" Stanley Johnson more PT than any other rookie he's had... that wasn't fair! So when he finally is fair to Stanley, the complaints start flying from some poster, I don't want to mention any names(cough, Don, cough).

Did SVG need any reason other than Stanley couldn't play the game of basketball worth a crap? He felt compelled to give a reason, but I didn't need one, my eyes are still working these days.

IMO, the tough love needs to be increased judging from the comments Stanley keeps making, the kid is a bit delusional. Confidence is one thing, but he almost believes he walks on water and still knows more than the coach... that's bordering on insufferable arrogance.

Don, exactly how many personalities do you have? You're all over the map from day to day and sometimes from post to post. This team doesn't revolve around a near rookie who's a big


What position can he really play? Is he a head case? Is he as good as you and he thinks? We don't have answers to any of these questions yet, and they're all potential deal breakers.

Also, on what planet do you believe a team is who they'll be at 25% of the season by the end of the season.

It's alright to point out the issues, heaven knows we do have a few, but damn, you might want to give them some time to work on them before declaring everybody other than Stanley and the never played youngsters are the ones to save us from these awful veterans... sheesh!

Relax Don, there is a middle ground... the tooth is out there.

[deusXango]

SVG is getting the quarterback treatment from Pistons fans; far too much blame when the team loses and far too much credit when it wins. This is the reason I'll always say, SVG is a much better executive than coach; the game, with todays players who're younger than he's used to dealing with, has passed him by. Was he fair with Stanley Johnson? Who knows. Is he fair with Henry Ellenson? IMHO no. I don't think Michael Gbinije has been given a fair look either (particularly at PG.) It's time to delegate the head coaching responsibilities SVG!

With all that being said, Stanley Johnson is not the answer at PG...he's not the best forward at this point in time either, and he damn sure ain't the best big man on the Pistons. Let's tone it down a tad Don. He's a promising talent, not half way through his 2nd pro season, with a lot to learn yet. He'll reach his potential because of his hard work; he'll mature because of the guidance of wiser minds. As I remember (because it wasn't that long ago) there were a slew of consistent games that our PG didn't have a turnover and had the entire team engaged...that wasn't the Pistons starting PG and he didn't have the sex appeal of "getting us into the playoffs," (like that's a feat accomplished by a single player the caliber of Reggie Jackson). Talk about LOL! The Pistons had begun to roll with Ish Smith as their starting PG; the scoring was spread out, everybody was involved and playing like a team, and Lo' and behold, the teams defense began to click. My eyes saw some real leadership by Smith, but we missed Jackson and it was time for his return, so a monkey wrench was thrown into the teams development 25% into the season. No pre-season, no competitive game experience, stamina not up to par, and no feel for his teammates; it would've made more sense for a flock of bluebirds to fly out of Reggie's ass than for him to come in and maintain the chemistry that the team had going. Ish was not turning the ball over or leading the team in scoring but, the team was beginning to win handily. Beno, who's a forgotten man, was making substantial contributions; we've got to be patient with what SVG is going to get from his rotational changes and Reggie back as the starting PG.

I'm gonna say it one more time, "I'd love to see Leuer starting with Harris, and Morris coming off the bench with Smith, Johnson, Ellenson, and "hands of stone" Baynes; that 10 man rotation consists of the top/most promising players on the Pistons roster. If you don't play your best consistently, you ain't trying to win anything that matters...a Championship!

Personal Beef: When did we start b!tch!ng about back-to-backs as reasons for loosing? There's been back-to-backs since there's been a 82 game season! Why do writers/mass media members talk about how we've played more games than the rest of the league, like we're on a pitch count? The season starts and ends the same for everybody; from fall to spring, 82 games, it's all relative. A game managing coach will look at the schedule and play his talent accordingly (to get maximum production from the players the team's paying, particularly with the level of talent we have) because that's a part of game management isn't it? Looking ahead, planning ahead?

GO PISTONS!!

