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Don

Post  Oracle on Sun Jun 30, 2013 11:37 pm

You're right about Jack, I'm sure he's happy where he's at!

I didn't know that Al-Farouq, Aminu was unrestricted! Joe should absolutely looking his way!

BTW, this is a good source - 2013 Free Agent Tracker
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The FA crop is weak, but...

Post  deusXango on Sun Jun 30, 2013 11:36 pm

Oracle wrote:We have to spend some money, so let's go for solid and do it quickly!

1. O.J Mayo if the price is right
2. Jarrett Jack, could be good
3. Tony Allen, absolutely good on the defensive end!
4. Kevin Martin, when I see him I think soft defensively, but can drain 3's decently

These guys come to top of mind because we can't get or afford the top 3, and outside of Chris Paul, I'm not interested in Howard, and Smith's price tag is going to be silly for his skill level, but some sucker will pay!
Second rate guards are to be where we spend the CAP money we went to such great extents to acquire? Make no mistake, the best of this lot won't be leaving their current teams. From the ridiculous to the sublimely insane!
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Don

Post  Oracle on Sun Jun 30, 2013 10:50 pm

I know you're speaking from emotion, but you really need to examine what you're saying.

"It is nonsense to believe that KCP is a sure thing and not a smart thing for the Pistons. I hope like hell that I am wrong and he becomes a fantastic player for the Pistons." - Don

Are you kidding? This is the Draft Don, and a weak one at that... there are no "Sure Things"! Why must KCP be a sure thing and everybody else in the draft can fail and it's no problem?

Burke was obviously the 2nd or 3rd best guard or he wouldn't even have been on the board... let's get real! KCP isn't tied to Burke any more than he's tied to MCW or CJ, why are you making that connection? You're biased against this kid from the start for reasons that have nothing to do with him.

Don't be upset with Joe, get upset with all the teams that passed on a "Sure Thing" so good because they've got to be even dumber than Joe!

"I believe Dumars knows squat about KCP and how he handles key situations. That player couldn't get other players around him to improve enough to win or even get close to winning games last season." - Don

All I can say is Wow! Don, you can't believe that, or you'll need a list so long it's crazy to line up GREAT players that couldn't make a bunch of slugs play better and actually win anything.

Are you agreeing with the Knight detractors because Knight couldn't Maxiell & Stuckey to play better he's not capable? Not only didn't Knight get them to play better, those dudes actually got worse! You can't put that on Knight and you can't hang KCP's teammates around his neck.

Don, that's really unfair and not accurate! If the team is bad, you can only do so much especially if you aren't the PG for the team! So KCP had to be the scorer, distributor, big shot taker and the man to lead them when nobody else stepped up!

Sounds like a decent resume to me, but just like most players in this draft, I'm not looking for great, I'm looking for solid role players, and that's what I think he is. If he can become a starter... GREAT!

Bottom Line: Would I have drafted Burke? Hell yeah! But I didn't have the plan to free agency & trades! I don't know where they plan to go, so there's no way I can totally rule out what Joe did without seeing where he's going.

But I don't see KCP as a disaster either, but it's the draft, it's a crap shoot in good years, which really does make the strongest case for drafting a more know quantity like Burke, but we don't know for sure, and that's the only "Sure Thing" in any draft!
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Re: FORUM

Post  cool breeze on Sun Jun 30, 2013 10:13 pm

[quote="Oracle"]"And why are we targeting Eric Bledsoe instead of Lawson, Walker or Burke?  WTF has Bledsoe ever won?  Bedsoe was a "1 and doner" at KY, where is played off the ball in a backcourt with John Wall." - Murph

Murph, that's not quite fair, If you use that criteria it not only disqualifies 95% of the NBA, it also puts forth the notion that your performance doesn't count unless you've won something!

Also is it fair to blame the role player for the team not winning? We generally slap that on the star of the team. It's more fair, but also isn't accurate in a lot of cases.

