FORUM

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Re: FORUM

Post  deusXango on Tue May 07, 2013 3:00 am

merc wrote:For our F.A. targets I'd rather not overspend on anyone in this years pool... just get a good piece for just over the MLE (weeding out the competition)... saving enough for a mid season deal from a team needing to shed salary (gaining a bigger impact player).
This almost guarantees that Stuckey and CV continue to play prominent roles on the Pistons (wasting one more year of Drummond's and Monroe's careers); someone on this site advocated that we wait on Joe to make trade deadline deals this year and they never materialized (next to making bad decisions, prognostication is a damning defect of Joe Dumars).

Some of the desirable F.A.s are on teams that will have plenty of cap to drive the price up (Ty Evans, O.J. Mayo, Milsap etc.)
We don't need any of 'em!

Then there are the F.A.s that are old enough that they may be on the downside when the Pistons are truly ready to go deep into the playoffs (Smith, Iguodala, Kaman etc.)
Smith is the only one mentioned that has any value to the direction the Pistons could quite possibility be going in; IMHO Iggy and Kaman are on the decline now, and it's going to really be apparent next year.

Acting like rich fat cats with will put us right back in the same position (BG & CV)... Max deals should be reserved for two way superstars... which doesn't exist this year.
Monroe is not that "two way superstar" but there's talk circulating now about him being a max player; signing Smith to a big contract will help this team far more than it'll hurt, because Monroe and Drummond need a player of his skillset and there's only one out there now.

IMO the plan should be to focus on young players that haven't reached their upside... players like Aminu, Brewer, Clark.... hardly glamorous but good piece to the puzzle.
This I agree with 100%!

By acquiring good young talent via trades we can send back salary which extends the shelf life of our own useful talent.... Any deals can happen before the opening of the Piranha frenzy...
Don't overspend on this crop!
The Pistons can't just sit on their CAP money; you get what you pay for (hopefully) so under spending on this crop can be another long range curse.
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Re: FORUM

Post  Sparma2 on Tue May 07, 2013 12:48 am

Kudos to the Bulls!

I've got a proliferating set of ads which follow the announcement of the forum. I think Philip mentioned the same thing a week ago. Any advice? Time to toss the computer in the trash and stay out of contact?

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Can Burke take the pounding in the NBA?

Post  cool breeze on Tue May 07, 2013 12:39 am

Just watching Nate Robinson get his head crushed and then have Labron fall on him on this last game, makes me wonder how Burke would handle such abuse. I watched Burke struggle in some games this year playing against bigger and stronger guards. Yet some of you are offering the thought that Piston management should give away Knight to move up in the draft. Just checking the facts, Knight is 6 feet 3 inches tall and has added a lot of muscle over the last year. Maybe Knight will look even stronger this fall and will have two seasons of NBA experience under his belt. I think some of you think you have some of our young players down. You don't think they will ever be winners. I disagree. I think Knight will become a great point guard. He needs better players to play with. Calderon didn't look special with this team. Do any of you believe that Burke would change things for the Pistons if Stuckey and Charlie V are still on the team next year? And some of you have counted out Singler saying his defense is lacking. Yet after Prince was traded it was a given that Singler was the best defender on the team. The reason why Singler got the starts at the two guard and small forward was because he was an outstanding help defender. Some of you are watching Chicago play basketball. Why are they such a great defensive team? THEY BELIEVE IN PLAYERS WHO HELP OTHER PLAYERS ON DEFENSE. We need more Kyle Singlers on this Piston team instead of placing him on the bench or trading him.

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Josh Smith Is Only 26 Years Old

Post  WTF on Tue May 07, 2013 12:20 am

A 5 year deal only makes him 31 at the end of it.
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Re: FORUM

Post  cool breeze on Tue May 07, 2013 12:19 am

merc wrote:For our F.A. targets I'd rather not overspend on anyone in this years pool... just get a good piece for just over the MLE (weeding out the competition)... saving enough for a mid season deal from a team needing to shed salary (gaining a bigger impact player).