[cool breeze]

I cannot make any sense of how SVG decides on accountability for his players. Johnson was in the dog house up until he played well and dominated in a D League game. Did Van Gundy actually make some negative statements about Johnson's work ethic a few weeks ago to provide a reason why he didn't give him any playing time at all? I have never known Stanley Johnson to have a bad work ethic. He has always been a guy who you have to kick out of the gym late at night. Common sense would dictate that a head coach should not be needlessly cruel to a 20 year old guy especially a guy like Johnson who might be the only player on the team who wants to share the basketball. I have heard rumors that Morris might have been creating some false information maybe because he thinks that Johnson is waiting in the wings to play that small forward spot in the future. I don't believe in rumors about other players. Morris seems to have changed his attitude entirely since his playing days with the Suns. But I just don't get why Van Gundy decided that he needed to punish Johnson. Watching the last two basketball games has been painful for me. It was great that the Pistons pulled out that game in Memphis. But this team looked like they have never played with each other for more than a week. Smith was playing really well avoiding the stupidity of blindly driving into the lane and hoping he can make something happen. He would often remember to make his first pass to the weak side to Pope on the baseline and then follow the basketball and set a screen for Pope to drive around to his sweet spot in the 10 foot range on the wing. I haven't seen that play now for 2 games. Smith is copying Jackson's game. THE POINT GUARD PLAY IS SO BAD AN IDIOT CAN SEE THAT THE OTHER PLAYERS ARE CONFUSED AND OUT OF SORTS ON OFFENSE. YET STAN VAN GUNDY GIVES A LONG LEASH TO JACKSON AND SMITH REGARDLESS OF HOW MUCH THEY DOMINATE THE BASKETBALL. IT WAS REALLY SCARY IN THE PHILLY GAME WHEN STAN PLAYED BOTH SMITH AND JACKSON AT THE SAME TIME. COULDN'T VAN GUNDY PREDICT WHAT WOULD HAPPEN? SURE ENOUGH WE SAW A LOT OF THE TWO MAN GAME OF JACKSON AND SMITH SHARING TIME IN THE SHOT CLOCK DRIBBLING AROUND WITH THE OTHER 3 GUYS LEFT TO PICK THEIR NOSES. SVG STOOD AND WATCHED THOSE TWO PLAYERS MAKE FOOLS OF THEMSELVES AND NEVER BLINKED. JACKSON REDEEMED HIMSELF IN THE CLOSING MINUTES OF THE LAST GAME. BUT HE SHOULD BE REALLY EMBARRASSED WITH THE WAY HE PLAYED. IS IT NECESSARY FOR JACKSON TO BE THE HERO ON EVERY POSSESSION? WHY CAN'T HE COME UP THE COURT AND MAKE THE INITIAL PASS TO START THE HALF COURT OFFENSE LIKE OTHER REAL POINT GUARDS IN THE LEAGUE? HE ALWAYS LOOKS FIRST TO BE THE HERO AND GET HIS SHOT FIRST. I WAS RECENTLY ASKED TO REF A GAME INVOLVING SMALL KIDS AND OFTEN ONE OF THOSE SMALL KIDS WOULD GET THE BASKETBALL AND ATTEMPT TO GO COAST TO COAST WITHOUT MAKING A PASS. THIS IS THE WAY JACKSON STILL PLAYS THE GAME. NOW SMITH AS REVERTED TO THIS SAME STYLE. IN THE LAST GAME, THINGS TURNED AROUND WHEN JOHNSON CAME INTO THE GAME. HE WAS THE GUY WHO WAS TRYING TO ORGANIZE THE TEAM AND HE WAS THE PLAYER WHO KNEW WHERE THE OPEN TEAMMATE WAS STANDING AND GOT THE BASKETBALL TO THAT PLAYER. HOW SIMPLE THIS GAME CAN BE IF YOU HAVE PLAYERS WHO ENJOY PLAYING LIKE A REAL TEAM. IT SEEMS OBVIOUS THAT STAN VAN GUNDY IS A MAN WHO KNOWS BOTH POINT GUARDS HAVE NO IDEA HOW TO PLAY THE POINT GUARD POSITION. JACKSON CAN BE A SCORING MACHINE AT TIMES AND SVG IS WILLING TO SACRIFICE PLAYING A TEAM FIRST STYLE BECAUSE IT WAS JACKSON WHO GOT THE TEAM IN THE PLAYOFFS LAST YEAR. BUT IT IS CLEAR THAT THE TEAM WILL NOT EVER GET MUCH BETTER WITH THIS STYLE OF POINT GUARD PLAY WHERE NEITHER OF THE CURRENT TWO POINT GUARDS GETTING PLAYING TIME CAN PLAY EFFECTIVE DEFENSE. JACKSON DID LOOK BETTER IN THE LAST 3 MINUTES LAST NIGHT ON THE DEFENSIVE END BUT NOBODY WOULD SAY HE PLAYED EVEN AVERAGE DEFENSE FOR THE OTHER MINUTES HE PLAYED.