"But clever Joe didn't want the Timberwolves to know how interested he was in KCP because Joe was sure that Minn. wanted to draft him. Hummm. Is that so?" - Don

Don, the evidence supports Joe way more than your theory. The fact of the matter is that no one wanted Burke, and if Utah hadn't worked the deal, he would have dropped like a rock! So let's not pretend that Burke was considered the best PG in the draft, he wasn't.

Secondly, it's way more than obvious Minny wanted someone that had already been picked, and the solid betting money was that they wanted either McLemore or KCP. Once both were gone, the deal made sense to swap Burke!

Oracle on the most recent post, I would pass on all others you mentioned but Jack. However, based on how he played for Golden State, I can't imagine them not signing this guy. And Jack looked like he loved playing with those players as well.

I still think that I am right about my theory regarding the mistake of passing on Burke. The fact remains that Utah wanted a point guard and they identified Burke as the guy they wanted on their team not the other guards that others mentioned. Burke has the special quality Utah noticed in Burke as a winner type player. They were not worried about his size because he outplayed the bigger guards throughout his career. Burke has the mean streak and killer attitude like Isiah Thomas. That is important when considering that Utah liked those qualities in Burke. They didn't want the other point guards. It was Burke and they were willing to give up two first round draft picks for him. And the brain trust from the Timberwolves knew it. They didn't need a point guard on their team. But they knew Burke had a high value and they kicked Dumars butt in this draft. The player who is more ready to make an impact next season is Muhammad. He has the NBA body and he has all the offensive weapons and confidence to have his will on current NBA players. He will have to get in better shape so he can play effective defense but Muhammad is the player I suspect will be the talk of the draft by next spring. And this was a great pick for the Timberwolves who will break out into an elite team if they can stay healthy. I watched both Muhammad and Crabbe a lot last season. They both played in a defensive orientated conference and had huge pressure on them for every conference game. Both handled the pressure really well. So I still will stand with my idea that it would have been much better to have drafted two proven shooters who have both long distance skill as well as offensive skill closer to the basket. Muhammad is especially strong around the rim. KCP does not have a mid range game. You have to have developed that part of the game to ever become effective in the NBA. What we have regarding KCP is hype. I think he is better than Darko and Rodney White because he can defend. But why take a chance on basing everything on this guy when you could have had two players to fill needs on this Piston team? The fact is that Dumars had no idea that Utah wanted Burke that bad. But Minn, management did have that information because the trade was announced directly after Burke was selected. The other reason to draft Burke was the fact that he is a great point guard who could have been great on this Piston team if Detroit had picked him and not made that trade. It is nonsense to believe that KCP is a sure thing and not a smart thing for the Pistons. I hope like hell that I am wrong and he becomes a fantastic player for the Pistons. And one final comment that I believe is true. The workouts and the draft combines should count very little in the selection process. Drafting a player should involve what that player did for his team and what his coaches thought about that player in the past. How did that player play when all the marbles were on the line and the emotions are at their peak. Great players really don't use their emotion and mojo at a workout. If Larry Bird had gone to a modern day combine, he would have been ridiculed to no end. In the past, Dumars has made this same mistake. He made it with Rodney White, Darko, Maxiell and Daye. White was a ball hog in college and played zero defense and his teammates did not like him in high school or college. Darko was never a key player on any team he ever played on and now his career is over. Daye was a horrible defender and if Dumars had bothered to ask his college coach, that coach would have laughed at Dumars because Daye was a liability on his college team on defense and the coaching staff had major issues trying to hide him. If I were a GM, there is no way that I would have drafted any of those players based on the theory that I would have done the necessary work that Dumars avoided before drafting those players. Why in hell should I believe Dumars knows squat about KCP and how he handles key situations. That player couldn't get other players around him to improve enough to win or even get close to winning games last season. KCP had the freedom Crabbe and Muhammad didn't have on the teams they played on. Imagine if Muhammad had played on KCP's team last season. He would have averaged over 30 points a game and with 10 rebounds. He would have been a man among boys. Most Piston fans wouldn't know that because he wasn't on television much. But I saw this guy up close and he was one strong smart basketball player and few teams could stop him when he wanted to score when it mattered. KCP would not have caused UCLA to win the PAC12 championship last season. I like this idea of "changing places"(remember that movie) and try imagine how certain college players would have fit in on teams and what they would have brought to that team when comparing players. Dumars has used guess work, speculation and projection to make his pick in the first round this season. He could have had one good point guard or two shooting guards who might become better players than KCP.