Some of the desirable F.A.s are on teams that will have plenty of cap to drive the price up (Ty Evans, O.J. Mayo, Milsap etc)

Then there are the F.A.s that are old enough that they may be on the downside when the Pistons are truly ready to go deep into the playoffs (Smith, Iguodala, Kaman etc)

Acting like rich fat cats with will put us right back in the same position (BG & CV)... Max deals should be reserved for two way superstars... which doesn't exist this year.

IMO the plan should be to focus on young players that haven't reached their upside... players like Aminu, Brewer, Clark.... hardly glamorous but good piece to the puzzle.

By acquiring good young talent via trades we can send back salary which extends the shelf life of our own useful talent.... Any deals can happen before the opening of the Piranha frenzy...
Don't overspend on this crop!

You can't change the facts about this group of players available as free agents. Your post makes the most sense of all Mercury. If this current group of young Pistons are given time to develop skill and chemistry on both ends while adding one or two tough young guys through free agency or trades, your idea gives the Pistons the best chance to excel in two or three more years. However, I worry about this owner. He might do something crazy which might set the team back even more. The seats are empty.


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Re: FORUM

Post  merc on Mon May 06, 2013 11:19 pm

For our F.A. targets I'd rather not overspend on anyone in this years pool... just get a good piece for just over the MLE (weeding out the competition)... saving enough for a mid season deal from a team needing to shed salary (gaining a bigger impact player).

Some of the desirable F.A.s are on teams that will have plenty of cap to drive the price up (Ty Evans, O.J. Mayo, Milsap etc)

Then there are the F.A.s that are old enough that they may be on the downside when the Pistons are truly ready to go deep into the playoffs (Smith, Iguodala, Kaman etc)

Acting like rich fat cats with will put us right back in the same position (BG & CV)... Max deals should be reserved for two way superstars... which doesn't exist this year.

IMO the plan should be to focus on young players that haven't reached their upside... players like Aminu, Brewer, Clark.... hardly glamorous but good piece to the puzzle.

By acquiring good young talent via trades we can send back salary which extends the shelf life of our own useful talent.... Any deals can happen before the opening of the Piranha frenzy...
Don't overspend on this crop!
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Wiseism I Like That

Post  WTF on Mon May 06, 2013 11:03 pm

BTW, either stop calling CV & Gordon dumb, or treat everything as black and white! It's so easy to say something was dumb if it doesn't work! If your criteria is smart if it works and dumb if it doesn't, you have a whole bunch of dumb in your past, and we both know it's not that cut and dry. Admittedly I really didn't mind the signing of Charlie, but the Gordon signing was so dumb on so many levels because it result in trading away Affalo and the mental breakdown of Rip. It was dumb because Joe gave away what was a perfectly sound back-court. It's not dumb because it failed that was inevitable signing Gordon was simply un-neccessary and un-called for.

Speaking of another Wiseism, you made another strangely illogical comment about you don't need to have a GM as good as Joe's record, just go out and get anybody! See Below Comment

Wow, that logic escapes me! If that logic made any sense, then why in the world don't all of the GM's have 6 Conference titles and a championship to their credit? Correction Joe only has 2 ECF Titles and 6 ECF appearances. The logic is that before Joe had 6 ECF appearances he had none when he hired in. It's is illogical to assume that only this feat can be accomplished by only Joe Dumars and that the next inexperience GM would be as successful.
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Holy effing CRAP!!!

Post  Oracle on Mon May 06, 2013 10:50 pm

The Bulls are about to beat the HEAT!!!!
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If Phil Jackson won't do this...

Post  Oracle on Mon May 06, 2013 10:49 pm

A Piston at heart, Isiah Thomas would rush to coaching interview

Then he's no better than Joe!

How in hell do you justify NOT interviewing Zeke?