MY BIG QUESTION TO THE COACH IS THIS. WATCHING THE TIMBERWOLVES PLAY RECENTLY I COULDN'T TAKE MY EYES OFF THEIR 3 YOUNG STUDS ESPECIALLY TOWNS. THOSE THREE YOUNG GUYS ARE GUYS LIKE STANLEY JOHNSON. THEY HAVE MADE A LOT OF MISTAKES BUT NOW AFTER PLAYING A LOT, THEY ARE SHOWING THEIR SUPERIOR TALENT. AND HOW CAN ANYONE FORGET THE ASS KICKING THE PISTONS GOT FROM THOSE YOUNG AND FEARLESS PLAYERS PLAYING FOR PHILLY TWO GAMES AGO? PHILLY'S STARTING POINT GUARD WHO WAS NOT EVEN DRAFTED SHOWED WHY THAT TEAM WAS NOT TOO WORRIED WHEN SMITH SIGNED WITH DETROIT. IF YOU WATCHED ANY OF THAT GAME, YOU SAW A REAL BASKETBALL PLAYER AND A REAL POINT GUARD. HE SEES THE FLOOR AND THINKS HOW HE CAN MAKE HIS TEAMMATES BETTER. TJ KNOWS THAT YOU CAN'T MAKE YOUR TEAMMATES BETTER ON OFFENSE IF YOU STAND OUT BEYOND THE FREE THROW LINE AND DRIBBLE AROUND TRYING TO FIND YOUR OPENING AND SELDOM EVER ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THE BASIC FLOW OF THE OFFENSE. THE PROBLEM NOW FOR THE PISTONS IS THAT WHEN SMITH COMES INTO THE GAME HE THINKS THAT HIS COACH HIM TO PLAY LIKE JACKSON. ISN'T STAN LOOKING AT THE GLARING TURNOVER RATE RECENTLY?

ONE OTHER INTERESTING FACT THAT I AM SURE ALL OF YOU MUST GET AS FRUSTRATED AS MYSELF INVOLVES ALL OF THE BIG MEN AND THE GUARDS ON THIS VAN GUNDY TEAM ON THE DEFENSIVE END. WHAT ARE YOU TAUGHT IN JR HIGH ABOUT SCREENING OUT YOUR MAN WHEN A SHOT GOES UP? YOU ANTICIPATE THE SHOT IS GOING UP AND YOU QUICKLY TURN YOUR HEAD AWAY FROM THE RIM FOR A SPIT SECOND TO FIND A CUTTER OR YOUR GUY WHO IS ABOUT TO MOVE INTO THE PAINT GO GET GOOD POSITION AT YOUR EXPENSE AS A DEFENDER. THIS IS BASIC PISTON FANS. AND YET I SEE LAUER, ANDRE, MORRIS, POPE, AND BOTH POINT GUARDS JUST STANDING AND LOOKING AT THE RIM LIKE COMPLETE IDIOTS. TO VAN GUNDY'S CREDIT, AFTER ANDRE MADE THAT ERROR AND ALLOWED HIS MAN TO COME IN A SLAM A OFFENSIVE REBOUND FOR A THUNDER DUNK, THE COACH REMOVED HIM FROM THE GAME. AND I NOTICED ANDRE DID KNOW IMMEDIATELY THAT HE HAS SCREWED UP AGAIN. THE PISTONS ALLOW WAY TOO MANY 2ND CHANCE OPPORTUNITIES BECAUSE ALL OF THE OTHER NBA TEAMS HAVE SCOUTED DETROIT PLAYERS AND KNOW ABOUT THIS FLAW. THE COACHES NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE FOR THIS STUPID MISTAKE. EVERY PLAYER ON THE TEAM INCLUDING THE GUARDS SHOULD BE TRYING TO GET POSITION AND BOXING OUT SOMEBODY BEFORE THAT SHOT IS EVEN RELEASED. THE COACHES ARE TOLERATING LAZY BEHAVIOR FOR ALL OF THE STARTERS. SVG ONLY WILL PUNISH THE YOUNG GUYS. HE WILL STEW OVER THE SMALLEST MISTAKES BY JOHNSON OR HILLIARD. AND OF COUSE ELLENSON IS A FORGOTTEN GUY EVEN THOUGH HE CAN SHOOT THE LIGHTS OUT FROM DISTANCE. HOW MUCH WORSE CAN ELLENSON BE RELATING TO DEFENSIVE REBOUNDING WHEN THINKING ABOUT THE STARTERS ON THIS PISTON TEAM?