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The FA crop is weak, but...

Post  Oracle on Sun Jun 30, 2013 9:24 pm

We have to spend some money, so let's go for solid and do it quickly!

1. O.J Mayo if the price is right
2. Jarrett Jack, could be good
3. Tony Allen, absolutely good on the defensive end!
4. Kevin Martin, when I see him I think soft defensively, but can drain 3's decently

These guys come to top of mind because we can't get or afford the top 3, and outside of Chris Paul, I'm not interested in Howard, and Smith's price tag is going to be silly for his skill level, but some sucker will pay!
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Stuff: Around the league

Post  Oracle on Sun Jun 30, 2013 8:28 pm

Speaking of Burke, there are rumblings in Utah! Mo Williams will not re-sign with Utah unless they assure him he's the starting PG and not Burke - Mo Williams makes demand to Jazz, isn't ready to surrender starting PG spot to rookie Trey Burke

Are we interested? - Rockets waive Delfino and Brooks

I guess we lost the Bargnani sweepstakes before it got started - Sources: Knicks trade for Andrea Bargnani; Raptors get Steve Novak, Marcus Camby and picks, even as they also look to get Bledsoe - Report: Raptors also talking to Clippers about Eric Bledsoe

This is one of my biggest complaint areas with Joe! He hasn't been active in this level of negotiated trading like I think he should be!

Yeah he did good with the Prince trade, but we need more of that, not the once in a blue moon crap we've been getting!
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In defense of Joe...

Post  Oracle on Sun Jun 30, 2013 7:11 pm

"And why are we targeting Eric Bledsoe instead of Lawson, Walker or Burke?  WTF has Bledsoe ever won?  Bedsoe was a "1 and doner" at KY, where is played off the ball in a backcourt with John Wall." - Murph

Murph, that's not quite fair, If you use that criteria it not only disqualifies 95% of the NBA, it also puts forth the notion that your performance doesn't count unless you've won something!

Also is it fair to blame the role player for the team not winning? We generally slap that on the star of the team. It's more fair, but also isn't accurate in a lot of cases.

"But clever Joe didn't want the Timberwolves to know how interested he was in KCP because Joe was sure that Minn. wanted to draft him. Hummm. Is that so?" - Don

Don, the evidence supports Joe way more than your theory. The fact of the matter is that no one wanted Burke, and if Utah hadn't worked the deal, he would have dropped like a rock! So let's not pretend that Burke was considered the best PG in the draft, he wasn't.

Secondly, it's way more than obvious Minny wanted someone that had already been picked, and the solid betting money was that they wanted either McLemore or KCP. Once both were gone, the deal made sense to swap Burke!

The fact of the matter is that both Detroit and Minny wanted one of those two players, and if they didn't get them then they went to plan B.

Has Joe made mistakes in previous drafts... yes! However, according to that formula just about every GM should be fired!

I can't understand why folks keep harping on Burke! NOBODY took a PG before us, they all passed... WHY?

Burke worked out for these teams, and boasted about a guaranteed pick at #5! None of it came through, and those that saw him up close and personal didn't want him!

But nobody here sees that as a red flag? Something went wrong! That's not to say they won't ultimately be wrong about Burke, but it does say that in their opinions he faces a tough go!

Utah, IMO, is looking to score big again with another Big 10 guard, and I wish Burke well!

If Joe had taken a guard instead of Burke, then I think people would have a much more solid case, but he didn't! He had a plan and he stuck to it, and that's the way you have to roll if you're smart!
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Joe's next moves ...