Oh, the same way you did it with Laimbeer, but they'll parade a bunch of bums in here then give it to Shaw! mad
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Interesting Article

Post  Oracle on Mon May 06, 2013 10:44 pm

WISEFAN wrote:

It touched on a couple of things I've been saying, one I mentioned often trading either Knight or Monroe which I still think we should do.

I certainly don't think one can call Ben and Charlie bold moves more like ill-advised and dumb.

I've got every part of my body crossed in hope that we land 1,2, or 3 in the draft and that Joe is smart enough to select Burke. Would I consider Knight and our pick in a swap to move in to a top 3 spot? I sure would.

The more I've watch Tony Allen the more I like him and think we should make him an offer this summer.

As for Smith no way I don't make him an offer

I would love to see a line up of Burke, Allen, Josh, Monroe and Drummond or something close to this.

I knew you would like that article as it backs up some of the things you've advocated, and that I back(at least some of them)!

I'm 100% wanting Burke, less excited about trading Monroe or Knight, but I also don't rule it out, just show me what the return is!

BTW, either stop calling CV & Gordon dumb, or treat everything as black and white! It's so easy to say something was dumb if it doesn't work! If your criteria is smart if it works and dumb if it doesn't, you have a whole bunch of dumb in your past, and we both know it's not that cut and dry.

Speaking of another Wiseism, you made another strangely illogical comment about you don't need to have a GM as good as Joe's record, just go out and get anybody!

Wow, that logic escapes me! If that logic made any sense, then why in the world don't all of the GM's have 6 Conference titles and a championship to their credit?

How many of them have 1 Conference title or 1 championship?

Where do you keep coming up with this stuff Smile
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Joe was out of his mind and out of touch

Post  deusXango on Mon May 06, 2013 8:28 pm

Go Stones! wrote:Do you remember when the Atlanta Hawks wanted to keep J.Konkac and the Pistons signed an offer sheet and the Hawks had to make the decision to up the price and sign or allow the Pistons to sign him. That was one HORENDOUS signing...did not pay off for the Hawks. This article blames that signing on all the financial issues in the NBA:

SOOOOO, I say we do it again to other teams to make sure they sign some of these duds for max contracts so they are handicapped for years to come.

ORRRRR, was that what Joe D was trying to do with CV and Ben Gordon?
Stones, Chicago was done with Gordon and wasn't going to pay him $10 million a year; enter Dumars with his nonsense. Milwaukee was glad that Villanueva's contract was up; again, enter stage left, the clown from Detroit with an offer that exceeded the veteran's minimum (all CV could have gotten from anyone else).

Now that I'm over the shock of Phil Jackson coming to town to "consult" on the coaching hire, I wonder why Dumars never consulted with Jack McCloskey on anything? The popular thread is to mock Laimbeer's qualifications to coach the Pistons, and question why Joe's consistently turned his back on his comrade in arms but, it's never discussed why McCloskey (a proven commodity) has never had any input while Joe was making these blunders. Chuck Daly, bless his soul, must be turning over in his grave.
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Hmmmm...Let's John Konkac the other teams...

Post  Go Stones! on Mon May 06, 2013 7:32 pm

Do you remember when the Atlanta Hawks wanted to keep J.Konkac and the Pistons signed an offer sheet and the Hawks had to make the decision to up the price and sign or allow the Pistons to sign him. That was one HORENDOUS signing...did not pay off for the Hawks. This article blames that signing on all the financial issues in the NBA:

SOOOOO, I say we do it again to other teams to make sure they sign some of these duds for max contracts so they are handicapped for years to come.

ORRRRR, was that what Joe D was trying to do with CV and Ben Gordon?
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Wise, straighten me out on a few things

Post  deusXango on Mon May 06, 2013 6:30 pm

WISEFAN wrote:

It touched on a couple of things I've been saying, one I mentioned often trading either Knight or Monroe which I still think we should do.
IMHO Knight is the most logical trade piece the Pistons have right now; I'm not for giving up on Monroe regardless what his limitations on defense are, he's a big man!!