IF THE OWNER WANTS TO SEE A GOOD TEAM IN 3 YEARS, THEN HE BETTER START WATCHING THIS COACHING STAFF A BIT CLOSER. THE PLAYERS IN THE CURRENT ROTATION ARE NOT TALENTED ENOUGH TO COMPLETE FOR A CHAMPIONSHIP. SOME OF THE STARTERS ARE AT THEIR PEAK NOW. TWO OF THE YOUNG PLAYERS, JOHNSON AND ELLENSON HAVE HIGHER BASKETBALL IQS AND A HIGHER CEILING AND NEED TO GET EXPERIENCE LIKE TOWNS AND HIS TWO BUDDIES. THEY TOO WILL GET CONFIDENCE. THERE HAVE BEEN TOO MANY GAMES WHERE THE STARTERS HAVE PLAYED HORRIBLY YET REMAINED ON THE FLOOR IN A LOST CAUSE. ALL I WANT TO SEE IS WHEN THOSE BAD MOMENTS HAPPEN, THEN USE THE PLAYING TIME ON THOSE PROMISING YOUNG GUYS WHO ARE JUST SITTING. OVER THE LAST TWO GAMES, THERE IS NO WAY THAT EITHER JACKSON OR SMITH SHOLD HAVE BEEN ON THE FLOOR FOR VERY LONG BASED ON THEIR PERFORMANCE. THE TEAM WOULD HAVE BETTER OFF WITH THEIR 3RD POINT GUARD DURING THOSE TIMES OR TO ALLOW ANOTHER PLAYER LIKE JOHNSON TO DRIBBLE THE BALL UP THE FLOOR AND MAKE THE RIGHT PASS TO START THE HALF COURT OFFENSE. ALL I CAN SAY IS STAN VAN GUNDY MUST LIKE THE FAST UP TEMPO STYLE A LOT AND IS WILING TO STOMACH HIS POINT GUARDS TURNING THE BASKETBALL OVER A LOT. PRETTY STUPID BASKETBALL STAN AND I AM SURE MANY OF THE PLAYERS ARE GETTING PISSED OFF.

[cool breeze]

The change has been amazing on a lot of fronts, but two of them stand out.

Commitment to Detroit: Gores said a lot of things before he took over the Pistons, frankly things I hoped were true, but wasn't sure I believed. It turns out he was as good as his word, he's a real son of Michigan, and LA hasn't dimmed his love for home.

The move back to Detroit solidified his commitment to the region and the Detroit community in a way that makes me feel really good about this new ownership and especially with his first big hire Stan Van Gundy.

Commitment to a quality Team: The hiring of SVG was so much better than I imagined. I already believed he would be a good coach, but I didn't see how wise he was in his vision of how a modern organization should be run. I underestimated the lessons he learned from working with Pat Riley and the troubles he has in Orlando.

I copied almost all of this article, and it speaks to what he's done here, building from the ruins of "Mrs D" and Joe's ill fated last few years. He's taken us from being a total joke to something with tons of potential and valued assets! It's no small feat when you have nothing to start with and no bargaining power. Count out blessings Piston Fans.

And that speaks to the work – an amazing body of it, when you step back and allow a little perspective – Van Gundy and general manager Jeff Bower have done in 2½ years since inheriting a mostly bereft roster.

Van Gundy had a 20-year-old Andre Drummond, full of potential after two NBA seasons, and decided immediately he was a player around whom to build a roster – and a franchise. He had Kentavious Caldwell-Pope coming off a rookie season that stamped him more of a mystery than a building block. He had Greg Monroe, already determined to get a fresh start elsewhere, and two veterans with spotty reputations, Josh Smith and Brandon Jennings.