Post  Sebastian on Sun Jun 30, 2013 5:39 pm

I'm not psychic but I got a feeling I know what Joe is planning to do:

Joe is going to give Toronto a call about helping them rid themselves from paying Rudy two more years, $36 million over the next two seasons. He's going to offer the Raptors the expiring contracts of 1) Stuckey, a PG/SG, yes a combo guard who will help their guard rotation, playing with Lowery and Derozan; and Charlie V.'s expiring contract.

You may ask, why would the Raptors want Charlie V., again. Well he does have an expiring contract of $8.5 and he can help the Raptors stay around the Cap Minimum. And, every now again, he can get hot. The Raptors will need the similar production that they would get from Bargnani, because you see the Clippers really wouldn't mind having a stretch-5 like Bargnani to open up the floor for Blake Griffin. And, Bargnani would be a great pick and pop partner with Chris Paul.

WE can also throw in the energetic, Jonas Jerebko. Jerebko has a manageable $4.5 million, two years remaining on his contract.

Next, Joe should go after Brandon Jennings. After reading the Bucks blog, I quickly learned that the Bucks fans don't think of Mr. Jennings and I believe he can be had for $7.5 million over 4 years, easily. Then WE roll with a strong roster:

PG- B. Jennings/B. Knight/Siva
SG- KCP/Middleton/English
SF- Rudy/Singler
PF- Moose/T. Mitch
C- Dre Drummond/The Ukraine
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Pistons Decide To Keep Rodney Stuckey, Decline Savings Of $4.5M

Post  Sebastian on Sun Jun 30, 2013 3:50 pm

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/228484/Pistons-Decide-To-Keep-Rodney-Stuckey-Decline-Savings-Of-$45M

Just curious to learn how my Pistons Pals would feel about helping the Raptors get out of their contractual obligations with Rudy Gay for a Stuckey and Charlie V. swap.

This trade would bring back the SF with range on his jumper that would help free up room for Moose and Dre, but it would come at a price, as Rudy is owed $17,888,932 (2013-14) and $19,317,326 (2014-15). This trade would also jettison two players that most Pistons fans don't want to see in a Pistons uniform going forward.

Just curious to read what others may think.  
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Re: FORUM

Post  cool breeze on Sun Jun 30, 2013 3:45 pm

deusXango wrote:Oracle, it's no problem. I can't wait for this years summer league to begin; I'm expecting it to be like men against boys, for the most part, I just hate they play in that kiddie gym!

All this madness about Iggy, Rondo, and Bledsoe should be put to rest, by the time summer league is over; maybe, just maybe, Vasquez and Aminu will make more sense by then. Joe's forte has been about the undiscovered gems, never the high priced, "stars." Vasquez and Aminu have been under the radar because of the franchises they've played for, not their lack of talent. After summer league, it should be apparent that we don't need the "name" players to get back on top of the heap, just a couple more solid pieces.

Am I off my rocker but, shouldn't Payton Siva be a part of this team? Out of all our draft picks, he's the only one from a WINNING program, and is known for his heady defensive play. The biggest knock on Bynum was his lack of defense; now that's being answered and at a discount cost! I can't wait to see how he plays with Drummond; he may prove that Bynum and Stuckey aren't the only ones who can make a successful "alley oop" pass, and show how inept they are as offensive facilitators. The only thing he can't beat them at is ball hogging.

dX good post. Why would Dumars want to play in that summer league which is 3rd rate at best? Please tell us Joe. And I agree with you relating to Payton Siva. He is a solid players and a huge upgrade over Bynum and Stuckey. I will really be pissed of Siva doesn't get in the rotation at the start of this season. Unlike the other two new draft selections, Siva doesn't make stupid mistakes during games. He plays great defense, can penetrate and dish. This is the type of player who will improve this club. And I love the fact that you have kept pushing for Vasquez and Aminu. However, I fear that nothing will make any sense relating to the Detroit Pistons until Joe Dumars is terminated. I want Joe to be successful but have lost all faith in his ability to make good decisions relating to NBA basketball.