I certainly don't think one can call Ben and Charlie bold moves more like ill-advised and dumb.

I've got every part of my body crossed in hope that we land 1,2, or 3 in the draft and that Joe is smart enough to select Burke. Would I consider Knight and our pick in a swap to move in to a top 3 spot? I sure would.
You and me both Wise; if we're going to go the "undersized" route, I'm taking Burke over Knight all day long! We need a young PG in the worst way.

The more I've watch Tony Allen the more I like him and think we should make him an offer this summer.
I personally feel that he's found a home with the Grizzlies and will finish his career there.

As for Smith no way I don't make him an offer
This is the linchpin for the Pistons big men; he brings together perfectly the skills of Monroe and Drummond, and creates a balance that no team in the NBA will have! At this point only the foolish are spending Tom Gores money and turning their backs on the enormous possibilities Smith represents.
I would love to see a line up of Burke, Allen, Josh, Monroe and Drummond or something close to this.
Failing to sign Tony Allen, I'm for giving Khris Middleton the same chance Kyle Singler was given at SG; Singler's defensive shortcomings shouldn't be viewed as Middleton's if for no other reason, they're two different players!!! I think he's better than Mohammad and McLemore (it remains to be seen what Ben McLemore is going to bring to the NBA).
Wise, are we on the same page or am I a babe lost in the woods?
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Another day has ticked by without a head coach for the Pistons. And we are not even sure who the GM is right now.

Post  cool breeze on Mon May 06, 2013 5:40 pm

I tried last night to communicate with Walter Dukes through a Medium fortune teller to find out if he might know what in hell is going on in Piston land. If we are counting on our Detroit News sports reporters to give us the low down we might as well try something like that. I had no luck. Walter would not respond regardless of how much money I spent with the Medium. Without a coach or possibly GM, how can the Piston brain trust function? Is the famous Laker and Bulls head coach using his Zen abilities right this minute to figure out this mess called the Detroit Pistons? Mr. Gores has gone on a star search it seems much like school boards in Michigan who bring in a new superintendent from New Mexico to solve the issues that the previous super could not solve. If I could please make a suggestion here. Please Mr. Gores hire a coach with some common sense this time around. And make sure your GM doesn't sign another Charlie V. And please remove Charlie from the roster. This alone might bring in more fans.

Does size count? Please watch the NY - Indiana series. The Pacers are big. Our team needs more big men not Maxiell for another 3 years. If Joe is still the GM, please don't even think about Jason even though you love him. If Burke is not available, draft Zeller who was listed as the number one pick for much of the season on most draft boards. Wasn't that the same for Drummond? Trade for a solid vet shooting guard who can make big shots and play outstanding defense. Better defense wins games. Yes Joe I know you forgot that fact but now believe in defense again. If Dumars had not gone soft on his belief that defense is important, he would not be in the hot seat right now.

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Hey DX

Post  WTF on Mon May 06, 2013 4:54 pm

Phil1980boy wrote:"Stick 'em up your ass Phillip!!"

No apology needed Xango. Keep em coming. That was funny... lol

We have to have some fun on this thing. The draft is A good while away and so is the free agent market and trades...

Don't encourage Sour Pee Boy to stick things in his arse! He's been riled up every since Collins came out the closet lol
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FORUM

Post  WTF on Mon May 06, 2013 4:50 pm


It touched on a couple of things I've been saying, one I mentioned often trading either Knight or Monroe which I still think we should do.

I certainly don't think one can call Ben and Charlie bold moves more like ill-advised and dumb.

I've got every part of my body crossed in hope that we land 1,2, or 3 in the draft and that Joe is smart enough to select Burke. Would I consider Knight and our pick in a swap to move in to a top 3 spot? I sure would.

The more I've watch Tony Allen the more I like him and think we should make him an offer this summer.

As for Smith no way I don't make him an offer

I would love to see a line up of Burke, Allen, Josh, Monroe and Drummond or something close to this.
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Re: FORUM

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