And a week into the job, Van Gundy learned he had to hand over his lottery pick to Charlotte.
Since then, he’s traded for Reggie Jackson, Marcus Morris and Tobias Harris for shockingly little cost, added Aron Baynes, Jon Leuer and Ish Smith – the heart of a vastly improved bench – in free agency and drafted two players with vast upside, Stanley Johnson and Henry Ellenson. He’s retained all of the franchise’s future first-round picks in those lopsided trades for three quality starters, too.

That gives the Pistons an enviable trove of assets. Johnson has struggled in his second season, adjusting to a niche role after a lifetime of having his name on the marquee, but is coming off a promising outing in Dallas. Ellenson is buried behind Harris and Leuer on the depth chart, but showed Van Gundy enough in the first two weeks of training camp to see a budding scoring star.
Two years ago, they would have been used of dire necessity. Even last season, Johnson was more a need than a luxury. The addition of Leuer has limited him to backup minutes at one position (shooting guard) instead of two (small forward, too) and that could well have something to do with Johnson struggling to find a rhythm in fewer opportunities than he’s ever experienced.

Van Gundy said midway through preseason that Ellenson, sooner rather than later – sometime this season, perhaps, or early next season – would force some decisions on frontcourt minutes.
As those two first-rounders mature and emerge, as Harris and Morris and Caldwell-Pope continue their career ascents, as the Pistons add another young player in next year’s highly anticipated draft, the assets drawer is going to start bulging.

It guarantees that the phones are going to ring with a frequency unknown to Van Gundy and Bower that lonely first summer as they plotted a course out of the woods. It also means that when they place phone calls to their peers, they’ll be answered on the first ring.

Van Gundy likes his roster – like, a lot – and now that Jackson is working his way back, he’ll have a handle soon enough on where he thinks it can take the franchise. But if at any point he sees an opening to climb another rung or two on the NBA ladder, he might yet place one of those phone calls of the sort that led to last week’s head fake. When he goes to the market now, he’s going with stuffed pockets.

Oracle thanks for taking the time to share this information.

[Oracle]

The change has been amazing on a lot of fronts, but two of them stand out.

Commitment to Detroit: Gores said a lot of things before he took over the Pistons, frankly things I hoped were true, but wasn't sure I believed. It turns out he was as good as his word, he's a real son of Michigan, and LA hasn't dimmed his love for home.

The move back to Detroit solidified his commitment to the region and the Detroit community in a way that makes me feel really good about this new ownership and especially with his first big hire Stan Van Gundy.

Commitment to a quality Team: The hiring of SVG was so much better than I imagined. I already believed he would be a good coach, but I didn't see how wise he was in his vision of how a modern organization should be run. I underestimated the lessons he learned from working with Pat Riley and the troubles he has in Orlando.

I copied almost all of this article, and it speaks to what he's done here, building from the ruins of "Mrs D" and Joe's ill fated last few years. He's taken us from being a total joke to something with tons of potential and valued assets! It's no small feat when you have nothing to start with and no bargaining power. Count out blessings Piston Fans.

And that speaks to the work – an amazing body of it, when you step back and allow a little perspective – Van Gundy and general manager Jeff Bower have done in 2½ years since inheriting a mostly bereft roster.

Van Gundy had a 20-year-old Andre Drummond, full of potential after two NBA seasons, and decided immediately he was a player around whom to build a roster – and a franchise. He had Kentavious Caldwell-Pope coming off a rookie season that stamped him more of a mystery than a building block. He had Greg Monroe, already determined to get a fresh start elsewhere, and two veterans with spotty reputations, Josh Smith and Brandon Jennings.

And a week into the job, Van Gundy learned he had to hand over his lottery pick to Charlotte.
Since then, he’s traded for Reggie Jackson, Marcus Morris and Tobias Harris for shockingly little cost, added Aron Baynes, Jon Leuer and Ish Smith – the heart of a vastly improved bench – in free agency and drafted two players with vast upside, Stanley Johnson and Henry Ellenson. He’s retained all of the franchise’s future first-round picks in those lopsided trades for three quality starters, too.

That gives the Pistons an enviable trove of assets. Johnson has struggled in his second season, adjusting to a niche role after a lifetime of having his name on the marquee, but is coming off a promising outing in Dallas. Ellenson is buried behind Harris and Leuer on the depth chart, but showed Van Gundy enough in the first two weeks of training camp to see a budding scoring star.
Two years ago, they would have been used of dire necessity. Even last season, Johnson was more a need than a luxury. The addition of Leuer has limited him to backup minutes at one position (shooting guard) instead of two (small forward, too) and that could well have something to do with Johnson struggling to find a rhythm in fewer opportunities than he’s ever experienced.