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Re: FORUM

Post  cool breeze on Sun Jun 30, 2013 3:32 pm

Murph wrote:Seriously, the more I think about it, the more I realize that this is the THIRD time in the last 5 years that Joe has passed on a franchise PG.  He took Austin Daye, instead of Ty Lawson, who had just won a National Championship.  He took Brandon Knight, instead of Kemba Walker, who had just won a National Championship.  And now he took KCP, when Trey Burke just carried the Wolverines on his back to the NCAA Championship game.

WTF?  How many times does Joe have to make the exact same mistake?

And why are we targeting Eric Bledsoe instead of Lawson, Walker or Burke?  WTF has Bledsoe ever won?  Bedsoe was a "1 and doner" at KY, where is played off the ball in a backcourt with John Wall.

It's no wonder we're stuck in lottery hell.

Yes Murph! So many judgment calls have been wrong when it comes to picking players to represent Detroit by Joe Dumars. He makes a mistake in trading Billups and then tries to make up for it by signing Gordon and Charlie V. He gives away Affalo and signs Stuckey to a new contract because the pick used to obtain Stuckey in the draft was obtained by trading Darko, the 2nd overall pick in the 2003 draft. Joe makes a huge mistake and makes another knee jerk decision that puts the team further behind. And now we have the Director of Perception, Vincent Goodwill and mouthpiece for Dumars coming out spreading more disinformation today about Burke. Before the draft, Goodwill had an article relating to how important it would be to draft Burke if Detroit had the opportunity. But clever Joe didn't want the Timberwolves to know how interested he was in KCP because Joe was sure that Minn. wanted to draft him. Hummm. Is that so? Maybe Minn. wanted Joe to think that they wanted KCP, the guy who has never won much of anything. No for sure Minn. didn't want Muhammad or the other guy they ended up getting by trading Burke. The test is would the Timberwolves have been able to obtain two first round players if they had drafted Pope and then put him on the trading block? We know the answer to that question. No, it was the guy who won every award you can win along with putting his team on is back to reach the NCAA Finals named Burke who did that and was, therefore, a player in high demand. Joe's players never seem to be in high demand but Joe for sure knows his players doesn't he? Doesn't he?? Did Isiah Thomas play any better than Burke in college? His team did win the championship but my guess is that if Joe had been our GM, he wouldn't have drafted Zeke either because of team needs. My guess is that Joe will now try to cover his ass by signing a 2 guard vet. Because if he doesn't and Pope is not ready which I believe is the case, then Dumars might actually be fired. It is strange that it has taken this long before more people started looking at Dumars history as a front office leader. Rodney White, Darko, Daye, Maxiell, Stuckey, Gordon, Charlie V, Mateen Cleeves and now perhaps KCP will join the ranks of Joe's crunch time players. Joe makes a pick and the fans and the Detroit News falls in line as the Palace crumbles. Yes, Murph, all along Joe was thinking about signing Eric Bledsoe. That will solve our problems for sure. But what about the big men on the Pistons who were unable to hold their own for several seasons relating to defense and rebounding? Oh, I forgot we now have that 2nd round draft pick who was a screw off last season on his college team. He decided to screw off instead of trying to help the other players build something better. Yes, he will now be our key guy. How stupid of me. The Timberwolves tricked Dumars into drafting KCP and he hasn't figured that out yet.

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Josh Smith

Post  merc on Sun Jun 30, 2013 10:44 am

Stein says Pistons are one of 5 teams going after him
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Joe Has Some Kind of a Mental Block

Post  Murph on Sun Jun 30, 2013 8:22 am

Seriously, the more I think about it, the more I realize that this is the THIRD time in the last 5 years that Joe has passed on a franchise PG.  He took Austin Daye, instead of Ty Lawson, who had just won a National Championship.  He took Brandon Knight, instead of Kemba Walker, who had just won a National Championship.  And now he took KCP, when Trey Burke just carried the Wolverines on his back to the NCAA Championship game.