Van Gundy said midway through preseason that Ellenson, sooner rather than later – sometime this season, perhaps, or early next season – would force some decisions on frontcourt minutes.
As those two first-rounders mature and emerge, as Harris and Morris and Caldwell-Pope continue their career ascents, as the Pistons add another young player in next year’s highly anticipated draft, the assets drawer is going to start bulging.

It guarantees that the phones are going to ring with a frequency unknown to Van Gundy and Bower that lonely first summer as they plotted a course out of the woods. It also means that when they place phone calls to their peers, they’ll be answered on the first ring.

Van Gundy likes his roster – like, a lot – and now that Jackson is working his way back, he’ll have a handle soon enough on where he thinks it can take the franchise. But if at any point he sees an opening to climb another rung or two on the NBA ladder, he might yet place one of those phone calls of the sort that led to last week’s head fake. When he goes to the market now, he’s going with stuffed pockets.

[Oracle]

Pistons crank up the defense in the 4th while KCP heats up a bit from being cold and Stanley Johnson plays another very good game.

But the biggest news is the continued great play of Jon Leuer!

Very pleased with this win!

Also Reggie is getting a bit better, but I still don't like the loose way he dribbles, looking like a turnover waiting to happen.

[BallinD]

KS, you suggested this earlier, and I do not disagree. He may be playing marginally better than Mook, but the issue IMO is at the point. As long as Leuer gets his minutes, does it really matter whether he starts or not?

Reggie is killing our ball movement, chemistry, defense...

Not sure what the answer is. I guess SVG plans to muddle through his recuperation (on the court) period and hope for the best.

[KaySlay]

Hey Piston Pals!

I am glad dX and Oracle feel the way I do when it come to Leuer. I am still interested in seeing him in the starting lineup.

Jon Leuer has been the Pistons’ biggest source of stability

"Over the course of the season, when Leuer is off the court, the Pistons are outscored 106.3 to 104.5 for a net rating of -1.8 points per 100 possessions. When Leuer is on the court, the Pistons outscore their opponents 101 to 96 per 100 possessions, a +4.9 differential."

We actually ran a couple of plays for him, which we have not done all year,” Pistons coach Stan Van Gundy said. “We’ve got to start incorporating a little more into our offense for him. I think there’s more there than we’re getting now. That guy is a really good basketball player

I agree Stan, now put him in the starting lineup.

[WTF]

Fair enough, Oracle.  538 favors the Giants (mildly), then we'll be major underdogs against the Cowboys.  I'm guessing the Packers game will be about 50/50, but few will be surprised if we lose that one.

Great season so far.  I think Stafford probably has made more of a difference to his team, has been most valuable in that sense, than anyone else.  Tough guy, carrying the ball in with an injured finger, taking multiple hits on the way.

Brutal stretch ahead though.

After an unexpected win over N.O. and a gritty one over the Bears, the Lions have climbed into #5 in one power ranking I saw, sitting pretty.  Nothing but a classic debacle keeps them out of the playoffs.  

What are the odds?  538 puts their odds of getting into the playoffs at 84% and of winning the division at 76%.  Why do those odds seems high to me (although I would put them at over 50% to make the playoffs)?  Fifty years of following this team or undue pessimism?

You feel uneasy because the damn schedule for the remaining games is a killer!!! If the sight of finishing out the season with the Giants & Cowboys on the road, and Green Bay at home doesn't frighten you, you're likely a corpse!

I say they're capable of winning all 3 remaining games. If there's was 1 game that I would worry about it would be the GIANTS, but who's worrying GO LIONS!!!! Both the Cowboys and Packers games likely more meaningful with much at stake, the could be playing Dallas for home field throughout or they could be playing the Packers for the Division. They win all 3 then it doesn't even matter

[Sparma]

Fair enough, Oracle. 538 favors the Giants (mildly), then we'll be major underdogs against the Cowboys. I'm guessing the Packers game will be about 50/50, but few will be surprised if we lose that one.

Great season so far. I think Stafford probably has made more of a difference to his team, has been most valuable in that sense, than anyone else. Tough guy, carrying the ball in with an injured finger, taking multiple hits on the way.

Brutal stretch ahead though.

After an unexpected win over N.O. and a gritty one over the Bears, the Lions have climbed into #5 in one power ranking I saw, sitting pretty.  Nothing but a classic debacle keeps them out of the playoffs.  

What are the odds?  538 puts their odds of getting into the playoffs at 84% and of winning the division at 76%.  Why do those odds seems high to me (although I would put them at over 50% to make the playoffs)?  Fifty years of following this team or undue pessimism?

You feel uneasy because the damn schedule for the remaining games is a killer!!! If the sight of finishing out the season with the Giants & Cowboys on the road, and Green Bay at home doesn't frighten you, you're likely a corpse!

[Oracle]

After an unexpected win over N.O. and a gritty one over the Bears, the Lions have climbed into #5 in one power ranking I saw, sitting pretty.  Nothing but a classic debacle keeps them out of the playoffs.  

What are the odds?  538 puts their odds of getting into the playoffs at 84% and of winning the division at 76%.  Why do those odds seems high to me (although I would put them at over 50% to make the playoffs)?  Fifty years of following this team or undue pessimism?

You feel uneasy because the damn schedule for the remaining games is a killer!!! If the sight of finishing out the season with the Giants & Cowboys on the road, and Green Bay at home doesn't frighten you, you're likely a corpse!

[Sparma]

After an unexpected win over N.O. and a gritty one over the Bears, the Lions have climbed into #5 in one power ranking I saw, sitting pretty.  Nothing but a classic debacle keeps them out of the playoffs.  

What are the odds? 538 puts their odds of getting into the playoffs at 84% and of winning the division at 76%. Why do those odds seems high to me (although I would put them at over 50% to make the playoffs)? Fifty years of following this team or undue pessimism?

[BallinD]

SVG clueless, team all discombobulated, Ish demasculated, Reggie carrying "his team" to the depths of despair.

[lemonpen]

This is a complicated game in a simple league. History has proven over and over again that an organizations chances of reaching the mountain top without HOF caliber players are slim and none. Matter of fact those chances don't become strong unless you get a top 50 All Time candidate.

We got guys. Guys with skills. Guys with uber physical talent. Guys with leadership (well one guy; Ish). Guys with an edge / attitude. Guys with a killer instinct. What we lack is one guy with all of the above. I think we might have a pretty good supporting group, but no BIG GUN with a voice that resonates. A voice that all others rally around, or get the F out.

[Phil-Good]

1. Stan got out coached tonight. Stan had Ish and Jackson on the floor too long together. Those two will not work together. Especially if R. Jackson is playing PG and Ish is standing in the corner watching Reggie pound the life out of the basketball.

2. Reggie Jackson. This guy really pissed me off tonight with the hot dog S.H.I.T he pulled. cost the pistons the game.

3. Great job Stan. He just put 20 million per season in Pop's picket by not going with Stanley or Hilliard in the 4th. Instead rolling with Ish and Jackson. Little trust in your 2-guards looks bad And makes Pop pockets look really good.

The Pistons have A lot of work to put in. Can't let easy wins like this slip away.

[deusXango]

I never thought I'd see the day when I said Ish Smith is a better PG than Reggie Jackson; when I say better it's because he seems to get the TEAM into its offense much quicker, gets everyone involved, and is not a "one trick pony." Reggie is a far better scorer than Ish, but my statement is aimed at PG play and with this team, we need a PG that plays Ish's game. (Look what T.J. McConnell did with a less talented team...he played Ish's game!!) Also, it's debatable as to who plays better defense, all things considered. Playing them both together is not a bad look but, allow Ish to be the primary ball handler and keep Reggie playing off the ball...he reminded me of Rodney Stuckey, when he completely stalled the 4th quarter comeback with his poor overall play, with the ball.

The fire is lit, I hope it flares and burns hot because I loved the effort Stanley Johnson displayed in the game. No one (with the exception of Marcus Morris) could hit a moose in the ass with a bass fiddle but, it was a fierce defensive game Stanley played; way to go young fella!!!

[Oracle]

The Pistons were on the way back to winning this game, when Reggie came down the court hot dogging, and turned the ball over... we never recovered and never scored another point with a lot of time left!

On the plus side, Stanley Johnson played very good defense, and was a big reason we almost came back and won this one!

I really want to see KCP and Stanley defending together one day, that was my dream before the season started.

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