WTF?  How many times does Joe have to make the exact same mistake?

And why are we targeting Eric Bledsoe instead of Lawson, Walker or Burke? WTF has Bledsoe ever won? Bedsoe was a "1 and doner" at KY, where is played off the ball in a backcourt with John Wall.

It's no wonder we're stuck in lottery hell.
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Rondo, Josh Smith, and Iggy ...

Post  Sebastian on Sun Jun 30, 2013 5:15 am

If KCP and T. Mitch make the roster, Rondo, J-Smoove, nor Iggy will be Pistons. KCP as a first round pick is guaranteed a roster spot and T. Mitch can make the roster, especially if he becomes a professional each day going forward.



Rondo, Iggy, and J-Smoove are going to want to wear their current numbers.
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Oracle

Post  deusXango on Sun Jun 30, 2013 1:14 am

Oracle, it's no problem. I can't wait for this years summer league to begin; I'm expecting it to be like men against boys, for the most part, I just hate they play in that kiddie gym!

All this madness about Iggy, Rondo, and Bledsoe should be put to rest, by the time summer league is over; maybe, just maybe, Vasquez and Aminu will make more sense by then. Joe's forte has been about the undiscovered gems, never the high priced, "stars." Vasquez and Aminu have been under the radar because of the franchises they've played for, not their lack of talent. After summer league, it should be apparent that we don't need the "name" players to get back on top of the heap, just a couple more solid pieces.

Am I off my rocker but, shouldn't Payton Siva be a part of this team? Out of all our draft picks, he's the only one from a WINNING program, and is known for his heady defensive play. The biggest knock on Bynum was his lack of defense; now that's being answered and at a discount cost! I can't wait to see how he plays with Drummond; he may prove that Bynum and Stuckey aren't the only ones who can make a successful "alley oop" pass, and show how inept they are as offensive facilitators. The only thing he can't beat them at is ball hogging.
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DX

Post  Oracle on Sun Jun 30, 2013 12:03 am

Actually, my bad!

I thought I had written backup/play, but I only put backup, which is confusing!

However, Langolis's tweet clears up all confusion!
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Re: FORUM

Post  Oracle on Sat Jun 29, 2013 11:54 pm

deusXango wrote:
Oracle wrote:" It will be fun to watch the Summer League games. Do you know if Middleton and English will play?" - Don

Yes, both will play!

English will play SG, Middleton SF, with Siva at PG! The other rookies will backup their respective positions with Drummond at center!
What??!! No Mitchell at PF? Who's going to start at PF then?

Of course, PF is his position, you must have done a speed read. I thought I posted this, but I'll post the tweet from langolis again.

@Keith_Langlois: Starting Summer League lineup: 5-Drummond; 4-Mitchell; 3-Middleton; 2-English/KCP; 1-Siva
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Oracle

Post  deusXango on Sat Jun 29, 2013 11:42 pm

Oracle wrote:" It will be fun to watch the Summer League games. Do you know if Middleton and English will play?" - Don

Yes, both will play!

English will play SG, Middleton SF, with Siva at PG! The other rookies will backup their respective positions with Drummond at center!
What??!! No Mitchell at PF? Who's going to start at PF then?
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Don

Post  Oracle on Sat Jun 29, 2013 10:24 pm

" It will be fun to watch the Summer League games. Do you know if Middleton and English will play?" - Don

Yes, both will play!

English will play SG, Middleton SF, with Siva at PG! The other rookies will backup their respective positions with Drummond at center!
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Re: FORUM

Post  cool breeze on Sat Jun 29, 2013 9:36 pm

Oracle wrote:Don, I do feel you on Burke! While I like the direction Joe went, I do have some mixed emotions because he violated my first principle... you don't pass on winners!

I always lean towards winners because they don't win by accident! There is that "Intangible" quality that they have that shows when the lights are bright and nobody else can step up, they are there!

Burke is such a talent! KCP may be as well, we don't know, his team was so bad he never got the chance to be on a stage that big, but I don't think it's a gamble to say that he's probably no Burke!

However, that's the only quibble I have with this draft, I can fully get behind what Joe did because we're on the right path and I don't see any of those guys other than KCP getting much activity unless they blow up like Drummond!

I also think you underestimate the big 3 we have on this team! IMO, the probability of one of those 3 becoming a real alpha dog is high! The most likely, IMO is Drummond, but it could also be Monroe or Knight, and it's all dependent on how well any of them adds what's needed to their game.

The real action is about to happen, and I too want the slugs gone and for Joe to NOT consider Iggy coming here! Iggy's time has passed, IMO, and his cost is too high!

The biggest problem to me is that they have a mandate to make the playoffs this season, and that's the wrong way to run a young club! The goal should be to improve and build chemistry and let the chips fall where they may!

You could still make the playoffs, but that shouldn't be the goal, it should be the result of reaching your goals!

I agree Oracle. It will be fun to watch the Summer League games. Do you know if Middleton and English will play?

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Don

Post  Oracle on Sat Jun 29, 2013 9:30 pm

Don, I do feel you on Burke! While I like the direction Joe went, I do have some mixed emotions because he violated my first principle... you don't pass on winners!

I always lean towards winners because they don't win by accident! There is that "Intangible" quality that they have that shows when the lights are bright and nobody else can step up, they are there!

Burke is such a talent! KCP may be as well, we don't know, his team was so bad he never got the chance to be on a stage that big, but I don't think it's a gamble to say that he's probably no Burke!

However, that's the only quibble I have with this draft, I can fully get behind what Joe did because we're on the right path and I don't see any of those guys other than KCP getting much activity unless they blow up like Drummond!

I also think you underestimate the big 3 we have on this team! IMO, the probability of one of those 3 becoming a real alpha dog is high! The most likely, IMO is Drummond, but it could also be Monroe or Knight, and it's all dependent on how well any of them adds what's needed to their game.

The real action is about to happen, and I too want the slugs gone and for Joe to NOT consider Iggy coming here! Iggy's time has passed, IMO, and his cost is too high!

The biggest problem to me is that they have a mandate to make the playoffs this season, and that's the wrong way to run a young club! The goal should be to improve and build chemistry and let the chips fall where they may!

You could still make the playoffs, but that shouldn't be the goal, it should be the result of reaching your goals!
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Lakers and Celtics positioning for next year's draft

Post  cool breeze on Sat Jun 29, 2013 4:40 pm

It seems that the rich get richer successful teams. Those two franchises are not looking to fit in average NBA players, they are looking for one new franchise player to start building a team around and next season might be a gold mine for teams with losing records. You can bet that the Lakers and Boston will not try to win meaningless games at the end of the season like our Piston brain trust. We could have picked 4th or better if Frank had been fired before the end of the season and guys like Charlie V had been forced to start and play entire games. Next season the Lakers and Boston will use every trick in the book to lose as many games as possible. And sure enough, somehow those ping pong balls will fall their way and they will get at least one future great player who will dominate our Piston players. Teams like the Washington who have been drafting for several seasons high up have not landed a franchise type player. Next season there will be a mad scramble to draft the top 4 or 5 players who will be prove to be an exceptional crop. Those teams that just miss the playoffs or make the 6th to 8th seeds, will be the real losers in years to come even though their fans will be really excited. The Lakers and Celtics will most likely land a key player after clearing their rosters. After that the free agents will flock to those teams to start fresh again in kicking the asses of the scum suckers of the league. If only Detroit could somehow figure out which other scum sucking team will do almost as bad as Boston and LA and snag one of those franchise type players next year by making a trade giveaway deal for their number one pick. Until Detroit lands a real stud leader type player who can back up the talk with his play, it will be difficult to rise above the pack. None of Joe's prime time players like Stuckey, Gordon, Charlie V who Dumars thought would be solid players with great trade potential have turned out to be worth a wooden nickel. We can only talk about CAP space. That is what losers do when they have bungled things and made bad decisions. Oh, at lease we have some CAP space so we can make another horrible move with players. I am still not seeing Detroit as a real playoff team and if they make the playoffs, for sure they will not get though the first round. So the team will be one of those middle of the pack teams searching for that prime time player like Isiah Thomas. Burke looked like a prime time player coming into this draft and he has great trade value right now. That means power for the club that has him. Detroit passed on him because he was not the right fit for a bad team. It is funny how so many fans get distracted so easily by nonsense. I am not saying Pope was a bad pick but it was not a powerful pick. He has assets the Pistons need regarding defense and shooting ability on the wing. If Detroit is to become a winner, fantastic team chemistry must form to overcome limitations of not having one great two way player like Labron on the team. A lot of the players have been on losing teams in the past. Siva, Knight, Charlie V, and Singler have experienced the highs of winning something meaningful. Charlie is out as far as I am concerned. So that leaves 3 guys who can help form the chemistry needed to become a winner. They need to help the others get in the right mind set. This kind of thinking is needed at the front office of the Pistons. Players like Iguodala and Smith have never been the type of players who have done anything to improve players on their teams. Iguodala played college ball at Arizona and I watched him play every game in college. Did I ever sense that he was interested in his teammates or really cared about how the team did during this stay? NEVER! In fact most Arizona fans really don't have any emotional bond that they have with other past players. He never gave much to anyone. This was just a stop on the way to a contract. Guys like Burke will be remembered fondly by Michigan Fans for the rest of their lives. He gave everything for his team and more. Those type of players usually end up on winning teams at any level of competition. This stuff is not important to Joe Dumars it seems.

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Detroit Pistons draft talk and trades

Post  Phil1980boy on Sat Jun 29, 2013 1:16 pm

Solid Draft work by the Pistons. We will see what Mr Pope can do but all the film looks solid. All I'm looking for from Pope is his ability to put it on the floor and get to the rim and not just live and die by his 3-bomb ability.

T.Mitchell is A Jason Mad Max replacement simple and plain. He could be A big time steal or A guy who bounces around the NBA. There is no in between for him. He has to play big time basketball from day 1.

I don't see the PG making the team. That's just my opinion.

Now it's time to hit the trade market and build something that can make the playoffs because this Hollywood Gores guy has no clue what it really takes to win in the NBA.
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Dumars idea of bringing more athletic players is something all of us have said for years. So why has it taken Joe so long to figure that out?

Post  cool breeze on Sat Jun 29, 2013 11:21 am

I am sorry to put a damper on all the excitement centering around these draft picks but it seems to me that Dumars is a day late and a dollar short most of the time. He stated that he kept his big secret to himself before draft day so Minn. would not try to trade up to draft the amazing KCP. So the Timberwolves draft Burke who won every award a player can win last season and was able to snag two first round draft choices for Burke. Was Pope ever listed on any expert's draft board as being a top 5 pick? Joe seems to think he is going to shock the world this season. I hope he does but there are no facts to back any of this crap up. And the 2nd round selection who tanked it this season while playing on a bad team is now going to shock the NBA world as well. It will be fun to watch those players in the summer league after they have run the court three times. My only happy feeling from this draft was Siva. And now we are reading that he might not even make the team. Siva will really help the 2nd unit on both offense and defense. He better get an honest chance. Still now that Joe believes that Detroit is in a great position with more athletic players, how will things be different with Monroe and Charlie V on the floor? Yes Charlie is CAP relief next season but damn it all he has not earned the right to actually play in games has he? I think the Pistons should try to acquire 2014 draft picks through trades but the guys we want off the team are of no value in trades.

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Maynor available

Post  merc on Sat Jun 29, 2013 1:14 am

The Blazers will not be extending a QO to Eric Maynor... might be a nice backup
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